251 réponses à ce sujet

[Ecksbawks_live]

Wow, I never thought people could be against biological evolution as it is "wrong" and "forceful".

It's just progress, and I imagine people would be fine with this happening IRL(except those backwards thinkers, but whatever).

I really am thinking that people are just finding ways to hate the EC.

[Zardoc]

Someone at BioWare certainly knows his biology, and more importantly, evolution... /sarcasm


Also, eugenics are a good thing, didn't you know?

Ecksbawks_live wrote...

Wow, I never thought people could be against biological evolution as it is "wrong" and "forceful".

It's just progress, and I imagine people would be fine with this happening IRL(except those backwards thinkers, but whatever).

I really am thinking that people are just finding ways to hate the EC.

 


I'm not against evolution. I am against BioWare's idea of it.

Modifié par Zardoc, 27 juin 2012 - 01:36 .

[Meohfumado]

Ecksbawks_live wrote...

Wow, I never thought people could be against biological evolution as it is "wrong" and "forceful".

It's just progress, and I imagine people would be fine with this happening IRL(except those backwards thinkers, but whatever).

I really am thinking that people are just finding ways to hate the EC.

How is it biological evolution?

Its space magic, there is nothing natural going on here.  Starchild is just taking all species from Level 1, and using a Cheat-code to make them Level 80.

That's not evolution friend.

[saracen16]

Lots of knee-jerkers against synthesis.

If anything, I think the closest analogy to synthesis is Helios's ending in Deus Ex Invisible War.

[Blind Rapture]

Zardoc wrote...

Someone at BioWare certainly knows his biology, and more importantly, evolution... /sarcasm


Also, eugenics are a good thing, didn't you know?

Ecksbawks_live wrote...

Wow, I never thought people could be against biological evolution as it is "wrong" and "forceful".

It's just progress, and I imagine people would be fine with this happening IRL(except those backwards thinkers, but whatever).

I really am thinking that people are just finding ways to hate the EC.

 


I'm not against evolution. I am against BioWare's idea of it.

Look what happened to the Krogan when they were forced to evolve. Another contradiction in the themes the other 99% of the game attempts to beat into your brain

[Catriana]

Comparing reconstruction of DNA to religion is the equivalent of comparing a tree with an apple. Sure the apple is from the tree, but beyond that, it's not really relevant to the overall picture.

Humans are still human. Turians are still turian. Asari are still asari. Shepard being partly synthetic didn't change his/her beliefs, attitude, thought processes, etc. The only thing that changes is that they all become mentally connected. All the races, everything is united. Knowledge, emotions, beliefs, everything is interconnected and through that comes eventual understanding and peace. Or at least, that's what the Synthesis ending leads us to believe.

It's not forced uniformity, it's forced unity, which is completely different and not necessarily a bad thing. Tolerance and understanding comes from unity and acceptance, which, I believe, is what Synthesis tries to give us.

That is not to say I like the Synthesis ending. I find it incredibly creepy that a person ends up working alongside all the grotesque forms of the reaper minions, which were once other people. To be honest, I really enjoyed the 'Rocks fall, everybody dies" or Reject ending. The Starbrat's logic is asinine and proven to be false throughout the entire game. Natural evolution and social tolerance was showing that organics and synthetics could, in fact, live together like any other race out there in the galaxy. Having to conform to the Starbrat's beliefs or bust is really what makes the end of ME3 fall flat for me. At least now I have the option of knowing I can tell baby!Harbinger to screw off and leave it up to the next cycle to get their crap together for the final push. They'll have 50,000 years after all.

[Meohfumado]

Forced unity is not true unity. It is like diplomacy at the barrel of a gun.

Sure, nobody seems to complain after they've been synthesized, but is that because they "all understand" or they were just reconfigured to think that way while their DNA was being rewritten, and all of a sudden had to deal with all this interconnectivity.

Simple fact is there could be hundreds, thousands, millions of people who do not want synthetic parts in their body, the "my body is a temple" types. These people were violated. Same for people who are isolationists, hermits, etc. and don't want to be connected to everyone else.

The right to self-determination is completely shat upon by the synthesis option. No species is allowed to progress in the direction they wish, no person is allowed to progress in the direction they wish. All their progress is dictated to them by starchild.

Space fascism may work for some, but not for my Shep. I repudiate it. I find the mere notion toxic to Life, Liberty, and Freedom.

[wizardryforever]

I do wish people would drop the "galactic rape" angle from their arguments against synthesis.  For one, all three endings basically force something on the galaxy (though I have yet to see the other two new endings, I will soon).  Destroy even kills a whole society and numerous individuals.  The galaxy is forced to accept the results of the Crucible regardless of your choice.  Synthesis is not unique in this.

