660 réponses à ce sujet

[staindgrey]

terdferguson123 wrote...

Man, I sorta think Bioware is making a mistake with this DLC. I know exactly whats going to happen. The DLC could be excellent, but there will still be a good chunk of people who are angry because they aren't changing what happens, and of course ignorant "They lied to us!" posts will be everywhere just like they are right now.

The point is, nobody wants to admit it, but a good chunk of the people who still hate on the ending, secretly WANT to hate it. It's some kind of mental disorder where people think that being miserable somehow gives value to their lives, and they will continue to produce that misery wherever they can because it "empowers" them. Sad.

A lot of people discontent with the ending don't fully understand why they dislike it. The core issues involve problems within the narrative itself (i.e. bad storytelling), and it all revolves around the starchild. The core of ME as a series (characters at the center of the experience, evolving choices and consequences, somewhat grounded sci-fi) is thrown out in the final moments in favor of character exclusion, choice nullification in the favor of a crunched number and one "final decision" that is tangent to all others before it and a total disregard for grounding the sci-fi in anything, favoring "space magic" instead.

People will hop on here and complain about the lack of a certain LI's participation, or plot holes, etc. But those are all forgiveable. It's the core issues that should have never made it out of the rough draft. And by the way Bioware has spoken, this DLC won't fix those very issues; it'll just "clarify" them.

Listen. There's a big difference between subjective and objective, and the ending is objectively bad in terms of narrative. Subjectively is up to the person playing. The new ending enhancements may make it more subjectively good for any of us, but if it's still objectively bad, then no, I'm not going to suddenly be satisfied. I expect better from Bioware, a company that prides itself on its storytelling above all else. A fanfiction-esque mess up to this degree should be inexcusible, yet they stand behind their faulty foundation with the excuse of artistic integrity. "Artistic integrity" applies to the subjective, not the objective.

[mebtru]

What i really want (and i don't think we will get it on the DLC) is epic battles showing your war assests (rachnni, elcor, mercenaries, Geth, krogan, etc. etc.) fighting endless waves of Reapers and its minions, your squadmates fighting showing the results of helping them, or the result if they died, (i still don't get how Jacob just decided to settle and have a family in the middle of the imminent extinction), watching and interacting with the result of the decision you made over the 3 games, getting a chance to fight or at least talk with the big enemy that taunted, chased, killed me, during all the games Harbinger, i want to see those multiple endings where the outcome really change depending of your choices.

I can think of a lot more things but if they included that i think they can fix the game, well there is only 1 day left i really hope they saw their flaws and give the great trilogy the ending it deserves, if not, well they just killed a great game because they did not want to listen, and wanted to "preserve" their artistic integrity (even if they didn't respect the artistic integrity of their own members).

[Pinkflu]

So does anyone know when it will be on Origin? Is it worth me staying up?

[Kuciowski]

No, probably it'll be in 30 or so hours

[Pinkflu]

Kuciowski wrote...

No, probably it'll be in 30 or so hours

Thanks.

Damn. Work is going to be torture tomorrow!

[mad_yojik]

I wonder why the lots of people stay so pessimistic about it... Though I presume there will be some issues that would not be adressed (like "space magic", but I dont care, since that "magic" is here from the start of the series, or anyone care to explain how the "mass effect fields" and fundamental law of energy conservation go along), but if they put in some good epilogue and maybe cutscenes with "assets" - it will make ending a way better, even without changing a letter in a dialogue (though I suspect there will be a lot more the just ending cutscene reworked). I really dont see why the people complaining, its not like EC going to make anything worse.

Modifié par mad_yojik, 25 juin 2012 - 09:46 .

[Feanor_II]

By the way a question I would like to have answered:

I live in Spain,I guess that because of timezones etc.... it won't be ready for Tuesday morning and I'll have to wait until the night, when I return from work....... right?

[Coreniro]

staindgrey wrote...

terdferguson123 wrote...

Man, I sorta think Bioware is making a mistake with this DLC. I know exactly whats going to happen. The DLC could be excellent, but there will still be a good chunk of people who are angry because they aren't changing what happens, and of course ignorant "They lied to us!" posts will be everywhere just like they are right now.

The point is, nobody wants to admit it, but a good chunk of the people who still hate on the ending, secretly WANT to hate it. It's some kind of mental disorder where people think that being miserable somehow gives value to their lives, and they will continue to produce that misery wherever they can because it "empowers" them. Sad.

A lot of people discontent with the ending don't fully understand why they dislike it. The core issues involve problems within the narrative itself (i.e. bad storytelling), and it all revolves around the starchild. The core of ME as a series (characters at the center of the experience, evolving choices and consequences, somewhat grounded sci-fi) is thrown out in the final moments in favor of character exclusion, choice nullification in the favor of a crunched number and one "final decision" that is tangent to all others before it and a total disregard for grounding the sci-fi in anything, favoring "space magic" instead.

