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[Shadow of Terror]

Singularity to prime any protection for biotic detonations if they are in range of it (it won't lift them however). Or singularity detonate (rank 6) to detonate on biotic explosions instead of just over time.

Singularity need something to make it worth using, and the first makes it a viable choice for constant damage via biotic explosions, while the second makes a difficult to pull off but very rewarding ability to singularity.

[GodlessPaladin]

Updated the first post due to today's balance changes.

Tactical Cloak Power
- Base cooldown reduced from 10 seconds to 8 seconds (Compensates for the
way the new duration affects Tactical Cloak's unique cooldown
mechanics.  The minimum cooldown remains the same)
- Base duration reduced to from 8 seconds to 4 seconds
- Base damage bonus increased from 50% to 60%
- Evolution 1 duration bonus increased from 40% to 150%
- Evolution 2 damage bonus decreased from 40% to 30% (10% moved to base damage bonus)
- Evolution 5 melee damage bonus decreased from 50% to 40%  (Because of changes to melee attacks)
- Evolution 6 damage bonus decreased from 40% to 25%, and tooltip changed
to clarify why it's different from other "%" bonuses.

Our ideas here were mostly implemented, with a few key differences!  Namely, BW's change cuts a flat 10% damage bonus off the base of Tactical Cloak, making the difference between old Tac Cloak and new Duration option 50% damage vs 30% damage we suggested, and the difference between old Tac Cloak and new Damage option 10% damage vs the 0% damage we suggested.  Also, the Evolution 6 change was intended to come alongside our SR buff suggestion.

Human Adept
- Base heavy melee damage increased from 250 to 425  (Great to see this increased to 500, which was my original, less conservative suggestion)
- Base light melee damage increased from 150 to 165

WEAPON CHANGES:

Black Widow Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [514.1-642.6] to [591.2-739.0]
- Weight range changed from [2.5-2.0] to [2.25-2.0]  (The weight range got changed to [2.3-2.0]!  So almost exactly)

Indra Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [62.6-78.2] to [72.0-89.9]
- Weight range changed from [1.25-0.7] to [1.25-1.0]  (The weight range got changed to [1.0-0.75]!)

Javelin Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [1030.5-1288.1] to [1236.6-1545.7]
- Weight range changed from [3.0-2.4] to [2.7-2.4]  (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

N7 Crusader Shotgun
- Damage increased from [486.6-608.3] to [559.6-699.5]
- Weight range changed from [2.5-2.0] to [2.0-1.7]  (Weight range was changed to [2.3-2.0]!)

Saber Assault Rifle
- Weight range changed from [2.0-1.4] to [1.7-1.4]  (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

Wraith Shotgun
- Weight range changed from [1.5-0.9] to [1.2 - 0.9] (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

So yeah, if nothing else, this means that Bioware is listening, which is pretty cool.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 27 juin 2012 - 01:20 .

[datako12]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Updated the first post due to today's balance changes.

Tactical Cloak Power
- Base cooldown reduced from 10 seconds to 8 seconds (Compensates for the
way the new duration affects Tactical Cloak's unique cooldown
mechanics.  The minimum cooldown remains the same)
- Base duration reduced to from 8 seconds to 4 seconds
- Base damage bonus increased from 50% to 60%
- Evolution 1 duration bonus increased from 40% to 150%
- Evolution 2 damage bonus decreased from 40% to 30% (10% moved to base damage bonus)
- Evolution 5 melee damage bonus decreased from 50% to 40%  (Because of changes to melee attacks)
- Evolution 6 damage bonus decreased from 40% to 25%, and tooltip changed
to clarify why it's different from other "%" bonuses.
Our ideas here were mostly implemented, with a few key differences!  Namely, BW's change cuts a flat 10% damage bonus off the base of Tactical Cloak, making the difference between old Tac Cloak and new Duration option 50% damage vs 30% damage we suggested, and the difference between old Tac Cloak and new Damage option 10% damage vs the 0% damage we suggested.  Also, the Evolution 6 change was intended to come alongside our SR buff suggestion.

