Aller au contenu

Photo

Merrill and Morrigan's Eluvian in DA3?


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
8 réponses à ce sujet

#1
computasaysnoo

computasaysnoo
  • Members
  • 25 messages
 I remember Merrill saying that the people of Arlathan used to use the Eluvian to communicate within their empire. 
At the end of Witch-Hunt DLC, we see Morrigan travel to a place "beyond the fade," through what Finn acknowledges as "an Eluvian." 
Considering Merrill doesn't smash the Eluvian in DA2 (She does this if she's rivaled,) then could Morrigan somehow communicate with her? I can't imagine that Eluvian's are a dime a dozen, and it's a coincidence that both Morrigan and Merril were working on restoring them in Origins and Da2 respectfully. 
Merrill already seemed to be connected to Flemeth as we saw in Act 1 of DA2. Perhaps Morrigan and Merrill could communicate and that's how Morrigan will be linked to Da3. Could Merrill help her pass back through into Thedas? 

Thoughts? :wizard:

#2
CuriousArtemis

CuriousArtemis
  • Members
  • 19 656 messages
I don't think we'll see much of Merrill again, at least in regards to the Eluvian, because she did smash it if rivaled. But I definitely think the Eluvians will make an appearance because they've been a continuous presence throughout the series thus far (the Eluvian also killed Tamlen and poisoned the Dalish Warden). And we know Morrigan will be back simply because she is a fan favorite (believe this has been confirmed).

Merrill isn't really connected with Flemeth; she was First and so she knew who Flemeth was; that's it.

#3
TEWR

TEWR
  • Members
  • 16 988 messages

motomotogirl wrote...

I don't think we'll see much of Merrill again, at least in regards to the Eluvian, because she did smash it if rivaled


Not really. That she may have smashed her personal mirror and stopped blood magic doesn't negate the possibility of her being seen around other Eluvians.

Her dialogue could be different or she may start working on that newly discovered Eluvian, since her Rivalry is about getting her to stop working on the one seen in the Dalish Ruins. As I understand it, she doesn't vow to stop researching the Eluvians themselves, but does stop working on the one that her clan found.

motomotogirl wrote...

Merrill isn't really connected with Flemeth; she was First and so she knew who Flemeth was; that's it.


The Elves as a whole are though. In fact, the thing Merrill recites to bring Flemeth back is In Uthenara in the Elvhen language.

#4
thats1evildude

thats1evildude
  • Members
  • 11 008 messages

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

The Elves as a whole are though. In fact, the thing Merrill recites to bring Flemeth back is In Uthenara in the Elvhen language.


Maaaaaaybe. The fact that she's being resurrected in an elven burial site may be the reason Merrill recites In Uthenara; it might have had something to do with harnessing the energy of that place.

I'm not convinced that Flemeth is an elven god or anything else connected to the elves. I know that the Dalish fear her and afford her a measure of respect, but that could simply be because she's immensely powerful and as old as sin.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 28 juin 2012 - 08:52 .


#5
robertthebard

robertthebard
  • Members
  • 6 108 messages

computasaysnoo wrote...

 I remember Merrill saying that the people of Arlathan used to use the Eluvian to communicate within their empire. 
At the end of Witch-Hunt DLC, we see Morrigan travel to a place "beyond the fade," through what Finn acknowledges as "an Eluvian." 
Considering Merrill doesn't smash the Eluvian in DA2 (She does this if she's rivaled,) then could Morrigan somehow communicate with her? I can't imagine that Eluvian's are a dime a dozen, and it's a coincidence that both Morrigan and Merril were working on restoring them in Origins and Da2 respectfully. 
Merrill already seemed to be connected to Flemeth as we saw in Act 1 of DA2. Perhaps Morrigan and Merrill could communicate and that's how Morrigan will be linked to Da3. Could Merrill help her pass back through into Thedas? 

Thoughts? :wizard:

Doesn't using the Eluvian render it powerless in Witch Hunt?  Assuming it doesn't, Merrill's Eluvian is after the demon that was "helping" her gets destroyed.  It was, after all, shattered in Origins, and she's been trying to remake it so it would work.  Of course, from the plot line, it seems that "purifying" it actually set it up as a conduit between where the demon was imprisoned, where-ever that may have been, and the mortal plane.  So no, whatever it's initial properties may have been, they don't exist any more.

If using Morrigan's Eluvian to travel did indeed discharge it, Merrill doesn't, at the end of 2, know how to make it work again.  Perhaps she can find knowledge to do so, but, I don't think it's going to be likely to be part of any future installments.

#6
TEWR

TEWR
  • Members
  • 16 988 messages

robertthebard wrote...

Doesn't using the Eluvian render it powerless in Witch Hunt?


More or less. For that specific Eluvian, it does. It only had enough power left in it to be used one time. That however doesn't negate the possibility that Morrigan could find another one in Eluvian Land.

Assuming of course they're easier to find in Eluvian Land. All we know about it is that it's:

1) Safe enough for Morrigan to feel confident in going there and more importantly leaving an untrained and unwatched child on the other side.
2) That it lies "beyond Thedas and beyond the Fade"
3) It's got something to do with Elves, more then likely.

robertthebard wrote...
  Assuming it doesn't, Merrill's Eluvian is after the demon that was "helping" her gets destroyed.  It was, after all, shattered in Origins, and she's been trying to remake it so it would work.  Of course, from the plot line, it seems that "purifying" it actually set it up as a conduit between where the demon was imprisoned,


Incorrect. It's very clearly established that Merrill's purification of the tainted shard was nothing more then using the powers inherent in blood to amplify her magic. There wasn't any "ritual" involved. She learned blood magic and she used it to amplify her powers.