People will hop on here and complain about the lack of a certain LI's participation, or plot holes, etc. But those are all forgiveable. It's the core issues that should have never made it out of the rough draft. And by the way Bioware has spoken, this DLC won't fix those very issues; it'll just "clarify" them.

Listen. There's a big difference between subjective and objective, and the ending is objectively bad in terms of narrative. Subjectively is up to the person playing. The new ending enhancements may make it more subjectively good for any of us, but if it's still objectively bad, then no, I'm not going to suddenly be satisfied. I expect better from Bioware, a company that prides itself on its storytelling above all else. A fanfiction-esque mess up to this degree should be inexcusible, yet they stand behind their faulty foundation with the excuse of artistic integrity. "Artistic integrity" applies to the subjective, not the objective.

It's objectively bad because you say so, and that's subjective. You're assuming that those who had a great experience with the whole story (including the ending), those who looked into these issues you wrote, only because you and others like you raised them, and found a good answer to all of them, are objectively wrong. They're not.  And it's not objectively bad because you wrote it in bold font. 

[Random Geth]

Coreniro wrote...

staindgrey wrote...

terdferguson123 wrote...

Man, I sorta think Bioware is making a mistake with this DLC. I know exactly whats going to happen. The DLC could be excellent, but there will still be a good chunk of people who are angry because they aren't changing what happens, and of course ignorant "They lied to us!" posts will be everywhere just like they are right now.

The point is, nobody wants to admit it, but a good chunk of the people who still hate on the ending, secretly WANT to hate it. It's some kind of mental disorder where people think that being miserable somehow gives value to their lives, and they will continue to produce that misery wherever they can because it "empowers" them. Sad.

A lot of people discontent with the ending don't fully understand why they dislike it. The core issues involve problems within the narrative itself (i.e. bad storytelling), and it all revolves around the starchild. The core of ME as a series (characters at the center of the experience, evolving choices and consequences, somewhat grounded sci-fi) is thrown out in the final moments in favor of character exclusion, choice nullification in the favor of a crunched number and one "final decision" that is tangent to all others before it and a total disregard for grounding the sci-fi in anything, favoring "space magic" instead.

People will hop on here and complain about the lack of a certain LI's participation, or plot holes, etc. But those are all forgiveable. It's the core issues that should have never made it out of the rough draft. And by the way Bioware has spoken, this DLC won't fix those very issues; it'll just "clarify" them.

Listen. There's a big difference between subjective and objective, and the ending is objectively bad in terms of narrative. Subjectively is up to the person playing. The new ending enhancements may make it more subjectively good for any of us, but if it's still objectively bad, then no, I'm not going to suddenly be satisfied. I expect better from Bioware, a company that prides itself on its storytelling above all else. A fanfiction-esque mess up to this degree should be inexcusible, yet they stand behind their faulty foundation with the excuse of artistic integrity. "Artistic integrity" applies to the subjective, not the objective.

It's objectively bad because you say so, and that's subjective. You're assuming that those who had a great experience with the whole story (including the ending), those who looked into these issues you wrote, only because you and others like you raised them, and found a good answer to all of them, are objectively wrong. They're not.  And it's not objectively bad because you wrote it in bold font. 

You obviously don't understand what you're discussing, so let me try to help you out.

What you're talking about is enjoyment.  What staindgrey is talking about is narrative structure, progression, and basic storytelling necessities.  The former is subjective. The latter is not.  You can enjoy an objectively bad narrative, but such things do exist.

[mad_yojik]

By the way I have a similar question - when the EC it will be avalible in Russia? I mean in our time zone (GMT+4:00).

[mad_yojik]

What you're talking about is enjoyment.  What staindgrey is talking about is narrative structure, progression, and basic storytelling necessities.  The former is subjective. The latter is not.  You can enjoy an objectively bad narrative, but such things do exist.

Strange. How the narrative can be "objectively bad", as there is no objective criteria exists to it being bad (or good either). The only way to rate such things is quite subjective itself (either "I like it " or "I dont like it"). Storytelling, music and movies isnt science, you know <_<.

Modifié par mad_yojik, 25 juin 2012 - 10:38 .

[Starshadow2010]

:(with cautious optimism) I hope it will be worth it. 1.9 GB is almost 20% of vanilla game's size.

Modifié par Starshadow2010, 25 juin 2012 - 11:03 .

[Coreniro]

[quote]Random Geth wrote...



It's objectively bad because you say so, and that's subjective. You're assuming that those who had a great experience with the whole story (including the ending), those who looked into these issues you wrote, only because you and others like you raised them, and found a good answer to all of them, are objectively wrong. They're not.  And it's not objectively bad because you wrote it in bold font. 



[/quote]

You obviously don't understand what you're discussing, so let me try to help you out.

