296 réponses à ce sujet

[Raging Nug]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

My heart bleeds for the cheating pieces of trash. Really.

Stop blaming BioWare for banning them. It's THEIR FAULT. And ONLY their fault. They broke the rules - knowingly. They cheated - knowingly. They got caught. So screw em.

Bioware banned them. How is their reaction anyone's fault but their own?
Yes, terms of service are absolute, but their reaction and damage control could use work.

Oh, and Pac-Man is COMPLETELY exploitable. The ghosts use a pattern in how they move, and if you know the pattern, you can find safe spots in the maze where they will never path to and be completely and utterly safe.

That's a game mechanic and a feature. The fact that you can exploit doesn't mean we should ban everyone who uses it, does it?

So no, no game is 100% exploit-free and your demands that BioWare make a 100% exploit free game instead of banning the scumbags who use exploits is completely and utterly asinine.

Is it asanine because it doesn't make sense to you or because you disagree with it? Either way I'm not impressed with your post. There's not a whole lot of content here - I'm just feeling lots of rage coming from you.

Yes... yes... use your hate. Soon your journey to the dark side will be complete!

[Siran]

Raging Nug wrote...


Not everything, but the major exploits that are apparently worth banning people over? Yeah, it would be nice if they could fix those.

I'm pretty sure you just can't patch away the coalesced.ini from mass effect without breaking the whole game. It's a fundamental part of it. Why it is not encrypted I don't know. But that would most likely only slow cheaters down, not prevent it.

I understand perfectly fine. I just don't give a damn. Live and let live.

So, because you don't give a damn, you just let everyone else's game get ruined? Got it, thank you very much.

Only in a randomized reward system. Otherwise the need for farming decreases as people unlock the things they actually want.

Not every game is the same. ME3's item reward system is just as randomized as Diablo III's. Don't like it? Don't play it. It's not as if you weren't aware of it...

Because cheaters always cheat, always, and never play for fun. :
If people lose interest, they lose interest. Maybe new content comes out and they come back. If people are banned, they're a lot less likely to come back

And it's good they don't come back, they'd just as likely begin to cheat anew. They never learnt it's not OK to cheat! It's not that I say they're not having fun, but they ruin the fun of others in the process! And a reward that is not obtained in the way it was meant to is pretty hollow, don't you think?

The original Pac-man and Donkey Kong disagree.
Unless there are exploits for those games I'm unaware of. I don't think there are though.

You're wrong, on both accounts: The Original Arcade Pac-Man very much has an exploit, the Arcade Donkey Kong has several. And those games where just a few lines of code then. The games today are infinitely more complex, as are the bugs and exploits they can have.

Modifié par Siran, 20 juin 2012 - 08:00 .

[Astartes Marine]

Raging Nug wrote...

Sure it is. Here I am, debating it. Doing a decent job too, I think.
What I'm debating isn't that they should be punished, but rather how and why. Banning people is a knee-jerk reaction. A probational sentence or reduced credit gain or some other thing might be more interesting like rewarding people who haven't cheated, but that would be good customer relations, and it's not like we're talking about Valve here.

You're too soft.  It's a good reaction from BioWare, I love zero tolerance policies on cheaters.
Those players cheated, they abused the system, they got exactly what they deserved.  Hopefully they learn from their lesson and play legit when their bans end.

Raging Nug wrote...
Oo, scum. Yeah, because someone else having more credits than you detracts from your gaming experience. :
I
understand that the matches themselves wouldn't be very interesting,
but I don't take issue with people doing it in their own private
lobbies.

They cheated in what amounts to the matchmaking service, private lobbies mean nothing as all rewards gained are universal across public/private.  They abused exploits to get things unfairly and they were rightly corrected by BioWare.  They cheated, they are scum in my eyes. 

[Raging Nug]

"Hopefully they learn from their lesson and play legit when their bans end."

End? Who said anything about bans ending? More to the point, why would they come back to a game they were kicked from?

Like I said, this isn't something we're likely to agree on. A lot of you seem a little too draconian "Rah! Kill the witch!" for my liking. I don't care that people get more credits than me. That you do kind of makes me question your motives for playing in the first place. Like I said last page, I moved on from ME3 a couple weeks ago - I don't think it's fun anymore. That your experience relies so heavily on the moral integrity of total strangers you've probably never played with and will never meet isn't something you can justify. Breaking the terms of service isn't justifiable either, but that said, Bioware could still be doing a better job with their damage control and customer relations.

[greghorvath]

Thomas Abram wrote...

Raging Nug wrote...

That said, I'm not arguing that they didn't deserve a ban. That's not my point. My point was made clear in my earlier post where I quoted the board meeting, which was that Bioware would rather ban players than fix the game. It was released months ago, it's still broken, and now they're making an already-shrinking community smaller.

