260 réponses à ce sujet

[xtorma]

CrissRiot wrote...

Here's the thing. Collector's are just two races: Prothean clones (by now anyways) and Humans. If we go by ME2 and Mordin, i which he states they've gone through cloning generations after cloning generations, while we mighta wiped out MOST of them in ME2 (base), there's probably remnant ships or something floating around that the Reapers hung onto, and certainly enough humans to huskify into Scions and such.

Want to introduce them into multiplayer? "Reward" us. Set it up so we (N7/Galaxy), are making enough headway into the war that the Reapers decide to toywith us and unleash whats left of the Collector forces. We don't have to assume they were sent everywhere in the millions, but small, efficient forces.

To me, it is not stomping all over canon/story/lore/blahblah because saying we killed ALL Collector's by destroying one base is kinda silly when the Batarian homeworld was destroyed and OMFG there's a Batarian in multiplayer. Add in the fact would greatly increase multiplayer fun-factor AND bring back the insanely-well-designed enemies and not let tem linger in single-player-solitude is a bonus.

An exception would be, again, the actual Prothean race as Javik is confirmed 100% to be the last, that's it. Game Over Protheans. But again this has been discussed roughly 2,303,321 times now.

your speculation that some survived is no more provable then someone speculating they were all killed in the collector ship, and base. Colonies in me2 were hit one at a time. That to me is a pretty solid indicator that there was just one base , with one ship. Otherwise the collectors would have been hitting multiple worlds simultaneously. The narritive went out of it's way to let shepard know that the collector ship he visited to get information was the same ship he encountered on horizon, and the same ship that killed him.

could there have been another ship out there? certianly there could have been, but the lore does not support it. That does not mean they can't just make some lore up though, and there is really no reason not to, unless it is a question of them wanting to stay true to thier story. That is entirely up to bioware.

As far as protheans are concerned, it is no less plausable that there is a planet out there with protheans in stasis on it.

[KiraTsukasa]

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

KiraTsukasa wrote...

The collectors never appear in game, so this leads one to believe that it was the seeker swarms (which is technology and not a part of the collector "race") that the reapers were using. Why didn't they appear either? Easily explained. After the events of ME2 Mordin, who created the countermeasure to seeker swarms went back to work for the STG where he would have reported the shielding technology. The STG would have more than likely sent the specs for this tech to the turians when they encountered the swarms. The reapers would eventually see that the swarms weren't working anymore and discarded the plan, but at that point they would logically have had ample turian victims for reaperization.

You are only destroying your own weak arguments.

Wouldn't that make the Seeker swarms "outdated"? Not stopping them from using them.

Although we can deduce these were indeed Seekers, the literal words were "Collector swarms". So you are telling us they were Collector swarms, without Collectors. Sorry. I'm not buying that. I don't have to buy that. Collectors can easily be dropped into MP without even an afterthought about lore.

Your lack of experience tells me that you are not nearly as tired of shooting the same enemies as most of us still playing, and our dire need for something new. As an aside, I can only assume that you are a either a selfish player that hoards rockets and medigel, or you are an uber awesome player that never dies while running around with your Carnifex III.

Oh, wait... You don't even have a Carnifex. Your Disciple III, maybe?

If a small group of people (Shepard and his squad in ME2) could easily defeat them with already distributed tech, why would the reapers send the collectors against entire civilizations? The difference is that the seeker swarms had no widespread defense and were still viable until the countermeasure was distributed. Once it was distributed, the seeker swarms were entirely useless and, yes, outdated.

Before I give up on this stupidity once and for all, I feel that I need to bring up one last thing that you fail to see. Morale. Morale is a HUGE factor in warfare. Collectors, as protheans, are not recognizable to the galaxy. It does no good to send something at an army that they have no problem killing. Turian forces, for example, see marauders that still look very much like turians. That hurts morale with the thought that they are killing their own people. Sure, they can tell themselves that it's not a turian any longer, but the idea that they are killing something that is still partially their own race is a haunting notion.

