193 réponses à ce sujet

[richcz3]

The M-90 Indra Should be at the D - Tier
I have it at X, and if there was ever a weapon that tickled the enemy, this is one.

Yes, when you add special ammo, amps, and use specific classes so it can do some damage, but anytime a weapon needs that much outside build up, it's "out of the box" weak

[MWaHa]

I did this with the Sniper rifles, and I would probably welcome amendments to move guns up from A to S:

S: EZ Mode
Krysae

A: Gold Viable
(******in no particular order******)
Widow
Black Widow
Jav
Valiant

B: Marginally gold viable
Mantis

C: Not gold viable:
Viper

D: Crap:
Incisor

Guns I don't have enough experience with to evaluate:
Indra
Harpoon Gun
Raptor

[NinthGeorgesw]

MrFuddyDuddy wrote...

Am I the only one made about the tier for the Arc pistol? Thing has almost the same uncharged damae as a Phalanx X, and its max charge does 6x's damage which is comparable to the paladin. Slap it on an infiltrator, with AP V and EB V and it one shots Guardians on Gold without any amps.

A lot of people hate on the Arc Pistol. It's a fine gun, and so is the Eagle. I take the Eagle with me instead of a SMG because of it's damage against armour.

[waakeegan]

Drawrof wrote...

No way is the canifex a top tier weapon. It does not have the stopping power for gold

Carnifex is a top tier weapon because it is lightweight and is capable of 1 shot kills on gold against unshielded enemies. The power and lightweight makes it viable to use on Adepts, Engineers, Vanguards, and some races of Sentinel, who are heavily reliant on quick power usage to be effective. They get quick recharge without sacrificing weapon damage.
 

[TCGwasHERE]

so Lemme get this straight. the Disciple is better then the Javelin? ok

[Kalas Magnus]

Drawrof wrote...

No way is the canifex a top tier weapon. It does not have the stopping power for gold

It has perfect accuracy for headshots and enough damage that armor reduction is not a big deal.

[MWaHa]

TCGwasHERE wrote...

so Lemme get this straight. the Disciple is better then the Javelin? ok

Dude, it's hard to do this kind of tier system and OP said it was just a draft and he knew he was going to make mistakes. You can suggests critiques without being a dick about it:happy:

[Equinoxe4]

waakeegan wrote...

I made this tier list with the mindset that these weapons would be used on Gold mode. Also, I see that the Black Widow could be placed in S-Tier. The reason I put it in A-Tier was that I was comparing it to the Valiant, which has the same advantages as the Black Widow without the weaknesses: multiple shots with good power, but without the recoil and long reload time. As for the regular Widow, when playing on gold, unless used by a Salarian infiltrator, will have a hard time quickly dispatching enemies with shields.

Valiant is easier to aim and with faster reload has the advantage in cc, whereas BW does a bit more damage. AP of BW is offset by low ammo (the free mod spot is often used for extended mag). All in all both are on the same level and usage is up to preference.

[Kalas Magnus]

richcz3 wrote...

The M-90 Indra Should be at the D - Tier
I have it at X, and if there was ever a weapon that tickled the enemy, this is one.

Yes, when you add special ammo, amps, and use specific classes so it can do some damage, but anytime a weapon needs that much outside build up, it's "out of the box" weak

Sniper rifles belong on infiltrators. This weapon shines on the salarian or the geth because of the rate of fire inrease. 

[MrFuddyDuddy]

Lol Javelin should be a D tier, it can't shield gate anymore and with its poor spare ammo and incredibly high weight, it makes it pretty worthless on even an infiltrator, on top of being very hard to level. I don't see the hate for the incisor either, its pretty good if you can control the recoil, its basically a scoped vindicator otherwise.

[mikepaul]

If I equip the Valiant III with the barrel mod then look at the Black Widow II, the line for damage is shorter than the Valiant's total. Sure, I could mod the BW, but it's too heavy to bother carrying.

So when both are at X, does the BW exceed the Valiant with the barrel mod, or is there hidden damage involved in calling the BW 'better'?...

[Tangster]

mikepaul wrote...

If I equip the Valiant III with the barrel mod then look at the Black Widow II, the line for damage is shorter than the Valiant's total. Sure, I could mod the BW, but it's too heavy to bother carrying.

