398 réponses à ce sujet

[justafan]

For everyone saying "the humans would have kept it secret", yes, yes they would have. Withholding Prothean data is only a crime if you get caught.

The Asari got caught. Not only did they get caught, they got caught red handed at a time when such data could have saved the galaxy billions of lives. Needless to say, there are going to be a lot of people pissed at the Asari and I doubt they are going to keep their "diplomats of the galaxy" reputation when people realize that they are hypocrites of the highest order. Will this result in any sanctions? I hope so.  It will hopeflly either lead to their expulsion from the council or the collapse of the council system entirely.

Modifié par justafan, 31 décembre 2012 - 09:22 .

[MisterJB]

Barquiel wrote...
And you're talking BS out of your ass, as usual. The game tells you more than once that they couldn't activate the beacon (or was Javik just being nice as well?). And ignoring in-game dialogue (Tevos' Rannoch conversation) that disproves your point doesn't make your point any better.

Then don't ignore it yourself. The game makes it plainly clear for anyone that this is it. This is why the asari are advanced, they have been using this beacon to stay ahead of everyone.

That there is a part of it that is only acessible through the Cyper does not change the fact that Prothean Beacons can be acessed and utilized without it. Otherwise, humanity wouldn't have gotten off Earth when we did, Liara wouldn't know about the Crucible, TIM wouldn't be able to extract information from that same beacon on Mars.

And even had they not known been able to acess it, when they first heard about a prothean device, they should have come out imediatelly and revealed their secret. Billions of lives could have been saved.
But Tevos was concerned about upsetting the balance of power. Well, f*ck her.

The salarians have zero interest in losing the asari as a council race, so your Shepard can rant as much as he wants.

The salarians are another species that made no friends in this war. Humans, turians, volus, krogans, elcors, hanars, drells, quarians, geth all against the salarians and asari?
They can force them out or build their own Council if they want to.

Modifié par MisterJB, 31 décembre 2012 - 09:27 .

[TopSun]

They should be eliminated.

/Thread

[Rifneno]

Carlos3lance wrote...

I was under the impression that there are no more asari governments on Thessia - there's the councilor, but I think what went down was punishment enough, whatever the case...

At the very least, she needs to lose her seat on the Council.  At worst, the asari lose the seat period and that **** loses her life.

[MisterJB]

All the races who actually fought in this war should form their own council.
With blackjack and hookers. Actually, forget the hookers, we don't want the asari in this Council.

[gisle]

Rifneno wrote...

Gisle-Aune wrote...

Tech that would give your species an edge? Even the selfless honorable turians would have kept that one for themselves, were they given the chance. It is wrong, of course, but none would hold doing it above themselves. Double standards, you know.

I find it incredible that people are still clinging to this completely ridiculous argument even after, as someone pointed out: the first thing the Alliance did after finding the Eden Prime beacon was alert the Council.

The asari government committed one of the highest order of crimes in Council law.  They should have to pay the price.  Specifically, everyone who knew about that beacon before the war should have to pay the ultimate price.

I was lending most credence to my other arguments, which you conveniently skipped over... Sure, I never thought the matriarchs behind it should get away with it, but most here seem the best way to punish them is to subdue the entire race under a human dominated galactic government.

[Darth_Trethon]

That depends....does part of their penance involve sleeping with Shepard? If yes then I want a DLC where we play through all the details.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 31 décembre 2012 - 10:43 .

[Falaxe]

PUNISHMENT IN NATURE!!111!!
Asari owe me 8 million leafs, 72 billion cones and two rocks.

Modifié par Falaxe, 31 décembre 2012 - 10:44 .

[Darth_Trethon]

Falaxe wrote...

PUNISHMENT IN NATURE!!111!!
Asari owe me 8 million leafs, 72 billion cones and two rocks.

Screw all that....they owe me some time and I choose the activities.

Punishment is in order....spanking is a good place to start.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 31 décembre 2012 - 10:53 .

[Rifneno]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Falaxe wrote...

PUNISHMENT IN NATURE!!111!!
Asari owe me 8 million leafs, 72 billion cones and two rocks.

Screw all that....they owe me some time and I choose the activities.

I agree.  The activity I choose is Russian Roulette with an N7 Typhoon.

[Darth_Trethon]

Rifneno wrote...

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Falaxe wrote...

PUNISHMENT IN NATURE!!111!!
Asari owe me 8 million leafs, 72 billion cones and two rocks.

Screw all that....they owe me some time and I choose the activities.

