2906 réponses à ce sujet

[achegal]

Maybe that has been brought up before and I just didn´t see it but was there ever a statement if
SP DLC will be considered as a "backdoor" to actually change the endings ?
So during one of the DLC mission you find some tech/data that will allow you to actually change the ending.
I think this way they could give players what they want without destroying the artist´s original
idea for the game, because you know now there´s new content/possibilities.

[AlanC9]

mwags85 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
Huh? Bio says that a couple of things you thought happened in the ending -- all but three people on the Normandy died, people starved -- didn't actually happen. And your response to this is that they're not listening?You're not asking for an EC that shows that everyone on Earth really did starve and all but three people on the Normandy really did die, are you?

What I'm saying is that what we witnessed and what Bioware said their intention for the ending was were two completely different things.  I'm not saying I want the EC to show everyone at Earth starving or the Normandy crew dying, but that's how I would interpret the outcome in the end currently.  They said the ending left a lot for the player to imagine.  My imagination says everyone is screwed. 

Ah. Thanks, I got it now.

But isn't this exactly the sort of problem that the EC is supposed to fix? And will fix, at least for your first issue (take a look at the screenshots.)

The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

[Sphroth82]

Been waiting for this. Like many people, I did feel cheated with the original, anti-climatic ending. So yeah, I've been waiting for an ending that would be worth my choices through all three games. A lot of things didn't make sense, so hopefully this extended cut makes those choices worth it.

[ld1449]

magnetite wrote...

I'd disagree with mass genocide. I mean the Reapers were destroyed, but everyone else was unharmed. Did anyone not notice the soldiers on the ground who threw their arms in the air when the Reapers were defeated. Joker lived, as well as several others.

Plus Bioware said no one starves to death.

Sometimes the choices that we have to make have some serious consequences.

The Geth don't count? If they don't you're right, it isn't mass genocide and everyone else was unharmed.

Since I say they do after the events of ME3 you just wiped out an entire people in the span of 3 seconds. Nice job.

And Bioware said no one starves to death, this is true. Their reason?

Magical plot armor.

Everyone said people starved to death because they're stuck in Sol with no Relay to get them back to where they need to be and earth not capable of taking in all these aliens, let alone the Turians and Quarians who have to have a completely different branch of food sources.

And yeah, your choices should have consequences, that's the crux of half the argument.  Our choices have none and are reduced to the same cinematic with a different color.

[ld1449]

AlanC9 wrote...

snip*

The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

Not blow up the relays

[suliabryon]

Thank you, Bioware! Regardless of whether or not this changes my feelings about the ending, I so appreciate the hard work that went into making this. What other game company out there listens to their fans and actually responds like this? I look forward to finally finishing my game this week.

[AlanC9]

ld1449 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

Not blow up the relays

I should have been clearer there. The "position" I meant was his conclusion that no relays = starvation. Not blowing up the relays would just make the issue irrelevant, not refulte the position.

[saracen16]

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

Not blow up the relays

I should have been clearer there. The "position" I meant was his conclusion that no relays = starvation. Not blowing up the relays would just make the issue irrelevant, not refulte the position.

It sounds ridiculous. How were the galactic nations able to live to the point of discovering mass relays? They need sustenance, and they never needed spaceflight to acquire that.

Modifié par saracen16, 24 juin 2012 - 06:37 .

[krysohmy7]

saracen16 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

Not blow up the relays

I should have been clearer there. The "position" I meant was his conclusion that no relays = starvation. Not blowing up the relays would just make the issue irrelevant, not refulte the position.

It sounds ridiculous. How were the galactic nations able to live to the point of discovering mass relays? They need sustenance, and they never needed spaceflight to acquire that.

Actually, I think (I may be wrong, though) that somewhere in ME1 there was a mention about the need to "unlock" the "destination relay" before You'd be able to use it in network. So it's logical that someone must have gotten there through FTL before...

...just saying

[AlanC9]

ld1449 wrote...
Everyone said people starved to death because they're stuck in Sol with no Relay to get them back to where they need to be and earth not capable of taking in all these aliens, let alone the Turians and Quarians who have to have a completely different branch of food sources.

Not "everyone" said something that silly.

Somehow people convinced themselves that there were hundreds of millions of aliens with the fleet -- I've heard figures as high as a billion. But there's no foundation for this assumption. 20 million or so aliens is just a rounding error compared to Earth's prewar population.

And since the quarians brought their liveships -- they're plainly visible as the fleet reports in --  they've got all the food they ever had. Since a lot of quarian civilians got off at Rannoch, there's no particular reason to think the turians are in trouble. (Unless you botched Rannoch, that is).

[AlanC9]

krysohmy7 wrote...
Actually, I think (I may be wrong, though) that somewhere in ME1 there was a mention about the need to "unlock" the "destination relay" before You'd be able to use it in network. So it's logical that someone must have gotten there through FTL before...

...just saying

I think you have to unlock the source relay, not the destination relay. Otherwise a relay can't take you anyplace you haven't already been, in which case the Mu Relay wouldn't help Saren get to Ilos, and the turians wouldn't have been worried about humans unlocking relays at the time of the First Contact war.

