252 réponses à ce sujet

[Howie225]

Creighton72 wrote...
Nobody really got nerfed, between gear
and the new level 4 stuff, the infiltraitor doesn't really lose anything
and the other classes just got buffed. In fact the infiltraitor may be
even stronger than he was pre gear with the right equipment. Notice the
buff came with the release of level 4 consumables. That pretty much
balances it out, then throw in the gear.

Jessica Merizan wrote...

we’ve removed

Character kit cards as rare drops after all appearance options have been

unlocked and we’ll be introducing a new powerful Rare Ammo type that will drop

when you’ve maxed out your kits.

if i am not miss quoting her it means that only when you
maxed out every kit will these rare consumables be dropped more often i
presume. also this means that these consumable (1 time use items) will
be Gold items meaning you can only get 1 per SP and maybe 2 per PSP.
this means that every gold match you play equates to getting one rare
ammo type only if you have complete your kits or 3 gold matches for a
possiblity of getting 4. this that if you must use them to make up for
the nerf. then your are pretty much playing gold to get equipment.
unless they make them stacked where you can get three or four as one
Gold item.

[Wolfsbladex]

Howie225 wrote...

if its like this they should nerf the biotic explosions and tech burst too then huh... basically they nerfed what makes the class useful. ability to sneak around and get objectives done and deal damage to boss characters. the con of the class is pretty much the fact that infiltrators are squishy and TC helped to alleviate this problem. however if you face geth you know how everything pretty much can shoot you even if you where cloaked not to mention the pain of having a banshee corner you while you are trying to shoot it.

personally still gonna tech my salarian and geth infiltrators for damage. so imma let the other people on the team try to get the objective done. give it enough time and people will start complaining that infiltrators are not doing their jobs and maybe they'll start asking for a buff

B-Explosions were nerfed fool. Tech Bursts were so weak that it was buffed dramatically. Blowin smoke up your *** before finding out facts is a ignorant thing to do.

[robarcool]

It isn't nerfed for cloak+shoot. It is nerfed to avoid being a be all end all. I didn't like the damage nerf though! Well, I will keep rolling.

[Fox-snipe]

cly57 wrote...
However, I always felt bad for infiltrators because everyone always expected them to do the revives and cap the 4 objectives.  That is a lot of pressure and when I tried to be an infiltrator - getting all those things done left very little time for me to kill stuff (plus I suck as a sniper.[1]

  I would think this would take some of the pressure off and now those things are everyone's responsibilities and not just the infiltrators - which is how it should be in a cooperative game.[2]

1) I never minded those added responsibilities, it tended to be a fun challenge to see if I could revive everyone who went down.  I never liked leaving someone to rot even if they were a schmuck and charged into a Banshee (as much as I cursed them in my mind).  Now though I'm unlikely to even give a downed player the time of day.

2) Except people aren't going to want to adapt to the loss of their Magic Objective Runner.  They'll instead curse us for not taking the longer duration.  Which if we did means we are more useless on 8 out of 11 waves (more, since I doubt all three objectives will be the 4-count variety) and can't weaken a boss as much as we could before.

And if we want to take the Damage bonus to be more useful for a greater period of the game, the team needs to stop counting on us for objectives.  Which got us crap for not being "team players."  Which puts us right back to the first sentence in the above paragraph.


We're in a no-win situation when it comes to the nerfers, because of the nerfers.  In other words, they got 100% what they want, but we're still in a position where they will have the same exact reasons for hating us, except now those reasons are valid and we cannot deal with it.

The slight damage decrease, for what it's worth, I don't really mind (except that why the hell are shotguns more useful than snipers).  The duration cut is the killer.

Bolo Xia wrote...
why should i team play when someone is being butthurt over a nerf?

Why should we, when we were nerfed because people simply didn't like us, had ego problems, or have some kind of elitist attitude that we made the game too easy and no one but the top 1% should be able to extract on Gold?  Why are we not permitted to feel targetted and spiteful thanks to those very vocal minority players?  Why do you get a pass to suicide and be spiteful to us when our ability to teamplay was directly decreased because of other players (similar in attitude to you no less)?

Modifié par Fox-snipe, 27 juin 2012 - 02:12 .

