531 réponses à ce sujet

[IanPolaris]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

Have you ever dealt with Fire Ants?  I live in Texas and I have.  They can (and sometimes do) kill people.  Then there are the infamous "army ants" that all creatures (including humans) simply avoid when they are on the move.

It's an interesting analogy but not quite in the way I think you intended.

-Polaris

[Allan Schumacher]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

Science Daily: Fire Ants Can Attack Humans In Homes Or Health Care Facilities.

The ants won.

Sounds like a hit and run attack.  Those worked for humanity from time to time against the Reapers too

[Dragoonlordz]

nrcrane wrote...

The writers wanted it to be impossible to win conventionally so they did just that. It's a work of fiction so they could have easily done otherwise, and I think it was a mistake that they didn't. A conventional means of victory would have had a much more satisfying and climatic ending then the reaper off switch that was given.

If you recall before ME3 was released there were many discussions about how it should end and two things were what people kept saying, one was they did not want a conventional victory due to the sheer overwhelming power of the reapers of which large amounts of people said it was unrealistic to win the war with such at that time and second one was no big red win button to push. Now that ME3 has been released and completed some people are now redacting on that and asking for conventional because they did not enjoy the result.  There however should not be conventional victory in the first place just because you did not like what was presented.

[Malanek]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

I think the ant analogy is more disparate. They wouldn't comprehend the purpose of defeating humans. The big problem is that the story is at times inconsistant with the Reapers omnipotence. This is from the codex about the fall of Palaven...

When Taetrus fell, the turians knew little about the Reapers except that they wanted to enrage the turians. Staying calm, the turians massed force around Palaven, their homeworld. Fleet Admiral Irix Coronati, in what became known as the "Fifteen-Minute Plan," stationed only two carriers, Undaunted and Resolute, near the system's relay. When the Reaper fleet emerged, the carriers launched swarms of unmanned fighters and spy drones. These were quickly destroyed, but the drones transmitted vital data on the Reapers' effective range, fleet composition, and exact location. The turians' other ships then deployed to defend the system in earnest.

Knowing that the Reapers' weapons had a longer effective range than any of his own, Coronati made a short, daring FTL jump--landing his dreadnoughts in the middle of the Reaper fleet. The dreadnoughts then turned to line up their main guns on the Reapers, which also needed to turn to fire on the turians. This ploy used the Reapers' size against them--because they could turn faster, and their concentrated firepower downed several Reaper capital ships.

The Reapers countered instantly. Their destroyers performed a jump of their own to the skies above Palaven, beginning orbital strikes of turian cities. The turians, forced to defend the planet, found themselves in a pitched battle far from the relay, from which emerged a seemingly endless line of Reaper ships. After massive casualties, Coronati ordered retreat.

Just from this excerpt, a conventional victory should have been possible imo. Every advantage was the Reapers, but in the end they had to rely on reinforcements and the threat of non-milatary targtes. Overall the tactics of the Reapers were pretty bad from a galaxy wide perspective. They isolated their own forces to reap the galaxy faster but in doing so they would have allowed a united force to overwhelm the smaller groups of them.

Modifié par Malanek999, 28 juin 2012 - 11:01 .

[Carlthestrange]

I think a conventional victory would have been kinda insulting to the Protheans and all the cycles before them.

According to what we know, yes, they didn't make the Mass Relays. But the Protheans were still far more advanced than we are, and they still lost.

Lets face it. Our cycle beating the Reapers conventionally wouldn't have made sense.

[Twinzam.V]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

Science Daily: Fire Ants Can Attack Humans In Homes Or Health Care Facilities.

The ants won.

Sounds like a hit and run attack.  Those worked for humanity from time to time against the Reapers too

I'm not sure if a conventional victory would work. If only we had defeated a Reaper before and the military would start reverse engenering its wepons and armor.
But were talking about ME and the military in ME is kind of dumb to make the normal things that the army in the real world does.

Using ME logic, if in WW2 the Germans somehow caught the nuclear bomb they would say "Naaahhh, there's no point whatsoever of start mass producing this s**t.".

Modifié par Twinzam.V, 28 juin 2012 - 11:06 .

[IxSITHxI]

In a conversation with Javik, they say there were going to win the war against the Reapers. However they lost because of indoctrinated officials undermining them. So yes conventional victory is possible and heres how...

