209 réponses à ce sujet

[Reptilian Rob]

Seryl wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Seryl wrote...

For the Destroy ending, it does make sense that the relays, the Geth and EDI are destroyed. The Crucible destroys all Reaper tech, which the relays are built from, while the Geth and EDI both have incorporated. I hate the endings as they stand, but the relays going BOOM does make sense if you kill the Reapers.

That said, I'd like for one of the ME3 DLCs to focus on how we'd rebuild the relays or reignite them. Maybe have it centre around the Mars Archives.

See were that the case then the Normandy's Eezo core should go up like a supernova.

Reapers didn't build the Normandy's drive core. They directly built the relays, and their tech is directly incorporated into the Geth and EDI. 

Mass Effect technology (including drive cores) are principle Reaper tech. ALL OF IT IS REAPER BLOODY TECH.

In the eyes of Walters, in order to defeat the Reapers you must destroy ever single trace of their existance. That means drive cores, relays, citadels, wepapons, guns, EVERY FREAKING THING.

How does this even make sense? I don't even know. 

[Ticonderoga117]

MisterJB wrote...
Compare the Control ending with the others. You can see the Relay being damaged but there is no all-encompassing explosion.

Only because the video was cut. Otherwise it's the exact same version all the other endings get. Why? I don't know, but GlowBoy said that they all get destroyed no matter what, and according to what we have currently, they do.

[Reptilian Rob]

Erixxxx wrote...

Reptilian Rob wrote...

It's the equivalent of destroying all the Stargates in Stargate and all the Troopers in Starship Troopers.

It's in the goddamn name FFS. MASS Effect.

Plus the Citadel was a symbol of unity and leadership, destroying that was unintentional symbolism (Walters couldn't even create symbolism if he tried) of the destruction of unity and the relays being destroyed thus stranding everyone.

The name is indeed Mass Effect. Not Mass Effect Relays.

And the Citadel is not destroyed with Control. The relays don't blow up either like they do in the other two endings.

Oh, don't even get me started on the hypocrtitical choice that is control. Where Shep literally said three minutes ago that TIM was crazy for attempting it.

Control, yes, because we want the Reapers around for a bit longer. 

[The Angry One]

MisterJB wrote...

In real life, sure. This is not real life and Bioware should not write an epilogue that goes against the theme of the endings. It would be better if we invented our own form of travel in all endings but Control.
Still, ultimately, those relays would still be our creations, not the Reaper's.

Mass Effect followed the logic of real life up until Mac Walters decided to steer it into la la land.
Also the theme of the endings go against all 3 games, so why not?

The point is to stop the Reapers. If they are on a leash, then they have been stopped.

No, the point was to remove the Reapers from the equation permanently, not have them hang around ready to go back to their old ways the minute NotShepard gets bored or something.

[MisterJB]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Only because the video was cut. Otherwise it's the exact same version all the other endings get. Why? I don't know, but GlowBoy said that they all get destroyed no matter what, and according to what we have currently, they do.

The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

[AngryFrozenWater]

The Angry One wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

You know what would've been inspiring and uplifting?

Looking over the Citadel and the relay network and realising that for the first time, they're ours. We earned them. The Reapers are gone. Now the galaxy's species are left to make their own legacy with the tools that brought them together in the first place.

But no let's just blow them up good YEEHAW.

Bah. I wish you would post something I disagree with. :lol:

Uhm... I think synthesis is right!

Thanks. I like the other quote better, though.

On topic: I think the idea is to remove the traps that the reapers set up. Unfortunately that is bad news for the galactic economy and delays the recovery from the war. That's once again an attempt which supports the brat's agenda. After all the options ought to be "a new solution" to the hypothetical problem.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 25 juin 2012 - 02:32 .

[justafan]

D24O wrote...

justafan wrote...

My problem is that the endings didn't do a good enough job of showing this. What we are left with is a feeling that their destruction was a tacked on consequence to have a bittersweet ending. Much like the geth perishing in destroy, it comes off as an artificial attempt to elicit sadness, instead of giving hope as it should have done.