[Funky_D_Luffy]

KiraTsukasa wrote...
If a small group of people (Shepard and his squad in ME2) could easily defeat them with already distributed tech, why would the reapers send the collectors against entire civilizations? The difference is that the seeker swarms had no widespread defense and were still viable until the countermeasure was distributed. Once it was distributed, the seeker swarms were entirely useless and, yes, outdated.

Before I give up on this stupidity once and for all, I feel that I need to bring up one last thing that you fail to see. Morale. Morale is a HUGE factor in warfare. Collectors, as protheans, are not recognizable to the galaxy. It does no good to send something at an army that they have no problem killing. Turian forces, for example, see marauders that still look very much like turians. That hurts morale with the thought that they are killing their own people. Sure, they can tell themselves that it's not a turian any longer, but the idea that they are killing something that is still partially their own race is a haunting notion.

Just face it... BW could just drop the Collectors into MP as a faction tomorrow, and everyone in the world would be happy for it. Except for you, apparently, who would be whining about how they were "outdated" or some such rubbish.

[xtorma]

KiraTsukasa wrote...

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

KiraTsukasa wrote...

The collectors never appear in game, so this leads one to believe that it was the seeker swarms (which is technology and not a part of the collector "race") that the reapers were using. Why didn't they appear either? Easily explained. After the events of ME2 Mordin, who created the countermeasure to seeker swarms went back to work for the STG where he would have reported the shielding technology. The STG would have more than likely sent the specs for this tech to the turians when they encountered the swarms. The reapers would eventually see that the swarms weren't working anymore and discarded the plan, but at that point they would logically have had ample turian victims for reaperization.

You are only destroying your own weak arguments.

Wouldn't that make the Seeker swarms "outdated"? Not stopping them from using them.

Although we can deduce these were indeed Seekers, the literal words were "Collector swarms". So you are telling us they were Collector swarms, without Collectors. Sorry. I'm not buying that. I don't have to buy that. Collectors can easily be dropped into MP without even an afterthought about lore.

Your lack of experience tells me that you are not nearly as tired of shooting the same enemies as most of us still playing, and our dire need for something new. As an aside, I can only assume that you are a either a selfish player that hoards rockets and medigel, or you are an uber awesome player that never dies while running around with your Carnifex III.

Oh, wait... You don't even have a Carnifex. Your Disciple III, maybe?

If a small group of people (Shepard and his squad in ME2) could easily defeat them with already distributed tech, why would the reapers send the collectors against entire civilizations? The difference is that the seeker swarms had no widespread defense and were still viable until the countermeasure was distributed. Once it was distributed, the seeker swarms were entirely useless and, yes, outdated.

Before I give up on this stupidity once and for all, I feel that I need to bring up one last thing that you fail to see. Morale. Morale is a HUGE factor in warfare. Collectors, as protheans, are not recognizable to the galaxy. It does no good to send something at an army that they have no problem killing. Turian forces, for example, see marauders that still look very much like turians. That hurts morale with the thought that they are killing their own people. Sure, they can tell themselves that it's not a turian any longer, but the idea that they are killing something that is still partially their own race is a haunting notion.

 but the idea that they are killing something that is still partially their own race is a haunting notion.

Doesn't seem to bother humans on earth a whole lot,  and we don't have any excuses like invading aliens bent on destroying the entire galaxy.

[CrissRiot]

When you break it all down really, it comes down too:

Could we have an insanely awesome new faction to fight in multiplayer? Yep.
Will some of us throw lore and such in the way? Yep.
Would some of us accept it happily anyways? Sure would

Unfortunately we could debate on Collectors/Mercs/Mechs/Ohter factions. Doesn't mean jack****. If Bioware said "ey Collector's were on vacation for abit but are returning in force!" or "Nope Collectors = Vapor Dust yo", that = is what is lore.