First, with the Leviathan DLC coming, it allows a Reaper to join forces with Shepard. Now then, this is the perfect opurtunity for them to please the people (95% of the fans) who hated the R G B endings. All they have to do is have it set that if you get this Reapers aid early enough, and you rally the whole galaxy (quarians and geth, cure genophage etc etc) it should be plausible to beat the Reapers conventionally. Leviathan would be able to give the victory fleet advanced weapons and defences as well as tactical data on the other Reapers. With this, choosing the F U god child option should allow the player to get the best possible ending. Your forces, with Reaper augmentation, should be able to defeat the much smaller Reaper fleet. With the Relays and the Citadel in still working condition, this victory fleet would be able to crush any smaller pockets of Reaper resistence. Shepard, not being forced into the BS RGB endings would be rescued by the Normandy, and after being hospitalised, is able to live on with his/her LI. They then show this in a CUTSCENE not a CHEAP ASS SLIDESHOW. And in Tali's case we see her effin face.

So in this one perfect ending, in which you have to do literally everything right and take the time and effort, we do get a happy ending. We get to watch the Normandy blasting Reapers with Turian, Asari, Salarian, Krogan, Batarian, Quarian, Geth, Rachni, Volus, and Elchor ( I think I got them all(the main ones at least)) forces in space and on the ground. Then we get to see the celebrations and what not *cough*starwars ending*cough*. Shepard settles down, and the game is set up for future DLC/Games. So everyone, the fans, and Bioware win.

With the FU god child option, failing to get EVERY SINGLE THING done right should still end in with the cycle. However, the only difference would be them showing, IN A CUTSCENE, the victory fleet going down in a blaze of hellfire and glory. It should show Palaven and the Turians and Asaris and Krogans going down fighting. The way it is now however is truly a slap in the face as it ends with " SO BE IT " cuts to bunker "Liaras monologue".

NOTE: Anyone sayin we cant have a happy ending clearly did not see the BS Synthesis ending wherein Kasumi , the DLC side character from ME 2 has the happiest ending. (Gamble confirmed that the Greybox brought Keiji back to life in synthesis.....SPACE MAGIC in full force in Synthesis wherein the Reaper are our Fwiends)

[nrcrane]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

nrcrane wrote...

The writers wanted it to be impossible to win conventionally so they did just that. It's a work of fiction so they could have easily done otherwise, and I think it was a mistake that they didn't. A conventional means of victory would have had a much more satisfying and climatic ending then the reaper off switch that was given.

If you recall before ME3 was released there were many discussions about how it should end and two things were what people kept saying, one was they did not want a conventional victory due to the sheer overwhelming power of the reapers of which large amounts of people said it was unrealistic to win the war with such at that time and second one was no big red win button to push. Now that ME3 has been released and completed some people are now redacting on that and asking for conventional because they did not enjoy the result.  There however should not be conventional victory in the first place just because you did not like what was presented.

Wasn't on the forums before so I can't go on what was said at the time.  It still does'nt change that I believe it was a mistake and just because in the past people on the forums thought there should not be a conventional means doesn't mean I don't think they were wrong either.

So people were also asking for no big red win button to push also, but you have no problem with that being basically what was given?

There should be a conventional means of victory in place, just because you did like what was presented doesn't mean the big red off buttion that was given is better.  Your opinion of how things should have ended is no more valuable then mine.

Also, you seem to be implying that I want the endings changed.  Just because I would have prefered something else does not mean I expect the writers to change what they did.  I would not want them to change the endings just because there are different opinions.  All I am saying that in hindsight they could have done better with a conventional means put in. Something they will hopefully consider in the future.

Modifié par nrcrane, 28 juin 2012 - 11:28 .

[Qeylis]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

Science Daily: Fire Ants Can Attack Humans In Homes Or Health Care Facilities.

The ants won.

So, I guess the answer is yes, ants have beaten humans.  And that isn't the first time.  Would you like to go smaller?  How about Bacteria?  They have beaten humans too.

I understand this isn't the place for a historical debate, but if you are referring to the Germans, they had better technology, we (all the Allies) had numbers.  Kind of like the Reaper war, just a bit more balanced.  If you are referring to any of the others, I didn't say better tech, just an inferior force.  

1. The Reapers lost the element of surprise.  From what we can tell, that has never happened before.

2. The Reaper Command and Control was discovered.  We know this is the first cycle to find it (unless Star Child is a liar.)

3. We had the largest, most diverse fleet ever assembled in this galaxy. (We know this because the sneak attack did not work.)