You're talking about two seperate divisions here. If we were to ban 0 people patches wouldn't come out any quicker. If we were to ban 1,000,000 people patches wouldn't come out any slower.

Actually, he is talking about what makes sense and what doesn't.

[Kev87]

guess that is why there was no balance changes yesterday.

[Siran]

Raging Nug wrote...

Like I said, this isn't something we're likely to agree on. A lot of you seem a little too draconian "Rah! Kill the witch!" for my liking. I don't care that people get more credits than me. That you do kind of makes me question your motives for playing in the first place.

As soon as you don't have any arguments left, you switch to questioning peoples motives and imply them being the morally "bad" ones. Yet you still don't understand. I don't care if they have more credits than me provided they earned them. If they cheated, they did not earn them. It's that simple. Credits are part of the reward system of ME3 MP and therefore part of the fun: I enjoy opening every Pack I bought with the credits I earned the game before which was fun playing with the weapons, characters, gear and mods I earned.

That your experience relies so heavily on the moral integrity of total strangers you've probably never played with and will never meet isn't something you can justify.

I want to play a game that's the same for everyone. I want to play a game where I don't have to ask myself if the host has done something to his ini-file after joining each random lobby. I want to see the progress I've made (be it playstyle-wise or equipment-wise) compared to others (yes, even in a co-op game there can be some competition). This is all not possible if cheating does not get punished and spreads.

[Astartes Marine]

Raging Nug wrote...
"Hopefully they learn from their lesson and play legit when their bans end."

End? Who said anything about bans ending? More to the point, why would they come back to a game they were kicked from?

I highly doubt a first offense earns a permanent ban from the game right off the bat, more likely it's a temporary one for a few days or a week. 
As to why?  If they enjoy the game they may, if not then that's their choice.  I wouldn't miss them, don't need any infinite rocket bums in my matches no thank you.

Raging Nug wrote...
Like
I said, this isn't something we're likely to agree on. A lot of you
seem a little too draconian "Rah! Kill the witch!" for my liking.

There's nothing wrong with draconian justice as long as it's pointed at the right offender for the right offense.  All it means is "of great severity" after all. 

Raging Nug wrote...

I
don't care that people get more credits than me. That you do kind of
makes me question your motives for playing in the first place.

YOU MISS THE POINT.  The credits are not the point, the methods used ARE.  They abused glitches and exploits, THAT is why they got banned.  THAT is why I see them as scum. 

Raging Nug wrote...

That your experience relies so heavily on the moral
integrity of total strangers you've probably never played with and will
never meet isn't something you can justify.

No idea where this came from, but my experience with the game relies on nothing from them.  I merely see them as scum for cheating, nothing more.

Raging Nug wrote...

but that said, Bioware could still be
doing a better job with their damage control and customer
relations.

In your opinion. 

I think they're doing a fine job punishing the fools who deserve it.  As for customer relations...well we did get two free DLCs with characters, maps, guns, etc. and weekly tweaks to the game.

[ElementL09]

Its a quick fix, banning people I mean. Its always quicker to ban someone for doing something in the game that shouldn't be there in first place then fix the issue itself. While I can understand both sides of the arguement (they cheated/less people to play/matchmake with), it is what is in this industry.

Now cheating in a co-op game hardly makes that person scum Astartes Marine, well in my opinion they aren't scum. Their cheating to earn credits, why should they be considered scum by you because they used an exploit or glitch in the game (glitches and exploits that should have honestly and probably should have been fixed by now)?

Cheating or using a glitch or exploit doesn't effect me at all. Uh oh, someones using the infinite rocket glitch, whatever, atleast that someone can deal with those pesky rocket troopers. Theres always usually one person who does exceedingly well in game without exploiting or glitching it, so this honestly doesn't effect me in the slightest, if anything its entertaining.

Also, about the host wave 10 thing, just leave the game, plan and simple. I leave lobbies and games all time if I find or predict something is going to go wrong or it isn't to my liking.

Cheaters shouldn't even be considered as scum because what they do most likely doesn't effect other players, while this is from my experience as I can't speak for others, I would rather have a cheater in my game then a bunch of randoms who don't know what there doing.

So hey, you cheated, but your not scum in my book, just try not to cheat next time, k

[iTz JoNeSy]

Eh. The rocket glitch is funny. Nobody should be banned for using it but it should be fixed. Did bungie go around banning people for double shotting the BR? Nope. Plus, how many times have bioware ruined the fun? Servers crashing? Hunters not dying? Losing all are credits and weapons when the game first came out? The rocket glitch is just making up for all the time we've wasted on this broken game.