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 juin 2012 - 06:52 .

[MEforever]

Thank you very much,

i still want Mass Effect 4 with Shepard as protagonist =)

[pmac_tk421]

ld1449 wrote...

magnetite wrote...

I'd disagree with mass genocide. I mean the Reapers were destroyed, but everyone else was unharmed. Did anyone not notice the soldiers on the ground who threw their arms in the air when the Reapers were defeated. Joker lived, as well as several others.

Plus Bioware said no one starves to death.

Sometimes the choices that we have to make have some serious consequences.

The Geth don't count? If they don't you're right, it isn't mass genocide and everyone else was unharmed.

Since I say they do after the events of ME3 you just wiped out an entire people in the span of 3 seconds. Nice job.

And Bioware said no one starves to death, this is true. Their reason?

Magical plot armor.

Everyone said people starved to death because they're stuck in Sol with no Relay to get them back to where they need to be and earth not capable of taking in all these aliens, let alone the Turians and Quarians who have to have a completely different branch of food sources.

And yeah, your choices should have consequences, that's the crux of half the argument.  Our choices have none and are reduced to the same cinematic with a different color.

Dextro's with no food source, except for the large collection of giant agricultural vessels the quarians brought to earth with them.

[davepissedatending]

Buzzing cart fu##ing wait !!!

[LiarasShield]

I don't want a me4 because it may end up being worse then mass effect 3 and the reapers are kinda out of the picture at least until maybe another 50 thousand years and shepard will be long dead by that time so a me4 eh I'd rather extended give mass effect a decent send off

[weirdnerd]

pmac_tk421 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...

magnetite wrote...

I'd disagree with mass genocide. I mean the Reapers were destroyed, but everyone else was unharmed. Did anyone not notice the soldiers on the ground who threw their arms in the air when the Reapers were defeated. Joker lived, as well as several others.

Plus Bioware said no one starves to death.

Sometimes the choices that we have to make have some serious consequences.

The Geth don't count? If they don't you're right, it isn't mass genocide and everyone else was unharmed.

Since I say they do after the events of ME3 you just wiped out an entire people in the span of 3 seconds. Nice job.

And Bioware said no one starves to death, this is true. Their reason?

Magical plot armor.

Everyone said people starved to death because they're stuck in Sol with no Relay to get them back to where they need to be and earth not capable of taking in all these aliens, let alone the Turians and Quarians who have to have a completely different branch of food sources.

And yeah, your choices should have consequences, that's the crux of half the argument.  Our choices have none and are reduced to the same cinematic with a different color.

Dextro's with no food source, except for the large collection of giant agricultural vessels the quarians brought to earth with them.

what large collection of giant agricultural vessels are you talking about    
there are 3 liveships that produce food for the quarians and they were converted into dreadnaughts

[mwags85]

AlanC9 wrote...

mwags85 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
Huh? Bio says that a couple of things you thought happened in the ending -- all but three people on the Normandy died, people starved -- didn't actually happen. And your response to this is that they're not listening?You're not asking for an EC that shows that everyone on Earth really did starve and all but three people on the Normandy really did die, are you?

What I'm saying is that what we witnessed and what Bioware said their intention for the ending was were two completely different things.  I'm not saying I want the EC to show everyone at Earth starving or the Normandy crew dying, but that's how I would interpret the outcome in the end currently.  They said the ending left a lot for the player to imagine.  My imagination says everyone is screwed. 

Ah. Thanks, I got it now.

But isn't this exactly the sort of problem that the EC is supposed to fix? And will fix, at least for your first issue (take a look at the screenshots.)

The starvation issue -- well, that might be harder since it's not obvious how you concluded that in the first place. What would they need to do to refute your position?

Initially my first response when I witnessed the ending was confusion.  Mostly all of what I said above is what many people thought as well.  Bioware was not clear on their true intentions for the ending, even if to them they thought it was solid.  With the tons of loop holes and everything everyone is saying, and judging from that podcast I don't think they really understand why we hate the endings so much.  Read this article.  http://www.gamefront...-fix-anything/ 