4. We had Reaper level intelligences on our side in the form of Geth.  It is unlikely that any other Cycle had that, as they would have been wiped out prior to gaining Reaper code, or their version of the Geth would have stayed indoctrinated.

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

[StevenG_CT]

What will be interesting is if conventional victory will in fact become possible at some point. Presumably all future single player DLC's (and we have been told that there will indeed be some) are going to be pre-ending and will almost certainly add more war resources. It would be awesome if at some point the "refuse" ending would allow for conventional victory (basically the "destroy" ending minus the synthetic genocide) if you were an absolute completionist and played all of the DLC's.

[Twinzam.V]

Qeylis wrote...

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

Forgot to add we also got their cannons from Sovereign (the ants also have machine guns).

[Qeylis]

StevenG_CT wrote...

What will be interesting is if conventional victory will in fact become possible at some point. Presumably all future single player DLC's (and we have been told that there will indeed be some) are going to be pre-ending and will almost certainly add more war resources. It would be awesome if at some point the "refuse" ending would allow for conventional victory (basically the "destroy" ending minus the synthetic genocide) if you were an absolute completionist and played all of the DLC's.

This would be great, and might restore my faith in BioWare.  However, they have said that there will be nothing more that is related to the ending.  So, I doubt it.  This flipping bird is where we will stand.

[Qeylis]

Twinzam.V wrote...

Qeylis wrote...

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

Forgot to add we also got their cannons from Sovereign (the ants also have machine guns).

lol, your right!

The ants have machine guns, not ant sized machine guns.  Full sized, scary machine guns (5).

Modifié par Qeylis, 28 juin 2012 - 11:25 .

[Allan Schumacher]

Qeylis wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Could this invincible force be defeated? Of course. The conditions have to be right, but any invincible force can be defeated. Germanic tribes beat the Roman Empire. Greeks (Alexander) beat Persia. The World beat the technologically superior Germans and their allies. America beat the worlds greatest power, England (or Britain). Afghanistan beat the USSR. North Vietnam beat the USA.

Have there been any recent occurrences of ants defeating human beings though? Particularly if those human beings have made it a goal to destroy the ants?

I don't think your analogies work because the level of technological superiority is not on the same level as the Reapers vs. society. (I actually disagree with some of the claims you have about who had technological superiority).

Science Daily: Fire Ants Can Attack Humans In Homes Or Health Care Facilities.

The ants won.

So, I guess the answer is yes, ants have beaten humans.  And that isn't the first time.  Would you like to go smaller?  How about Bacteria?  They have beaten humans too.

I understand this isn't the place for a historical debate, but if you are referring to the Germans, they had better technology, we (all the Allies) had numbers.  Kind of like the Reaper war, just a bit more balanced.  If you are referring to any of the others, I didn't say better tech, just an inferior force.  

1. The Reapers lost the element of surprise.  From what we can tell, that has never happened before.

2. The Reaper Command and Control was discovered.  We know this is the first cycle to find it (unless Star Child is a liar.)

3. We had the largest, most diverse fleet ever assembled in this galaxy. (We know this because the sneak attack did not work.)

4. We had Reaper level intelligences on our side in the form of Geth.  It is unlikely that any other Cycle had that, as they would have been wiped out prior to gaining Reaper code, or their version of the Geth would have stayed indoctrinated.

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

The analogy was apparently lost.  That ants have been able to kill humans actually lines up quite well, since humans were able to kill reapers.  If humanity made it its goal to systematically exterminate all ants, how much of a fight do you think the ants would be able to put up?

The premise that the Reapers cannot be defeated conventionally does not mean that the Reapers are not capable of taking losses.

[nrcrane]

Carlthestrange wrote...

I think a conventional victory would have been kinda insulting to the Protheans and all the cycles before them.

According to what we know, yes, they didn't make the Mass Relays. But the Protheans were still far more advanced than we are, and they still lost.

Lets face it. Our cycle beating the Reapers conventionally wouldn't have made sense.

In the game Javik talked about their war with the reapers.  Javik explained that their greatest weaknesses were that their galaxy was divided and they were unable to adapt to different strategies.  Just because the protheans lost doesn't have much bearing on why the current cycle can't win.

[Menagra]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maybe a more pertinent question is:

Is it acceptable that conventional victory is not obtainable?

It's one thing to want to be able to win conventionally. But is the disappointment with it not being possible fed more from the fact that someone wanted it to happen but didn't, or because it realistically doesn't make sense?