Furthermore, the galaxy has put all of its hopes into the Crucible.  In a sense, they're willing to use it even though they aren't entirely sure what it will do.  They lose the right to complain about being altered when they consider that they and everyone else would be dead otherwise.  No one other than Shepard is ever made privy to the other two options the Catalyst offers, at least I don't know of anything said on that.  When you consider the sheer amount of weight they're putting on the Crucible, they are accepting of the results, whatever those may be, as long as it ends the war without killing everyone.  In that sense, it isn't even forced.  And if you don't buy that, my above paragraph still stands.

I'm with the OP.  I greatly enjoyed the new synthesis ending, and I liked how they cleared up some of the basic plot holes with the pre-ending as well.  Like what happens to your squadmates, and why Joker leaves the system, and what happens to the fleet and the Normandy.  I'm quite satisfied with my purchase.  Oh right, it was free.  Even better. 

[sololeocr]

I love this ending, What's my favorite part? See Kasumi with her love, that's a good detail, Shepard dies and lives at the same time his DNA are with everyone. I don't know for me this is the perfect solution for synthetics and organics,

If Neo or Skynet had learned this before everything had been different

Modifié par sololeocr, 27 juin 2012 - 02:43 .

[Grandsome]

For those who wonder how the crucible functions, one word: Flux Capacitor. 

...

Okay that's two.

Modifié par Grandsome, 27 juin 2012 - 03:05 .

[Zero132132]

I remember when I chose synthesis, my first thought was "Javik is gonna be PISSED..."

[AresKeith]

I don't care if they did make it look nice in the EC, its still space magic and a Deus Ex copy, an you basically go back to ME1 and do what Saren wanted

[MisterJB]

I agree with the OP. A new galaxy, just teeming with wonderful possibilities to be discovered along with hhe entire knowledge of the Reapers allied to ours and a new understanding between synthetics and organics.
It's so...beautiful beyond words.

[Cyricsservant101]

wizardryforever wrote...

I do wish people would drop the "galactic rape" angle from their arguments against synthesis.  For one, all three endings basically force something on the galaxy (though I have yet to see the other two new endings, I will soon).  Destroy even kills a whole society and numerous individuals.  The galaxy is forced to accept the results of the Crucible regardless of your choice.  Synthesis is not unique in this.

You've missed the point.  Synthesis changes everyone (without their consent) at a cellular level, and alters their brain chemistry.  It's essentially a form of magical, invasive surgery.  In that way it IS unique from the other options.

Furthermore, the galaxy has put all of its hopes into the Crucible.  In a sense, they're willing to use it even though they aren't entirely sure what it will do.  They lose the right to complain about being altered when they consider that they and everyone else would be dead otherwise.

... But everyone wouldn't be dead otherwise.  Shepard could have chosen Destroy or Control. 

[GenericUserName9]

MisterJB wrote...

I agree with the OP. A new galaxy, just teeming with wonderful possibilities to be discovered along with hhe entire knowledge of the Reapers allied to ours and a new understanding between synthetics and organics.
It's so...beautiful beyond words.

You tjhink that guy in your avatar finds his new existence beautiful beyond words?

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Destroy is still the best ending. You can destroy the Reapers and restore the Geth and any other technologies you desire to restore. Hackett said so.^^

No galactic takeovers and no dead Shepards.

[MisterJB]

GenericUserName9 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

I agree with the OP. A new galaxy, just teeming with wonderful possibilities to be discovered along with hhe entire knowledge of the Reapers allied to ours and a new understanding between synthetics and organics.
It's so...beautiful beyond words.

You tjhink that guy in your avatar finds his new existence beautiful beyond words?

I think that if Shepard could be reconstructed from meat and tubes, with the Reaper's assistance, Husks should be able to be "cured".
Alternatively, a new way of looking at "husks" could appear,
If everything else fails, the fate of all civilizations take precedence over that of an individual and society is clearly improved by Synthesis.

[camcon2100]

I liked the fact that the races remain independent and different yet have a common understanding of each other. I dislike the green tint to everyone thou. Should have stayed with just new cyborg eyes. But the way I saw synthesis was less about becoming the same and more about gaining new knowledge to be free free from the petty and silly prejudices. Some people disagree but personally I am in favor of knowledge no matter what form.

[MisterJB]

camcon2100 wrote...

I liked the fact that the races remain independent and different yet have a common understanding of each other. I dislike the green tint to everyone thou. Should have stayed with just new cyborg eyes. But the way I saw synthesis was less about becoming the same and more about gaining new knowledge to be free free from the petty and silly prejudices. Some people disagree but personally I am in favor of knowledge no matter what form.

I agree. I don't believe everyone has been forced into following a certain behaviour.
I think it simply allows people to see through each other's eyes, share perspectives. It's hard to kill someone you know and that is probrably what happened.
People can still wage war if they truly want to, it's just harder.

[KingKhan03]

DESTROY

[StevenG_CT]

MisterJB wrote...
If everything else fails, the fate of all civilizations take precedence over that of an individual and society is clearly improved by Synthesis.

Consider that one of the major themes throughout the series was that uplifting a primitive culture by instantaneously giving it advanced knowledge and technology was damaging to both the uplifted culture as well as the galaxy as a whole. Things didn't work out too well when the Krogan were uplifted, not for the Krogan, not for the Rachni, and not for the rest of the galaxy.