So when both are at X, does the BW exceed the Valiant with the barrel mod, or is there hidden damage involved in calling the BW 'better'?...

Black Widow I damage per shot = 514.1
Valiant X damage per shot = 396.5

Stop using the stupid ingame bars as reference. Use this spreadsheet.

Modifié par Tangster, 18 juin 2012 - 12:13 .

[waakeegan]

TCGwasHERE wrote...

so Lemme get this straight. the Disciple is better then the Javelin? ok

Like I said, the list isn't perfect. The Javelin is a strong weapon, but it runs out of ammo way too fast even with an ammo capacity mod, plus the delay to shoot it. It leaves little room for error either. On gold difficulty, if you shoot a Javelin at an enemy with a shield it will just take off the shield. If you shoot again you will kill it...IF you hit it. If you happen to miss that shot, by the time you reload your weapon and are ready for the third shot the enemy will begin to recharge their shields, and then you're back to square one. Also, I put the disciple A-Rank because it is lightweight and has the ability to stagger, which is great for Vanguards and Adepts. 

[Kenadian]

The Mattock easily belongs in Tier A, it was by far the best assault rifle until the Harrier (an upgraded Mattock) came along. To stick that in B and the Revenant in A is just silly.

Drawrof wrote...

No way is the canifex a top tier weapon. It does not have the stopping power for gold

You're joking, right? Tell me you're joking, because this sentence defies reality.

Modifié par Kenadian, 18 juin 2012 - 12:19 .

[waakeegan]

Kenadian wrote...

The Mattock easily belongs in Tier A, it was by far the best assault rifle until the Harrier (an upgraded Mattock) came along. To stick that in B and the Revenant in A is just silly.

The Mattock is a beautiful weapon, I agree. The list isn't perfect, and you can definitely argue that the Mattock belongs in A tier. However, the Revenant is still better. The Revenant doesn't have the accuracy of a Mattock unless you stick it on a Turian Soldier, but the power difference is clear. You can take out an Atlas/Geth Prime/Banshee a hell of a lot quicker with a Revenant than a Mattock. This is a huge asset on Gold Difficulty, because being able to contribute to taking out the big guys is more important than taking out the little guys.

[Tangster]

waakeegan wrote...
This is a huge asset on Gold Difficulty, because being able to contribute to taking out the big guys is more important than taking out the little guys.

Disagree. Taking out the little guys is more important, because in gold the little guys can actually kill you, while the bosses are easy to kite around/ignore.

[AldarionnEB]

You can't really rank guns this way. It's not that simple.

For example, you rank the Javelin below the Widow, but the Javelin is a superior weapon rank for rank. It has higher damage, more penetration, almost the same ammo capacity rank for rank, and a better scope. In the negative column it has a firing mechanism that takes some getting used to, and it's harder to rank up than a Widow because it's a higher rarity. But a rank equivalent Javelin will put out more DPS than a Widow. Also, in the hands of a Salarian Infiltrator, a Javelin/Widow will put out more DPS than most of the S tier weapons you posted.

So how do you rank the weapons? Do you do it by damage potential? Ease of unlock? Ease of use? Ubiquitous use across many classes? You cannot compare these weapons in a vacuum against one another. The Krysae is only stupidly powerful in the hands of an Infiltrator. Many people feel it's remarkably sub-par on most other classes, while the Talon is probably the best Heavy Pistol on that list for numerous classes, but most Biotic won't touch it because it weighs too much unless they have specific pistol weight reduction talents, or a rank X version.

I think there are at most three tiers of weapons, and most will fall into the middle category, which is ubiquitously useful on a variety of classes. The top tier should be reserved for extreme standouts, and the bottom tier should include guns that really don't have a purpose, or are outclassed by other weapons of similar type.

As for the Black Widow V Valiant debate, the Valiant is patently better rank for rank. On the same character, a higher DPS can be achieved with the Valiant, and it's much more useable due to the low recoil, fast rate of fire and extremely fast reload speed. The Black Widow is only better if it significantly outranks a Valiant. People with a Black Widow X likely won't replace it with a Valiant below rank V at the lowest, or shouldn't if they can effectively handle the Black Widow's recoil.