It's not that the endings don't show it, it's that the trilogy doesn't really go deep enough into the topic. To us they are what keeps the galaxy connected, what makes the ME universe interesting, and the games don't show us they they really need to be gone.

And that is where we differ I think.  I never saw the relays as necessary to keeping the universe interesting.  They were most certainly iconic, but ME1 was all about how the relay network was one big trap.  ME is about the Mass Effect not the Mass Relays.  While they are the most convenient mode of travel, they are not necessary for the survival of life.  

If ME3 is truly the end of the series, then they can be rendered inert for emotional impact.  As long as there is the possibility that the species of the galaxy, which I think are what Truly make the series interesting, can survive and have a free future, then the relays are expendable as symbols of reaper control.

[Ticonderoga117]

MisterJB wrote...
The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

GlowBoy states otherwise. However, he lies about a lot of things, so if EC somehow tweaks his line there, it'll be fine.

[MisterJB]

The Angry One wrote...
Mass Effect followed the logic of real life up until Mac Walters decided to steer it into la la land.
Also the theme of the endings go against all 3 games, so why not?

The finale of ME3 doesn't present a confortable choice. Apparently, that is all it requires for people to disconnect with it.

No, the point was to remove the Reapers from the equation permanently, not have them hang around ready to go back to their old ways the minute NotShepard gets bored or something.

Only to you. I don't see why there must be only one path towards peace.

[MisterJB]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

GlowBoy states otherwise. However, he lies about a lot of things, so if EC somehow tweaks his line there, it'll be fine.

The StarChild is not infallible.
And there is not a single instance of it lying.

[Reptilian Rob]

MisterJB wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
Mass Effect followed the logic of real life up until Mac Walters decided to steer it into la la land.
Also the theme of the endings go against all 3 games, so why not?

The finale of ME3 doesn't present a confortable choice. Apparently, that is all it requires for people to disconnect with it.

No, the point was to remove the Reapers from the equation permanently, not have them hang around ready to go back to their old ways the minute NotShepard gets bored or something.

Only to you. I don't see why there must be only one path towards peace.

Oh I don't know, maybe because they tried to liquify the Human race? Just a thought...

[Kungfu Nando]

all this backlash could have been avoided with one news article, codex entry or convo in game stating the salarians or alliance had been researching into faster ftl travel or something along those lines...

[Reptilian Rob]

MisterJB wrote...

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

GlowBoy states otherwise. However, he lies about a lot of things, so if EC somehow tweaks his line there, it'll be fine.

The StarChild is not infallible.
And there is not a single instance of it lying.

There you go, just proved yourself wrong.

He says releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the Relays. That means all choices. 

Modifié par Reptilian Rob, 25 juin 2012 - 02:38 .

[Guglio08]

terdferguson123 wrote...

The Relays were created by the Reapers as a way for organics to move along the paths that the Reapers desired. This means, that the relays are indeed part of the cycle, whether or not the Reapers are destroyed or not. The point is, the destruction of the relays represents organics moving along their own path without any Reaper influence.

This is almost all true except for the fact that it was the Reaper-controller that prompted the destruction in the first place. So really, organics accomplished nothing. 

The whole ending could have been salvaged if Shepard simply rejected the Catalyst and had the fleet blow the Crucible up. The energy released from the explosion then does the rest, wiping out all synthetics (or whatever) and the Relays.

[D24O]

justafan wrote...

And that is where we differ I think.  I never saw the relays as necessary to keeping the universe interesting.  They were most certainly iconic, but ME1 was all about how the relay network was one big trap.  ME is about the Mass Effect not the Mass Relays.  While they are the most convenient mode of travel, they are not necessary for the survival of life.  

If ME3 is truly the end of the series, then they can be rendered inert for emotional impact.  As long as there is the possibility that the species of the galaxy, which I think are what Truly make the series interesting, can survive and have a free future, then the relays are expendable as symbols of reaper control.