What do you suppose will happen now that every race in the galaxy (including the primitive pre-space flight ones) have suddenly been uplifted and given access to advanced knowledge and technology? Most likely it's not going to be all rainbows and unicorns.

[MisterJB]

StevenG_CT wrote...
Consider that one of the major themes throughout the series was that uplifting a primitive culture by instantaneously giving it advanced knowledge and technology was damaging to both the uplifted culture as well as the galaxy as a whole. Things didn't work out too well when the Krogan were uplifted, not for the Krogan, not for the Rachni, and not for the rest of the galaxy.

What do you suppose will happen now that every race in the galaxy (including the primitive pre-space flight ones) have suddenly been uplifted and given access to advanced knowledge and technology? Most likely it's not going to be all rainbows and unicorns.

But when humanity advanced 200 years in months after discovering the Mars archive, it was good for humanity and the rest of the galaxy.
I don't expect Synthesis to create an utopia from night to day, however, primitive cultures were not given advanced knowledge or technology. They don't have the Reapers to help them. At best, their bodies now hold the same wonderful possibilities as ours.
And, according to the Catalyst, the current organic spacefaring species are ready for this knowledge.

[Bootsykk]

I personally didn't like the Synthesis ending because it had a distinctly dystopian feeling to it. I loved all the benefits that came with it, couldn't help but smile and feel warm inside at everything EDI said about being alive and not alone... but there is a VERY distinct and EXTREMELY creepy dystopian undertone to Synthesis.

Synthesis does NOT make synthetics the same DNA as organics; as it is explicitly stated, Synthesis "will make all organic life partly synthetic and give synthetic life an understanding of organic life". Synthesis doesn't "ascend" anyone; it just essentially turns *everything* into very complex and lifelike synthetics. It completely eradicates organic life. It is then implied that this change leads everyone to suddenly work together, put aside their differences, and build a new society--this makes absolutely NO sense. Synthetics, having gained a true understanding of organics, implies that they become true AI's, meaning that they can have organic emotions--such as anger, a desire for power, and spite. This would lead to a greater degree of "chaos", in which some geth or AI's would be very angry at Organics for treating them like ****. Organics, on the other hand, suddenly all become okay with the reapers; none of them have any disgust or hate towards the reapers or reaper forces for pretty much slaughtering everyone.

It's dystopian in that human nature, which is morally grey, is GONE. It is literally NOT THERE in the epilogue. Everyone is peaceful, life is great, immortality is achieved, etc--without any conflict at all, as apparent by the epilogue. Shepard has a line in ME2 that goes, "I'm going to stop the reapers, but I won't sacrifice the soul of our species to do it". In my personal opinion, all the negative is a very vital, essential part of the soul--without it, the positive would have no worth. Life stagnates under a universal regime of a so-called "peace".

[camcon2100]

MisterJB wrote...

camcon2100 wrote...

I liked the fact that the races remain independent and different yet have a common understanding of each other. I dislike the green tint to everyone thou. Should have stayed with just new cyborg eyes. But the way I saw synthesis was less about becoming the same and more about gaining new knowledge to be free free from the petty and silly prejudices. Some people disagree but personally I am in favor of knowledge no matter what form.

I agree. I don't believe everyone has been forced into following a certain behaviour.
I think it simply allows people to see through each other's eyes, share perspectives. It's hard to kill someone you know and that is probrably what happened.
People can still wage war if they truly want to, it's just harder.

It's kind of like Javiks power of seeing an essense where others cannot. We can't comprehend that power because we don't have that knowledge. Now the races have the means to see each other for what they are and intellegently make decisions. No more stupid wars. If a war arises it will be for the right reasons and not for greed or some unintelligent idea but for something much more.

[greggers1]

Obvakhi wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Synthesis was always their love child. You know despite raping the entire Universe into becoming cyborgs without their consent and becoming the Reapers little toy. Instead they made it out to be the ultimate ending when really it isn't.

 Once again Synthesis-haters are too stubborn to even look at the potential benefits, they can only look at the negative aspects. 'It MUST be bad because I say so!'

No it's bad because you rewrite the genetic structure of every living creature and machine in the galaxy against their will, at no point in time was a there a vote to see if everyone wanted to be raped by the star child. I'm stubborn because rape is bad and at no time would I let the Catalyst a.k.a. a reaper a.k.a. the enemy, tell me what to pick. I'd show them my butts cheeks and laugh as I sent them straight to hell. The last two games all anyone has said is "We need to destroy the reapers" and "Trying to control them is a bad idea" destroy is the only option that makes logical sense in the entire universe.

What about the people turned into husks? Shouldn't synthesis mean they now walk around and talk forever turned into some cyborg looking freak? What about hte Brutes, some mashed up pile of body parts? You think they're going to like being alive as some freak?

I think any leader in history that has said anything along the lines of "We must become genetically perfect" has turned out to be a pretty bad guy.