It left more questions then it answered.  Which means something went very wrong in the ending creation process and they completely lost touch with the fan base or something.  They weren't expecting us to retaliate like we did.  They thought they had a winning product and it failed miserably (the ending that is).  They say they are providing closure with this extended cut, but they are also saying they are taking what is already there and expanding on it. They don't seem to grasp that we didn't lke what was there to begin with as it completely destroyed the entire game premise in a matter of 10 minutes or so.  Maybe they have an ace up their sleeve in the EC, not holding my breath and I'm expecting the worst only because they lied to us before and the way they're talking about it now in that podcast, it either sounds like ego talking or they are completely clueless about this whole controversey.  As far as what I'd like to see them do to refute my position...they need to have some humility.  Apologize to the fans and admit they were wrong for doing what they did.  They made promise's of what to expect in the game (especially the endings, promising multiple tangents based on our choices) and didn't deliver.  They hyped it, got us excitied and to most people the ending was a slap in the face.  They call it their "artistic vision" and they are proud of it.  Sorry, but no one understood your "artistic vision" Bioware.  Even those few people who liked the endings.  Did they really understand the vision Bioware had?  What was Bioware's vision?  Certainly not what played out on the screen.  They left it completely up to player imagination, which in my opinion is just lazy and distasteful given the massive success this series has had.  If the EC clears everything up and is a major hit, then it just looks like they were too lazy or inept in the first place to come up with an ending that really closes out this awesome series.  In the end, their credibility has taken a major hit and they will have a lot to make up for with their fans.  Bioware has built a relationship with their customers, and in 10 seconds of gameplay, has squandered it.  People say we're a bunch of "winers", and yeah we do sound like it, but it's more than just a small group, it's a vast majority.  Bioware didn't have to do anything at all in response, but then again we also don't have to buy their games and we can put them all out a job.  Anyway, went kinda long here.  Two more days...definitely going to be interesting.             

[Jade Elf]

beaverskenneth wrote...

Ajzpick wrote...

Awww yeaaah, the moment has finally arrived... Whatever happens people, know that it has been an honor to serve with you all from the beginning to the end! And that we will always be proud of Bioware, for giving us such an amazing universe!

It is an amazing universe, and all three games were great games. The ME3 ending lacked, but it didn't make it a bad game.I'm quite looking forward to the extended cut.

This.

[Reptileman778]

I was surprised it will come out so soon(not that I am complaining), I hope bioware will chance some of the miserable dialogue too.

[AlanC9]

weirdnerd wrote...
what large collection of giant agricultural vessels are you talking about    
there are 3 liveships that produce food for the quarians and they were converted into dreadnaughts

Yep. Like the Codex  War Assets screen says:

The civilian liveships, enormous floating gardens that produce food for the quarians, have also been fitted with massive Thanix cannons to provide heavy firepower. 

Note the "also" there.

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 juin 2012 - 08:45 .

[babymoon]

MEforever wrote...

Thank you very much,

i still want Mass Effect 4 with Shepard as protagonist =)

Same. Oh, how I wish...

I'm just really looking forward to what happens if you got the Shepard "gasp" ending. I haven't read much on the forum lately, so maybe it's already been discussed, but I really hope they don't get rid of that part and I sincerely hope it actually meant something in the grand scheme of things. I just can't handle my Shepard dying all alone in space with Starkid lol.

[visionazzery]

this is not the end of sp for me3 before we even comprehend or accept and me4 we must HACE GENUINE ADDITIONAL SP DLC CONTENT DON;T LET EA FOOL YOU THE EC DLC IS NOT AUTHENTIC SP DLC IT IS NOT A SEPERATE MISSION PART OF ME UNIVERSE ITS A CORRECTION OF AN EASILY AVOIDABLE MISTAKE IT TIME TO PUT HEAT ON EA TO RELEASE SP DLC LIKE THE ONE OF ME2 SIMILAR IN SCOPE AND SCALE....TO YOU MASS EFFECT LOYAL FANS MAKE YOUR VOICES HEARD LOUD AND CLEAR DEMAND FROM EA WE XPECT HALF A DOZEN SP DLC AT LEAST TO DO PRIOR TO ENDING DO NOT GET COMPLACENT AND ACCEPT EC DLC AS AUTHENTIC SP DLC IT MERELY A CORRECTION OF A VERY VERY SILLY MISTAKE!

[TUHD]

Ouch. My eyes! My eyes! The caps!

- Serious note now -
Replaying ME3 atm (#*(# didn't have pre-Cerb save) and wondering how different the outcome will be with the EC. I'm playing with an Renegade Council/Krogan/Geth-killer and with an Paragon tree-lover (j/k), so ought to be quite an difference in the end...

[AlanC9]

@mwags5: One of the problems I have when discussing the endings is that I always end up coming across as more of a defender of the endings than I want to be. I don't think they were good at all -- not as bad as the horrible mess that was KotOR 2, but bad enough.

And even when all of the misinterpretations -- everyone starving, relay explosions killing everyone crew stranded forever on Gilligan's Planet -- go away, there will still be the faction that really doesn't like the logic of the endings anyway, and probably the faction that demands a happier ending than we've got won't be happy either (my bet: you want your little blue babies, you gotta pick Red).

[Drasynd]

AlanC9 wrote...

Yep. Like the Codex  War Assets screen says:

The civilian liveships, enormous floating gardens that produce food for the quarians, have also been fitted with massive Thanix cannons to provide heavy firepower. 

Note the "also" there.

Those ships would be classified as Dreadnaught class and such would be priority targets for any opposing fleet.
So, unless the reapers don't care about tactics, these liveships should be either destroyed or crippled.
If I'd have to guess, reaper's arrogance and belief on their superiority, might actually leave these ships intact.

But yes, the quarian liveships can produce food for, what, 16 - 17m quarians if fully funtional.