Human Adept
- Base heavy melee damage increased from 250 to 425  (Great to see this increased to 500, which was my original, less conservative suggestion)
- Base light melee damage increased from 150 to 165

WEAPON CHANGES:

Black Widow Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [514.1-642.6] to [591.2-739.0]
- Weight range changed from [2.5-2.0] to [2.25-2.0]  (The weight range got changed to [2.3-2.0]!  So almost exactly)

Indra Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [62.6-78.2] to [72.0-89.9]
- Weight range changed from [1.25-0.7] to [1.25-1.0]  (The weight range got changed to [1.0-0.75]!)

Javelin Sniper Rifle
- Damage increased from [1030.5-1288.1] to [1236.6-1545.7]
- Weight range changed from [3.0-2.4] to [2.7-2.4]  (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

N7 Crusader Shotgun
- Damage increased from [486.6-608.3] to [559.6-699.5]
- Weight range changed from [2.5-2.0] to [2.0-1.7]  (Weight range was changed to [2.3-2.0]!)

Saber Assault Rifle
- Weight range changed from [2.0-1.4] to [1.7-1.4]  (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

Wraith Shotgun
- Weight range changed from [1.5-0.9] to [1.2 - 0.9] (My suggestion got implemented exactly!)

So yeah, if nothing else, this means that Bioware is listening, which is pretty cool.

when i read the balance changes today, i was like damn GP when did you replace Fagnan, then i saw it was still Fagnan  (not that Fagnan is terrible or anything)  although he did forget to mention the fact that common character cards now have the same exp value that uncommon character cards did (62500k) so that recruit packs are now the best for leveling (would actually be true even if PSPs still trolled us with character cards)

[capn233]

Ha unfortunately I made some posts around the time of the HM nerf that they should cut 10% of the general purpose damage out of Cloak and reduce SR damage bonus to 25%.

I think though that the SR damage reduction should certainly have been with a bit of a rifle buff, and I did end up starting to think that the cloak you guys came up with was fairly decent (except for general damage) if the rifle changes would have been implemented as well.  Although I liked base duration of 5s, but beggars can't be choosers.

In any event, like I claimed in the other thread, the metagame will likely be max damage infiltrators, with a little more bias towards shotguns compared to before this change. That is assuming some level of understanding and sophistication among the players. Oblivious ones will just wonder why their cloak and rifles aren't working as well.

Modifié par capn233, 27 juin 2012 - 01:56 .

[Mysterious Stranger 0.0]

Gratz on the devs using the exact numbers from some of your suggestions GP.

[Metal Vile]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Phoenix light melee does 400 damage according to the "whipmanmeleepassive" entry in the DLC ini. Interesting file name choices... I also proposed a buff for it, but haven't posted it up in the OP yet (the original melee rebalance didn't include Rebellion characters because I didn't have access to the hard game file data on their melee yet).

Other notes: Phoenix Light Melee tracks enemies much like most heavy melees, whereas the Geth light melee doesn't really. It also has very little recovery and you can combo off of it.  It also potentially serves a purpose e.g. not sending enemies flying like the whip melee does, letting you light-->heavy them to finish them and get the power synergy.

Apologies for spewing incorrect figures.  Not sure where I heard that number from before.  Also, LoL at the ini entry name.

Seriously, try testing out the Phoenix Light Melee repeatedly.  Because I often get tracking issues where the character does not lock on when I am clearly within the typically melee lock-on distance, which results in my character not dashing up, subsequently swinging at nothing but air with the baton.

Although, on a bit further reflection, I think perhaps the problem (or maybe my problem) is that unlike most of the other melee attacks, the Phoenix Light Melee does NOT have any movement inherent to the action.  Most Heavy Melees have a forward motion attached to the animation.  This may also explain my problem with Drell Light Melee, which is another melee set with no inherent movement properties.

Given this is the case, perhaps they should enhance the lock-on distance for these melee sets?  Just a thought.

