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Destroy Ending. Good or Bad?


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#1
Peregrin25

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All this is based on the Extended Cut.

Ok, I have heard lots of arguments and opinions on why each ending had their ups and downs, and the results of making that hard and difficult choice.

Before you go an start hating or praising the choice you prefer, I ask this. This is somewhat based in a hypthetical situation where this were to actually happen in reality. So please bare with me.

What makes the destroy ending so horrible to those that hate it?

I understand that Synthesis allows just about everyone, save the casualties of war to survive on a more grand scale a supreme life force if you will. But in my opinion based on a moral perspective. It is not Shepard's decision to deicide somthing like that for anyone except maybe himself. He cannot speak for an entire gallactic civilization. By making that kind of choice even though it seems to be a better way out than other choices is just unethical and illogical.

Now we have the Control choice. Yeah, control allows Shepard to use control them in a sense of becomong a god and forcing them to leave civilized space forever. Yeah, it seems like a good choice but in the end you are allowing am abomination to keep its existance alive. Somthing that does and has done horrible and disturbing things for a means of irradicating all life that is so evolved that they danger their existance. Shouldn't thoes people face the repercutions of their actions instead of a more powerfull non organic form of life making that choice for them?

They should take responsibility for their actions so in my opinion Controling somthing that thinks they have that right is just absurd, immoral and again illogical. It goes against everything humanity and all life stands for.

Now we have Destroy choice. If you chose destroy, things get a little darker, all artificial intelligence and synthetic creations will be destroyed. Me being a U.S. Marine, I am taught preservation of life no questions asked. Logic dictates I do what ever is necessary to protect all living things wheather it be from others or from themselves. Commander Shepard in this case, can make that kind of choice based on a moral aspect of life as a whole.

Regardless what kinds of peace treaties wer brokered between synthetics and organics. Since when does human or any organic life less important over a machine regardless of if it can be more human in nature. In the end rgardless of what a synthetic may think it is still a machine. Yes it is sad that you were able, if you qualmed the war between geth and quarian or made EDI think more like a human than not. Destroy in my opinion is the best choice to make, is it the right one?

Not necessarily. Neither choice in my opinion is 100%  right. Yes, you destroy majority of all synthetic life, but is synthetic life more valuable than an entire galactic civilization to live in a world where Reapers are 100% gone where no threat of them is ever present? I think it sucks that most Geth are gone and EDI is gone but they knew what they would probably have to sacrifice themselves if necessary. In that respect we can honor that sacrifice, and we all can live out the rest of our lives in peace with no fear of such destruction and loss of life. Still, they are not living beings therefore making a choice like destroy is easier to make. Techincally you cannot cause genocide with something that does not live like the bulk of the galactic civilization as a whole. Some will argue based on what upgrades  the Geth got that they were more human, but they are not. Just because it can comprehend our logic from a synthetics normal logic doesn't make it alive.

It does suck that it comes down to one person making that choice, but machines are machines no matter how human they seem to be. I would gladly in reality sacrifice a machine to save my brothers in arms, my family, friends and myself so we can preserve our current way of life. I would have it no other way. Preservation of life is all that matters, not to make it better, not to go against all logic and choose to controll somthing that could eventually come back to bite us in the ass. We were made one way the way we are currently. I do not want to be more supreme as a being. I don't want to have to worry about a large destructive abomination still living in the far beynd galaxies just hoping somthing doesn't happen to where they decide it's necessary to come back and irradicate all life that is more evolved.

If I had to sacrifice myself to preserve all civilized life I would make that choice. We can prosper on our own we have done it in the past and we can do it again. It will help all life grow stronger and more resillient. But then again, that is just me.

Modifié par Peregrin25, 29 juin 2012 - 03:16 .


#2
The Night Mammoth

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Well I don't know about you, but I don't see any dead Geth.

Heeeeaaaaaaaaaadcanonnnnnn!

#3
Giga Drill BREAKER

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The Destroy ending is neither really, but it is the most preferable outcome.

#4
Clayless

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It's subjective.

#5
Peregrin25

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The Night Mammoth wrote...

Well I don't know about you, but I don't see any dead Geth.

Heeeeaaaaaaaaaadcanonnnnnn!


LOL, my ideal choice is not in the game and I revert to headcannon too. Preferably where Geth and EDI live while everyone else does too. the kind of happy walk into the sunset type ending where Shepard lives with LI happyily ever after.

I know it's cliche and lame but that's just me lol.

