76 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadesofsiknas]

SirDremor that would be appreciated. Pleas let us know how it goes.

[SirDremor]

As promised, I've tried to check DAO-generated traffic. So that's what I found:

DAO generates nearly 200 frames during logging in and loading content (with DAUpdater turrned on), the most addressed places are:

biostore.bioware.com (on ip: 159.153.106.159) - 50% of frames
dragonage-pc.fesl.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.3) - 25%
dragonage.gos.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.25)
Some other EA servers (on ip range of 159.153.244.xxx)
Limelight Networks, Inc. (on different ip addresses throught the world - US, Europe, Australia) - don't panic, they are some kind of network partner of EA.

The most strange thing I found is that many frames has no data - they're either control frames or... just empty.
Well, everything written above shows, that perhaps I was wrong, because 200 frames is not something, that could bring down modern routers.
What perhaps could - is SSL3. You see, DAO uses SSL3 encryption for some connections. And in order for SSL3 to work properly it also must establish some kind of secure connection between PC and the router... which may,  in theory, cause router hick-ups... or slowdowns.

As proposed by Jesse van Herk, I tried to disable all in-game online options - one by one - to no avail - the troubles persisted.

Then, as he also noted - I disabled DAUpdater service. And THAT is the most interesting.
If the game is in "Logged out" state - then everything is fine - I could load my games even with DLC enabled. Strange, but as it is.
In this mode, the connection is ONLY made to:

dragonage-pc.fesl.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.3)
Some other EA servers (on ip range 159.153.244.xxx)

No biostore.bioware.com, no Limelight servers, no dragonage.gos.ea.com... and as a result no errors, and troubles, except, that your progress won't be uploaded to your profile.


If I log in, then I am not able even to load a game with DLC enabled - the game simply can't verify my authorization to use it (because of turned off DAUpdater service). I tried to disable DLC, but as it was still in my saved games, I still couldn't load.

So, that's all for now. I guess, it is pretty clear, that DAUpdater service and namely something, that connects to biostore.bioware.com has something to do with loss of connection, what causes network slowdowns... I don't know, but I think it may be SSL3.

Anyway, if there's somebody, who knows more, please, tell us.

Modifié par SirDremor, 19 décembre 2009 - 02:21 .

[fkirenicus]

Great work, SirDremor, thanks!

SirDremor wrote...

As promised, I've tried to check DAO-generated traffic. So that's what I found:

DAO generates nearly 200 frames during logging in and loading content (with DAUpdater turrned on), the most addressed places are:

biostore.bioware.com (on ip: 159.153.106.159) - 50% of frames
dragonage-pc.fesl.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.3) - 25%
dragonage.gos.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.25)
Some other EA servers (on ip range of 159.153.244.xxx)
Limelight Networks, Inc. (on different ip addresses throught the world - US, Europe, Australia) - don't panic, they are some kind of network partner of EA.

Heh heh, you say... "Don't panic"?
May I be permitted to again remind about the EA "privacy" update around Dec 1st, where they say they collect info they may sell to 3rd parties?

Then, as he also noted - I disabled DAUpdater service. And THAT is the most interesting.
If the game is in "Logged out" state - then everything is fine - I could load my games even with DLC enabled. Strange, but as it is.
In this mode, the connection is ONLY made to:

dragonage-pc.fesl.ea.com (on ip: 159.153.235.3)
Some other EA servers (on ip range 159.153.244.xxx)

No biostore.bioware.com, no Limelight servers, no dragonage.gos.ea.com... and as a result no errors, and troubles, except, that your progress won't be uploaded to your profile.

If I log in, then I am not able even to load a game with DLC enabled - the game simply can't verify my authorization to use it (because of turned off DAUpdater service). I tried to disable DLC, but as it was still in my saved games, I still couldn't load.

So, that's all for now. I guess, it is pretty clear, that DAUpdater service and namely something, that connects to biostore.bioware.com has something to do with loss of connection, what causes network slowdowns... I don't know, but I think it may be SSL3.

You don't say.... So it seems that the "innocent" DAupdater service does quite a few other things than verifying DLC - as I and others suspected.
Well, your research has made my decision to completely disable the DAupdater service and play offline more adamant.
Again, thank you!

[SirDremor]

2fkirenicus, actually I can't understand what are you so afraid about. "New" privacy policy doesn't have anything, that should worry enyone.

We are living in a world of facebook and twitter, everyone places all the info about themselves online, photos (even XXX ones), phone numbers, addresses, e-mails... what are you afraid of on EA.com? That they could sell your name and IP address to some other site? You don't provide them with anything really valuable, and don't try to tell me, that your real Name and IP address is SO importaint, that you would kill yourself for such an information...

Anyway, THIS topic is not about privacy policy.

Modifié par SirDremor, 19 décembre 2009 - 03:06 .

[fkirenicus]

SirDremor wrote...

2fkirenicus, actually I can't understand what are you so afraid about. "New" privacy policy doesn't have anything, that should worry enyone.

