94 réponses à ce sujet

[Gecon]

CUN stands for Cunning.



Thats like complaining in a Lineage 2 forum that "SS" for Soul Shots remind you of something else.

[GHL_Soul_Reaver]

rogues are squishy, you need a tank to hold the targets while your rogue DPS and sneak attack

[fchopin]

With the new 1.02 patch my rogue is a monster.



At level 12 my rogue is destroying everything in the game very easily.

I did not expect anything so powerful in the game after playing a mage.

[Amioran]

Rogues are very powerful if played correctly but sucks if you don't manage them fine or don't know very well what talents to choose.

Then there are some problems with some abilities having bugs (as Dual Striking missing half the times also on an hit for a bug with the animation blend- see my mod on nexus for the fix for this and other things about dual-wield) that accentuates the problems when fighting without backstabs.

Take momentum as fast as you can and try always to go to backstabs range. Also research a bit on powerful rogue builds (usually it's easier to make a powerful rogue going the dex/str route, cun/dex is maybe more powerful but requires much more knowledge on which talents/skills to chose).

If you download the fix of Dual Striking and use it with Momentum when you have to fight "face to face" and on the other occasions you backstab, the rogue is the most powerful single target killer in all the game, neither mages are comparable. I suggest, as I said, to make a rogue focused on str/dex on the first run, it's easier.

Useful talents:
Momentum
Dual Striking (fixed)
Coup De Grace
Lethality (only if you go the cun/dex route)
Dual Weapon Mastery (better for the str/dex route)
Whirlwind attack (fixed)

Coup De Grace coupled with Dirty Fighting, Riposte and stun spells become very powerful indeed. There are many posts in these forums that talk about powerful rogue builds if you search them a bit. Studing them will make you change your idea fast on the matter.

Modifié par Amioran, 16 décembre 2009 - 02:43 .

[Darpaek]

Rogues aren't THAT squishy. They should be a lot squishier. My rogue PCs make better tanks than Alistair mid-game+

[Greg558]

i noticed that as well, but only up until after level 10-15 or so then it seems to balance out a bit

[Gracchio]

XOGHunter246 wrote...

my rouge hits 80-90s frequently

That's some pretty heavy rouge there!

IT'S THE FINAL COUNTDOOOOWN DOOODOODOOOOOO

[BanditGR]

NetBeansAndJava wrote...

Darpaek wrote...

Completely disagree. A rogue shouldn't have less than 50 Cunning at the endgame. The AP boost is particularly hot. My rogue can dance between raindrops with 36 base Dex (low 40ish with item bonuses, etc).

Besides, you need 30 Cun to open every lock and win every persuade.

I like to go to Soldier's Peak as early as possible so I can get the lowest tier Warden armor possible.  That requires 26 or 28 Str (I can't recall).  I just think the armor's sexeh! 

Well if you need 30 cun for every lock and conversation, then lethality is much more useful.  I didn't know that, so thanks for the tip... but then if you're wearing the wardens armor, then you're pushing your str up to 28, which again lessens the usefulness for lethality

After all, every pt spent in str that closes the gap with cunning is a pt that is not contributing to dmg.  Granted, wardens armor is super sexeh, as you say... it's a tough call.

All this min/maxing needs a dmg calculator!

There are more reasons on why Cunning is one of the most important stats for a rogue and all is thoroughly explained in the DPS calculation post, situated in the gameplay forum. Suffice to say, talents such as Exploit Weakness, Tainted Blade (DLC) etc all provide bonus damage that scales with Cunning. As far as Strength goes, you will NEVER really REQUIRE more than 31 (adjusted), that is, if you are going for a Str build or you intend to use the best longsword(s) or even axes in the game. Considering that you can boost your Str stat for free, through a certain....situation, you only really need 26-27 base, which will also enable you to wear some decent armor (moreso if you have the Warden's Keep DLC). While Str builds are generally acceptable in terms of DPS, they require careful planning and stat/talent allocation per level. In conclusion : While you can certainly go wrong when favoring Str, you just can't go wrong if you favor Cunning (and even if you do, its usually easy to "fix").

All in all, basically (almost) everything and anything has already been calculated and explained in the aforementioned post.

Modifié par BanditGR, 16 décembre 2009 - 06:50 .

[thegreateski]

36 dex
crap load of cunning
the talent to enchange the strength modifier for cunning.
2x "Haste"



Holy !%$@

Modifié par thegreateski, 16 décembre 2009 - 06:50 .

[Darpaek]

I also think there are 4 (?) attribute books around... between those and the above mentioned "stat boost situation", I can usually meet my rogue's strength requirements without putting more than two levels worth of points in strength.

[wonko33]

mine's not that powerful but he's fun to play, 'nuf said

[BanditGR]

Darpaek wrote...

I also think there are 4 (?) attribute books around... between those and the above mentioned "stat boost situation", I can usually meet my rogue's strength requirements without putting more than two levels worth of points in strength.

