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[RedArmyShogun]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

@ bear
True on Wu but they could have shown us Sun Quan declaring himself Emperor and the battle of Shi-ting. Also, they didn't show us the Wu offensive on Hei Fei before. I feel with a few more episode, they could have shown more on Wu and provide some form of closure for characters like Sun Quan and Lu Xun.

I think Naughty's reply fits part of why this happend.

Mind you I would have liked to seen those, but I wonder how much of it was due to budget, or populatrity falling.

I mean I think we both can agree that Cao Cao, and Liu Bei were the stars of the show, but the show was more than them...Its like watching Star Trek after Kirk dies and seeing Spock run the ship. It would be "meh".

So I'm wondering if the ratings dropped off when they got into the future events, and they were forced to rush it.

[Costin_Razvan]

In the middle of episode 18 right now. Lu Bu's death and that of Gongtai was something a lot more emotional for me then that of the Starks mostly because while Lu Bu was a fool in the end he was still intelligent enough for me to care for me unlike the Starks which are fools are every bloody turn and every single intelligent action they make is vastly overshadowed by the bad ones.

[naughty99]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

In the middle of episode 18 right now. Lu Bu's death and that of Gongtai was something a lot more emotional for me then that of the Starks mostly because while Lu Bu was a fool in the end he was still intelligent enough for me to care for me unlike the Starks which are fools are every bloody turn and every single intelligent action they make is vastly overshadowed by the bad ones.

It's interesting to compare these, as both series feature a lot of court intrigue and war strategy; however, with 95 episodes and a basis in fascinating historical events over a long period of time, Three Kingdoms has a lot more liberty to drill deeply into the various tactics employed in all these battles. Ultimately, this series is more centered around the brilliant strategies of warfare, while GoT is more like the tragic tale of this huge cast of interesting characters with their own goals and personal conflicts.

Modifié par naughty99, 02 juillet 2012 - 05:52 .

[Costin_Razvan]

Three kingdoms is also a story about a huge cast of characters, even more so then Song of Ice and Fire ( **** the show ).

[naughty99]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Three kingdoms is also a story about a huge cast of characters, even more so then Song of Ice and Fire ( **** the show ).

Certainly there are a lot of characters in the Three Kingdoms series, some of them quite interesting. However, the spotlight is on the brilliant military tacticians, and the turmoil of that period in history.

There are also a lot of epic battles in GoT, more so in the novels than the show, but the focus of this series is ultimately more about the personal conflicts of its cast of compelling characters.

Modifié par naughty99, 02 juillet 2012 - 06:43 .

[Godak]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Three kingdoms is also a story about a huge cast of characters, even more so then Song of Ice and Fire ( **** the show ).

To be fair, I think GoT/SoIaF has only taken place over the course of a few years so far. Romance of the Three Kingdoms lasts for generations. While they have similar themes (court politics, brutal warfare, etc.) the scope/scale is quite different.

Modifié par Godak, 03 juillet 2012 - 01:35 .

[Chewin]

Damn! Episode 42 was awesome! Cao Cao surrendering to Guan Yu and letting his remaining troops walk past was badass! Though the way I saw it, when he was begging to Guan Yu to chop off his head, was him being half serious and half acting. Though I don't blame him for it.

The follow up episode was nice as well. Really liked Cao's speech. And finally Suma Yi enters!

[RedArmyShogun]

Least the Actor for Yi is a good pic, apperance wise, what I know of the man historically, from the books, and the general history, just the way that actor looks is the sort of face I would not trust lulz.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Chewin3 wrote...

Damn! Episode 42 was awesome! Cao Cao surrendering to Guan Yu and letting his remaining troops walk past was badass! Though the way I saw it, when he was begging to Guan Yu to chop off his head, was him being half serious and half acting. Though I don't blame him for it.

The follow up episode was nice as well. Really liked Cao's speech. And finally Suma Yi enters!

In regards to Cao Cao and Guan Yu, that was my interpretation as well. He'd rather get out alive but if death was inevitable he'd rather spare his men.

In my mind, Sima Yi becomes the main character of the story in around the 60th episode or so. The rivalry between Liu Bei and Cao Cao gets replaced with the historic rivalry of Zhuge Liang and Sima Yi.

[Chewin]

Sounds interesting. Kongming sure is something. If I didn't know the show was based on historic events, I would find it hard to believe a man like him existed, though it also depends on how accurate the novel and show is, e.g. that arrow trick he achieved pre Red Cliff battle.

Though I don't believe that it's all talk. The Longzhong plan, his exceptional talent in geopolitics, and so on are remarkable. Can't wait to see Sima in action as well.

[KnightofPhoenix]

The arrow trick was ridiculous and makes Cao Cao look like an idiot.
Luo Guanzhong and his novel definitely had a bias towards Shu and Zhuge Liang, exaggerating the latter's exploits, particularly in the battle of Red Cliff. The main architect of the victory was Zhou Yu and Kongming's role in the battle was marginal at best (the critical aspect of his role was to secure the alliance between Wu and Shu).

Also, am I the only Lu Su fan?

