406 réponses à ce sujet

[Gterror2]

Synthesis debate is rather interesting, you can justify and criticise it forever, but your always wrong, because human mind can't comprehend it.No right answers to put it simply.

Modifié par Gterror2, 29 juin 2012 - 09:13 .

[The Night Mammoth]

From the perspective I have right now, in hindsight: f*ck no. Green glowing lines, I still have no f*cking idea what it does, the Reapers are still around, and it makes people immortal.

From the perspective of someone post-decision with just what the Catalyst tells you: F*CK NO.

[Malditor]

iamzer0xx wrote...

Malditor wrote...

Yes, as I'm the type of person to go for compromise primarily this is the best compromise I saw. After watching the Control ending I was torn which was better for me though.

Te control ending had me a bit nervous. Essnetially, its like having all your eggs in one basket. Too much power given to a single being. For me, its too risky. What if a few thouands years down the road Shepard decides that the cycle needs to continue again? 

True, but YOU are shepard so whatever decisions would be what you would do. That being said the reason I don't 100% like Control is because as Shepard if a conflict arose and you stepped in you'd have to chose a side that was right in the conflict. Once again you'd be forcing your choice on all that not everyone would agree on. Never ending cycle. Shepard/We are put in a position where we can literally not make a completely correct choice.

[Welsh Inferno]

roryw2203 wrote...

How do you know they are fried?  I didn't see anything fried really, I just saw the reapers falling down in a heap.  No indication given that they didn't just shut down is there?  And Destroy isn't my favourite ending, I didn't care much for any of the endings.  I don't even have an order for preference of them.  It just seems to me that in all three endings it is possible for everything to be achieved that occurs within another ending.  I mean you could probably bring Shepard back to life again after all the endings.  Did it once before, why not again?

How do you know they are not? I saw/heard plenty that told me that all Synthetics would be destroyed. It would be different if the Crucible blew them into pieces, they could be restored then because the programs were not completely erased. But the nature of how the crucible "kills" them all(watch how the reapers die) indicates that their insides(processors & eezo core specifically I assume) are fried to hell. Oh yeah sure, Shep could totally come back from Synthesis and Control endings...  Other than his body essentially disintigrating that is..

[TreguardD]

iamzer0xx wrote...

Welsh Inferno wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Synthesis... did it work for saren. Your friends were willing to pay their lives for the cause. Are you sure as many would have come if you had asked them... hey how about we befriend the reapers?... How many would have told you your indoctrinated?

Control and Destory are the true endings. Control you control only reapers, in destroy you destroy only reapers. Nobody else is hurt, happy ending for greedy power grabbing people, and for paragons.

You believe in synthesis.... u didn't pay attention to any of the game at all. Plus you believe in eugenics which is just disgusting.

Buddy, it didn't work for Saren because the Reapers were lying. They would have harvested us all had he succeeded and then swiftly discarded Saren into a heap of rubbish.

And the bolded part shows how little you understand Synthesis. Go think about it some more.

I didn't even respond to what he said. Comparing eugenics, ridiculous.. lol.

Why do you think they're telling the truth now?

And Synthesis is absolutely Eugenics. We will make you perfect, so you can survive.

[Shadowvalker]

If evolution demands my extinction so be it - BUT there is no way a selfish brat of an oversized calculator should decide the future of the human race.

[roryw2203]

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

It really seems to me like people don't pay attention to these endings, and what they mean. The synthesis ending is totally misinterpreted.

How should it be interpreted?  Please share your wisdom with the rest of us idiots.

All life evolving into a higher being of existence, yet at the same time retaining their individualism. This is somehow a bad thing because it was forced upon us? Irreleveant point don't you think?

Seems to me you just don't like the endings, and you're over-thinking it and trying to rationalize your distaste over them. 

In no way was the Synthesis ending analogous to what Saren wanted. Saren wanted something like the Borg collective out of Star trek, the Synthesis ending was anything but that. Even the color had meaning to this ending, which I see a lot of people just spit on pre-maturely. Green comes off as a color of birth and new life in nature. Hence why there is so much greeen in the ending, it is a start of something new.

Kind of like how after a fire is purged new vegetation grows from the ashes.

Don't think it's irrelevant the idea that forcing something upon the universe because you think it would be better for them isn't a good thing.  It's called dictatorship.  You think all of the dictators throughout history actively thought that what they were doing was bad for mankind?  Nope, they were doing what they thought was right.  But in all cases it qualitatively wasn't.