#6
Fiery Phoenix

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Subjective, really. However, since it is apparently the most widely accepted ending, I'd say it has some merit. It's my personal favorite for a variety of reasons.

#7
BatmanPWNS

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Depends but for me it's good.

The reapers are dead an the only peple who we lost were the synthetics who willingly joined Shepard on his quest (unless you killed 'em all in Rannoch) and knew that they're life were in danger if they went with Shepard.

Of course, if you're a geth hater from the start than this is a bonus instead of a bittersweet ending.

#8
CHALET

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Geth can be rebuilt. Star Child and Hackett claim they have the technology to do so. Organics? Not so much.

Destroy is the most "Neutral" in terms of outcome. The Reapers are destroyed, life goes on. In Control they have Emperor Shepard potentially influencing their lives through the use of Reapers, acting as a sort of inter-space police force. In Synthesis everybody becomes "perfect". In Destroy everything returns to normal pretty much... organics are still organics, as are synthetics.

#9
Adamantium93

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I liked control better because I don't like the thought of a universe without Geth and I couldn't bear to kill EDI.

CHALET wrote...
Geth can be rebuilt. Star Child and Hackett claim they have the technology to do so. Organics? Not so much.
 


1. The Quarians won't risk another Geth uprising
2. You can't recreate their sentience.

Modifié par Adamantium93, 29 juin 2012 - 03:22 .


#10
Peregrin25

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DinoSteve wrote...

The Destroy ending is neither really, but it is the most preferable outcome.


I agree. That is why I stick by it. It is the only logical choice to make. Is it a fantastic choice? No, it is by far the best, but is it bad? No, it isn't bad either.

The Destroy option is an enigma. A tug of war with what is logical and what is not, what is the right and what is wrong. Or what is considered crossing the line.

Like I mentioned in my original post no choice is 100% clear, but in my mind destroy is the better out come


Then again having the refusal option if you were capable fo destroy the reapers on conventionl level. That would be my choice. No doubt in my mind.

#11
Helios969

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Totally subjective, but I believe it was the most consistent to the storyline and how most people played Shepard throughout the series.

#12
CHALET

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The only reason people like the Geth is because of Legion. People were quite happy to gun them down by the truck load in ME1. You can bet if the Catalyst said "all Quarians would be wiped out" most people would be "Pah, it's a necessary sacrifice!"

Modifié par CHALET, 29 juin 2012 - 03:25 .


#13
Adamantium93

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CHALET wrote...
In Control they have Emperor Shepard potentially influencing their lives through the use of Reapers, acting as a sort of inter-space police.


If you get Paragon control it seems more like Shep is just some kind of silent guardian who doesn't get involved in day to day activities.

#14
Carlthestrange

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Destroy is neither good or bad.

But it is mission accomplished.

#15
sTARheels

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Destroy was an easy choice for me. Only ending where reapers are dead. Plain and simple. My paragon sheps are horrified over the thought of synthesis and control.

As for sacrificing the geth/EDI, its that ruthless calculus garrus talked about. They will be remembered (or rebuilt if possible).

Being able to live and reunite was the icing on the cake

#16
Peregrin25

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CHALET wrote...

Geth can be rebuilt. Star Child and Hackett claim they have the technology to do so. Organics? Not so much.

Destroy is the most "Neutral" in terms of outcome. The Reapers are destroyed, life goes on. In Control they have Emperor Shepard potentially influencing their lives through the use of Reapers, acting as a sort of inter-space police force. In Synthesis everybody becomes "perfect". In Destroy everything returns to normal pretty much... organics are still organics, as are synthetics.


I agree, however I doubt the Quarians would like having fresh built Geth. I am sure they would learn from their mistakes the first time, and if humanity had a hand in their rebirth of sentience then Quarians would be very angry lol.

I agree, who want's to be perfect. We were not originally created that way, why interfere. Not to mention I don't want some higher desructive power to dictate how we as an organic civilization can live. We should beable to make our own choices wheather they be good or bad. We just have to be willing to accept responsibily for the actions we take.

#17
Giga Drill BREAKER

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Adamantium93 wrote...

CHALET wrote...
In Control they have Emperor Shepard potentially influencing their lives through the use of Reapers, acting as a sort of inter-space police.


