517 réponses à ce sujet

[SNascimento]

I think it was great to give players that option... it should be in the game from the start.
.
About the result, it's logical... the cicle will continue for God knows how long.

[_Flipp_]

Why does actually everyone think that this ending is a big Fu** you from Bioware?

I mean with possibility comes the chance of failure and chosing wrong. So why does it take everyone as an insult if Bioware says "Wrong decision" ( especially because its kinda reasonable ).

I mean just because everyone cried for an the option to screw the godchild that doesn't mean it has to end welll...

[Sepharih]

[quote]Geneaux486 wrote...
Because it was buried in the Mars archives.  Let's not forget that it was Liara who found it, on her first time ever visiting that place.  Let us also not forget that she is the only known acheologist to have actually determined there was an extinction cycle at all before knowlege of the Reapers was made public.  It wasn't clumsily introduced, it was a plan that was preserved in an area the Reapers didn't visit in the previous cycle, found by someone who's got a knack for finding things nobody else can.[/quote]

Right....and the crucible isn't space magic.  


[quote]Geneaux486 wrote... Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.[/quote]
It removes the diversity between organic and synthetic life.  The fact that there is diversity in the new result doesn't matter.  You are faced with a situation in which the only solution to solve a conflict between two kinds of life is to merge them together and make them the same.  That is in direct conflict with the themes of the series.

[quote]Geneaux486 wrote... 
Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.  Everytime shepard learns something new, he adjusts his plans to compensate.  The ending is no different.[/quote]
Shepard told him that even if he could, we weren't ready.  The crucible didn't prove him wrong, it just said "you can control us, scouts honor".  Shepard was right the first time.





[/quote]

[Zero132132]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Geneaux486 wrote...

Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.  Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.

I need to contradict this one. It is cleary stated that Synthesis will create a new DNA which is the same for all. Now it's up to everyone by himself to define "Diversity of races" through looks or through their DNA....

No. He says a 'new' framework/DNA. Never says that everyone will have the same DNA. And it isn't a matter of looks, it's a matter of attributes. Krogan are still visibly disparate from humans and Asari in significant ways in the synthesis ending. Is your assumption that for some reason, things that aren't physically visible are all going to be the same now? What's your justification for that?

[NoUserNameHere]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Why does actually everyone think that this ending is a big Fu** you from Bioware?

I mean with possibility comes the chance of failure and chosing wrong. So why does it take everyone as an insult if Bioware says "Wrong decision" ( especially because its kinda reasonable ).

I mean just because everyone cried for an the option to screw the godchild that doesn't mean it has to end welll...

People hear SO BE IT from the author avatar and think it is Bioware talking down to them for wanting a fourth option. Coupled with the abruptness of Refuse and they think this choice got the shaft.

[No_MSG]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Why does actually everyone think that this ending is a big Fu** you from Bioware?

I mean with possibility comes the chance of failure and chosing wrong. So why does it take everyone as an insult if Bioware says "Wrong decision" ( especially because its kinda reasonable ).

I mean just because everyone cried for an the option to screw the godchild that doesn't mean it has to end welll...

I think it's because it was half assed, more so than even the original endings.  It's just "You said no, you lose."  I guess, sadistically, I want to watch everyone die.

[Subject M]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Geneaux486 wrote...

Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.  Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.

I need to contradict this one. It is cleary stated that Synthesis will create a new DNA which is the same for all. Now it's up to everyone by himself to define "Diversity of races" through looks or through their DNA....

No, the catalyst is speaking in a metaphor ("DNA"). It is true that everyone will be part of a new system and share characteristics associated with this system but it does not state that everyone will be the same. Turians and Quarians will still no doubt be dextros, but with new synthetic addition to their makeup, Geth will still be mainly mineral based and so on and so forth.

One can hardly say that organics are non-diverse (even though they are relative to a comparison between organics and synthetics) and I see no reason why the same would not be true for the synthesized lifeforms.

[_Flipp_]

Zero132132 wrote...

_Flipp_ wrote...

Geneaux486 wrote...

Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.  Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.

I need to contradict this one. It is cleary stated that Synthesis will create a new DNA which is the same for all. Now it's up to everyone by himself to define "Diversity of races" through looks or through their DNA....

No. He says a 'new' framework/DNA. Never says that everyone will have the same DNA. And it isn't a matter of looks, it's a matter of attributes. Krogan are still visibly disparate from humans and Asari in significant ways in the synthesis ending. Is your assumption that for some reason, things that aren't physically visible are all going to be the same now? What's your justification for that?

If it is just a new DNA for everyone, why they all stop fighting? If there would still be diversity in the DNA then the good old evolution ( Survival of the fittest ) would kick .

Also starchild claims that organics would reach "the perfection" they seek - so that means with diversity there are different kinds of perfect?

[Applepie_Svk]

You don´t like space magic ? You wanna win convetionaly ? Are you have problems with RGB?
Than get out of my deck and pick refusal ....

[Megachaz]

Refuse ending was fine. There's no way you could win. Even if you could have beaten the Reapers conventionally before, there's no way you could have now. Sword fleet would have gotten annihilated because they're all just waiting around for the Crucible to do something. It was definitely short, and could have gotten a few scenes of your fleets being destroyed, but it made sense.