[SilentBacon]

I'm glad they are laying the ban hammer down...keep it up bioware. Play the game right or don't play it at all, you deserve to be banned for your attempts at ruining the experience for others.

[jpraelster93]

Fix the game bioware please

[Jadebaby]

Thomas Abram wrote...

Raging Nug wrote...

That said, I'm not arguing that they didn't deserve a ban. That's not my point. My point was made clear in my earlier post where I quoted the board meeting, which was that Bioware would rather ban players than fix the game. It was released months ago, it's still broken, and now they're making an already-shrinking community smaller.

You're talking about two seperate divisions here. If we were to ban 0 people patches wouldn't come out any quicker. If we were to ban 1,000,000 people patches wouldn't come out any slower.

So should've done the whole Stanley Woo  deal...

[jpraelster93]

Thomas Abram wrote...

Raging Nug wrote...

That said, I'm not arguing that they didn't deserve a ban. That's not my point. My point was made clear in my earlier post where I quoted the board meeting, which was that Bioware would rather ban players than fix the game. It was released months ago, it's still broken, and now they're making an already-shrinking community smaller.

You're talking about two seperate divisions here. If we were to ban 0 people patches wouldn't come out any quicker. If we were to ban 1,000,000 people patches wouldn't come out any slower.

It is still no excuse for you advertising fixes via a patch then not following up

[l Saminator l]

Wonder if anyone in the top 100 of the leaderboards has been dropped out? If they're still farming, they must have been pretty high up if they kept doing it enough to receive a ban.

[JMC002]

N R Nuclear Sam wrote...

Wonder if anyone in the top 100 of the leaderboards has been dropped out? If they're still farming, they must have been pretty high up if they kept doing it enough to receive a ban.

Quite a few of the top 100 world-wide were removed in both "waves" of bans; both times, I moved up quite a few places. For example, after wave 2, I moved up from 109 world-wide to 91.

[Cricketer15]

the game is still quite broken, some people might get ban because of that, an accident glitch they did and people think they are cheating thus reporting them. like the other day, i was playing random, and some other dude was hosting. was on firebase white, some guy died on the back area and respawn in the LZ, the guy that died was a newbie and thought that the host had some kind of hack and said he was reporting the host, then he left. then the medi gel when u use it at the very last second of a countdown and died for 3 seconds then come back to life, that happens a bit when ur lagging, but newbies think you're hacking and they report you lol. and then some guy had the vanguard glitch and was out of the map, and this guy was like , how did you get there, are u hacking then he just left the match lol.? i say bioware should fix the game up

Modifié par Cricketer15, 20 juin 2012 - 11:50 .

[JMC002]

Cricketer15 wrote...

the game is still quite broken, some people might get ban because of that, an accident glitch they did and people think they are cheating thus reporting them. like the other day, i was playing random, and some other dude was hosting. was on firebase white, some guy died on the back area and respawn in the LZ, the guy that died was a newbie and thought that the host had some kind of hack and said he was reporting the host, then he left. then the medi gel when u use it at the very last second of a countdown and died for 3 seconds then come back to life, that happens a bit when ur lagging, but newbies think you're hacking and they report you lol. and then some guy had the vanguard glitch and was out of the map, and this guy was like , how did you get there, are u hacking then he just left the match lol.? i say bioware should fix the game up

Yeah, that's a known bug on Firebase White. But I doubt ppl are being banned after just one report.

[Cricketer15]

JMC002 wrote...

Cricketer15 wrote...

the game is still quite broken, some people might get ban because of that, an accident glitch they did and people think they are cheating thus reporting them. like the other day, i was playing random, and some other dude was hosting. was on firebase white, some guy died on the back area and respawn in the LZ, the guy that died was a newbie and thought that the host had some kind of hack and said he was reporting the host, then he left. then the medi gel when u use it at the very last second of a countdown and died for 3 seconds then come back to life, that happens a bit when ur lagging, but newbies think you're hacking and they report you lol. and then some guy had the vanguard glitch and was out of the map, and this guy was like , how did you get there, are u hacking then he just left the match lol.? i say bioware should fix the game up

Yeah, that's a known bug on Firebase White. But I doubt ppl are being banned after just one report.

newbies dont know that so they think every bug is a hack. 

Modifié par Cricketer15, 20 juin 2012 - 11:56 .

[3XT3RM1N4TUS]

When you ban one - it's a tragedy, when you ban million - it's statistics.

[Siran]

3XT3RM1N4TUS wrote...

When you ban one - it's a tragedy, when you ban million - it's statistics.

And what if you ban thousands? 

[3XT3RM1N4TUS]

Siran wrote...