[A Wild Snorlax]

I don't really think the carnifex should in the highest tier tbh.

If they're both the same level it's nowhere near the paladin and talon.

Needs moar tiers.

[weezer1201]

Equinoxe4 wrote...

Valiant is easier to aim and with faster reload has the advantage in cc, whereas BW does a bit more damage. AP of BW is offset by low ammo (the free mod spot is often used for extended mag). All in all both are on the same level and usage is up to preference.

You are right about the ammo and armor peircing offsetting, though my Black Widow has more ammo base because ot the level.   You can't make up for the damage difference though, which is compunded with all the infiltrator skills.   A valiant with EB and AP isn't nearly as good as a BW with EB and Clip.

[weezer1201]

waakeegan wrote...

TCGwasHERE wrote...

so Lemme get this straight. the Disciple is better then the Javelin? ok

Like I said, the list isn't perfect. The Javelin is a strong weapon, but it runs out of ammo way too fast even with an ammo capacity mod, plus the delay to shoot it. It leaves little room for error either. On gold difficulty, if you shoot a Javelin at an enemy with a shield it will just take off the shield. If you shoot again you will kill it...IF you hit it. If you happen to miss that shot, by the time you reload your weapon and are ready for the third shot the enemy will begin to recharge their shields, and then you're back to square one. Also, I put the disciple A-Rank because it is lightweight and has the ability to stagger, which is great for Vanguards and Adepts. 

There are only two mods yit doesn't have, so everyone takes EB and Clip on the Javelin.  At level X it is 30 shots.  The only downside to this weapon is if you don't know how to aim.  The shielded enemies duck for cover when you hit them with the first shot.  With the scope they can't hide from you and are sitting ducks.

Modifié par weezer1201, 18 juin 2012 - 12:32 .

[Necrotron]

Kem1995 wrote...

Black Widow should be S rank, why is it A rank?

Because it is a tier below the Krysae.

[MWaHa]

A Wild Snorlax wrote...

I don't really think the carnifex should in the highest tier tbh.

If they're both the same level it's nowhere near the paladin and talon.

Needs moar tiers.

Agreed. Talon and Paladin come perilously close to making the game EZ mode if you can aim.

[Deucetipher]

Is there argument for the Valiant over the black Widow by the combination of headshots and shieldgate? That is, the BW can take out shielded mooks on gold in two shots, but the Valiant can do the same thing with headshots, right? So, at least if you're really good, the valiant would be better with its various other advantages, already listed.
This is from the viewpoint of infils though. I'd check the math, but I don't know where to find the health/shield info for the various mooks.
If this is true, BW would only be better vs. the big bads, but would be worse vs. the mooks.  Most of the big bads aren't too terribke because of their limited mobility, and the focus fire of the mooks kills ya faster anyway.

Modifié par Deucetipher, 18 juin 2012 - 12:36 .

[veramis]

I strongly agree with 80% or so of the weapon ranking. A problem is there is 100% shieldgate in gold, so when javelin can kill almost anything in one shot in the body, it can only strip shields when used on shielded enemies. I think it's a great weapon on silver, but gold has way too many mooks running around and shielded too. I think eviscerator is a better weapon than disciple though, only thing I really disagree with in list.

[waakeegan]

Tangster wrote...

waakeegan wrote...
This is a huge asset on Gold Difficulty, because being able to contribute to taking out the big guys is more important than taking out the little guys.

Disagree. Taking out the little guys is more important, because in gold the little guys can actually kill you, while the bosses are easy to kite around/ignore.

And I disagree with you on that matter for anything except for Cerberus. Atlas' are slow and can be maneuvered around. Geth Primes, Ravagers, and Brutes are a different story. Geth Primes spawn annoying turrets that can see an Infiltrator through cloak for some strange reason and come equipped with nuclear bullets (fkin hate those things), not to mention Primes stun lock ANYTHING from like halfway across the map. Ravagers are easy to kill, but spawn swarmers that people usually ignore, and end up having to pay the price for it later, not to mention they snipe you from half way across the map and kill you in three shots with incredible accuracy. Brutes, when left alone, can corner you can make holding down a position impossible with his big ass in the way.