What you're talking about is enjoyment.  What staindgrey is talking about is narrative structure, progression, and basic storytelling necessities.  The former is subjective. The latter is not.  You can enjoy an objectively bad narrative, but such things do exist.

[/quote]



"those who looked into these issues yuo wrote and found a good answer to all of them". Do I need to write it in bold font to make you understand? There are no basic story telling necessities, or rules.

[Drom]

when it's gonna be online? Why would you choose the same day as 1.3 patch in SWTOR? Why?

[Ezlo86]

Well, PSN usually updates about 9am - 12pm. Can't say for Live or Origin, tho.

Modifié par Ezlo86, 25 juin 2012 - 04:58 .

[nevar00]

Well, I guess this is it folks. Make it or break it time for me.

[BaladasDemnevanni]

Blueprotoss wrote...

If you really did pay attention then you wouldn't being blaming Bioware especially when it comes to the optional "perefct" endings.

No, enough of this. Point to me where Bioware released a statement contradicting their previous assertion that a high enough EMS could be obtained through SP. Until you do so, your claim has no basis. I hold the company responsible for making the claim to also tell me of the opposite is now true, no one else.

I guess you missed that most people didn't offer iced coffee around that time, which means someone really couldn't make an excuse on hot coffee.

And I guess you missed the part where I asserted that the woman from McDonald's should have known that the coffee was hot. Again, your reading comprehension is terrible. The point is that:

1) the woman is responsible, based on McDonald's and past experience.
2) The scenarios you are trying to connect are not applicable.

Stop confusing the two.

Yet you're using a straw-mann and a red herring just like the "hot" coffee woman.

Then you should be able to address the content of that paragraph rather than make a false claim about strawmans. I illustrated how the two scenarios are different. McDonald's told the woman what to expect and she took actions in defiance of those expectations. Bioware told us what to expect and what we obtained was in defiance of that expectation.

Insulting people won't help and you're still jumping the gn like usual, which means you should practice what you preach.

I seem to recall you having just misunderstood the entire point behind the DAII autoattack, for some craptastic attempt at portraying me as a "console-hater". Accept that you failed and move on.

I'm not backpedaling at all and it seems like you forget that some people don't like specific endings like how a small group of people don't like most of the ME3 endings.

If only you had proof that it was a small group. I'd love to see your statistics showing all the people who loved ME3's ending.

You don't need to play MP whileyou'll make up excuses based on your anger, which means you choose to blame Bioware while you should be playing yourself based on your misunderstanding.

Then I'd love to see your ME3 playthrough where Shepard survives the Destroy ending using only the single-player.

We do get the same framework and half of the same content but there are a lot of small variables in the endings..

Half of the same content does not equal all of the same content. It is impossible to obtain the ending where Shepard lives using the SP experience alone. So cut the crap.

Modifié par BaladasDemnevanni, 25 juin 2012 - 12:49 .

[mad_yojik]

2 BaladasDemnevanni - And how all this huge post is related to the EC? You're probably picked wrong topic to argue about SP/MP/readyness  thingy. Here it just annoys people waiting news or discussing EC, most of which dont care about your MP issues.

P.S. Getting alive Shepard using only SP is perfectly possible using coalesced.bin editor (at least on PC), though MP is interesting enough to run some bronze just for fun.   So if you use your brains instead of whining - you'll get what you want.

Modifié par mad_yojik, 25 juin 2012 - 01:42 .

[AresKeith]

just ignore BlueProtoss he'll just say the samething over and over

[Apollo-XL5]

Well that's just great, since I live in Britain, I have to wait a week for it and hope togod that I don't come up to any spoilers which is impossible because it is the Internet. Plus mates of mine have xboxes and they won't shut up about it either for the next serveral days.

Why can't they just have a world wide release, because that will stop spoilers appearing before most people have a chance to play it.

Modifié par Apollo-XL5, 25 juin 2012 - 05:48 .

[Kem1995]

I know it's not as important as the closure but has anyone else wondered wether or not a few additional soundtracks have been recorded for the EC? I was listening to some of the ME3 music and it came to mind, will they use the previous songs for the additional footage or make new soundtracks?

[Tazzmission]

anyone know if a trailer will be out for this?

or screenshots?

[CaliGuy033]

It's a pretty classic move to take an opinion and attempt to couch it in "objective" terms.

There's nothing objectively bad about the ending whatsoever.

[Grammarye]

mad_yojik wrote...I wonder why the lots of people stay so pessimistic about it...

It's significantly more enjoyable to be pessimistic & pleasantly surprised than optimistic having already had disappointment.

Put another way, I imagine lots are very much 'wait and see, but not hoping for anything spectacular'. I certainly am. Should the EC be absolutely superb, all the better, and if not, no arbitrary hopes have been set up to be knocked down.