[Lord Rosario]

My geth infiltrator laughs at this nerf! [And so does my Salarian] And a laughing geth is a rare sight indeed. TC is still op stronger than any other single ability, but at least the nerfing calls might, at the very least, slow down.

[Mal3fact0r]

Fox-snipe wrote...

 
2) Except people aren't going to want to adapt to the loss of their Magic Objective Runner.  They'll instead curse us for not taking the longer duration.  Which if we did means we are more useless on 8 out of 11 waves (more, since I doubt all three objectives will be the 4-count variety) and can't weaken a boss as much as we could before.

Let them cry, it's their crying that got us where we are they can suck it up now. I know I'll enjoy killing things a lot more and bad players can learn some teamwork instead of Infils having to do it.

[Lord Rosario]

Fox-snipe wrote...

1) I never minded those added responsibilities, it tended to be a fun challenge to see if I could revive everyone who went down.  I never liked leaving someone to rot even if they were a schmuck and charged into a Banshee (as much as I cursed them in my mind).  Now though I'm unlikely to even give a downed player the time of day.

2) Except people aren't going to want to adapt to the loss of their Magic Objective Runner.  They'll instead curse us for not taking the longer duration.  Which if we did means we are more useless on 8 out of 11 waves (more, since I doubt all three objectives will be the 4-count variety) and can't weaken a boss as much as we could before.

And if we want to take the Damage bonus to be more useful for a greater period of the game, the team needs to stop counting on us for objectives.  Which got is crap for not being "team players."  Which puts us right back to the first sentence in the above paragraph.


We're in a no-win situation when it comes to the nerfers, because of the nerfers.  In other words, they got 100% what they want, but we're still in a position where they will have the same exact reasons for hating us, except now those reasons are valid and we cannot deal with it.

The slight damage decrease, for what it's worth, I don't really mind (except that why the hell are shotguns more useful than snipers).  The duration cut is the killer.

Just no. You're making a lot of assumptions here that simply aren't true. You assume all the nerfers are 100% happy with this change. You also asume that anyone that wants to nerf the infiltrators want it because infiltrators were not team players. You assume that nerfers are the one's ridiculing people in game for not capping objectives, killing enemies, etc. You assume too much and you will find that these assumptions are in most cases incorrect.

[Shadow of Terror]

I'm in a match with 3 infiltrators (me being the 1 non).

I think it's still pretty damn good.

[friedricethem0n]

Hmm... I've just tried playing a Geth Claymore Infiltrator build (with Claymore X). Still doable, I guess. But the TC nerfs does not foster teamwork at all. It had just made infiltrators more selfish and less inclined to stick their neck out to revive teammates and perform objectives. It's pretty much every man for himself on Gold. God help us biotic players...

Thank you nerf herders for indirectly killing us biotic users on Gold.

[Father_Jerusalem]

First off: To anyone snarking "what's next, Biotic Explosions nerf?" well.. BEs were already nerfed. So. Congratulations on being late to the party? I guess?

Secondly: Any infiltrator who's rantiing "well screw you guys, I'm not going to revive or cap now!" will, in turn, not get any revives from me - or from, I'm betting, a lot of other people. You want to whine about a completely fair and necessary nerf and pretend like you're martyrs? Go ahead. Just don't expect me to care about you in return.

[xtorma]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

First off: To anyone snarking "what's next, Biotic Explosions nerf?" well.. BEs were already nerfed. So. Congratulations on being late to the party? I guess?

Secondly: Any infiltrator who's rantiing "well screw you guys, I'm not going to revive or cap now!" will, in turn, not get any revives from me - or from, I'm betting, a lot of other people. You want to whine about a completely fair and necessary nerf and pretend like you're martyrs? Go ahead. Just don't expect me to care about you in return.

right back at ya

Modifié par xtorma, 27 juin 2012 - 02:27 .

[Lord Rosario]

Shadow of Terror wrote...

I'm in a match with 3 infiltrators (me being the 1 non).

I think it's still pretty damn good.

I'm in a match with one infiltrato.. me being the one.. I don't feel any weaker to be honest. Still droping things in one shot [two if they have shields] and seriously pounding the bosses. Know the best part? I went for duration.

[Lord Rosario]

friedricethem0n wrote...