If so, why do you use a firewall and other security software? If you permit information theft (yes, I call it theft when someone uses a game to collect info to about their users, with the purpose of selling that info to 3rd parties), why not let any hacker simply get access to your computer?

We are living in a world of facebook and twitter, everyone places all the info about themselves online, photos (even XXX ones), phone numbers, addresses, e-mails...

Speak for yourself. I do not display neither my mailaddress or phone number on my facebook page, and I try to have at least some control over the pictures of me that are on the internet.

what are you afraid of on EA.com? That they could sell your name and IP address to some other site? You don't provide them with anything really valuable, and don't try to tell me, that your real Name and IP address is SO importaint, that you would kill yourself for such an information...

As I said, I don't display my phone number on Facebook. I am very careful about not giving out info that can be used for sinister purposes.
But at least at Facebook I have the option of allowing it - in EA's case I have NO CHOICE about what info they collect on me or my computer. The "privacy" policy of EA states that they may retrieve my mobile ID... EXCUSE ME?? What the hell do you need that for??

I bought this game I thought looked insanely good, and it is. But I didn't buy this game to let a "trojan" into my computer that gathers info about me or my computer. I do not like hackers, whether they call themselves "John Doe" or EA. Is that so hard to understand?

Anyway, THIS topic is not about privacy policy.

No, it's about known and not-so-known features of the DAUpdater "trojan" service.

Modifié par fkirenicus, 19 décembre 2009 - 03:42 .

[SirDremor]

No, it is NOT about "not-so-known features of the DAUpdater ", this topic is about troubles with network connections.

You know "about what info they collect on me or my compute", it is clearly stated in Privace Policy and doesn't contain anything suspicious.
DAO is not "trojan", it doesn't collect anything, it doesn't have any sniffing modules build-in, all EA has collected - was provided by you during your registration on this site (IP - automatically... but you can always use proxy), and will be collected, when you use their online services... what's the problem?
You know who, when and what will try to collect... you may always stop using theirs online services.

You think facebook doesn't keep some info, you don't know they keep? Well, good luck with that.

Modifié par SirDremor, 19 décembre 2009 - 03:50 .

[georage]

Conspiracy theorists should NOT use networked computers.

Thanks for the info SirDremor! I'll turn off the updater and see how that goes.

Modifié par georage, 19 décembre 2009 - 04:51 .

[fkirenicus]

SirDremor wrote...

No, it is NOT about "not-so-known features of the DAUpdater ", this topic is about troubles with network connections.

But you agree that the DAUpdater plays a role in that, yes? Or do you withdraw the data your research provided you with?

You know "about what info they collect on me or my compute", it is clearly stated in Privace Policy and doesn't contain anything suspicious.
DAO doesn't collect anything, it doesn't have any sniffing modules build-in, all EA has collected - was provided by you during your registration on this site (IP - automatically... but you can always use proxy), and will be collected, when you use their online services... what's the problem?
You know who, when and what will try to collect... you may always stop using theirs online services.

I won't "derail" this thread further. We don't agree on fundamental principles, so it's no use arguing more about this here. As I've said, I thank you for providing evidence that there are funny things going on in the background with the DAUpdater service. That piece of information was most welcome.

Modifié par fkirenicus, 19 décembre 2009 - 04:00 .

[Shadesofsiknas]

Thanks for the info SirDremor. Very intersesting.

[aries1001]

I sometimes buy games from amazon.co.uk - I have given amazon personal info and such things. Amazon keeps track of what I've been buying; they'd recommend me games (or books or movies to buy) from this. I like it This means that they care about me; I'm a good customer. I also times comments articles at newspapers in my country; they store my personal information, too. I don't have to write it everytime I comment, then. Very nice this is



The DAUpdater does nothing else, nothing more than these two services nor does it do anything more or less than windows update does.

[catofnine]

Thank you Sir Dremor for your work!



Left the DAupdater off for now and haven't seen any connection drops yet *knock on wood*. Will see if my rma'd wireless router would be happier with the daupdater off.

[Jayce]

BUGGERATION!

I've been having connection problems on and off exactly like this for over a week! I even spent an hour on the phone to the dreaded Mumbai call center last weekend and until now never connected the problem to DA. D'oh!

The only thing I can constructively add it that it seems to be killing my authentication with my ISP's servers, as though they can no longer recognize my modem as one of their own. That might lend some credence to the TLS/SSL3 theory, as it's definetly surfacing for me as a client/host handshake failure.

Modifié par Jayce F, 20 décembre 2009 - 06:23 .

[georage]

I cut off all the options in DAOs "online" tab and still get connection problems when the game is running.

[carrion0x07BD]

Um, great reading this. I was almost on the way to buy me a new mainboard since i thought my northbridge was fried or something. Not cool, EA.

[SirDremor]

2georage, I already told this - turning off ALL online options in DAO doesn't solve the problem - ONLY turning off DAUpdater service will resolve it. You can turn it off in Computer Management panel or you can always use run command: "services.msc".

