418 réponses à ce sujet

[Taboo]

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

[OchreJelly]

nicocap24 wrote...

There is no reason to show that scene other than to imply that Shepard will survive and get out of there.

As far as I've seen, most people *do* totally understand this scene (there really are not many other ways to take it.) They just wanted something more definitive. There's a million ways to go from Shepard taking a breath in rubble to a reunion with crew/lover.

Seeing as how speculation bit them in the arse with the original endings to the game, I think most people expected more closure with that endgame plot point, not just the same scene rehashed with different implications thanks to the Normandy taking off.

I can't imagine there's that many people who desperately wanted to imagine a reunion vs. seeing it. Bioware could have easily kept it simple while still showing it, so that we can imagine everything after that.

Modifié par OchreJelly, 01 juillet 2012 - 12:19 .

[nicocap24]

3DandBeyond wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

iakus wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

There is no reason to show that scene other than to imply that Shepard will survive and get out of there.

THat's just it, "imply" isn't enough.

Why not? There's plenty of movies that do this, and it works just fine. Have you seen Taxi Driver? In the end, it's implied that Deniro's character will start going crazy again. They don't have to show him doing it for it to work.

Again, it works fine for you.  Do not tell people what should work for them.  If someone says they needed to see Shepard alive, that is what they needed.  I'm happy that you got what works for you.  But I am a different person with my own perspective.  I need different things from you.

And Taxi Driver is not ME.  People need to understand that ME was Shepard's and the player's story and leaving Shepard in the rubble does not conclude the tale for many people.  We can imagine everything, but the only thing that would make it real would be seeing it in the game.

If we don't need to see things, then why did they make the EC?  We could imagine it all--speculation for everyone.  Why have an ending at all?  Leave it at London or after Harby's beam hits Shepard.  Can't you imagine the rest?

Heck, why have ME3 at all?  Just imagine Shepard beats the reapers.

Because what matters is the end of the war and the fate of the galaxy. And those two things get all the closure they need. Shepard's story is the galaxy's story, the war against the reapers, not his love life.

[Iakus]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

I didn't say reunions.  I admit I wouldn't turn it down.  But I specified "lives" I don't want to do "Shepard lives" in my head if every other ending spells it out in big letters that Shepard dies.

Why should dead Shepards get closure but live ones can't?

[zigamortis]

Taboo-XX wrote...

But it isn't a cliffhanger.

You do that FOR sequels.

Unfortunatly it does not leave closure. hence leaving it a clifhanger. 

[Iakus]

nicocap24 wrote...

Because what matters is the end of the war and the fate of the galaxy. And those two things get all the closure they need. Shepard's story is the galaxy's story, the war against the reapers, not his love life.

How about just Shepard's life then?  The life of one person, rather than the messianic overtones they laid on way too thick by the ened?

[nicocap24]

iakus wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

I didn't say reunions.  I admit I wouldn't turn it down.  But I specified "lives" I don't want to do "Shepard lives" in my head if every other ending spells it out in big letters that Shepard dies.

Why should dead Shepards get closure but live ones can't?

You don't need to do Shepard lives in your head. They're showing it to you. He's alive.

[3DandBeyond]

iakus wrote...


Because every other ending in ME3 is definitive about Shepard's fate.  All of them.  Why should the only one that "implies" Shepard lives be the one that's coy with the audience?

Because apparently Bioware thought it was so cool to watch Shepard vaporize bit by awesome bit, but showing one scene of slight recognition by friends and Shepard that they made it must be a threat to their masculinity?:innocent:
Seriously, it would have taken just one little scene and that would have meant everything to me.

I still say that Shepard not Hackett should have given that "we will rebuild and work together" speech.  Shepard did all the work.

[zigamortis]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

If i wanted to imagine what happened i wouldnt of bought the ****ing game. **** if i fantisize about doing dirty things with beautiful woman does that mean that its going to happen?

[Taboo]

zigamortis wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

If i wanted to imagine what happened i wouldnt of bought the ****ing game. **** if i fantisize about doing dirty things with beautiful woman does that mean that its going to happen?

