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[KingZayd]

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...


Clearly not all Cerberus troops became immediately controlled by the Reapers, which is why Cerberus troops fought Husks on Sanctuary.

OK, but I do know that we saw pure indoctrination husks somewhere, i guess it was the STG agents then.

Yes, and Saren thought that made him safe, but he was wrong. Sovereign's priority was Saren's loyalty. Once he sensed Saren was having doubts, Sovereign reacted by implanting him and indoctrinating further.

Kai Leng was damaged by Anderson or Kahlee wasn't he? Also, he's pretty far gone, but he's not FULLY indoctrinated, because he's not a husk. As in there's still room for more indoctrination. That said Kai Leng was loyal to TIM, and indoctrinated by him too.

Cerberus and the reapers are really shady because TIM is fighting the reapers but yet he tells the reapers that we are going to use the crucible when he says he needs to use it as well but now cant becuse the reapers are protecting it.   So in short...Cerberus even fought the reapers pets at the same time that they were doing there biding.

The husks that you see on vermire had there minds completely destroyed by indoctrination. However also notice that there was another one that was fully indoctrinated but not brain dead. He says to let him out and when you do he attacks you on command.

The implanted cerberus troops makes it clear that implants is a direct control device, not a indoctrination accelerator. Indoctrination and direct control are two different things and so are the methods. 

It states in the cerberus main base that Kai Lang was upgraded. Yes he was shot by Anderson but only in the legs. It shows that most of his body is machine.

That's assuming TIM is doing EXACTLY as the Reapers want throughout ME3. I suspect this is not the case. He is indoctrinated, and he is causing trouble for us, but he only really goes off the deep end at the end, after he implants himself. Up to that point, all evidence indicates that Cerberus remains completely loyal to him.

Yeah Kai Leng was heavily modified (according to the Cerberus HQ videos, the Reaper implants improve performance). You said it was because the indoctrination was damaging his body. I don't think so. His legs were damaged, and the rest was just for an extra boost.

The Cerberus troops are implanted and indoctrinated, not just "remote controlled"

The one who wasn't a husk yet, was clearly not FULLY indoctrinated then, although he was damn close. Given more time, he'd turn into a husk. He was probably just the toughest/last test subject.

Saren showed, when he blew his own brains out that resistance is possible, even with implants. He did become even more indoctrinated, as indicated by all his doubts disappearing (until you bring them back again).

[KevShep]

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...


Clearly not all Cerberus troops became immediately controlled by the Reapers, which is why Cerberus troops fought Husks on Sanctuary.

OK, but I do know that we saw pure indoctrination husks somewhere, i guess it was the STG agents then.

Yes, and Saren thought that made him safe, but he was wrong. Sovereign's priority was Saren's loyalty. Once he sensed Saren was having doubts, Sovereign reacted by implanting him and indoctrinating further.

Kai Leng was damaged by Anderson or Kahlee wasn't he? Also, he's pretty far gone, but he's not FULLY indoctrinated, because he's not a husk. As in there's still room for more indoctrination. That said Kai Leng was loyal to TIM, and indoctrinated by him too.

Cerberus and the reapers are really shady because TIM is fighting the reapers but yet he tells the reapers that we are going to use the crucible when he says he needs to use it as well but now cant becuse the reapers are protecting it.   So in short...Cerberus even fought the reapers pets at the same time that they were doing there biding.

The husks that you see on vermire had there minds completely destroyed by indoctrination. However also notice that there was another one that was fully indoctrinated but not brain dead. He says to let him out and when you do he attacks you on command.

The implanted cerberus troops makes it clear that implants is a direct control device, not a indoctrination accelerator. Indoctrination and direct control are two different things and so are the methods. 

It states in the cerberus main base that Kai Lang was upgraded. Yes he was shot by Anderson but only in the legs. It shows that most of his body is machine.

That's assuming TIM is doing EXACTLY as the Reapers want throughout ME3. I suspect this is not the case. He is indoctrinated, and he is causing trouble for us, but he only really goes off the deep end at the end, after he implants himself. Up to that point, all evidence indicates that Cerberus remains completely loyal to him.