I'm one of those that just sees them as a potentially-awesome fourth faction (based on how they operated in ME2) I can run around and strategize and shoot around online with people.

Modifié par CrissRiot, 25 juin 2012 - 02:06 .

[Vazorath Shepard]

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

KiraTsukasa wrote...

For exactly the same reason that scouts aren't sent to the frontlines in war: They aren't meant for it. Collectors are a essentially a reaper scout force that exists to keep an eye on technological advancements and biological evolutions of the current civilizations. For all we know, if the reapers won in the current cycle, the turians might have become the collectors of the next cycle.

Once news of reaper existence spread, the reapers no longer had time for silent take downs. They had to move in fast and hard before fortifications could be erected. Yes, reaper forces DID have some trouble with ground forces in certain places. But they were on the ground. Had the reapers given them time to set up, they wouldn't have ever been able to land.

Bzzzzzt!!! Wrong again.

We have seen Collectors on the front-lines against the Protheans.

Javik says that they sent the Collectors at them to make them think twice before killing them since they were their comrades at one point. So, in that cycle the Collectors' job wasn't to collect and examine, it was to fight the Protheans. I assume during the Prothean cycle the Reapers used a different species to act as illusive collectors, perhaps the Inusannon.

[Funky_D_Luffy]

Vazorath Shepard wrote...

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

KiraTsukasa wrote...

For exactly the same reason that scouts aren't sent to the frontlines in war: They aren't meant for it. Collectors are a essentially a reaper scout force that exists to keep an eye on technological advancements and biological evolutions of the current civilizations. For all we know, if the reapers won in the current cycle, the turians might have become the collectors of the next cycle.

Once news of reaper existence spread, the reapers no longer had time for silent take downs. They had to move in fast and hard before fortifications could be erected. Yes, reaper forces DID have some trouble with ground forces in certain places. But they were on the ground. Had the reapers given them time to set up, they wouldn't have ever been able to land.

Bzzzzzt!!! Wrong again.

We have seen Collectors on the front-lines against the Protheans.

Javik says that they sent the Collectors at them to make them think twice before killing them since they were their comrades at one point. So, in that cycle the Collectors' job wasn't to collect and examine, it was to fight the Protheans. I assume during the Prothean cycle the Reapers used a different species to act as illusive collectors, perhaps the Inusannon.

Sure, but that doesn't mean that they are strictly a "scout force".

But lets say that they are! Isn't that the only thing we are fighting in MP?! Scout forces?! If a Gold match can be held by a single  "Arch Angel" imitation, I'm not exactly going to call that a war battalion.

[Vazorath Shepard]

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

Vazorath Shepard wrote...

Funky_D_Luffy wrote...

KiraTsukasa wrote...

For exactly the same reason that scouts aren't sent to the frontlines in war: They aren't meant for it. Collectors are a essentially a reaper scout force that exists to keep an eye on technological advancements and biological evolutions of the current civilizations. For all we know, if the reapers won in the current cycle, the turians might have become the collectors of the next cycle.

Once news of reaper existence spread, the reapers no longer had time for silent take downs. They had to move in fast and hard before fortifications could be erected. Yes, reaper forces DID have some trouble with ground forces in certain places. But they were on the ground. Had the reapers given them time to set up, they wouldn't have ever been able to land.

Bzzzzzt!!! Wrong again.

We have seen Collectors on the front-lines against the Protheans.

Javik says that they sent the Collectors at them to make them think twice before killing them since they were their comrades at one point. So, in that cycle the Collectors' job wasn't to collect and examine, it was to fight the Protheans. I assume during the Prothean cycle the Reapers used a different species to act as illusive collectors, perhaps the Inusannon.

Sure, but that doesn't mean that they are strictly a "scout force".

But lets say that they are! Isn't that the only thing we are fighting in MP?! Scout forces?! If a Gold match can be held by a single  "Arch Angel" imitation, I'm not exactly going to call that a war battalion.