Very true, I didn't mention it, since I personally consider their price a bit too much for the benefit they introduce but early on they are certainly something to consider.

[Sylixe]

IckyLicks wrote...

BramAlam12345 wrote...

My dw rogue is also quite good. What are your stats? Why can't you sneak and backstab/

I I can sneak and backstab but killing a single target seems to take forever.  I"m busting out 20+'s on white colored enemies for backstabs.  They die quick but not asassination quick, like my experiences in D&D.  For regular attacks it's around 15-18.  It's seems a lot but against yellow's and red's it's like, what's the point of attacking ( I get like 1's and 2's dmg).

m stats are low 20's for strength

32 dex
24 cunning
22 const

22 Con?

What exactly is your rogue tanking that you need that much Con?  Pump up your Dex and get your DW skills and you will be just fine if you grab some agro until you have a solid tank.  Bleeding mobs is also a highly valuable ability when fighting the long fights.

[Darpaek]

I dunno. 45 gold for a free level? I only had gold issues in my first playthru. I've had more gold than I know what to do with in my more recent playthrus.

[Beldukil]

Amioran wrote...

Rogues are very powerful if played correctly but sucks if you don't manage them fine or don't know very well what talents to choose.

Then there are some problems with some abilities having bugs (as Dual Striking missing half the times also on an hit for a bug with the animation blend- see my mod on nexus for the fix for this and other things about dual-wield) that accentuates the problems when fighting without backstabs.

Take momentum as fast as you can and try always to go to backstabs range. Also research a bit on powerful rogue builds (usually it's easier to make a powerful rogue going the dex/str route, cun/dex is maybe more powerful but requires much more knowledge on which talents/skills to chose).

If you download the fix of Dual Striking and use it with Momentum when you have to fight "face to face" and on the other occasions you backstab, the rogue is the most powerful single target killer in all the game, neither mages are comparable. I suggest, as I said, to make a rogue focused on str/dex on the first run, it's easier.

Useful talents:
Momentum
Dual Striking (fixed)
Coup De Grace
Lethality (only if you go the cun/dex route)
Dual Weapon Mastery (better for the str/dex route)
Whirlwind attack (fixed)

Coup De Grace coupled with Dirty Fighting, Riposte and stun spells become very powerful indeed. There are many posts in these forums that talk about powerful rogue builds if you search them a bit. Studing them will make you change your idea fast on the matter.

Where do I download the fix for dual striking and whirlwind or were those fixed in 1.02?

[Amioran]

No, they are not fixed in 1.02. I fixed them.



You can download the fixes here:

http://www.dragonage...file.php?id=337

[Amioran]

BanditGR wrote...

There are more reasons on why Cunning is one of the most important stats for a rogue and all is thoroughly explained in the DPS calculation post, situated in the gameplay forum. Suffice to say, talents such as Exploit Weakness, Tainted Blade (DLC) etc all provide bonus damage that scales with Cunning. As far as Strength goes, you will NEVER really REQUIRE more than 31 (adjusted), that is, if you are going for a Str build or you intend to use the best longsword(s) or even axes in the game. Considering that you can boost your Str stat for free, through a certain....situation, you only really need 26-27 base, which will also enable you to wear some decent armor (moreso if you have the Warden's Keep DLC). While Str builds are generally acceptable in terms of DPS, they require careful planning and stat/talent allocation per level. In conclusion : While you can certainly go wrong when favoring Str, you just can't go wrong if you favor Cunning (and even if you do, its usually easy to "fix").

All in all, basically (almost) everything and anything has already been calculated and explained in the aforementioned post.

Actually is the exact contrary. It is more difficult to go wrong with a str/dex build than with a cun/dex one. The calculations you quote are primarly for expert players and not certainly the audience of the OP.

Cunning has a great disavantage from strength: while it gives +dmg with Lethality it doesn't give +attack and so if you don't plan carefully both the abilties and party members you risk to gimp your character really badly. Actually going wrong with cunning is really easy for a first run, strength doesn't pose this problem at all and dex is the better state in all the game.

Certainly a build with cun/dex does more damage in the end but it's for people that know what they are doing. You cannot go wrong raising both str/dex. The abilities you speak about are all fine and good but 1) they need field awareness, a thing many first time players don't have and 2) they need builds reliance, another thing not good for first timers.

[Palathas]

As long as you have a taunting tank or a crowd control mage then a dual wield Duelist/Assassin should wipe the floor. You really don't need a Con higher than 14, I basically put 2 points in Dex and 1 in Cun with every 3rd level 1 Dex, 1 Cun, 1 Will. Using poisons you can just wipe anything from the field.
Make sure you max out your stealth as soon as possible too. Always go for the Backstab.

Modifié par Palathas, 17 décembre 2009 - 12:09 .

[Xeper84]

after 1.02 you can kill everything with a dual wield fighter.....