Yeah Kai Leng was heavily modified (according to the Cerberus HQ videos, the Reaper implants improve performance). You said it was because the indoctrination was damaging his body. I don't think so. His legs were damaged, and the rest was just for an extra boost.

The Cerberus troops are implanted and indoctrinated, not just "remote controlled"

The one who wasn't a husk yet, was clearly not FULLY indoctrinated then, although he was damn close. Given more time, he'd turn into a husk. He was probably just the toughest/last test subject.

Saren showed, when he blew his own brains out that resistance is possible, even with implants. He did become even more indoctrinated, as indicated by all his doubts disappearing (until you bring them back again).

-TIM has always been driven to survive at any cost. This happends to be what the limbic system does and it is how they manipulate you as they do at the end with the three choices about survival destroy/synthesis/control.

-What you said about the cerberus troops is what Iam saying...There in direct control and not part of indoc.

-Fully indoctrinated people are not husks...yet( your assuming that because he is not brain dead that he is not FULLY indoctrinated). Remember that in the Codex it says that the long the process last the longer an indoctrinated (meaning fully) person will last because indco will destroy the mind.

-Remember also that a strong minded person is very hard to control even for reapers. Let me brake down what indoc is and how it works because a LARGE amount of people are still unclear.


The limbic system is a set of evolutionarily primitive brain structures located on top of the brainstem and buried under the cortex. Limbic system structures are involved in many of our emotions and motivations, particularly those that are related to survival. Such emotions include fear, anger, and emotions related to sexual behavior. The limbic system is also involved in feelings of pleasure that are related to our survival.
  
Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions.
Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.
Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.
Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable. Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.   

Indoctrination is a process of the limic system and is not connected to anything of direct control, infact useing direct control eleminates indoctrination altogether because they are no longer useing you limbics.

Saren was not saren on the citadel...that was sovereign talking about believing in him completely. After saying this saren himself says other wise by trying to resist this notion of believing in sovereign.

Modifié par KevShep, 16 juin 2012 - 02:03 .

[KingZayd]

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...


Clearly not all Cerberus troops became immediately controlled by the Reapers, which is why Cerberus troops fought Husks on Sanctuary.

OK, but I do know that we saw pure indoctrination husks somewhere, i guess it was the STG agents then.

Yes, and Saren thought that made him safe, but he was wrong. Sovereign's priority was Saren's loyalty. Once he sensed Saren was having doubts, Sovereign reacted by implanting him and indoctrinating further.

Kai Leng was damaged by Anderson or Kahlee wasn't he? Also, he's pretty far gone, but he's not FULLY indoctrinated, because he's not a husk. As in there's still room for more indoctrination. That said Kai Leng was loyal to TIM, and indoctrinated by him too.

Cerberus and the reapers are really shady because TIM is fighting the reapers but yet he tells the reapers that we are going to use the crucible when he says he needs to use it as well but now cant becuse the reapers are protecting it.   So in short...Cerberus even fought the reapers pets at the same time that they were doing there biding.

The husks that you see on vermire had there minds completely destroyed by indoctrination. However also notice that there was another one that was fully indoctrinated but not brain dead. He says to let him out and when you do he attacks you on command.

The implanted cerberus troops makes it clear that implants is a direct control device, not a indoctrination accelerator. Indoctrination and direct control are two different things and so are the methods. 

It states in the cerberus main base that Kai Lang was upgraded. Yes he was shot by Anderson but only in the legs. It shows that most of his body is machine.

That's assuming TIM is doing EXACTLY as the Reapers want throughout ME3. I suspect this is not the case. He is indoctrinated, and he is causing trouble for us, but he only really goes off the deep end at the end, after he implants himself. Up to that point, all evidence indicates that Cerberus remains completely loyal to him.

Yeah Kai Leng was heavily modified (according to the Cerberus HQ videos, the Reaper implants improve performance). You said it was because the indoctrination was damaging his body. I don't think so. His legs were damaged, and the rest was just for an extra boost.