While I disagree that they needed to be destroyed, I recognize that its their story, and that the relays are going to be destroyed regardless. I just wish they would address the neccecity of destroying them, deeper than what they did. And in ME1 we beat the trap, I don't see it as hammering in that the relays are bad so much as it shows we can overcome their negative functions.

[The Angry One]

MisterJB wrote...

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

GlowBoy states otherwise. However, he lies about a lot of things, so if EC somehow tweaks his line there, it'll be fine.

The StarChild is not infallible.
And there is not a single instance of it lying.

"But you killed the rest."

"We helped them ascend."



Ascension everybody!

Modifié par The Angry One, 25 juin 2012 - 02:36 .

[Obadiah]

Er, I thought the Crucible when used with the Catalyst was designed to blow up the relay when it fires. That was the whole point of using the Citadel.

[Ticonderoga117]

Reptilian Rob wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
The video is the same because Bioware recycled imagery. However, unlike what happens in Destroy and Synthesis, they purposely cut the part where the Relay explodes.
This suggests it is not destroyed in Control which would fit with the theme of that particular ending where we claim mastery over the Reapers and their technology, Relays and Citadel included.

GlowBoy states otherwise. However, he lies about a lot of things, so if EC somehow tweaks his line there, it'll be fine.

The StarChild is not infallible.
And there is not a single instance of it lying.

There you go, just porved yourself wrong.

He says releasing the energy of the Crucible will destroy the Relays. That means all choices. 

Or "Organics are the chaos."
*5 minutes later*
"Synthetics are the chaos."

Infallible you say? Hunk of junk I say.

[MisterJB]

Reptilian Rob wrote...
Oh I don't know, maybe because they tried to liquify the Human race? Just a thought...

The turians tried to turn the Human race into a client race. But we are at peace with them now.

Modifié par MisterJB, 25 juin 2012 - 02:41 .

[Sowilo]

The mass relays were never destoryed it was all in your mind... just so you know.... and you acutally are harvested...

[Erixxxx]

Reptilian Rob wrote...

Oh, don't even get me started on the hypocrtitical choice that is control. Where Shep literally said three minutes ago that TIM was crazy for attempting it.

Control, yes, because we want the Reapers around for a bit longer. 

You don't like it? Fine, that's your choice.

It is still a viable ending put in the game, meaning it is canon for everyone who chooses it. Their galaxy still very much have the Citadel and the Relays.

Not everything is black and white. And most people don't seem to know how to deal with grey.

[Reptilian Rob]

[quote]MisterJB wrote...

[quote]Reptilian Rob wrote...
Only to you. I don't see why there must be only one path towards peace.[/quote]
Oh I don't know, maybe because they tried to liquify the Human race? Just a thought...
The turians tried to turn the Human race into a client race. But we are at peace with them now.[/quote]
[/quote]

I'm sorry, but client is a lot different than a smoothie shake...

And for all intensive purposes we ARE clients of the galaxy. 

Modifié par Reptilian Rob, 25 juin 2012 - 02:40 .

[steeltrainn]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Or "Organics are the chaos."
*5 minutes later*
"Synthetics are the chaos."

"No Shepard, you are the chaos."

And then Shepard was a space hamster.

[Reptilian Rob]

Erixxxx wrote...

Reptilian Rob wrote...

Oh, don't even get me started on the hypocrtitical choice that is control. Where Shep literally said three minutes ago that TIM was crazy for attempting it.

Control, yes, because we want the Reapers around for a bit longer. 

You don't like it? Fine, that's your choice.

Not everything is black and white. And most people don't seem to know how to deal with grey.

That's the problem with control though, too much ****ing grey. 

[MisterJB]

The Angry One wrote...
"But you killed the rest."

"We helped them ascend."

Ascension everybody!

The StarChild never said it helped every single organic ascend. Only that it helped their races ascend, which it did.
It is not lying, it simply has a different way of looking at the galaxy.