If you get Paragon control it seems more like Shep is just some kind of silent guardian who doesn't get involved in day to day activities.


lol Emperor Darth Shepard

#18
Mojenator12345

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The Reapers are an existential threat to the galaxy. The Geth are an acceptable loss (as would be any other single race, including humans). Synthesis is too absurd and horrifying to even consider. Control only kicks the problem down the road. After a 1000 or 10,000 or 100,000 years, Shepard is going to forget who he is or what his purpose is and be corrupted by wielding supreme power. Then you're back where you started. The Reapers cannot, under any circumstance, be allowed to survive. For the good the galaxy, the only reasonable choice is destruction. Sorry, Geth.

#19
Hackulator

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You can easily turn it around and say its not Shepard's right to DENY everyone the Utopian world of synthesis, simply because he doesn't have the balls to make a hard decision. Ask EDI and the Geth which choice they'd like.

#20
Peregrin25

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sTARheels wrote...

Destroy was an easy choice for me. Only ending where reapers are dead. Plain and simple. My paragon sheps are horrified over the thought of synthesis and control.

As for sacrificing the geth/EDI, its that ruthless calculus garrus talked about. They will be remembered (or rebuilt if possible).

Being able to live and reunite was the icing on the cake


Yeah, it was the choice I made as well. I did pick others just to see the outcomes, but something deep down in myself it just felt wrong.

Your mention of Garrus's ruthless calculus is perfect example.

I do like the fact that even though Geth and EDI were sacrifieced, I have no prejudice in honoring them even though they are not organic. They were willing to die to fight the reapers and they also wanted them destroyed.

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

#21
Thornne

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I think it is difficult to discuss one ending choice in isolation from the others, since it basically boils down to choosing the least-worst option.

I prefer Destroy because it is the only ending that terminates the Star Kid project unambiguously and on my terms. No more Reapers, and no compromising with an AI who thinks melting down and combining organics and synthetics into Reapers is an acceptable way to get them to co-exist peacefully.

But destroying EDI and the Geth is bad, alright. You sacrifice them. They're gone. It's just a matter of whether you are willing to do that or not.

#22
mireisen

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I believe the destroy ending encompasses everything that the whole galaxy's been fighting for during each cycle, to obliterate the reapers at any cost. Most opponents believe that it's genocide, that the synthetics have finally grown to "feel alive", but each instance has been with the use of reaper tech.

Not saying reaper tech is all evil. But it just doesn't sound right. So OK, you feel alive because you've got some upgrades or were somehow conceived by the reapers? This didn't jive well with me. And although Legion and EDI were two of my favorites, they are essentially immortal. This goes into a whole other issue of godhood and mortality. The natural order of things is that all life must die at one point. That's the point of being alive. Things that can't die are considered things, not people.

So in a wicked way, I think, my Shepard granted the synthetics true life by showing that they can also die. The synthetics ending really bugged me because of the possibility of immortality. As if immortality is the last stage of evolution. I do not believe that. Evolution is change over time, improving. I do not believe that there is a last stage and I'd hate to think it'd be immortality.

If organics were granted immortality, it changes the whole galaxy's perception of life. Life becomes meaningless if you can't die. That's why I chose destroy. Although the catalyst says, "And then, your children will create synthetics, and the chaos returns," I'm like ppppftt. "You were created by a fallible organic, Star Kid. You don't know the future anymore than I do, so GTFO!"

So IMHO, destroy preserves life. Ironically.

#23
Peregrin25

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Hackulator wrote...

You can easily turn it around and say its not Shepard's right to DENY everyone the Utopian world of synthesis, simply because he doesn't have the balls to make a hard decision. Ask EDI and the Geth which choice they'd like.


Thing is we don't know because BioWare didn't give us that kind of indepth morality in their narrative of the story. Somthing the Old BioWare probably would have done. So, in the end, we will never truly know unfortuantely.

#24
Enhanced

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Destroy is bad. It is just a temporary solution. Synthetics will eventually try to wipe out all organics, and the reapers won't be around to stop them.
 
"...the peace won't last. Soon your children will create synthetics, and then the chaos will come back."

Modifié par Enhanced, 29 juin 2012 - 03:37 .


#25
Hackulator

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Peregrin25 wrote...

Hackulator wrote...

You can easily turn it around and say its not Shepard's right to DENY everyone the Utopian world of synthesis, simply because he doesn't have the balls to make a hard decision. Ask EDI and the Geth which choice they'd like.


Thing is we don't know because BioWare didn't give us that kind of indepth morality in their narrative of the story. Somthing the Old BioWare probably would have done. So, in the end, we will never truly know unfortuantely.


I mean, we definitely know that EDI approves of Synthesis, her monologue is pretty clear on that.