[Mallaidh]

I think its a slap to the face and then Bioware spitting in my face but its still the least ****ty ending.

It involves the least amount of space magic and terrible plot design.

Needless to say: this is my final Bioware game.

Modifié par Mallaidh, 26 juin 2012 - 11:41 .

[Garlador]

Am I the only one that noticed in the coda for the Reject ending, the Stargazer is no longer Buzz Aldrin, but is instead an ASARI?

I like to think it could be Liara in the future.

[manwiththemachinegun]

xistfirat wrote...

manwiththemachinegun wrote...

I like how for months, people were endlessly ****ing saying

"Give us the option to say F-U to the Reapers, let us go down fighting, and entrust our knowledge to the next cycle."

I literally heard about a dozen of the most diehard ending haters say this would completely satisfy them, if only the evil Bioware had given them the chance.

And you're given EXACTLY THAT ENDING, after being explicitly told the Reapers cannot be defeated conventionally.

You're given an epilogue showing that the next cycle was ABLE to defeat the Reapers thanks to Shepard and Liara's knowledge.

And the only reaction from the 'fans' is, "Boo hoo, Bioware is spitting in our face."

Seriously, this is just pathetic.

Anyway, back to the red ending! Canon of course since Zaeed and Jessie retire.

Don't blame all of us, I was one of the people saying "Give us the option to say F-U to the Reapers, let us go down fighting, and entrust our knowledge to the next cycle.", and now I am completely satisfied and happy with the products as a whole.

I'm mostly irritated with the first page or two, with diehards saying the Reject ending is Bioware spitting in their face which, after the Director's Cut, really does sound like petulant, whining ****ing for the sake of ****ing. I know this is the internet, but it gets old fast.

They got EXACTLY what they wanted. There is just no pleasing some people.

[M0keys]

Garlador wrote...

Am I the only one that noticed in the coda for the Reject ending, the Stargazer is no longer Buzz Aldrin, but is instead an ASARI?

I like to think it could be Liara in the future.

good god this speculation stuff is like an endless cycle

it's Samsara for god's sake

buddha save us all

[aries1001]

As I see, from this discussion, it is a quesion about who or what ore how much are you willing to sacrifice? Do you choose freedom, even if it means death? Or do you make a compromise where you accept being slaves to a foreign race or the synthesis ending where all get implants even against their will perhaps?

Is it better to die free than to live under slavery?

On another matter, Bioware has given us what we want - or have Bioware done this? People wanted a reject ending so they could down fighting, they got it. And some people are still angry...it seems....
The point is, just as student don't seem to know what they want to learn in school, Bioware - and video-game fans also sometimes don't seem to know what they want, except something else than a, b and c. And then it is like well if you add d, but take away half og a and blnd it with c, but leave be andf add e, f and g, then it'll be perfect. Not quite, because both a teacher (of which I'm one) and Bioware has to have a plan for goals they're trying to acheive or reach. Sometimes it fails, sometimes it doesn't.

I've seen on some other websites that you can actually question the Star Child now....this was one of the things many of us (including myself) wanted to be able to do. Are the questions & answers relevant...?

[vasametropolis]

It's fully possible that BioWare is trolling with Refusal, but it does work and should have been there from the start. Liara's capsule survives so maybe a future generation can win in a straight up fight. Nothing wrong with that.

[Jenonax]

I love the refusal ending. Having banner made as we speak. That is all.

[No_MSG]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

_Flipp_ wrote...

Geneaux486 wrote...

Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.  Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.

I need to contradict this one. It is cleary stated that Synthesis will create a new DNA which is the same for all. Now it's up to everyone by himself to define "Diversity of races" through looks or through their DNA....

No. He says a 'new' framework/DNA. Never says that everyone will have the same DNA. And it isn't a matter of looks, it's a matter of attributes. Krogan are still visibly disparate from humans and Asari in significant ways in the synthesis ending. Is your assumption that for some reason, things that aren't physically visible are all going to be the same now? What's your justification for that?

If it is just a new DNA for everyone, why they all stop fighting? If there would still be diversity in the DNA then the good old evolution ( Survival of the fittest ) would kick .

Also starchild claims that organics would reach "the perfection" they seek - so that means with diversity there are different kinds of perfect?

The original synthesis ending, at least, says that it's the final evolution of life.  

[MIBO765]

DocJill wrote...

Creighton72 wrote...

Personally I think the 4th ending is nothing more than a clue. I don't think it's an ending at all, but ties itself to the story. The moment the Catalyst spoke with the reaper voice, seems to be one big screaming warning about him. Then I look at destroy which is not really a bad ending except for the sacrifice of the Geth and Edi. The races of the universe band together to overcome the Reaper destruction on their own. But when I look at the memorial wall scene, Shepards name does not go on the wall. At first I thought that was a slap in the face, but then started wondering why would you put a living person on a memorial wall. That seemed to be a second clue.