Hmm... I've just tried playing a Geth Claymore Infiltrator build (with Claymore X). Still doable, I guess. But the TC nerfs does not foster teamwork at all. It had just made infiltrators more selfish and less inclined to stick their neck out to revive teammates and perform objectives. It's pretty much every man for himself on Gold. God help us biotic players...

Thank you nerf herders for indirectly killing us biotic users on Gold.

I just actually made a signiture, and I think it is relavent to your post.

[FreeshootXiggy]

While I think this community is retarded for calling for nerfs, I don't see much of a difference. They changed the encumb on a lot of rifles, and it's a good thing I learned to multi cloak. Also, there's ways of boosting the time isn't there? duration items work on it if I'm correct in saying. This is kind of a yes and no hit to Infiltrator. But way to go, we're nerfing classes left and right because of a scoreboard. Way to go team!

[Howie225]

Wolfsbladex wrote...

Howie225 wrote...

if its like this they should nerf the biotic explosions and tech burst too then huh... basically they nerfed what makes the class useful. ability to sneak around and get objectives done and deal damage to boss characters. the con of the class is pretty much the fact that infiltrators are squishy and TC helped to alleviate this problem. however if you face geth you know how everything pretty much can shoot you even if you where cloaked not to mention the pain of having a banshee corner you while you are trying to shoot it.

personally still gonna tech my salarian and geth infiltrators for damage. so imma let the other people on the team try to get the objective done. give it enough time and people will start complaining that infiltrators are not doing their jobs and maybe they'll start asking for a buff

B-Explosions were nerfed fool. Tech Bursts were so weak that it was buffed dramatically. Blowin smoke up your *** before finding out facts is a ignorant thing to do.

all they did was nerf the range by 1m the ability to deal massive damage and spam explosions on bosses which tend to be surrounded by multiple enemies is still there. they buffed tech burst damage, but i basically used it only for crowd control to stun them as an engineer while the team picked them off. what i was saying was if they nerfed it so that you have to kill the opponent with the detonator power for the combo to go off similar to fire explosion or cryo explosion
p.s. why the rage mama still dont love you enough kid

[Fox-snipe]

Lord Rosario wrote...

Fox-snipe wrote...

We're in a no-win situation when it comes to the nerfers, because of the nerfers.  In other words, they got 100% what they want, but we're still in a position where they will have the same exact reasons for hating us, except now those reasons are valid and we cannot deal with it.

Just no. You're making a lot of assumptions here that simply aren't true. You assume all the nerfers are 100% happy with this change. You also asume that anyone that wants to nerf the infiltrators want it because infiltrators were not team players. You assume that nerfers are the one's ridiculing people in game for not capping objectives, killing enemies, etc. You assume too much and you will find that these assumptions are in most cases incorrect.

I don't assume anything.  I'm stating exactly what I have seen on the forums in terms of majority.

Because they are the ones that did the most complaining.  If you want to blame someone for my loss of interest in keeping my team alive and moving through the waves, I suggest you target your blame at the vocal minority instead of me.  Because It's not my fault my utility has dimished.  I'm not going to put aside my enjoyment just so I can be useful for a small portion of my games.

[Edit]

FreeshootXiggy wrote...

While I think this community is retarded for calling for nerfs, I don't see much of a difference. They changed the encumb on a lot of rifles, and it's a good thing I learned to multi cloak. Also, there's ways of boosting the time isn't there? duration items work on it if I'm correct in saying. This is kind of a yes and no hit to Infiltrator. But way to go, we're nerfing classes left and right because of a scoreboard. Way to go team!

I don't think there is any consumable/gear that impacts duraction, since very few powers even have a "duration" to them.  All the bonuses are either damage (weapons, powers), cooldown, or recharge (shields).

Modifié par Fox-snipe, 27 juin 2012 - 03:06 .

[Lord Rosario]

Fox-snipe wrote...

Lord Rosario wrote...

Fox-snipe wrote...

1) I never minded those added responsibilities, it tended to be a fun challenge to see if I could revive everyone who went down.  I never liked leaving someone to rot even if they were a schmuck and charged into a Banshee (as much as I cursed them in my mind).  Now though I'm unlikely to even give a downed player the time of day.