Do scouts attack in waves and have banshees and brutes? And I think the Reapers' general idea with the Collectors was to use them to see how far tech has progressed in the cycle and to gather specimin to study and do whatever they want with them (turn into Reaper toys), so if they didn't all die/get deactivated they would just help process the Humans, Turians, Asari, Salarians, etc into paste or indoctrinate them.

[Funky_D_Luffy]

Vazorath Shepard wrote...
Do scouts attack in waves and have banshees and brutes?

In video games... Sure. In fact, it is pretty obvious. It isn't like an actual Reaper is attacking the firebase.

"Firebase", by the way, is used wrong, as well. A firebase is an artillery support base.

Point is, Collectors have a war host troop tier. They can easily be utilized to take a FB. One would think they are well suited to such a task, as it is almost the same as raiding colonies.

[Astartes Marine]

KiraTsukasa wrote...
Before I give up on this stupidity once and for all,

You mean the stupidity of arguing AGAINST adding another force into multiplayer to fight against?  Yeah that is pretty stupid.  Trying to argue against multiplayer expansion.  <_<


I mean it's not like the same opponents won't get boring fast, oh wait for some they are already way past that.  Especially those thrice-damned Geth.

[SavagelyEpic]

Okay... Why is it so hard to ask for an enemy husk variant created from any of the current races that functions the same as a harvestor/scion/hard ME2 enemy or what have you?

They don't need to BE collectors, I'm pretty sure the OP just wants a new, fresh enemy with that kind of capability.

[Daveros]

Collectors would be a great addition to multi-player, and a great piece of DLC for single-player, too. I have my fingers crossed.

[KotorEffect3]

Daveros wrote...

Collectors would be a great addition to multi-player, and a great piece of DLC for single-player, too. I have my fingers crossed.

How would you implement them without making the suicde mission from ME 2 irrelevant?   The collectors were a great enemy for ME 2 and I loved fighting them in ME 2.  I loved exploring the collector cruiser and infiltrating the collector base.  But in the end the collector's are ME 2's baby.  For the sake of ME 2 keep the collectors out of ME 3 with the exception being a flashback sequence (such as was the case with Javik)

[Astartes Marine]

KotorEffect3 wrote...
How would you implement them without making the suicde mission from ME 2 irrelevant?

Reapers clone more would be the easiest solution or they simply carried some within themselves in stasis after the last war.  And to avoid repetion they could be "improved/augmented" versions of the original Collectors.

Though this series is no stranger to making things of the past irrelevant. 
Didn't save the Rachni Queen in ME1?  Don't worry, the Reapers just make a new Queen anyway and start spawning Ravagers despite the race being extinct.
Made Anderson Councilor in ME1?  Udina's back in ME3...somehow.
Uploaded Cerberus data to Shadow Broker in ME1 for promise of future favor?  Nah, nothing ever comes of it.

Modifié par Astartes Marine, 25 juin 2012 - 06:26 .

[Simocrates]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Daveros wrote...

Collectors would be a great addition to multi-player, and a great piece of DLC for single-player, too. I have my fingers crossed.

How would you implement them without making the suicde mission from ME 2 irrelevant?   The collectors were a great enemy for ME 2 and I loved fighting them in ME 2.  I loved exploring the collector cruiser and infiltrating the collector base.  But in the end the collector's are ME 2's baby.  For the sake of ME 2 keep the collectors out of ME 3 with the exception being a flashback sequence (such as was the case with Javik)

After reading your posts in this thread I figured you were trolling until I read your signature. It all makes sense now except for one thing, your "Retake" sig would imply you want change when you clearly don't want change. I kind of feel like you are just arguing for the sake of it. Surely there must be something better in your life than sitting here and instigating angst.

[KotorEffect3]

Zanza86 wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Daveros wrote...

Collectors would be a great addition to multi-player, and a great piece of DLC for single-player, too. I have my fingers crossed.