The Cerberus troops are implanted and indoctrinated, not just "remote controlled"

The one who wasn't a husk yet, was clearly not FULLY indoctrinated then, although he was damn close. Given more time, he'd turn into a husk. He was probably just the toughest/last test subject.

Saren showed, when he blew his own brains out that resistance is possible, even with implants. He did become even more indoctrinated, as indicated by all his doubts disappearing (until you bring them back again).

-TIM has always been driven to survive at any cost. This happends to be what the limbic system does and it is how they manipulate you as they do at the end with the three choices about survival destroy/synthesis/control.

-What you said about the cerberus troops is what Iam saying...There in direct control and not part of indoc.

-Fully indoctrinated people are not husks...yet( your assuming that because he is not brain dead that he is not FULLY indoctrinated). Remember that in the Codex it says that the long the process last the longer an indoctrinated (meaning fully) person will last because indco will destroy the mind.

-Remember also that a strong minded person is very hard to control even for reapers. Let me brake down what indoc is and how it works because a LARGE amount of people are still unclear.


The limbic system is a set of evolutionarily primitive brain structures located on top of the brainstem and buried under the cortex. Limbic system structures are involved in many of our emotions and motivations, particularly those that are related to survival. Such emotions include fear, anger, and emotions related to sexual behavior. The limbic system is also involved in feelings of pleasure that are related to our survival.
  
Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions.
Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.
Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.
Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable. Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.   

Indoctrination is a process of the limic system and is not connected to anything of direct control, infact useing direct control eleminates indoctrination altogether because they are no longer useing you limbics.

Saren was not saren on the citadel...that was sovereign talking about believing in him completely. After saying this saren himself says other wise and tries to resist.

 
On the contrary, I was saying the Cerberus troops ARE indoctrinated, not just remote controlled with their implants.

And the longer indoctrination goes on, the stronger it gets. At maximum indoctrination, there is zero-independent thought and you have a husk.

You said if implanted it was IMPOSSIBLE to resist. Saren shows this is not true.

OK, so indoctrination probably does at the very least exploit the limbic system, but I'm not sure why you're posting all that. I do believe Shepard is being indoctrinated.

Saren was Saren on the Citadel, albeit a very corrupted one. This is why his reasoning is still recogniseable as being Saren-esque, although clearly, it wouldn't be the same if he wasn't indoctrinated. Basically, think Theoden and Wormtongue (in the book, not the film where Saruman is possessing him), where Sovereign is acting as both Wormtongue and Saruman rolled in one. Theoden's still there, just his mind is poisoned, and his trust in Wormtongue makes him so.. malleable.

[KevShep]

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...


Clearly not all Cerberus troops became immediately controlled by the Reapers, which is why Cerberus troops fought Husks on Sanctuary.

OK, but I do know that we saw pure indoctrination husks somewhere, i guess it was the STG agents then.

Yes, and Saren thought that made him safe, but he was wrong. Sovereign's priority was Saren's loyalty. Once he sensed Saren was having doubts, Sovereign reacted by implanting him and indoctrinating further.

Kai Leng was damaged by Anderson or Kahlee wasn't he? Also, he's pretty far gone, but he's not FULLY indoctrinated, because he's not a husk. As in there's still room for more indoctrination. That said Kai Leng was loyal to TIM, and indoctrinated by him too.

Cerberus and the reapers are really shady because TIM is fighting the reapers but yet he tells the reapers that we are going to use the crucible when he says he needs to use it as well but now cant becuse the reapers are protecting it.   So in short...Cerberus even fought the reapers pets at the same time that they were doing there biding.

The husks that you see on vermire had there minds completely destroyed by indoctrination. However also notice that there was another one that was fully indoctrinated but not brain dead. He says to let him out and when you do he attacks you on command.

The implanted cerberus troops makes it clear that implants is a direct control device, not a indoctrination accelerator. Indoctrination and direct control are two different things and so are the methods. 