2) Except people aren't going to want to adapt to the loss of their Magic Objective Runner.  They'll instead curse us for not taking the longer duration.  Which if we did means we are more useless on 8 out of 11 waves (more, since I doubt all three objectives will be the 4-count variety) and can't weaken a boss as much as we could before.

And if we want to take the Damage bonus to be more useful for a greater period of the game, the team needs to stop counting on us for objectives.  Which got is crap for not being "team players."  Which puts us right back to the first sentence in the above paragraph.


We're in a no-win situation when it comes to the nerfers, because of the nerfers.  In other words, they got 100% what they want, but we're still in a position where they will have the same exact reasons for hating us, except now those reasons are valid and we cannot deal with it.

The slight damage decrease, for what it's worth, I don't really mind (except that why the hell are shotguns more useful than snipers).  The duration cut is the killer.

Just no. You're making a lot of assumptions here that simply aren't true. You assume all the nerfers are 100% happy with this change. You also asume that anyone that wants to nerf the infiltrators want it because infiltrators were not team players. You assume that nerfers are the one's ridiculing people in game for not capping objectives, killing enemies, etc. You assume too much and you will find that these assumptions are in most cases incorrect.

I don't assume anything.  I'm stating exactly what I have seen on the forums in terms of majority.

Because they are the ones that did the most complaining.  If you want to blame someone for my loss of interest in keeping my team alive and moving through the waves, I suggest you target your blame at the vocal minority instead of me.  Because It's not my fault my utility has dimished.  I'm not going to put aside my enjoyment just so I can be useful for a small portion of my games.

I don't know a single person that was calling for nerfs and complaining that infiltrators don't go for the objectives and revives, at least none of the smart ones. Anyone calling for a nerf was calling for it because the infiltrators did too much, not too little.

Besides.. anyone that is complaining about an infiltrator not going for objectives/reviving is a twit anyways. An infiltrator should not have to do any more than any other team mate. If they are expecting so much, then they should be the one's doing it, not pushing it off on someone else.

[Fox-snipe]

Lord Rosario wrote...
Besides.. anyone that is complaining about an infiltrator not going for objectives/reviving is a twit anyways. An infiltrator should not have to do any more than any other team mate. If they are expecting so much, then they should be the one's doing it, not pushing it off on someone else.

I whole-heartedly agree with you there.  Sadly that doesn't seem to be the case in most games.  Which is why I took up the duty to revive and hit the 4-count objectives, knowing I was helping my team (and still getting flak for it from the vocal nerfers).  I didn't even mind it since it was something from the norm (and didn't ruin my ability to be still have fun on the other murder-focused waves).

Maybe I'm too far on the jerk side of the scale right now, but frankly I don't care.  The change has made me very spiteful.  I'm sure I'll adjust and continue to try and do objectives at some point, but right now, no, absolutely not.  This is what the vocal community (and Bioware, so maybe they'll notice the lop-sided preference) want, so that's what they'll get.  If it's the choice between sitting on my ass for 8+ waves, or killing/having fun for 11, guess which one I'm going to pick?

You can't keep hitting the dog with a newspaper and not expect it to bite back at some point.

Modifié par Fox-snipe, 27 juin 2012 - 03:17 .

[Teliko Freedman]

That 4 second loss of duration is really bad for me...

I'm willing to settle for 2 more seconds added to base duration, and make Rank 4 100% duration instead.

[Pedro Costa]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

First off: To anyone snarking "what's next, Biotic Explosions nerf?" well.. BEs were already nerfed. So. Congratulations on being late to the party? I guess?

Secondly: Any infiltrator who's rantiing "well screw you guys, I'm not going to revive or cap now!" will, in turn, not get any revives from me - or from, I'm betting, a lot of other people. You want to whine about a completely fair and necessary nerf and pretend like you're martyrs? Go ahead. Just don't expect me to care about you in return.

This. Spot on, really.

[usctrojanbulldog]

Dude, this is an awesome nerf. I'll be honest, I was dead set against any nerf due to the overstepping that takes place.

However, this nerf forces most infiltrators to play the class the way I use to play it before I moved on. You will need to stay out of TC and use the power in the most appropriate situations. You won't be able to cloak and sit forever lining up a shot. Now enemies will focus on infiltrators the way they focus on the rest of the team.