Take in the fact that the other two endings are both closer to warnings than they are good things. Control, one person basically becoming god. When has one person having all the power ever been good? Synergy the single push button ending that makes everything perfect. Don't really have to work for anything every again, everyone gets their wish. The to perfect world that has no price. Both of those are well established warnings signs in almost every form or writing genre ever.

My question is if you tie all the endings together did BioWare pull the wool over everyones eyes for a 4th game? Dropping suttle clues and warnings. You notice with all the endings they seem to not want to say certain things or reveal to much. They have done this twice. The clue in the starchilds voice switch, Shepard taking a breath and his memorial plaque not going up, the well established warning of one person having to much power and the classic disengenuous perfect world that is achieved with the push of a button. There is no perfect world where everything suddenly becomes easy.

Smells like a 4th game to me.

Excellent analysis. 

I agree on the blue and green ending. Remember ME2 Legions speach after the destruction of the collectors base (his warnings from going the way of the old machines) and the corruption of TIM and Cerberus through foreign technologies in ME1 and ME3.

[TJX2045]

 I didn't even realize there was now a "reject" ending but I think it's a pretty obvious outcome if you don't do anything.  We knew the story's ending was going to stay the same.  If you thought it would be different clearly people did not read the original announcement on the EC...

[Joe Del Toro]

Jenonax wrote...

I love the refusal ending. Having banner made as we speak. That is all.

OH NO PRESSURE OR ANYTHING

[Subject M]

_Flipp_ wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

_Flipp_ wrote...

Geneaux486 wrote...

Synthesis doesn't remove diversity.  Krogans are still Krogans, Geth are still Geth, Turians are still Turians, etc.  Shepard told TIM that he couldn't control the Reapers, and to his knowlege that was true.  The Crucible proved him wrong.  The entire story has been based on preconceptions being disproven.

I need to contradict this one. It is cleary stated that Synthesis will create a new DNA which is the same for all. Now it's up to everyone by himself to define "Diversity of races" through looks or through their DNA....

No. He says a 'new' framework/DNA. Never says that everyone will have the same DNA. And it isn't a matter of looks, it's a matter of attributes. Krogan are still visibly disparate from humans and Asari in significant ways in the synthesis ending. Is your assumption that for some reason, things that aren't physically visible are all going to be the same now? What's your justification for that?

If it is just a new DNA for everyone, why they all stop fighting? If there would still be diversity in the DNA then the good old evolution ( Survival of the fittest ) would kick .

Also starchild claims that organics would reach "the perfection" they seek - so that means with diversity there are different kinds of perfect?

Synthesis supposedly removes some kind of unseen unavoidable reason for conflict. As far as I know we do not know what it is because we have not been informed of why. I could speculate that synthesis introduces some type of universal understanding of others because we now share a few characteristics or "tools". Think of it as everyone knowing a sharing a language and community while at the same time also having their own unique languages and unique communities.

Yes, there are different kinds of "perfection" corresponding and relative to different local environment it which they fit.

[No_MSG]

TJX2045 wrote...

 I didn't even realize there was now a "reject" ending but I think it's a pretty obvious outcome if you don't do anything.  We knew the story's ending was going to stay the same.  If you thought it would be different clearly people did not read the original announcement on the EC...

Technically, according to the announcement, we weren't getting a new ending at all.

[Mallaidh]

Creighton72 wrote...

Personally I think the 4th ending is nothing more than a clue. I don't think it's an ending at all, but ties itself to the story. The moment the Catalyst spoke with the reaper voice, seems to be one big screaming warning about him. Then I look at destroy which is not really a bad ending except for the sacrifice of the Geth and Edi. The races of the universe band together to overcome the Reaper destruction on their own. But when I look at the memorial wall scene, Shepards name does not go on the wall. At first I thought that was a slap in the face, but then started wondering why would you put a living person on a memorial wall. That seemed to be a second clue.

Take in the fact that the other two endings are both closer to warnings than they are good things. Control, one person basically becoming god. When has one person having all the power ever been good? Synergy the single push button ending that makes everything perfect. Don't really have to work for anything every again, everyone gets their wish. The to perfect world that has no price. Both of those are well established warnings signs in almost every form or writing genre ever.

My question is if you tie all the endings together did BioWare pull the wool over everyones eyes for a 4th game? Dropping suttle clues and warnings. You notice with all the endings they seem to not want to say certain things or reveal to much. They have done this twice. The clue in the starchilds voice switch, Shepard taking a breath and his memorial plaque not going up, the well established warning of one person having to much power and the classic disengenuous perfect world that is achieved with the push of a button. There is no perfect world where everything suddenly becomes easy.

Smells like a 4th game to me.

As much as I hate to say it, this makes sense and it will drive me nuts they broke their word on it being a trilogy but it might not be so terrible to read the plot after the game is released(no I will not buy it)

[Jenonax]

Joe Del Toro wrote...

Jenonax wrote...

I love the refusal ending. Having banner made as we speak. That is all.

OH NO PRESSURE OR ANYTHING

Ha! Its public now, you can't let me down, love! Hahaha!  Get to work computer monkey!