109 réponses à ce sujet

[GodlessPaladin]

Blackest_Knight wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Incidentally
I just tested the Geth Pyro out. If Tangster's numbers were right I
should have killed it in 3 body shots. It took FOUR. 

Which raises the question, does anyone have access to a more accurate data sheet?

Is
this counting armor damage reduction? (I'm not attacking your
statement, just checking for pieces that could be missed. Seeing as I
don't know what weapon, etc.)

Yes.

Tangster wrote...

deadpixel92 wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Incidentally
I just tested the Geth Pyro out. If Tangster's numbers were right I
should have killed it in 3 body shots. It took FOUR. 

Which raises the question, does anyone have access to a more accurate data sheet?

I guess checking the coalesced.ini data stats would do the job

Pity that's how I did it.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/sad.png[/smilie]
Any
and all changes to the MP are stored server side, don't have acess to
them unless BW wishes to post them up. We only have access to the SP and
DLC info.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 22 juin 2012 - 04:45 .

[Atheosis]

a ViciousFerret wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

I call shenanigans. There's no way that's actually how it works. I'd laugh my ass off if it turned out that evo 6 has just been glitched this whole time.

Oh gosh, imagine the community uproar then!

I'd be ecstatic if that was the case and they simply fixed it with a patch.  Evo 6 is what breaks Tactical Cloak.  Well mostly.

[Credit2team]

turns out order of operations is important, now how to decide what falls in the parenthesis

[GodlessPaladin]

Atheosis wrote...

a ViciousFerret wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

I call shenanigans. There's no way that's actually how it works. I'd laugh my ass off if it turned out that evo 6 has just been glitched this whole time.

Oh gosh, imagine the community uproar then!

I'd be ecstatic if that was the case and they simply fixed it with a patch.  Evo 6 is what breaks Tactical Cloak.  Well mostly.

I disagree.  It's what breaks sniper rifle balance for every non-Infiltrator class.  I'd say sniper rifles are actually fairly decently balanced for Infiltrators with the exception of the Krysae.

The problem with Tactical Cloak and Infiltrators in general is that they combine incredible damage with fantastic survivability with a staggering amount of supoort, utility, and special tools.  They are jacks of all trades, but definitely not masters of none.  Their support is about as good as Engineers.  Their survivability is at least as good as krogans.  Their damage is at about as good as adepts.  Their ability to handle objectives of all 4 types is hard to match for anyone.  I'd say that that paradigm is where the issue lies... they don't really have to choose to give up any of these things to get access to the other.  They just get it all in one incredible character package.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 22 juin 2012 - 04:52 .

[BoomDynamite]

BUMP

[Eric Fagnan]

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

[capn233]

Thank you for the clarification.

Thread complete.

Modifié par capn233, 22 juin 2012 - 05:51 .

[ryoldschool]

capn233 wrote...

Thank you for the clarification.

Thread complete.

True, and I changed the title....

[Dilandau3000]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

Well, there's your nerf then: just make it additive like most people thought it was supposed to be.

[Mozts]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

Good thing we could settle that before the nerf:whistle:

Modifié par Mozts, 22 juin 2012 - 05:57 .

[BjornDaDwarf]

Now I really do wonder if it was supposed to be an additive bonus.

[Cayse]

BjornDaDwarf wrote...

Now I really do wonder if it was supposed to be an additive bonus.

Everyone was expecting it to be additive, apparently even Bioware. Additive would be consistent with all other abilities.

That's why the "look at" TC. It has some bugs in its behavior that are obvious to just about everyone, and it also apparently has some pretty hard to nail down bugs.

[capn233]

Cayse wrote...

Everyone was expecting it to be additive, apparently even Bioware. Additive would be consistent with all other abilities.

That's why the "look at" TC. It has some bugs in its behavior that are obvious to just about everyone, and it also apparently has some pretty hard to nail down bugs.

I seriously doubt they intended it to be additive.  If they did then they also accidentally made the Sniper Rifle Damage evolution in Operational Mastery (in single player) add to the Tactical Cloak multiplier as opposed to adding it to the rest of the additive bonuses.  That is pretty unlikely.

[BobWalt]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

So this mean that instead of granting a 40% bonus to the base weapon damage it awards the bonus to the amount of damage the weapon does after all the other bonuses are applied.  Is that correct?

By this same logic is it correct to assume that the headshot bonus granted by a power evolution works the same way?

Modifié par BobWalt, 22 juin 2012 - 06:12 .

[Adhok42]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

...Wha?

Could you slow that down some? I think part of it went by too fast.

The level 6 Sniper damage multiples the Mantis's damage which multiples the bonus damage from Quarian Defender Rank 6?

I don't get it.

Did you mean to say the multiplier from Tac 6 is ADDED to the bonus Weapons damage From QD 6 and THEN the grand total affects the Sniper Rifle?

And does this only apply to Sniper Rifles? From the sound of your post it would affect all weapons and not just the SRs.

[BjornDaDwarf]

BobWalt wrote...

