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[Urzon]

Dragon Age 2: Varric's Ultimate Friend Fiction!

[Samuel_Valkyrie]

Varric's story is true enough. He embellished, added some things to tell a good story, made himself out to be the most awesome badass bro in existence, but the events itself still occurred as he tells them. A cake it still a cake, no matter how much whipped cream and sprinkles you throw on it. Which is what Varric does. And he's being very generous with his cream.

...wow, that metaphor went into a direction I didn't intended it to, at all.

[EricHVela]

Yet, there is a question that still begs for an answer: Why would he tell the truth or not?

What would be the point in telling the truth? She obviously could not verify his story, and he must have known that after her occasional doubts.

(Again, I still think he told her as much truth as he knew, but I can't figure out why he did.)

EDIT: From perusing a few other topics, it seems that people are using this point of contention regarding whether Varric was telling the truth as a means to argue in certain discussions that seem to be based on the assumption that Varric was telling the truth -- like a "what if Varric's story was accurate" topic.

I would have assumed that any discussions on such points would have their basis on the face value of Varric's tale, or else, I wouldn't see the point in asking the questions in those other threads. Saying Varric was lying or stretching the truth in those threads would essentially invalidate the intended discussion. I would rather keep those arguments where they belong in this thread instead of trying to end valid discussions in those other threads.

Modifié par ReggarBlane, 27 juin 2012 - 01:57 .

[Ihatebadgames]

I think Varric mostly told the truth to Cassandra.In the Seeker movie Cassandre was threatning to "Clean" a Elfs ear so he could hear her question better.What would she chop off on a Dwarf?
I think Verric values all his appendages,even if there are no female Dwarfs in Kirkwall.

[Am1vf]

Ihatebadgames wrote...

I think Varric mostly told the truth to Cassandra.In the Seeker movie Cassandre was threatning to "Clean" a Elfs ear so he could hear her question better.What would she chop off on a Dwarf?
I think Verric values all his appendages,even if there are no female Dwarfs in Kirkwall.

Haha.
Still, the proper way of answering an interrogation is usually to answer something the inerrogator won't ever belive, so they belive the second lies mixed with the truth.
At least, that is what they say in movies.

It makes some sense to belive that Varric would downplay Hawke's blame in the mage rebelion and if the fighting is as in the game it is hard to belive Kirkwall still has some inhabitants.

[EricHVela]

Yet, I still ask: Why would he lie or tell the truth?

We know he can lie. We know he can be honest, too. He seems to know that she can only verify a limited amount of the story. So, there's opportunity and ability, but that's not enough.

We need a motive for why he would lie or be honest to the Seeker.

EDIT: His personality as shown in his stories suggest to me that his first attempt to lie was to find out how much Cassandra knew and show her where her bargaining position really stood, giving him all the power.

It's still not enough. It's just more evidence to opportunity but not motive to the second story he tells.

Modifié par ReggarBlane, 28 juin 2012 - 03:03 .

[LolaLei]

I think most of what Varric said is the truth, he just over exaggerates slightly to embellish the story... and entertain himself lol.

My theory is that when we import the game into DA3 all the main important stuff will be addressed the way Varric told us (like if Hawke supported the Mages or Templars etc) but if they need to retcon something out (for example, making Feynriel a companion regardless of his fate) then they can just claim that it was Varric bullsh!tting to be dramatic.

[LolaLei]

Nizaris1 wrote...

let see the time scale of Varric story

- The event in DA2 begin at the same time as the Blight begin, Hawke is running from the darkspawn, Lothering is destroyed, Hawke meet Aveline who run from Ostagar and she tell they lost out of Loghain betrayal, Hawke meet with Flemeth, from there we learned King Cailan dead

- Hawke arrive at Kirkwall, working either as mercenary or a smuggler for 1 year in Kirkwall

- After 1 year Hawke in Kirkwall, the Blight ended, Hero of Ferelden is known to everyone, meaning the whole event of DA:O is JUST ONE YEAR

isn't that a major LIE and contradiction by Varric?

DA:O took place over the course of one year, so no it wasn't a lie. Although I agree, DA2 didn't make the time line easy to work out.

[thats1evildude]

Nizaris1 wrote...

- After 1 year Hawke in Kirkwall, the Blight ended, Hero of Ferelden is known to everyone, meaning the whole event of DA:O is JUST ONE YEAR

isn't that a major LIE and contradiction by Varric?

No, that is a historical fact. The Fifth Blight was defeated in less than a year.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 28 juin 2012 - 08:47 .

[LolaLei]

Nizaris1 wrote...

as i know the event of DA:O take more than 2 years...