I was on the record a couple months ago stating that I agreed with the notion many posters had that refusing the reapers should have been a viable option, but I was also clear in stating that I'd have it result in failure because in my opinion it makes it a more interesting choice. So I'm just asking this to get a better understanding from those that are disappointed.

I think the EMS should have at least had influenced this ending. Low EMS = liara's probe talking. High EMS = another result. Perhaps shepard at least gets word out to destroy the citadel (and therefore destroy the catalyst that controls the reapers). What happens to the reapers if the catalyst is destroyed? Do they continue the cycle without it's influence? It doesn't have to be a positive outcome --- though considering tragedies and comedies are as old as ancient greece I so no reason why a happy ending is any more "artistic" than a sad ending --- both are conventional. I am not so sure why BW is so insistant that one option couldn't be "happy" it wouldnt' degrade anything....but even so an ems defeat/tragedy coudl be possible to. Hundreds of years of war and perhaps humanity and the races all die, but maybe also there are no reapers for the next cycle to have to fight. So the VI talking wouldn't say "we tried, but failed" they would say "we bought your future with our lives".

[Malanek]

The ants are not actually ever going to win a "war" though. Examples that are being given are when they "sabotage" less than a billionth of human "forces", who aren't at war anyway. I would forget about the ant analogy, its OK to illustrate a point but I think it is quite flawed anyway.

[Qeylis]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

The analogy was apparently lost.  That ants have been able to kill humans actually lines up quite well, since humans were able to kill reapers.  If humanity made it its goal to systematically exterminate all ants, how much of a fight do you think the ants would be able to put up?

The premise that the Reapers cannot be defeated conventionally does not mean that the Reapers are not capable of taking losses.

Ah, good point.  Missed that.  I just don't think that this war is as out of balance as you are making it out to be.  The Reapers think it is, but every superior force thinks their enemies are on the levels you are describing.  They are often proven wrong, and often proven right.  EMS should have decided this, not a debate on BSN.

Modifié par Qeylis, 28 juin 2012 - 11:30 .

[IanPolaris]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

The analogy was apparently lost.  That ants have been able to kill humans actually lines up quite well, since humans were able to kill reapers.  If humanity made it its goal to systematically exterminate all ants, how much of a fight do you think the ants would be able to put up?

Talk to an exterminator.  Seriously.  We've been trying to make cockroaches extint since forever, but one of the two (human, roach) has been around since the Cambrian Age.  Of the two, I know which one I'd put money on to survive until the sun burns out (and it's not the human).

 

The premise that the Reapers cannot be defeated conventionally does not mean that the Reapers are not capable of taking losses.

The problem is that the idea that the Reapers can only be defeated by one special way is new to ME3 (and IMHO not a good addition).  Sure with any straight fight against the reapers you lose, but insisting that a particular McGuffin is the only way ever, for any cycle?

Not buying it.  Also while I'm at it, the Reapers are NOT able to take losses.  Not consistantly.  The Reapers only replenish (ship) losses extremely slowly.  Already in this cycle, the Reapers have probably lose at least a few million years of cycles worth of ship production.

-Polaris

[nrcrane]

Need to get off the ant analogy. There is nothing that says we must be like ants to the reapers. It's just a point of view some people seem to want to take.

[StevenG_CT]

Qeylis wrote...

This would be great, and might restore my faith in BioWare.  However, they have said that there will be nothing more that is related to the ending.  So, I doubt it.  This flipping bird is where we will stand.

Perhaps, but they also said they weren't going to change the endings and in reality the Extended Cut does in fact retcon a number of things that were included in the original endings. (Normandy engines no longer explode, relay explosions now less dramatic, synthesis now apparently only affects sentient life as there are no longer circuit traces on the leaves, etc.)

Bottom line, if enough people want conventional victory to be possible in the "refuse" ending providing that max resources had been gathered though future DLC's I think Bioware would be foolish to not consider allowing this. It would actually make a good incentive to get people to buy the future SP DLC's.

[Rip504]

Qeylis wrote...

So, I guess the answer is yes, ants have beaten humans.  And that isn't the first time.  Would you like to go smaller?  How about Bacteria?  They have beaten humans too.

I understand this isn't the place for a historical debate, but if you are referring to the Germans, they had better technology, we (all the Allies) had numbers.  Kind of like the Reaper war, just a bit more balanced.  If you are referring to any of the others, I didn't say better tech, just an inferior force.  