How would you implement them without making the suicde mission from ME 2 irrelevant?   The collectors were a great enemy for ME 2 and I loved fighting them in ME 2.  I loved exploring the collector cruiser and infiltrating the collector base.  But in the end the collector's are ME 2's baby.  For the sake of ME 2 keep the collectors out of ME 3 with the exception being a flashback sequence (such as was the case with Javik)

After reading your posts in this thread I figured you were trolling until I read your signature. It all makes sense now except for one thing, your "Retake" sig would imply you want change when you clearly don't want change. I kind of feel like you are just arguing for the sake of it. Surely there must be something better in your life than sitting here and instigating angst.

Trolling because I don't agree with using the collectors in ME 3 thus nullifying the suicide mission?  Grow up.

[Nathanmaxtro]

The collectors are clones.

Which means that the Reapers can always make more if they want to.

[Funky_D_Luffy]

KotorEffect3 wrote...
Trolling because I don't agree with using the collectors in ME 3 thus nullifying the suicide mission?  Grow up.

Except it doesn't nullify anything. This has been explained numerous times in this thread, while you were apparently covering your eyes, and yelling "nananananana, I can't hear you!"

Ok, explain to me how the Ravagers ruined your experience. Tell us how the appearance of Rachni nullified your Mass Effect experience, when in all the following Codex entries have them under "Aliens: Extinct Races". If you were correct, we would find the Collectors there too. But where do we find the entry for Collectors? Under "Aliens: Non-Council Races".

You are fighting the wrong battle, with your helmet on backwards, soldier.

[Demon Velsper]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

but ME 3's MP is still connected to the story

Yeah, cause I totally believe that Cerberus had a million Phantoms to spare in Operation Exorcism.

[Yaevinn]

Join us!
http://social.bioware.com/group/7122/

[jpraelster93]

Demon Velsper wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

but ME 3's MP is still connected to the story

Yeah, cause I totally believe that Cerberus had a million Phantoms to spare in Operation Exorcism.

THIS

[Simocrates]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Zanza86 wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Daveros wrote...

Collectors would be a great addition to multi-player, and a great piece of DLC for single-player, too. I have my fingers crossed.

How would you implement them without making the suicde mission from ME 2 irrelevant?   The collectors were a great enemy for ME 2 and I loved fighting them in ME 2.  I loved exploring the collector cruiser and infiltrating the collector base.  But in the end the collector's are ME 2's baby.  For the sake of ME 2 keep the collectors out of ME 3 with the exception being a flashback sequence (such as was the case with Javik)

After reading your posts in this thread I figured you were trolling until I read your signature. It all makes sense now except for one thing, your "Retake" sig would imply you want change when you clearly don't want change. I kind of feel like you are just arguing for the sake of it. Surely there must be something better in your life than sitting here and instigating angst.

Trolling because I don't agree with using the collectors in ME 3 thus nullifying the suicide mission?  Grow up.

Arguing for the sake of it. Either compensating or trolling. Your choice.

[MstrJedi Kyle]

I could see Collectors making sense. It seems foolish that the Reapers would keep all the Collectors at one location. For all we know there could have been more than the one ship we destroyed in ME2.

Modifié par DarthKilby, 25 juin 2012 - 12:43 .

[jpraelster93]

DarthKilby wrote...

I could see Collectors making sense. It seems foolish that the Reapers would keep all the Collectors at one location. For all we know there could have been more than the one ship we destroyed in ME2.

thats what people have been saying but the naysayers have their ears plugged

[mrcanada]

jpraelster93 wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

No, I know this is the MP and some people that play MP don't always care about the story but ME 3's MP is still connected to the story (and I am not talking about just getting your galactic readiness score up). Our MP characters are still fighting in the same war Shepard is and in ME 2 the collectors were destroyed and they need to stay that way.

Not all the collectors were destroyed in ME2 Check the miracle on palaven codex entry

THIS.  I hate that people constantly use the lore argument for Collectors when they have no idea what they're talking about.