3XT3RM1N4TUS wrote...

When you ban one - it's a tragedy, when you ban million - it's statistics.

And what if you ban thousands? 

It's obviously tragic statistics.

[78stonewobble]

Well I'd love to be able to spawn 20 cerberus turrets as my own just to turn the tables for once. Like this

In a non public, non xp/credit earning game obviously (modded game that doesn't count for anything).

Just to satisfy my own bloodlust and sentrygun building fetish.

EDIT: Uhm what I meant to say is that not all cheats are "teh evil" towards others.

Modifié par 78stonewobble, 20 juin 2012 - 12:55 .

[kiltysue]

Thanks for banning known cheater/exploiters Bioware!

And for the confused few in this thread, that is not a
condemnation of 1000+ strangers. Applauding Bioware
for banning cheaters in no way labels cheaters as "teh
evil". It's just a ban from a game for cheating. People
that are banned for cheating can appeal the ban and
come back if they wish. Banned people can also
create a new ME3 account (and hopefully not cheat on
that account). Or, they can just move on to another
game that is more tolerant of cheating. There are
plenty of games available that do nothing about
cheating.

[Feauce]

A quick note before I begin...

BioWare wrote...

We at BioWare take cheating very seriously. We want to keep multiplayer as clean and fun as possible and that means maintaining a policy of zero tolerance against cheaters.

Offences & Disciplinary Breakdown

Below is the breakdown of offences and the guidelines we use when determining the appropriate punishment per offence. BioWare reserves the right to take whatever action we deem necessary to reprimand/deter cheaters.

“Tier One” offences are considered the most heinous and will usually result in a ME3 MP ban.

This includes but is not limited to:
- N7 leaderboard exploitation
- Credit exploitation via editing your INI settings
- Aimbot

“Tier Two” offences are the most wide spread abuses and although these will usually result in a ME3 MP ban, certain cases (such as self-reporting) will be handled case by case and will usually result in a credit wipe.

This includes but is not limited to:
- Credit exploitation via host migration
- INI editing to increase your personal performance
- Illegitimate weapon/character/consumable/etc. rank
- Recruiting for credit exploitation via host migration
- Item “x” exploitation

Bolded sections for emphasis. Seems to me like they're pretty serious about dealing with people that glitch/cheat for credits. At the same time, it looks like they're pretty serious about not banning those that report such glitches. Interesting...

Optimus J wrote...

I was not banned, I just lost the interest.

Are we to assume you cheated, then? If not, what purpose does this statement even serve? If so, why would you say that on BioWare's own forums?

death_for_sale wrote...

Because if you don't, ... <snip>

This is entirely true. If a person still don't understand after reading death_for_sale's post, and some others that came before, I don't believe they ever will. That, or they do know better, just choose not to care, and only act as though they don't. You know, now that I think of it, there's another word for people that misrepresent their actions, intentions, ideas, or even themselves as a whole... We call them liars.

Raging Nug wrote...

I lost interest in the game itself a while ago - haven't played, and don't feel bothered enough to farm credits. I'll only play now if my girlfriend wants to play, but to be honest, we're doing Fable II at the moment, so ME3 seems unlikely.

If you've lost interest in the game, why are you here standing up for cheaters? Why do you still visit the forums? You've willingly removed yourself (possibly temporarily, possibly not; makes no difference) from the multiplayer community, so what right do you have to argue who BioWare allows to be a part of it?

Raging Nug wrote...

People farm credits in response to the RNG system - some people don't like waiting around to unlock gear/character cards, so they get as many credits as they can as quickly as they can. Some turn to using exploits, but the goal is the same - get credits.

People rob banks in response to the skewed economic/social structure. They don't like waiting around for a good job, an education, or HARD WORK to get them what they want, so they go after as much money as they can as quickly as they can. Of course, some people don't do this, but bank robbers are just fine, right? Their goal is the same as everyone else - to get money and live a comfortable life.

People who cheat at the game are stealing credits from it. If a person took advantage of, for example, the credit-farming glitch where you'd get 40k+ every 4-5 minutes for a collective total of ~9 hours or more, that would net them over 4mil credits. Assuming a full lobby, you've got four people, so that comes out to ~16.6mil credits total. That works out to ~$1000 stolen, which in many states constitutes a felony. The minimum sentance for any felony is one year, and many are much higher than that.

So alright, I'm in a generous mood, let's grant the notion for a moment that we should not ban these people permanently; let's just ban them for a year. Do you think they'll come back? You said yourself, why would a person come back to a game that kicked them out? Given that, what's the functional difference between them not coming back to the game and getting a permanent ban for stealing from it? In both cases they're still 100% gone from the community.