Modifié par SirDremor, 21 décembre 2009 - 07:11 .

[georage]

Ahhh ... thanks SirDremor, I read right over that.

[NeoobieRPG122]

Im having the same problem with my internetz. Win 7 x64, no firewall, no AV.

It just kills my internet connection and nothing else works. Close out DAO and 50% my internet comes up without having to reboot my router.

[Jay91]

Sorry for being stupid, but how do I turn off this updater? What is it?
I installed the game, turned off all of the online stuff in the config program then tried to create an account through the game and the program hung and hung my router.
I rebooted pc and router and finally got it to create an account, but do I need to turn something else off as well as removing all the checks from the boxed in the online tab on the config tool in order to stop it hanging my router? Which really annoys my wife when she's working!

[Jayce]

*Grumbles*



Lost my connection again, 6th time in 8 days. Even after I switched off DAUpdater, I still had to reset my modem twice before I got my connection back.



*Sigh* I'm uninstalling Dragon Age and cancelling my ME2 order till they've sorted this. It's too much of an pain to have the net go down and then to reboot the modem a dozen times every time I switch on the computer.

[Jayce]

Jay91 wrote...

Sorry for being stupid, but how do I turn off this updater? What is it?
I installed the game, turned off all of the online stuff in the config program then tried to create an account through the game and the program hung and hung my router.
I rebooted pc and router and finally got it to create an account, but do I need to turn something else off as well as removing all the checks from the boxed in the online tab on the config tool in order to stop it hanging my router? Which really annoys my wife when she's working!

open up the "Run" command prompt from your start up menu
 
type in: services.msc

confirm it 

double left click the file labelled Dragon Age: Origins Content Updater

look for the Startup type button and select Disabled from the List.

You're done but remember, this will interfere with online content patches DLC etc.

Modifié par Jayce F, 22 décembre 2009 - 04:23 .

[Jay91]

Thanks. I missed the fact that it installed a service - which wasn't running. For some reason it was set to manual start and didn't start. Either that eliminates it from the list of possibilities for hanging the router, or means it crashed. Interestingly, once it's been started by me manually the game will restart it if I kill it.

I've now discovered the tech support page here:
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/81613/1
now, which helps a lot

Starting it from services makes two things appear in the list of things to buy with points as well - which was previously blank. I wondered why it was blank. I had just assumed that there was no extra content available yet. Funny - I had another problem and no way to know I even had the problem.

Anyway, thanks a lot for the help. Think I'll just disconnect the network cable before I run DLO in future, so that I don't risk hanging the router. Then ensure it's all dead (task manager) before I reconnect.

If I do this, will the stuff that I redeemed (some armour and golem thing) still be available?
Does it just validate when I redeemed it, or will it need to authenticate each time?
I also noticed that they aren't in the list of downloadable content, so I guess they go through a different system?
Are there any docs anywhere for how any of this works? There seem to be a distinct lack of instructions.

Modifié par Jay91, 22 décembre 2009 - 11:33 .

[AsheraII]

Jay91 wrote...

If I do this, will the stuff that I redeemed (some armour and golem thing) still be available?
Does it just validate when I redeemed it, or will it need to authenticate each time?
I also noticed that they aren't in the list of downloadable content, so I guess they go through a different system?
Are there any docs anywhere for how any of this works? There seem to be a distinct lack of instructions.

I think this might depend on the system and version you're using. Since you're on the PC Tech forum, I'll assume that you play the PC version.
I just booted up my laptop, disconnected physically from the internet (unplugged the cable, wireless is turned off by default for me), and was still able to enter Wardens' Keep normally. This is with the box version of DA:O. The Steam version might work different though.

[JEGam1]

Like several of you, will be shelving this game for awhile. Have Vista 64 Ultimate and a MS Laser Mouse, so no wheel function. Error 36 and the internet/router/restart fiasco is the final straw. Never had DLC or crash problems. Back to Sacred 2 Fire and Ice. Running like a real game now. Hope the well known issues of DAO are addressed and fixed as it is a fun game.

[poofighter77]

So no solutions on this? I happened to be just browsing but my internet has been losing connection like crazy lately-- as in since I installed DA:O. Would have never put those two together. This is total BS.

[Jay91]

Thanks. Yes I'm on windows (XP Pro).



Interestingly JEGam1: I have no wheel on my input device either (use a stylus because got tendon problems/RSI from mouse clicking), but my keyboard has a wheel-equivalent so that's OK. Annoying thing is it seems that you have to double-click on something to use it, and double-click button on stylus isn't recognised (is by NWN1 and 2 btw), so I have to have a mouse available as well for activation. Am hoping not to have to use it too much since clicking is the problem I have, otherwise I'll have to retire the game already. Does anybody know an 'activate' key. I looked at the controls options and couldn't see one. And tried stuff like ENTER. Maybe I just missed it though?