It states in the cerberus main base that Kai Lang was upgraded. Yes he was shot by Anderson but only in the legs. It shows that most of his body is machine.

That's assuming TIM is doing EXACTLY as the Reapers want throughout ME3. I suspect this is not the case. He is indoctrinated, and he is causing trouble for us, but he only really goes off the deep end at the end, after he implants himself. Up to that point, all evidence indicates that Cerberus remains completely loyal to him.

Yeah Kai Leng was heavily modified (according to the Cerberus HQ videos, the Reaper implants improve performance). You said it was because the indoctrination was damaging his body. I don't think so. His legs were damaged, and the rest was just for an extra boost.

The Cerberus troops are implanted and indoctrinated, not just "remote controlled"

The one who wasn't a husk yet, was clearly not FULLY indoctrinated then, although he was damn close. Given more time, he'd turn into a husk. He was probably just the toughest/last test subject.

Saren showed, when he blew his own brains out that resistance is possible, even with implants. He did become even more indoctrinated, as indicated by all his doubts disappearing (until you bring them back again).

-TIM has always been driven to survive at any cost. This happends to be what the limbic system does and it is how they manipulate you as they do at the end with the three choices about survival destroy/synthesis/control.

-What you said about the cerberus troops is what Iam saying...There in direct control and not part of indoc.

-Fully indoctrinated people are not husks...yet( your assuming that because he is not brain dead that he is not FULLY indoctrinated). Remember that in the Codex it says that the long the process last the longer an indoctrinated (meaning fully) person will last because indco will destroy the mind.

-Remember also that a strong minded person is very hard to control even for reapers. Let me brake down what indoc is and how it works because a LARGE amount of people are still unclear.


The limbic system is a set of evolutionarily primitive brain structures located on top of the brainstem and buried under the cortex. Limbic system structures are involved in many of our emotions and motivations, particularly those that are related to survival. Such emotions include fear, anger, and emotions related to sexual behavior. The limbic system is also involved in feelings of pleasure that are related to our survival.
  
Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions.
Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.
Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.
Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable. Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.   

Indoctrination is a process of the limic system and is not connected to anything of direct control, infact useing direct control eleminates indoctrination altogether because they are no longer useing you limbics.

Saren was not saren on the citadel...that was sovereign talking about believing in him completely. After saying this saren himself says other wise and tries to resist.

 
On the contrary, I was saying the Cerberus troops ARE indoctrinated, not just remote controlled with their implants.

And the longer indoctrination goes on, the stronger it gets. At maximum indoctrination, there is zero-independent thought and you have a husk.

You said if implanted it was IMPOSSIBLE to resist. Saren shows this is not true.

OK, so indoctrination probably does at the very least exploit the limbic system, but I'm not sure why you're posting all that. I do believe Shepard is being indoctrinated.

Saren was Saren on the Citadel, albeit a very corrupted one. This is why his reasoning is still recogniseable as being Saren-esque, although clearly, it wouldn't be the same if he wasn't indoctrinated. Basically, think Theoden and Wormtongue (in the book, not the film where Saruman is possessing him), where Sovereign is acting as both Wormtongue and Saruman rolled in one. Theoden's still there, just his mind is poisoned, and his trust in Wormtongue makes him so.. malleable.

That one mission (its the mission that is also a multiplayer map) there is a note of a guy that just did it and is under full control. Direct control is not indoc...Indoc is about manipulation without control, if you direct control then there is no manipulation...hence the word indoctrination. Husk like the dragons teeth and husks like what we see in ME3 are NOT indoctrinated. The cerberus troops, like the one where we see his face is a husk!

fully Indoctrinated person is a husk basicaly but not brain dead.The brain dead ones are the ones that have BEEN indoctrinated for some time and its starting to decay the mind. Read the codex at the bottom of it.

It is impossible resist implants...Paul Grayson is proof of this. He had times where his mind was his own(like saren) but in the end no matter what he did he would always listen to them. The only way out was to kill yourself.

Iam just saying to you what the limbic system is because its the core of what indoctrination is. 

Modifié par KevShep, 16 juin 2012 - 02:35 .