I agree.  The activity I choose is Russian Roulette with an N7 Typhoon.

Eh...a bit extreme. Spanking shall be a good place to start with some eternity embracing later on

What they did was reasonable....too important and neccessary to ensure it never falls into the wrong hands, and all they did was create a peaceful existence between all civilized races.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 31 décembre 2012 - 10:59 .

[Rifneno]

It already fell into the wrong hands. The asari found it.

[Darth_Trethon]

Rifneno wrote...

It already fell into the wrong hands. The asari found it.

Don't be so dramatic....they did nothing wrong with it except arguably hide it.

But then if the Batarians got their hands on it and used it to obliterate humanity or if the Krogan used it to hammer the other races into extinction as they tried to do in the Krogan rebelions when they were driving asteroids into planets then what. What if Cerberus had obtained it sooner and really had time to work with all its secrets....the horrors are hard to immagine. Or maybe the rachni during the Rachni wars.....the list keeps going. The Asari did good.

They kept it safe and never used it for harm....like it or not we owe them a debt for that.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 31 décembre 2012 - 11:07 .

[Rifneno]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

It already fell into the wrong hands. The asari found it.

Don't be so dramatic....they did nothing wrong with it except arguably hide it.

But then if the Batarians got their hands on it and used it to obliterate humanity or if the Krogan used it to hammer the other races into extinction as they tried to do in the Krogan rebelions when they were driving asteroids into planets then what. What if Cerberus had obtained it sooner and really had time to work with all its secrets....the horrors are hard to immagine.

They kept it safe and nevver used it for harm....like it or not we owe them a debt for that.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
They had something that if made public like their own highest laws demand, would have warned the galaxy of the Reapers and the Crucible would be built and ready to go when they arrived.  Billion are dead directly because of those tentacleheads filth.  And you say it's arguable that they did anything wrong.  Holy hell.  The moral compass on BSN never ceases to amaze.

[Darth_Trethon]

Rifneno wrote...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
They had something that if made public like their own highest laws demand, would have warned the galaxy of the Reapers and the Crucible would be built and ready to go when they arrived.  Billion are dead directly because of those tentacleheads filth.  And you say it's arguable that they did anything wrong.  Holy hell.  The moral compass on BSN never ceases to amaze.

I seriously doubt that....the others would have stayed in denial regardless. They refused to believve their Spectres what makes you think they'd believe an old glitchy machine? You are leaping to huge assumptions....beyond that the beacons didn't function right....the information transfered from the beacons on Virmire and Eden Prime to shepard was mangled and confused....it took time to stard understanding it.

Just look at the human pattern: when denial is comfoting it WILL prevail against all else because those embracing denial want nothing more than to cover their ears, close their eyes and scream like pathetic children in need of a good beating.

Either way the risks far outweighed the potential benefits....most other races would have used it much as a child would use a nuke.....Batarians, Krogan, Rachni, the insanely intelligent and psychotic Yagh and hell evven humanity is no better as proven by Cerberus.

That information would have been used for insane, senseless slaughter loooong before the reapers showed up and then we wouldn't have had any chance at all.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 31 décembre 2012 - 11:22 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

MisterJB wrote...

Barquiel wrote...
And you're talking BS out of your ass, as usual. The game tells you more than once that they couldn't activate the beacon (or was Javik just being nice as well?). And ignoring in-game dialogue (Tevos' Rannoch conversation) that disproves your point doesn't make your point any better.

Then don't ignore it yourself. The game makes it plainly clear for anyone that this is it. This is why the asari are advanced, they have been using this beacon to stay ahead of everyone.

That there is a part of it that is only acessible through the Cyper does not change the fact that Prothean Beacons can be acessed and utilized without it. Otherwise, humanity wouldn't have gotten off Earth when we did, Liara wouldn't know about the Crucible, TIM wouldn't be able to extract information from that same beacon on Mars.

And even had they not known been able to acess it, when they first heard about a prothean device, they should have come out imediatelly and revealed their secret. Billions of lives could have been saved.
But Tevos was concerned about upsetting the balance of power. Well, f*ck her.

The salarians have zero interest in losing the asari as a council race, so your Shepard can rant as much as he wants.

The salarians are another species that made no friends in this war. Humans, turians, volus, krogans, elcors, hanars, drells, quarians, geth all against the salarians and asari?
They can force them out or build their own Council if they want to.

You think Tevos has the authority? Tevos has to clear it with the Matriarchs. She did. That's why you got access. Tevos is like the Secretary of State. She can't make those decisions unilaterally.