1. The Reapers lost the element of surprise.  From what we can tell, that has never happened before.

2. The Reaper Command and Control was discovered.  We know this is the first cycle to find it (unless Star Child is a liar.)

3. We had the largest, most diverse fleet ever assembled in this galaxy. (We know this because the sneak attack did not work.)

4. We had Reaper level intelligences on our side in the form of Geth.  It is unlikely that any other Cycle had that, as they would have been wiped out prior to gaining Reaper code, or their version of the Geth would have stayed indoctrinated.

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

The answer is still NO. That largest and diverse fleet with Geth Aid,yea it failed to retake Earth without the use of the Crucible... That "Fleet" managed to get two people aboard the Citadel,but that equals conventional victory is possible. Not  to mention (again) the rate of death. We are losing billions to their single digit losses.

Did these ants destroy all humans? No they did not. They may be able to take credit for a few deaths. Just as our cycle can take credit for a few Reaper deaths. So in your eyes,it is possible for ants to overthrow humanity and take over the world?

[IxSITHxI]

Rip504 wrote...

The answer is still NO. That largest and diverse fleet with Geth Aid,yea it failed to retake Earth without the use of the Crucible... That "Fleet" managed to get two people aboard the Citadel,but that equals conventional victory is possible. Not  to mention (again) the rate of death. We are losing billions to their single digit losses.

Did these ants destroy all humans? No they did not. They may be able to take credit for a few deaths. Just as our cycle can take credit for a few Reaper deaths. So in your eyes,it is possible for ants to overthrow humanity and take over the world?

Note that the Protheans almost beat the Reapers conventionally, but lost due to indoctrination.

The Leviathan DLC if done right, could make beating the Reapers even more plausable. With Reaper aid, they would have better weapons and defences as well as tactical data on Reaper weak points.

If they turn him into EMS and dont show him at all, then theres no point in even buying it. BioWare has a chance to give the people who hated the RGB endings a fourth choice in which Shepard acts like the Badass he/she is.

^ I posted more in depth above ^

Modifié par IxSITHxI, 28 juin 2012 - 11:46 .

[Qeylis]

Rip504 wrote...

Qeylis wrote...

So, I guess the answer is yes, ants have beaten humans.  And that isn't the first time.  Would you like to go smaller?  How about Bacteria?  They have beaten humans too.

I understand this isn't the place for a historical debate, but if you are referring to the Germans, they had better technology, we (all the Allies) had numbers.  Kind of like the Reaper war, just a bit more balanced.  If you are referring to any of the others, I didn't say better tech, just an inferior force.  

1. The Reapers lost the element of surprise.  From what we can tell, that has never happened before.

2. The Reaper Command and Control was discovered.  We know this is the first cycle to find it (unless Star Child is a liar.)

3. We had the largest, most diverse fleet ever assembled in this galaxy. (We know this because the sneak attack did not work.)

4. We had Reaper level intelligences on our side in the form of Geth.  It is unlikely that any other Cycle had that, as they would have been wiped out prior to gaining Reaper code, or their version of the Geth would have stayed indoctrinated.

So, lots of ants (3).  Ants that know how to kill humans (2).  Humans that thought the ants would just lie down and die(1).  And, some really, really smart, fast annoying ants (4).  Not saying they win automatically, but of course its possible.

The answer is still NO. That largest and diverse fleet with Geth Aid,yea it failed to retake Earth without the use of the Crucible... That "Fleet" managed to get two people aboard the Citadel,but that equals conventional victory is possible. Not  to mention (again) the rate of death. We are losing billions to their single digit losses.

Did these ants destroy all humans? No they did not. They may be able to take credit for a few deaths. Just as our cycle can take credit for a few Reaper deaths. So in your eyes,it is possible for ants to overthrow humanity and take over the world?

I answered this.  No, I do not believe it is possible for ants to overthrow humanity.  I just don't believe the premise that the Reapers are so far above humanity that we could never beat them.  I don't buy the idea that we are as ants to Reapers.  

They are not invincible.  They have been, um, vinced before.  We know way more about them now than we did when we killed Sovereign.  How much study do the ant put into their plans to conquer humanity?  How far has their research taken them?

We are not ants to Reapers.  I don't buy it.  I would say that 100 ships equals 1 Reaper dreadnaught.  Less for lesser ships.  You need thousands of ants to kill a human.  We aren't that weak.

OH!!! If they ants got intelligent.. oh, nevermind.