Don't think you can over-think something that is designed to be 'speculated' about really.  But  I don't really like any of the endings particularly, including destroy.  

Don't remember Saren saying once that he wanted a collective, just remember him stating he wanted Synthetics and Organics to combine into the pinnacle of evolution.  And you can't seriously say that the ending is good because people are kinda green now?  No matter what it represents metaphorically, imagine you waking up synthetic and your first thought is going to be: "Oh I'm green! That represents life! Awesome!"

I am a Geographer, I like green.

I also don't see who or what the dictator is here? You're alright with forcing mass extinction but you're not alright with forcing the latter? I fail to see the logic in that.

If you want to use the Saren analogy, then one could argue that he was correct about joining organics and synthetics was he not? 

Ha okay, fair enough.

Well Shepard would be the dicator technically if he chose to bend everyone to his will.  No I'm not alright with it, it's just that in a universe in which it has been proven that it is possible to bring beings back to life I think that it is possible to restore every species to former glory without changing the fabric of their being.  Just like I think it would be possible to bring Shepard back to life after both the Control and Synthesis endings, which seems to be the draw to Destory for some.

I don't know, I'm undecided as to what being part synthetic would mean.  I mean, wouldn't it possible for some one to upload a virus to every being in the galaxy if we all had the same synthetic code in our DNA?  And the people walking around at the end with the reapers like they didn't just try and kill us all kinda weirds me out.

[WYLDMAXX]

No

[TudorWolf]

Hell yeah, why would I turn down that chance to be something more?

[Aquilas]

Hackulator wrote...

Aquilas wrote...

No. If I was with Shepard on the Citadel and saw him going toward that Fountain of Space Magic I'd have shot him. Several times. Then I'd have walked up to his body and put one in his brain for good measure.

This scenario assumes that the God of the ME Universe, Star-jar, wouldn't smite me before I had the chance.

Pretty sure Shepard would have kicked your ass. 

I'm pretty sure Shepard wouldn't have.  My imagination, my scenario, my "Solution."

But thanks for sharing.

[roryw2203]

Welsh Inferno wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

How do you know they are fried?  I didn't see anything fried really, I just saw the reapers falling down in a heap.  No indication given that they didn't just shut down is there?  And Destroy isn't my favourite ending, I didn't care much for any of the endings.  I don't even have an order for preference of them.  It just seems to me that in all three endings it is possible for everything to be achieved that occurs within another ending.  I mean you could probably bring Shepard back to life again after all the endings.  Did it once before, why not again?

How do you know they are not? I saw/heard plenty that told me that all Synthetics would be destroyed. It would be different if the Crucible blew them into pieces, they could be restored then because the programs were not completely erased. But the nature of how the crucible "kills" them all(watch how the reapers die) indicates that their insides(processors & eezo core specifically I assume) are fried to hell. Oh yeah sure, Shep could totally come back from Synthesis and Control endings...  Other than his body essentially disintigrating that is..

I don't, I'm just saying that there is no way to know whether they are fried or not or whether their programming was erased.  I mean the Catalyst tells you that you can repair all the damage done, wouldn't that mean that maybe their programming wasn't destroyed and they are simply highly damaged?  I don't know, it's left too vague to really grasp tightly.

Well he entered the atmosphere of a planet at the beginning of Mass Effect 2, and seeing as how asteroids are disintergrated that way, wouldn't he have been also?  Even if he was, all you would need would be some of his DNA and you could grow another one of him NOW nevermind how many centuries into the future.  

[iamzer0xx]

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

It really seems to me like people don't pay attention to these endings, and what they mean. The synthesis ending is totally misinterpreted.

How should it be interpreted?  Please share your wisdom with the rest of us idiots.

All life evolving into a higher being of existence, yet at the same time retaining their individualism. This is somehow a bad thing because it was forced upon us? Irreleveant point don't you think?

Seems to me you just don't like the endings, and you're over-thinking it and trying to rationalize your distaste over them. 

In no way was the Synthesis ending analogous to what Saren wanted. Saren wanted something like the Borg collective out of Star trek, the Synthesis ending was anything but that. Even the color had meaning to this ending, which I see a lot of people just spit on pre-maturely. Green comes off as a color of birth and new life in nature. Hence why there is so much greeen in the ending, it is a start of something new.

Kind of like how after a fire is purged new vegetation grows from the ashes.