[Chewin]

To be honest, Cao Cao acted strangely ever since he defeated Zhou Yun imo. Felt like he lost his sharpness and became 'lazy b/c of so many victories', as he himself put it. The whole Red Cliff event, both before the main battle and after, didn't feel like he was that Cao Cao he was much earlier.

And you're definitely not the only Lu Sun fan. He is one of my favourites. He as well has remarkable talents concerning military strategy, politics, and so forth. And I do admire his loyalty.

[RedArmyShogun]

Kongming was pretty effective actully and is credited with making the first preassure plate landmine, hot air balloon, and improved upon the repeating crossbow (which I wish was in the show) back then, if you were thoughtof a man of talent so to speak, education wasn't open to everyone, but those of promise, reguardless of rank or merit. Several of the important officals of the Era were frankly from nobody backgrounds.

So in that reguard plus the culture of the Chinese, it led to verry capable or at the least, persuassive leaders and advisors. Plus generals for the most either had to be higly smart, or great combatants and adminstrators. As failure ment Death, and if lucky just your death. So litterally this isn't like you going to college for some mediocre job. This litterally guided the fate of your whole family line.

And if you screwed up its not just you that might be a head short, but litterally your whole family, from your 2nd cousin, to you grandmother. Dead.

So while the rewards were great so were the risks. This is mainly attributed to culture however I feel. You don't see the same level of commitment and loyality in Europe of the same and much later periods. Or at least the same willingness to die for shame. So basically, only those who were willing to risk all and had promise got to advance. So defactoly only the best, brightest, and generally the most able of that society made it.

Today it seems impossible as frankly our officals are chosen by means that if acient rulers were around you would see massive purges of civilian and military leadership, plus destruction of the public education system as it stands past the basic level. As to them educating everyone to the highest levels was a fools errand.

Largely Money, family, and a willingness to work for others wills, gets you the high spots today, which to them would be horrific. I mean of course you had people who had no skill in positions up high. But in every case they lost a head, or became a puppet at some point.

Modifié par Confess-A-Bear, 05 juillet 2012 - 05:17 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Kongming was most definitely a prodigy, there is no denying that. But the novel takes that and makes him almost divine. The show brings it back to humanity's level, but I still feel it exaggerates his exploits on some occasions (notably Chi Bi).

@ Chewin
Cao Cao definitely grew complacent like most victorious commanders, after his victory over Yuan Shao. But the arrow thing is pushing it.

[Chewin]

Goes great length showing that I still can't remember all the persons names, haha.

[Prince_12]

Chewin3 wrote...

Goes great length showing that I still can't remember all the persons names, haha.

Heh, you and me both. Particuraly when there's so many people with the name Zhou or Zhau in it.


Anyway, recently saw the episode where Liu Bei travels to the Southland to marry that girl. Before he left, he visited Kongming, and wrote something which shocked him. Anyone know what Liu wrote on that paper?

[naughty99]

Prince_12 wrote...

Chewin3 wrote...

Goes great length showing that I still can't remember all the persons names, haha.

Heh, you and me both. Particuraly when there's so many people with the name Zhou or Zhau in it.


Anyway, recently saw the episode where Liu Bei travels to the Southland to marry that girl. Before he left, he visited Kongming, and wrote something which shocked him. Anyone know what Liu wrote on that paper?

Yes, you will learn what Kongming wrote in future episodes. Better not to spoil it for you.

Modifié par naughty99, 06 juillet 2012 - 03:54 .

[RedArmyShogun]

^ That pretty much. Sadly the one Youtube link is stopped for now at Ep 86, the uploader is having computer problems. Which only leave my ad banner link to use unless your okay with dling.

Edit, uploader gots his stuff back up and running. rejoice!

Modifié par Confess-A-Bear, 06 juillet 2012 - 05:35 .

[Godak]

I just finished episode seven. My progress has been slow (for one very specific reason), but I am definitely impressed with the quality of the production. While I feel they sometimes reach a little too far and come up short (I feel they choreograph the fight scenes for a budget they did not have, leading to some visual silliness), I'm still engrossed by the acting, the sets, the costumes, etc. It's distilled awesome in a sippy-cup.

Do they ever explore Sun Quan's shift from amazingly/surprisingly competent administrator and commander to senile/insane quasi-tyrant? He's probably my favorite major character of the period - though Zhang Lu has always fascinated me for his relatively humane and tolerant warlordship - and his rule is marked by the almost overly romantic "rise and fall" we see so often in ancient literature.

What I'm saying is that I really wanna see this adorable little nine year-old boy become a sixty-something year-old crazy dictator. Is that too much to ask?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sadly no, we do not get to see Sun Quan as an older ruler. His ruthlessness is something that is hinted at but not directly explored I fear.

[Godak]

Man, Dong Zhuo be horny. XD

I can tell the actor had a great time portraying him.

[Costin_Razvan]

The actor for him was amazing.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 07 juillet 2012 - 04:52 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

The acting in general is pretty good.

[Godak]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

The acting in general is pretty good.

Agreed. There is some melodrama thrown into the mix, but I feel it is generally handled with some level of self-awareness (and I don't think they ever let said melodrama overshadow the moments of authentic gravitas). It is based off of the Romance of the Three Kingdoms, so it is understandable that there is some things that might be a little on the fantastic side.