6 réponses à ce sujet

[SilentWolfie]

I can absolutely predict that people are going to go bananas and be happy with that decision, and yet we get the part where "SO BE IT" low, angry voice, and cutscene humanity + galaxy loses. It's not even a fan's ending, not even a pat on the back to us for trying to get better endings. Apparently EMS doesn't matter one single bit...

I saw Allan Schumacher seemingly trying to defend Bioware's decision on this ending, BUT, I'm using a huge BUT here, Bioware knew the general public sentiments are in disagreement towards the original ending, and writing this sort of refusal ending is an extreme disservice and a rehash and remake of the "original ending".

Are we to speculate once again whether this is a slap to the fans or it's our artistic vision, take it or leave it?

Even if the idea is to defend "their artistic vision", the very least they had better clarify the crap out of it, pardon my angry rebuttal here, so everyone who wants to defend Bioware can kiss my --- never mind........

What...?

I'm just kidding. Really!



Anyway, another epic failure by Bioware. This was very likely made out of spite and anyone who tries to defend this ending, honestly, should understand the writers don't want to the players to be happy about playing this ending (maybe one can be satisfied on getting to shoot Star Jar, but it is absolutely not meant to be a happy ending, not even bittersweet). Getting upset and angry? Yes. For whatever reason, many players are angry, that's a fact.

So am I right or wrong? High EMS + Refuse = Victory will be the best ending, right?

Modifié par SilentWolfie, 28 juin 2012 - 03:52 .

[Allan Schumacher]

I saw Allan Schumacher seemingly trying to defend Bioware's decision on this ending

Regardless of my actual defense of BioWare specifically, I do want to make it clear that it's as much me defending my preference for how I would have gone through with this.

I find the choice more interesting if it's presented as a fail case. Especially when contrasted with the other endings. In many ways because I can respect someone that is willing to face certain death to stand by their convictions.

I can agree that it'd be cool to flesh it out more (I'd love to see an epic space battle of the fleet doing desperate measures to take as many ships down with it), and it sucks that some people think that it's an insult. Unfortunately I can't do much about either of those.

My support of this ending though is less about defending the company I work for and more about defending the type of game experiences I find interesting as a gamer.

[Allan Schumacher]

One big problem a lot of us are having is that one of your co-workers (Gamble) acting in his official capicity wouldn't or couldn't just let things be and allow us to 'head canon' how the next cycle defeated the reapers. Had nothing been said, it would have been a lot better, but we are now specifically told by a BIOWARE employee acting in his official capacity that, "Oh the next cycle used the crucible anyway" making Shepard's morality and refusal completely pointless.

I can't speak on behalf of Gamble's tweet, but I do want to address something else:


At what point can a person dismiss someone willing to die for his cause because it is "pointless?"

[Allan Schumacher]

Velocithon wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

One big problem a lot of us are having is that one of your co-workers (Gamble) acting in his official capicity wouldn't or couldn't just let things be and allow us to 'head canon' how the next cycle defeated the reapers. Had nothing been said, it would have been a lot better, but we are now specifically told by a BIOWARE employee acting in his official capacity that, "Oh the next cycle used the crucible anyway" making Shepard's morality and refusal completely pointless.

I can't speak on behalf of Gamble's tweet, but I do want to address something else:


At what point can a person dismiss someone willing to die for his cause because it is "pointless?"

Why make a sacrifice when that sacrifice leads to the death of everyone you know, only to have the next cycle do what you refused to do and win? To me that sounds a lot like surrender. Might as well pick an option and save your friends and the current civilizations.

Well, it does require metaknowledge for Shepard to know what the future cycle does, and to let that affect his decision (something that I consider to be an advantage of a more open ended ending).

But still, if you're against slavery and your people are about to be enslaved, does it make you dying to prevent slavery irrelevant if after the fact your people end up being enslaved?  Or does it make you a man that was willing to die for what you believed in because you felt it was the right thing to do?

[Allan Schumacher]

JA Shepard wrote...

I think it's when it is really out of spite. The crucible is Shepard's and this cycle's weapon. We may not like the catalyst but he is not the one who makes the crucible do what it does. Your own construction does. His line about control when he asks Shepard something lie "do you think I want to be replaced by you?" tells me that. If you want to blame someone, blame the previous cycles for their design.

The catalyst is basically just allowing you to use your own weapon even if it will destroy the reapers, because in his logic driven mind, events that have taken place in this cycle may have rendered his solution obsolete. He's open to new ideas. Refusing to choose is just spiting yourself. It also happens to validate the catalyst's logic because it proves that organics are still so irrational that even the best of them can't see past his own hatred to do what he came to do and save everyone. It's just as an f-you to an enemy that is conceding victory to you when he can still kill you. That's where dying for a cause becomes pointless. 

I like this response a lot.  Thanks for taking the time to write it

Do you think it's fair for someone to choose the refuse end for a non-spiteful reason?  Such as not trusting the Catalyst, or feeling that the costs associated with firing the Crucible are too much and not a decision that one man can make on behalf of others?

[Allan Schumacher]

JA Shepard wrote...

It's tough to answer because I think it requires Shepard to ask the catalyst what happens if he does nothing. It's important at that point to actually know the consequences associated with that action. The answer would be very telling. If the catalyst levels with you and says " Seriously, this is your only shot. You don't fire the crucible, and I will roflstomp your entire species and everyone else's as planned", then you can make an informed decision.

If you don't trust him, then you're back to square one because you simply can't know whether or not he's being honest. Under that circumstance staying true to your original plan is the safest route because the only thing that's making you waiver is the mere presence of your enemy. Going by your principles could be a crutch for a lack of conviction. If Shepard doesn't truly believe in the plan, I don't think he would make it that far. The responsibility is his, for better or worse. The galaxy needs him to take on that burden whether he believes he should carry. And refusing to make a decision is still a decision. 

Interesting.

Do you think the ability to refuse should not be in the game at all?

[Allan Schumacher]

JA Shepard wrote...

It should absolutely be in the game and I love that it was added. At the end of the day, this is just a game and that addition makes it more fun. After the EC, I actually look forward to the last scene and I never thought that would happen. I think the writers were clever in the way they presented that choice. The "SO BE IT" is glorious. Even if it was just them being cute, which I don't think is totally the case, it's funny as hell. Like I said, I think refuse validates the catalyst's logic when he was just starting to question his own need to exist. Having unwitting players prove right an argument that nearly all of us, including myself, thought was ridiculous was well done. It's a joke within a joke. 

Cool!  Thanks for the discussion!