[KingZayd]

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...


Clearly not all Cerberus troops became immediately controlled by the Reapers, which is why Cerberus troops fought Husks on Sanctuary.

OK, but I do know that we saw pure indoctrination husks somewhere, i guess it was the STG agents then.

Yes, and Saren thought that made him safe, but he was wrong. Sovereign's priority was Saren's loyalty. Once he sensed Saren was having doubts, Sovereign reacted by implanting him and indoctrinating further.

Kai Leng was damaged by Anderson or Kahlee wasn't he? Also, he's pretty far gone, but he's not FULLY indoctrinated, because he's not a husk. As in there's still room for more indoctrination. That said Kai Leng was loyal to TIM, and indoctrinated by him too.

Cerberus and the reapers are really shady because TIM is fighting the reapers but yet he tells the reapers that we are going to use the crucible when he says he needs to use it as well but now cant becuse the reapers are protecting it.   So in short...Cerberus even fought the reapers pets at the same time that they were doing there biding.

The husks that you see on vermire had there minds completely destroyed by indoctrination. However also notice that there was another one that was fully indoctrinated but not brain dead. He says to let him out and when you do he attacks you on command.

The implanted cerberus troops makes it clear that implants is a direct control device, not a indoctrination accelerator. Indoctrination and direct control are two different things and so are the methods. 

It states in the cerberus main base that Kai Lang was upgraded. Yes he was shot by Anderson but only in the legs. It shows that most of his body is machine.

That's assuming TIM is doing EXACTLY as the Reapers want throughout ME3. I suspect this is not the case. He is indoctrinated, and he is causing trouble for us, but he only really goes off the deep end at the end, after he implants himself. Up to that point, all evidence indicates that Cerberus remains completely loyal to him.

Yeah Kai Leng was heavily modified (according to the Cerberus HQ videos, the Reaper implants improve performance). You said it was because the indoctrination was damaging his body. I don't think so. His legs were damaged, and the rest was just for an extra boost.

The Cerberus troops are implanted and indoctrinated, not just "remote controlled"

The one who wasn't a husk yet, was clearly not FULLY indoctrinated then, although he was damn close. Given more time, he'd turn into a husk. He was probably just the toughest/last test subject.

Saren showed, when he blew his own brains out that resistance is possible, even with implants. He did become even more indoctrinated, as indicated by all his doubts disappearing (until you bring them back again).

-TIM has always been driven to survive at any cost. This happends to be what the limbic system does and it is how they manipulate you as they do at the end with the three choices about survival destroy/synthesis/control.

-What you said about the cerberus troops is what Iam saying...There in direct control and not part of indoc.

-Fully indoctrinated people are not husks...yet( your assuming that because he is not brain dead that he is not FULLY indoctrinated). Remember that in the Codex it says that the long the process last the longer an indoctrinated (meaning fully) person will last because indco will destroy the mind.

-Remember also that a strong minded person is very hard to control even for reapers. Let me brake down what indoc is and how it works because a LARGE amount of people are still unclear.


The limbic system is a set of evolutionarily primitive brain structures located on top of the brainstem and buried under the cortex. Limbic system structures are involved in many of our emotions and motivations, particularly those that are related to survival. Such emotions include fear, anger, and emotions related to sexual behavior. The limbic system is also involved in feelings of pleasure that are related to our survival.
  
Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions.
Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.
Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.
Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable. Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.   

Indoctrination is a process of the limic system and is not connected to anything of direct control, infact useing direct control eleminates indoctrination altogether because they are no longer useing you limbics.

Saren was not saren on the citadel...that was sovereign talking about believing in him completely. After saying this saren himself says other wise and tries to resist.

 
On the contrary, I was saying the Cerberus troops ARE indoctrinated, not just remote controlled with their implants.

And the longer indoctrination goes on, the stronger it gets. At maximum indoctrination, there is zero-independent thought and you have a husk.

You said if implanted it was IMPOSSIBLE to resist. Saren shows this is not true.