[Drummernate]

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly increasing damage...

Easy mode for non-infiltrators now.

Refuse to play.

Not only that.... but of course there is the whole:

"Character card fix!!! Barely more powerful ammo power!!!"

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

Modifié par Drummernate, 27 juin 2012 - 05:08 .

[GodlessPaladin]

Drummernate wrote...

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No
I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other
than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly
increasing damage...

Easy mode for non-infiltrators now.

Refuse to play.

Not only that.... but of course there is the whole:

"Character card fix!!! Barely more powerful ammo power!!!"

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

Since when do you play anything other than Infiltrator, Drummernate?

Nevermind that your comments, as usual, are just uninformed trolling.  Nothing in BW's latest balance changes buffed the maximum potential of anything (minimum weights of all the weapons remained the same) except for the Human Adept's heavy melee attack, which was obviously underpowered.  Oh noes, the Human Adept got a better melee attack!  Boo hoo, game ruined, easy mode for eveyone who's not an Infiltrator.  Right.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 27 juin 2012 - 05:29 .

[DarkerCompanion]

Drummernate wrote...

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly increasing damage...

Easy mode for non-infiltrators now.

Refuse to play.

Not only that.... but of course there is the whole:

"Character card fix!!! Barely more powerful ammo power!!!"

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

Infiltrators lose power, and then the game becomes easy mode for non-infiltrators? Where is that logic.

[ol MISAKA lo]

DarkerCompanion wrote...

Infiltrators lose power, and then the game becomes easy mode for non-infiltrators? Where is that logic.

That's what I said in my thread.  Nerfing the INF will not magically make everything better.  All your going to get now is slayer-infiltrators.  Hope y'all like doing those 1234 objectives you wanted so badly, cuz us slayers aren't going anywhere near those with a 30 meter pole.

[Drummernate]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Drummernate wrote...

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No
I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other
than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly
increasing damage...

Easy mode for non-infiltrators now.

Refuse to play.

Not only that.... but of course there is the whole:

"Character card fix!!! Barely more powerful ammo power!!!"

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

Since when do you play anything other than Infiltrator, Drummernate?

Nevermind that your comments, as usual, are just uninformed trolling.  Nothing in BW's latest balance changes buffed the maximum potential of anything (minimum weights of all the weapons remained the same) except for the Human Adept's heavy melee attack, which was obviously underpowered.  Oh noes, the Human Adept got a better melee attack!  Boo hoo, game ruined, easy mode for eveyone who's not an Infiltrator.  Right.

Since forever... nice try though!

Another uninformed post from GodlessPaladin thinking he is smarter & better than me...

Nevermind that you are never correct about anything you post about me.

Power based classes now have a HUGE buff to almost every gun in the game since the recent patches.

Modifié par Drummernate, 27 juin 2012 - 05:51 .

[GodlessPaladin]

And now you put flame bait in your sig.  Always classy.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 27 juin 2012 - 05:58 .

[Geist.H]

Well done Godless. I hope Bioware continues like this.

[Drummernate]

GodlessPaladin wrote...

And now you put flame bait in your sig. classy.

Hey, I am not the one that calls people out on their knowledge every time they post anything.


That was an extremely stupid thing to say. So it deserves to be in my sig.

Modifié par Drummernate, 27 juin 2012 - 06:01 .

[GodlessPaladin]

Drummernate wrote...
That was an extremely stupid thing to say. So it deserves to be in my sig.

No, extremely stupid things to say are things like "The Carnifex is arguably one of the most inaccurate guns in the game" or bragging about how you're right about the Hurricane because you have a 15,000 word essay about Battlefield 3 (and your BF3 essay you linked wasn't actually even close to 15,000 words) or criticizing people for being "too logical" or claiming that people "stole" your builds even if they're not at all similar (in fact speccing fully into an ability tree you put zero points into, which is about as different as ME3 builds get) or saying that casters just got a huge buff to almost every gun in the game when not a single gun got a minimum weight decrease and only 6 guns got changed (half of which had and still have a weight of 2.0 or more), and that that somehow makes the game "easy mode" for non-Infiltrators.  Those are all examples of stupid things to say, Nate.