Ok... links?

[LolaLei]

Nizaris1 wrote...

this

http://dragonage.wik...l_of_DAI-series

Quoted straight from that wiki:

"My guestimate above suggests that DAO spans 7 month where most of the time is spend traveling between locations."

So yeah, it takes place over the course of a year lol.

[labargegrrrl]

i was just thinking about how in every good story, there's at least a kernel of truth.

and in every true story, there's always some non-fiction writer leaving out context or supposedly irrelevant data, in order to make the truth lie to people. (historians do this a LOT.)

i think that maybe the interaction between Varic and Casandra is symbolic of how those two modes of narrative intersect. (because seriously, how many of us WERE actually trying, as players, to use hawke to subvert the chantry? i admit to total guilt on that one!)

so tell me, who's the compulsive liar, and who's the seeker of truth?

DA3 is in a perfect space to be set up to either take Varic totally at his word, or to write him off altogether, if you follow the implications of this line of thought. (or am i just thinking in weird circles?)

[LolaLei]

Nizaris1 wrote...

How come it is just a year?

then time scale of Anders

When Anders come to Kirkwall?

If it a year the Blight ended and Hawke finish his/her debt, want to join bartrand expedition, Varric told there is a Grey warden in the city, and it is Anders

What?

isn't after the Blight, Anders is with the Warden in Awekening...?

I don't know, I don't work for Bioware.

As I said before the time scale is definitely difficult to work out, but we can 100% confirm that DA:O took place over the course of 1 year. Hawke works for a year in Kirkwall before we get to take control of him/her. I guess DA: Awakening must have only taken place over the course of a few months, so he was able to flee to Kirkwall in time to meet Hawke. Anders even tells Hawke that he ran away from the Warden's because he didn't like it there.

Either way, regardless of the time scale it doesn't mean Varric is lying about the events of DA2 (though he probably exaggerated a few little things.) But, we will find out soon enough in DA3.

Modifié par LolaLei, 28 juin 2012 - 09:33 .

[DPSSOC]

Nizaris1 wrote...

let see again...

If the the Blight ended for a year

- Hawke finish his/her debt as mercenary or smuggler, want to join Deep Road expedition, meet with Varric, talk to Bodhan and Sandal about the Hero of Ferelden

- Hawke meet with Varric at the Hang Man in the night and Varric tell his plan, that is to acquire infos from a Grey Warden that is already in the city

- Hawke meet with Anders as soon as know the location of Anders clinic

This happen after a year soon after the Blight ended...how come Anders be in the city while he is suppose to be with the warden in Awekening?

Alright let's see if we can't work this out.

9:30 sometime (are we ever given roughly where in the year we are?) Ostagar happens
- Warden Travels to Lothering
-Warden Travels to 1st Main Quest
- Warden completes main quest
- Hawke family flees Lothering (Remember in Origins Lothering is fine until you complete the first main quest)

So we have the Warden's quest, and the year the Blight lasted 20% complete (four quests plus final battle) and Hawke is only just leaving Lothering.

Hawke then has to travel to Gwaren (presumably on foot), wait for a ship, and take a ship to Kirkwall before his year even starts.

Now maybe somebody has a better idea of what that would mean travel time wise but I don't think it's unreasonable to believe the Warden's years is 40-50% done before Hawke's even starts. Awakening always struck me as a quick affair and since, according to the wiki, it and Amgarrak happen in the same year, it's not impossible for the events of Awakening to transpire and Anders to flee within that half year.

Nizaris1 wrote...
That is a lie...Anders have nothing to do with Kirkwall problem

Or it's incosistent writing.  The writers really wanted Anders to be in the story (or the marketing department or somebody wanted him) and didn't give thought to where Hawke fit in with the other game's timeline.  It happens.

[LolaLei]

Lothering couldn't have been destroyed at the same time as Ostagar because the Warden travels there after Ostagar had already gone up in flames (Flemeth saves the Warden/Alistair and they head straight to Lothering from the Korcari Wilds with Morrigan.) Lothering is still very much intact until they leave the area after picking up Sten and Leliana.

[LolaLei]

Nizaris1 wrote...

- If Hawke and his family from Lothering, how come they don't know the Warden was in Lothering?
- Bethany claim Qunari kill her friend meaning Bethany was in Lothering when Sten was in the cage
- After the Warden get in the inn, everybody know there is Grey Warden in Lothering, leading to some people attack them at Lothering for the bounty, how come Hawke say "they all die in Ostagar" if Hawke is from Lothering?

That's just a plot hole they've over looked. Still doesn't mean Varric is lying about all the events of DA2 though.