Don't think it's irrelevant the idea that forcing something upon the universe because you think it would be better for them isn't a good thing.  It's called dictatorship.  You think all of the dictators throughout history actively thought that what they were doing was bad for mankind?  Nope, they were doing what they thought was right.  But in all cases it qualitatively wasn't.

Don't think you can over-think something that is designed to be 'speculated' about really.  But  I don't really like any of the endings particularly, including destroy.  

Don't remember Saren saying once that he wanted a collective, just remember him stating he wanted Synthetics and Organics to combine into the pinnacle of evolution.  And you can't seriously say that the ending is good because people are kinda green now?  No matter what it represents metaphorically, imagine you waking up synthetic and your first thought is going to be: "Oh I'm green! That represents life! Awesome!"

I am a Geographer, I like green.

I also don't see who or what the dictator is here? You're alright with forcing mass extinction but you're not alright with forcing the latter? I fail to see the logic in that.

If you want to use the Saren analogy, then one could argue that he was correct about joining organics and synthetics was he not? 

Ha okay, fair enough.

Well Shepard would be the dicator technically if he chose to bend everyone to his will.  No I'm not alright with it, it's just that in a universe in which it has been proven that it is possible to bring beings back to life I think that it is possible to restore every species to former glory without changing the fabric of their being.  Just like I think it would be possible to bring Shepard back to life after both the Control and Synthesis endings, which seems to be the draw to Destory for some.

I don't know, I'm undecided as to what being part synthetic would mean.  I mean, wouldn't it possible for some one to upload a virus to every being in the galaxy if we all had the same synthetic code in our DNA?  And the people walking around at the end with the reapers like they didn't just try and kill us all kinda weirds me out.

Lol, it seems like in the Mass Effect universe, anything is possible. Who knows..? 

[The Night Mammoth]

TudorWolf wrote...

Hell yeah, why would I turn down that chance to be something more?

Because you don't know what will happen, and the Reapers are the ones giving you the pitiful amount of information you have, information that is self-contradictory and devoid of sense. 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 29 juin 2012 - 09:30 .

[Wydi]

Welsh Inferno wrote...

No I agree with you on both. No one seems to realise that long term consequence of destroy, but I kinda like the idea that organics are given the chance to overcome such, albeit being incredibly risky. Synth is my fave but I like Destroy also.

How is this so incredibly risky?
If you've done it right, you've just made peace between Geth and Quarians (and killed them, too..just in case). With the reapers being destroyed, there is no other imminent synthetic threat of any kind out there. There might be some problems in a distant future, but that's life, right? Someone else may or may not deal with it in several thousand years, but you can never tell. In the end, it isn't even remotely risky. It's just letting things happen without forcing anything.

The whole Synthesis ending is just so wrong.

As for the discussion about bringing back the Geth:
Since we don't know what exactly the red beam does to the AIs and we don't know how the Geth's identities are stored, so you might or might not be able to bring them back. It's just plain speculation.
But whatever the case is: Nobody will ever be able to bring all those Geths back. The ME universe is still very capitalistic, so I doubt that - after some vague help attempts in the beginning - they will spend all the time, money and efforts needed to bring all Geth back to life when everything else went back to normal. And even if they did: You still killed those guys, like it or not. At that moment up in the citadel you got no clue about whether or not it's possible to revert that genocide.

Modifié par Wydi, 29 juin 2012 - 09:30 .

[roryw2203]

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

iamzer0xx wrote...

It really seems to me like people don't pay attention to these endings, and what they mean. The synthesis ending is totally misinterpreted.

How should it be interpreted?  Please share your wisdom with the rest of us idiots.

All life evolving into a higher being of existence, yet at the same time retaining their individualism. This is somehow a bad thing because it was forced upon us? Irreleveant point don't you think?

Seems to me you just don't like the endings, and you're over-thinking it and trying to rationalize your distaste over them. 

In no way was the Synthesis ending analogous to what Saren wanted. Saren wanted something like the Borg collective out of Star trek, the Synthesis ending was anything but that. Even the color had meaning to this ending, which I see a lot of people just spit on pre-maturely. Green comes off as a color of birth and new life in nature. Hence why there is so much greeen in the ending, it is a start of something new.

Kind of like how after a fire is purged new vegetation grows from the ashes.

Don't think it's irrelevant the idea that forcing something upon the universe because you think it would be better for them isn't a good thing.  It's called dictatorship.  You think all of the dictators throughout history actively thought that what they were doing was bad for mankind?  Nope, they were doing what they thought was right.  But in all cases it qualitatively wasn't.