Whereas my comment was simply a tongue-in-cheek question based on your own comments about your enthusiasm for the Geth as well as my experience playing with you.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 27 juin 2012 - 06:51 .

[TehMerc]

Drummernate wrote...
That was an extremely stupid thing to say. So it deserves to be in my sig.

Going by that logic, why isn't half of what you've said in there? Or people whining about the TC balance notes?

[rcolol]

Drummernate wrote...

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly increasing damage...

Easy mode for non-infiltrators now.

Refuse to play.

Not only that.... but of course there is the whole:

"Character card fix!!! Barely more powerful ammo power!!!"

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

Please explain how the game 'feels like crap now' or 'easy mode for non-infiltrators'.

BioWare has implemented some suggestions because they were well-thought out and reasonable, and from what I've seen so far on gold, Infiltrators are still total powerhouses. Just that now, you have to choose between utility and damage, which it should've been from the whole time.

Quit whining, 'refuse to play' if you want, there are still many, many people who appreciate BioWare listening and making changes.

[Metal Vile]

ol MISAKA lo wrote...

DarkerCompanion wrote...

Infiltrators lose power, and then the game becomes easy mode for non-infiltrators? Where is that logic.

That's what I said in my thread.  Nerfing the INF will not magically make everything better.  All your going to get now is slayer-infiltrators.  Hope y'all like doing those 1234 objectives you wanted so badly, cuz us slayers aren't going anywhere near those with a 30 meter pole.

God forbid you need to actually take a risk to complete an objective, like EVERY OTHER class in the game.  And it]s STILL less risky for you, because you can actually GET to the objective while invisible at least part of the time.

[Geist.H]

The fact that Bioware decided to adopt Godless ideas should be enough to end this pointless argument. Infiltrators were dominating the game to an unacceptable level, Bioware took action, the incriminated ability got slightly nerfed: Good players will adapt, FOTM losers will whine and ragequit/reroll next FOTM.

It's how it always goes.

PS: Prime still dies in 1 and a half Hurricane clip, just need rank IV gear.

[Atheosis]

Wow Drummernate, you sure on the war path. If only you could make a single argument that wasn't based on hyperbole and purely illogical emotionalism...

[Jebel Krong]

Drummernate wrote...

Wow... if Bioware listens to all these suggestions this game will be completely ruined beyond repair.

Just like 3 or 4 of these have been implemented and the game feels totally crap now.

No I don't only play Infiltrator, but they keep buffing everything other than Infiltrators and reducing the weight on stuff and pointlessly increasing damage...

Yeah.... thanks... ya really solved the main issue there Bioware!

agreed. once again the "community" ruins a game. ruining the infiltrator class ruins the game for me - i like capping objectives but i wont even bother now. no headshot bonuses on bosses, remove all the skill for actually aiming.

[Kronner]

Good to see that BioWare really looks at all the data they have available. Tons of other great suggestions are posted in the original post, and I hope BioWare takes inspiration from them again.

[ka243]

Well you got your tc nerf and no sniper damage buffs. The success rate on gold random
Public matches will now drop. More people will play fbwgg as a result because its the only gold they can finish now. 

Yes im upset about this. I want my unwavering achievement! I dont think im likely to get it now..

Modifié par ka243, 27 juin 2012 - 09:55 .

[Arundel Vandraman]

Good work, GP. Your ideas were largely implemented. A lot of the infis seem to be missing that sniper rifles being lighter will mean shorter cool downs between invisibility sessions, which is a little bit of sweetness to counter the changes to TC base duration. Overall, very nice.

I do hope they patch up some of the non-functioning talents and evolutions next, though. A thread from GP, devoted to that, perhaps?

[Gladerunner]

I dont see Biotic Sphere, and that REALLY needs a buff.