OK, so indoctrination probably does at the very least exploit the limbic system, but I'm not sure why you're posting all that. I do believe Shepard is being indoctrinated.

Saren was Saren on the Citadel, albeit a very corrupted one. This is why his reasoning is still recogniseable as being Saren-esque, although clearly, it wouldn't be the same if he wasn't indoctrinated. Basically, think Theoden and Wormtongue (in the book, not the film where Saruman is possessing him), where Sovereign is acting as both Wormtongue and Saruman rolled in one. Theoden's still there, just his mind is poisoned, and his trust in Wormtongue makes him so.. malleable.

That one mission (its the mission that is also a multiplayer map) there is a note of a guy that just did it and is under full control. Direct control is not indoc...Indoc is about manipulation without control, if you direct control then there is no manipulation...hence the word indoctrination. Husk like the dragons teeth and husks like what we see in ME3 are NOT indoctrinated. The cerberus troops, like the one where we see his face is a husk!

fully Indoctrinated person is a husk basicaly but not brain dead.The brain dead ones are the ones that have BEEN indoctrinated for some time and its starting to decay the mind. Read the codex at the bottom of it.

It is impossible resist implants...Paul Grayson is proof of this. He had times where his mind was his own(like saren) but in the end no matter what he did he would always listen to them. The only way out was to kill yourself.

Iam just saying to you what the limbic system is because its the core of what indoctrination is. 

One person. Not the entire Cerberus force. 

The codex doesn't define ANYTHING as fully indoctrinated.

Saren resisted implants. He couldn't kill himself if he hadn't.

[KevShep]

KingZayd wrote...

[One person. Not the entire Cerberus force. 

The codex doesn't define ANYTHING as fully indoctrinated.

Saren resisted implants. He couldn't kill himself if he hadn't.

All cerberus troops got the same thing.

The codex does tell us if you pay attention when full indoctrination takes place. Read the last paragraph carfully.

As for saren. Like I said there are momtents when you CAN get a little control but only for a small time....just like Pual Grayson.

Modifié par KevShep, 16 juin 2012 - 02:52 .

[malakim2099]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

I don't see Harbinger's laser blast as an indoctrination attempt. I think it's a killing attempt. It knocks Shepard out. He dreams. Indoctrination had already started a while back with Object Rho. He's been resisting all this time, but now he's in a weakened state. This is potentially a point at which the indoctrination is able to present significantly.

This isn't canon. If you don't play the DLC, you never get this mission and never encounter Object Rho. So no, it cannot be used as a canon source of Indocrination, as for many it never happened.

Many did do this mission though. And everyone else who did have the object activate on them became indoctrinated. Therefore it becomes very unlikely that the Shepards who were involved didn't get indoctrinated. On the other hand, it's not quite so unlikely that the Shepards that didn't do this mission were indoctrinated in some other way.

But some didn't, thus it isn't canon.

Well, no, the result of Arrival (blowing up the mass relay in that system and wiping out the batarian colony) IS canon. So the exposure to Object Rho might be as well. Not having played the DLC myself, I couldn't say for sure.

EDIT: Apologies if this was brought up already. Catching up on the thread.

Modifié par malakim2099, 16 juin 2012 - 05:25 .

[KingZayd]

KevShep wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

[One person. Not the entire Cerberus force. 

The codex doesn't define ANYTHING as fully indoctrinated.

Saren resisted implants. He couldn't kill himself if he hadn't.

All cerberus troops got the same thing.

The codex does tell us if you pay attention when full indoctrination takes place. Read the last paragraph carfully.

As for saren. Like I said there are momtents when you CAN get a little control but only for a small time....just like Pual Grayson.

All of them got the same thing, but nothing indicates they were all hijacked by reapers immediately as you seem to be suggesting.

you said it was impossible to resist an implant.

implant is an indoctrination booster. It wasn't Sovereign talking before Saren blew his brains out. It was a corrupted Saren, whose mind had been poisoned so much that he was almost completely loyal to Sovereign.

[XxDarkTimexX]

people really need to under stand what a theory is.