Most importantly, now the lone batarian isn't getting gang ****** by 20 husks because the other three infiltrators are sitting in cloak at the back of the map looking for more impressive targets.

[Mozts]

 Whiners: Spec your cloak for duration, so you can cry for longer without no one seeing.

[f15_ace]

I think what some people are forgetting though, is that we now have the permanent gear bonus with the rebellion pack and new level 4 ammo bonuses, as well as level 4 shield, power damage, ect bonuses. So if you get your permanent gear bonus to level 5, you get 15% extra weapon damage. Couple that with a level 4 ammo bonus, and you are doing pretty much the same damage as before the nerfs. You can choose duration with 40% damage and make up or surpass the other 40% with gear. I mean, before rebellion we didn't have the permanent gear bonus, but we were still doing gold runs just fine. Then they gave us gear perks up to 15% extra damage, and we were still doing gold runs just fine. Now they take 15% off TC's sniper rifle bonus, and 40 percent damage bonus if you choose duration, but they gave us level 4 consumables, presumably adding an extra 10% to whatever the level 3s were doing. I think we will still be doing gold runs just fine.

In silver and bronze, I don't think this nerf isn't going to matter very much. I almost always play as a Salarian INF, but i think succeeding on Gold is more about smart players than whether or not you are doing an extra 15 or 20 percent damage. Smart players will not die as often, no matter what class they are. If they don't die as much, they don't need others to revive them. If a team doesn't need to revive much, they can fight much more effectively and prevent themselves from being overwhelmed. I mean, most of the times I remember failing gold was because we let the wave close in and surround us. Usually it starts with one guy getting instant killed or downed early into a wave. But if you play smart, you won't be needing a revive halfway across the map 10 seconds into a wave. Sure the duration nerf will have an effect, but no INF should be getting 15+ revives in a map in the first place.

[f15_ace]

Also, the duration nerf will have an effect one the 1-2-3-4 missions. Sure it will lead to a little higher failure rate, but I think it will just mean firing more missiles. Even with the nerf, if you cloak and immediately start, you will be halfway finished before uncloaking. The only times you are going to have trouble completing this objective is if one is placed in the middle of a enemy wave. And when that happens, it is trouble whether or not you have a 5 second cloak or a 13. It just means firing a missile or two. So don't waste a missile on a couple brutes or a single banshee unless it is absolutely necessary.

[Psycho Pisces]

Bolo Xia wrote...

Psycho Pisces wrote...

*SNIP* for length... Insert men flinching here.

so since i dont play infiltrator often should i stop reviving and doing objectives too?
based on how i dont have TC at all, by what your argument is i shouldnt revive or do objectives at all.

basically when i run into goofy teammates taking your advice i will just suicide everytime.
why should i team play when someone is being butthurt over a nerf?

oh and btw i dont run into many infiltrators that actually do the disable objectives anyways so it wont be really anything new.

I was being sarcastic,  Everyone demanding the Infiltrator fulfill all roles... Since they had tactical cloak, logically that meant they had medic duty...

Since they had tactical cloak, logically that meant that while running across the ENTIRE MAP to pick up some n00b going rambo in gold.. They obviously had time to cap all 4 objectives at the same time... an if they didn't they failed as infiltrator.  

This constant whining and demanding made a LOT of us do a few things that made people still complain.   On top of rezing people, capping objectives, and crowd control (Krysae)... We found ways to excell at our jobs and that made everying cry more. 

IF this were PVP I could UNDERSTAND the pitiful crying about how OP Infiltrator was, but no this is co-op.. We're all suppose to work as a team.   Now Infiltrators are expected to give up their damage bonus, spec for longer duration for less damange and STILL fill all those roles expected of us. 

I can top the score board with ease on bronze, silver, and sometimes gold..  Even after the nerf.   However IF I'm going to be a team player, I have to sacrifice MY fun becuase someone cried I was enjoying a game.  

I get to make that choice now, do I spec for damage an take down the tough enemies... Or do I spec for duration and snipe the trash Enemies for points while tagging ops..   It was less than 6 hours before people started crying the nerf didn't go far enough... Those people are NEVER happy so long as someone else higher on the scoreboard, even if that scoreboard is truly meaningless.