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

So this mean that instead of granting a 40% bonus to the base weapon damage it awards the bonus to the amount of damage the weapon does after all the other bonuses are applied.  Is that correct?

By this same logic is it correct to assume that the headshot bonus granted by a power evolution works the same way?

Check out peddroelmz weapon damage thread for a really intense look at a lot of modifiers.

The short answer, is that in SP, some headshot bonuses (particularly those  from Ammo Power Evolutions) are in fact global multipliers.  However, the HS bonuses from something like Alliance Training (which is what is available in both SP and MP) is just another additive bonus that is ONLY applied when a headshot is scored.  Functionally though, that turns that 20 percent bonus into a 50 percent bonus, since it will always have the 2.5x headshot multiplier applied to it. 

I've yet to see anyone test the Targeting VI equipment/gear, but the assumption that everyone has made is that it acts like the Alliance Training bonus and is just additive. 

[Poison_Berrie]

Tangster wrote...

Pity that's how I did it.
Any and all changes to the MP are stored server side, don't have acess to them unless BW wishes to post them up. We only have access to the SP and DLC info.

There's no mention of Geth Pyro armor changes in the balance changes thread, so it should be the same.
Weird.

BobWalt wrote...

So this mean that instead of granting a 40% bonus to the base weapon damage it awards the bonus to the amount of damage the weapon does after all the other bonuses are applied.  Is that correct?

By this same logic is it correct to assume that the headshot bonus granted by a power evolution works the same way?

Actually the way it is worded it's added before the other bonuses. 
So it's:

(Base Damage * TC-Sniper Bonus (1.4)) * Other Bonuses (1 + 0.9 + Passives + Amps and Gear)

Not that it actually makes a difference, since they both are multipiers.

[BjornDaDwarf]

Adhok42 wrote...

And does this only apply to Sniper Rifles? From the sound of your post it would affect all weapons and not just the SRs.

I would put that down to a slightly poorly worded post.  I tink it's clear that he meant the bonus applies to sniper rifles. 

The simple way to view it should be that the Evo 6 abiltiy raises your SR's base damage by 40 percent.  And then all of your other passive/active/consumable bonuses are added together and mutliplied times the new base damage.  Hence why it's so powerful. 

[Adhok42]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

Actually the way it is worded it's added before the other bonuses. 
So it's:

(Base Damage * TC-Sniper Bonus (1.4)) * Other Bonuses (1 + 0.9 + Passives + Amps and Gear)

Not that it actually makes a difference, since they both are multipiers.

...Ah, this makes loads more sense.

I never did like word problems in math. Especially when they spelled out the numbers.

[ryoldschool]

Adhok42 wrote...

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

...Wha?

Could you slow that down some? I think part of it went by too fast.

The level 6 Sniper damage multiples the Mantis's damage which multiples the bonus damage from Quarian Defender Rank 6?

I don't get it.

Did you mean to say the multiplier from Tac 6 is ADDED to the bonus Weapons damage From QD 6 and THEN the grand total affects the Sniper Rifle?

And does this only apply to Sniper Rifles? From the sound of your post it would affect all weapons and not just the SRs.

The tip says sniper rifle damage, which is why I never take it because I use shotguns.  Evidently Eric is not an equations kind of guy, because his note does not make the equation clear at all.

[Adhok42]

BjornDaDwarf wrote...

Adhok42 wrote...

And does this only apply to Sniper Rifles? From the sound of your post it would affect all weapons and not just the SRs.

I would put that down to a slightly poorly worded post.  I tink it's clear that he meant the bonus applies to sniper rifles. 

The simple way to view it should be that the Evo 6 abiltiy raises your SR's base damage by 40 percent.  And then all of your other passive/active/consumable bonuses are added together and mutliplied times the new base damage.  Hence why it's so powerful. 

Yeah I can see that now. Okay. That's a much better explination.

[a ViciousFerret]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Sorry for the confusion folks. After some investigation, it appears that Tactical Cloak's evolution 6 sniper rifle damage bonus multiplies the weapon damage, which then multiplies all other weapon damage bonuses.

Did you guys at Bioware knew about this prior? Or was it intended to be second multiplier?

[N7-RedFox]

Can't believe how retarded some people are for wanting powers/weapons nerfed in a co-op only game.

By nerfing something you are only hurting ur overall chance to win.... retarded.

*insert eternal facepalm jpeg here*

[a ViciousFerret]

CaptainTeabag wrote...

Can't believe how retarded some people are for wanting powers/weapons nerfed in a co-op only game.

By nerfing something you are only hurting ur overall chance to win.... retarded.

*insert eternal facepalm jpeg here*

I like how this guy has failed at basic reading comprehension.

[Adhok42]

a ViciousFerret wrote...

CaptainTeabag wrote...

Can't believe how retarded some people are for wanting powers/weapons nerfed in a co-op only game.

By nerfing something you are only hurting ur overall chance to win.... retarded.

*insert eternal facepalm jpeg here*

I like how this guy has failed at basic reading comprehension.

And yet, he has a point.