I think after the war the Council system is going to change anyway. It is no longer going to be the "big four".  It'll be more representative. Everyone is going to be represented and not ruled over. I hope what's in the past is in the past. Every world suffered.

Even if we had known about the Catalyst in advance was the device completed? It would have helped to know this yes.

[Someone With Mass]

Eh, yeah?

That Prothean VI could have helped prevent the war entirely, which I think is a tad more important than the asari's petty government.

[Massa FX]

They lost Thessia and many colonies. There are a whole lot less blue bodies in the galaxy. That should be enough punishment for any species.

[MisterJB]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...
You think Tevos has the authority? Tevos has to clear it with the Matriarchs. She did. That's why you got access. Tevos is like the Secretary of State. She can't make those decisions unilaterally.

I couldn't care less what kind of autorization Tevos needed. Even if the Matriarchs disagreed, she could have simply released the information to the rest of the Council who would then pressure the Matriarchs to give acess to the temple.

But we know that's not what happened. They weren't dealing with bureaucracy. They were waiting to see if the war could be solved without the asari making sacrifices. Once the Reapers started breathing on their necks, they were quick to release the information.

Everyone is going to be represented and not ruled over.

I don't think this will ever happen in any realistic setting but that's not the point of this thread.

I hope what's in the past is in the past. Every world suffered.

And some worlds suffered more than they needed to because the asari were unwilling to sacrifice some political pull.

Even if we had known about the Catalyst in advance was the device completed? It would have helped to know this yes.

If Shepard had known about the Beacon earlier, he would have spoken to Vendetta which could have helped gather support for the building of the Crucible. Not to mention that Cerberus would never have discovered the Citadel was the Catalyst and thus would never have revealed it to the Reapers who would not have brought it to Reaper cntrolled space thus saving many lives.

[gisle]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Eh, yeah?

That Prothean VI could have helped prevent the war entirely, which I think is a tad more important than the asari's petty government.

(ME1 Spoiler) A beacon needs the cipher to safely and coherently accessed. Safely and coherent being the keywords.

MisterJB wrote...

If Shepard had known about the Beacon
earlier, he would have spoken to Vendetta which could have helped gather
support for the building of the Crucible. Not to mention that Cerberus
would never have discovered the Citadel was the Catalyst and thus would
never have revealed it to the Reapers who would not have brought it to
Reaper cntrolled space thus saving many lives.

Oh? Where does it say that there's a prothean VI with all the answers in it before you see it? I must have missed that...
/sarcastic

Modifié par Gisle-Aune, 01 janvier 2013 - 12:00 .

[schebobo]

Rifneno wrote...

schebobo wrote...

@ OP **** please, the humans would have done the same thing.

This thread has been enlightening.  I had no idea how many people thought that two wrongs made a right.  Let alone hypothetical wrongs.

OJ got away with murder, so therefor we should stop punishing killers.  Makes total sense!

Should the humans be pnished for cerburus?

[MisterJB]

Gisle-Aune wrote...
Oh? Where does it say that there's a prothean VI with all the answers in it before you see it? I must have missed that...
/sarcastic

When the only hope of survival lies in a mysterious prothean device and your "allies" are collecting every single piece of prothean technology or relics they can find, maybe, just maybe, the treasure trove of prothean knowledge that you are hiding in your homeworld might just be helpful. It can't hurt to try.

[MisterJB]

schebobo wrote...
Should the humans be pnished for cerburus?

Usually, I'd say Cerberus did nothing wrong but, just this once, I'll pretend I don't agree with what they did.

The human government did not support Cerberus' actions and was not responsible for them. The asari government was involved in hoarding prothean technology for millenia.

[MACharlie1]

schebobo wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

schebobo wrote...

@ OP **** please, the humans would have done the same thing.

This thread has been enlightening.  I had no idea how many people thought that two wrongs made a right.  Let alone hypothetical wrongs.

OJ got away with murder, so therefor we should stop punishing killers.  Makes total sense!

Should the humans be pnished for cerburus?

Yes: Cerberus was an Alliance blackops organization. Really, the only ones who can't be punished for anything really are the Turians and the Krogan. The Salarians should get a nice slap for attempting to commit genocide again with the Dalatrass' attempted deal with Shepard. 

[MisterJB]

MACharlie1 wrote...
The Salarians should get a nice slap for attempting to commit genocide again with the Dalatrass' attempted deal with Shepard. 

Personally, I think she was absolutely right.