That's all there is to it.

If it was a specific blood magic ritual, then she wouldn't have said she could've used lyrium as a subsitute, had she had enough of it. Lyrium acts as an amplifier as well. Blood magic would've been the only way, plain and simple. Instead, it was the easiest, quickest, and most readily available method she had considering she lacked the lyrium option. 

1) Merrill was taught Marethari's healing magic -- per DAO's DE Origin -- that was proven to be able to combat the taint in its unamplified form. When Marethari used it anyway, but Marethari said in DAO that Merrill knew the same magic.

2) The Demon taught Merrill blood magic. She says that she went to learn blood magic. Not that she learned any particular ritual needed in the cleansing.

3) Blood magic amplifies the power of magic, per the lore.

4) Anders never states that the shard is tainted, when he is so against the Eluvian. If it was tainted still, he would've told Hawke that it was so Hawke wouldn't help Merrill. Since he didn't, we know that it was in fact cleansed -- along with the fact that Merrill goes 7 years without being tainted.

5) It's very clearly stated in-game and out that the Demon was trapped in that demonic Buddha statue, sundered from the Fade, and could ONLY be freed by a powerful spell -- of which we have no idea if Merrill knew the particular spell, but we know Marethari does. He is basically Justice without the ability to move around the mortal world when he wants. He's stuck in the mortal world forever, unless someone frees him by the only method possible -- Marethari's method.

6) Marethari has said in both games that she wants nothing to do with the Eluvians. That includes researching them. So anything she says on the matter shouldn't be believed at all. And considering she was on the mountain for years on end, listening to the infernal whisperings of the Demon, I'm inclined to believe it manipulated her into freeing it. More then likely by feeding it lies based on what she wanted to hear -- "You were right, she was wrong. Free me and she'll be safe!"

7) As I stated above, Morrigan told us the Eluvians go beyond Thedas and beyond the Fade.


where-ever that may have been, and the mortal plane.  So no, whatever it's initial properties may have been, they don't exist any more.


They do. They're just dormant. Merrill states in-game that she can actually feel the power inside of the Eluvian, but can't get it to awaken.

thats1evildude wrote...

Maaaaaaybe. The fact that she's being resurrected in an elven burial site may be the reason Merrill recites In Uthenara; it might have had something to do with harnessing the energy of that place.


Is that even possible? As far as I know, it's just a song meant to be sung for the dead.

I'm not convinced that Flemeth is an elven god or anything else connected to the elves. I know that the Dalish fear her and afford her a measure of respect, but that could simply be because she's immensely powerful and as old as sin.


Well, she is the only known person to refer to the Dalish by the name they adhere to -- The People. That alone says that she at least is connected to the Elves.

Perhaps not in a "They're linked together through mutual history" type of connection, but at the very least in a "She does afford them some respect as well and knows about their history" sort of connection, y'know?

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 29 juin 2012 - 06:35 .


#7
thats1evildude

thats1evildude
  • Members
  • 11 008 messages

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Is that even possible? As far as I know, it's just a song meant to be sung for the dead.


Sort of. Uthenara is a very old elven ritual harkening back to the days when the elvhan were (supposedly) immortal. It had to do with ushering a loved one on to the afterlife once they've become tired of life.

Once Hawke has reached the Free Marches, what's stopping Flemeth simply pop out of the amulet? My assumption is that she can't, not without assistance.

For that matter, if it's simply a matter of reciting In Uthenara over the amulet, why not set it on the ground and do it the moment you meet Merrill? Why haul it all the way up to that altar on Sundermount?

I think she uses that ritual to power her resurrection. I mean, it's a Dalish burial rite being performed in an ancient elven graveyard. That's got to lend the ritual some metaphysical significance.

#8
computasaysnoo

computasaysnoo
  • Members
  • 25 messages
It is a coincidence that the Eluvians have surfaced three times in the Dragon age games (Dalish Origins;Witch Hunt and DA2.) Why would they end the tradition for DA3? I think that tying the two characters that used Eluvians together would be not only a great twist but an interesting way of bringing Morrigan back into DA3. 
Also, Morrigan and Merrill both spent a long time getting their Eluvians into shape. Just because Merrill smashed it, doesn't tell me that she hasn't the power to rebuild it. I won't go into the mechanics behind repairing an Eluvian, because I'm basing that one on Merrill being a smart enough/experienced mage, but I'd say that with enough of her blood magic and Elvish knowledge, she could get it back into shape. 
On the Flemeth/Elf thing: I remember Marethari saying that getting Flemeth to emerge from the amulet at Sundermount was her "paying back a debt, just as you." If Marethari was in a debt (or possibly many debts)  to Flemeth, then would these debts be passed onto Merrill, as the next-in-line? Wether she was banished from the camp is trivial because she was Marethari's first for all that time. Maybe Flemeth will call in her debts and demand Merrill to summon Morrigan through the repaired Eluvian? Maybe this way, Flemeth can have her much anticipated confrontation with Morrigan. 


Hawke: I'm not sure if this Morrigan is your daughter or your enemy. 

Flemeth: Either is she. 

Modifié par computasaysnoo, 05 juillet 2012 - 02:27 .


#9
Face of Evil

Face of Evil
  • Members
  • 2 511 messages

computasaysnoo wrote...

Hawke: I'm not sure if this Morrigan is your daughter or your enemy. 

Flemeth: Either is she. 


Slight quibble, but the quote is "Neither is she." That 'N' makes a difference.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 05 juillet 2012 - 04:28 .