Don't think you can over-think something that is designed to be 'speculated' about really.  But  I don't really like any of the endings particularly, including destroy.  

Don't remember Saren saying once that he wanted a collective, just remember him stating he wanted Synthetics and Organics to combine into the pinnacle of evolution.  And you can't seriously say that the ending is good because people are kinda green now?  No matter what it represents metaphorically, imagine you waking up synthetic and your first thought is going to be: "Oh I'm green! That represents life! Awesome!"

I am a Geographer, I like green.

I also don't see who or what the dictator is here? You're alright with forcing mass extinction but you're not alright with forcing the latter? I fail to see the logic in that.

If you want to use the Saren analogy, then one could argue that he was correct about joining organics and synthetics was he not? 

Ha okay, fair enough.

Well Shepard would be the dicator technically if he chose to bend everyone to his will.  No I'm not alright with it, it's just that in a universe in which it has been proven that it is possible to bring beings back to life I think that it is possible to restore every species to former glory without changing the fabric of their being.  Just like I think it would be possible to bring Shepard back to life after both the Control and Synthesis endings, which seems to be the draw to Destory for some.

I don't know, I'm undecided as to what being part synthetic would mean.  I mean, wouldn't it possible for some one to upload a virus to every being in the galaxy if we all had the same synthetic code in our DNA?  And the people walking around at the end with the reapers like they didn't just try and kill us all kinda weirds me out.

Lol, it seems like in the Mass Effect universe, anything is possible. Who knows..? 

Haha yeah exactly.  That's why I think it would have been better with a bittersweet fight to the death ending.  Having all this odd stuff being possible starts pushing Mass Effect into Fantasy waters aswell as Sci Fi.

[The Night Mammoth]

Rubios wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

You believe in synthesis.... u didn't pay attention to any of the game at all. Plus you believe in eugenics which is just disgusting.

So you equal eugenics to synthesis and tell us we didn't pay attention to the game.

LOL

Well.......... Synthesis is essentially eugenics. 

[HopHazzard]

For me, yes. For everyone else? I don't think I have the authority to make that decision anymore than Shepard does.

[Wydi]

roryw2203 wrote...

Haha yeah exactly.  That's why I think it would have been better with a bittersweet fight to the death ending.  Having all this odd stuff being possible starts pushing Mass Effect into Fantasy waters aswell as Sci Fi.

I tend to say that this has been the case from the very beginning. The whole indoctrination thing is fantasy, I don't see how anything else except midichlorians (Edit: and Steve Jobs) could do such things.

Modifié par Wydi, 29 juin 2012 - 09:36 .

[roryw2203]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

Rubios wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

You believe in synthesis.... u didn't pay attention to any of the game at all. Plus you believe in eugenics which is just disgusting.

So you equal eugenics to synthesis and tell us we didn't pay attention to the game.

LOL

Well.......... Synthesis is essentially eugenics. 

Eugenics is the forced sterilisation or mass murder of those whose genetic traits are 'undesirable'.  Have no idea how Synthesis can be said to do that.

[Chala]

Meh...
If I don't like how it ends I'll put a bullet on my brain and problem solved.

[roryw2203]

Wydi wrote...

roryw2203 wrote...

Haha yeah exactly.  That's why I think it would have been better with a bittersweet fight to the death ending.  Having all this odd stuff being possible starts pushing Mass Effect into Fantasy waters aswell as Sci Fi.

I tend to say that this has been the case from the very beginning. The whole indoctrination thing is fantasy, I don't see how anything else except midichlorians (Edit: and Steve Jobs) could do such things.

Yeah I guess.  But indoctrination would be possible to explain scientifically, brainwashing is possible in real life and maybe the reapers can alter the brains electrical signals or brain waves in some weird way.  Some one better with science than me would have to take that job obviously.  But the altering of the universes genetic code through throwing some organic life dependant on synthetics (Shepard) into a beam of light is just bat**** crazy.

[TamiBx]

I would rather die, thank you.

[Hackulator]

If you knew you could save someone's life with a medical procedure that would have no downsides, but they were afraid of it and would not let you, would you force it upon them? Is it really the morally superior decision to allow someone's fear and ignorance to lead to their downfall? As a politician, if you had a chance to enact laws which would ensure freedom and equality for all people, who you choose against it because of all the ignorant, hate filled people?