So it was just about the sex for you? Is that what you're saying?

[Dan Dark]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

And I think most of us would have been fine with that... had they done just a little more to show it's possible.

Something I've suggested in a couple other threads is they should have extended the breath scene by 30 seconds to a minute, and show your LI and/or crew finding Shepard, pulling him/her out of the rubble, they embrace, and cut, fade to black. It'd be short, simple, and effective. We don't need to know anything about Shepard's future - it just would have been appreciated if it was more obviously clear they have a future.

[nicocap24]

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

[zigamortis]

Taboo-XX wrote...

zigamortis wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

If i wanted to imagine what happened i wouldnt of bought the ****ing game. **** if i fantisize about doing dirty things with beautiful woman does that mean that its going to happen?

So it was just about the sex for you? Is that what you're saying?

Aparently you missed my intention... i play mass effect for the characters and the story. not so i can imagine what happens to them. i want to see an epic story unfold and come to a glorious conclusion involving shepard waking up from the indoctrination attempt and finnish what he started. and when i was talking about sex i was saying that just because i imagine it does not mean it is reality.

[Taboo]

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

People don't understand this.

It means something if it's shown. It ALWAYS does.

[chuckles471]

nicocap24 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I didn't need anything when I saw the scene myself. I understood it as I chose to.

Others do not. I really wish Bioware would comment on the issue.

I just don't see how anyone wouldn't understand it. It's obvious that it's implying that Shepard lives and gets reunited with his LI. I mean, we first see whoever his LI is hesitating to put his name in the wall of doom, and then we see him alive. You don't need to be a genius to figure it out.

 
They made a plaque for the memorial wall(unless they keep them all in a drawer), I pretty sure you make one of them after a bit of time being MIA(at least a week if you are cold hearted).  I can see the scene after "Eden planet", "Have we found Shep yet" "not yet" "call the engraver, the memorial wall is looking empty" "shouldn't we wait to make sure""No, we have to do it now before he gets alot of work".
The LI intrest can look up all they want , they are not a throian with a psychic connection and they could be in denial for all we knew.
See, this is what happens when we are told to use imagination.

[zigamortis]

Dan Dark wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Because Bioware wanted you do it in your head.

Paper Cutter reunions wouldn't cut it for everyone. That's why.

And I think most of us would have been fine with that... had they done just a little more to show it's possible.

Something I've suggested in a couple other threads is they should have extended the breath scene by 30 seconds to a minute, and show your LI and/or crew finding Shepard, pulling him/her out of the rubble, they embrace, and cut, fade to black. It'd be short, simple, and effective. We don't need to know anything about Shepard's future - it just would have been appreciated if it was more obviously clear they have a future.

While thats mostly what i would want, i would also like to see an after I.E. garrus and shepard on a beach drinking whatevs and chilling like the bros they are, or shepard with his or her love intrest and doing something like building talis house or little blue children or whatever they might do.

[nicocap24]

chuckles471 wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I didn't need anything when I saw the scene myself. I understood it as I chose to.

Others do not. I really wish Bioware would comment on the issue.

I just don't see how anyone wouldn't understand it. It's obvious that it's implying that Shepard lives and gets reunited with his LI. I mean, we first see whoever his LI is hesitating to put his name in the wall of doom, and then we see him alive. You don't need to be a genius to figure it out.

 
They made a plaque for the memorial wall(unless they keep them all in a drawer), I pretty sure you make one of them after a bit of time being MIA(at least a week if you are cold hearted).  I can see the scene after "Eden planet", "Have we found Shep yet" "not yet" "call the engraver, the memorial wall is looking empty" "shouldn't we wait to make sure""No, we have to do it now before he gets alot of work".
The LI intrest can look up all they want , they are not a throian with a psychic connection and they could be in denial for all we knew.
See, this is what happens when we are told to use imagination.

The point here is understanding the meaning of the scenes. If Shepard wasn't meant to be found that scene wouldn't be there at all, period. The LI would put the name and fly off with the Normandy, and there would be no breath scene. Scenes are there for a reason. They mean something.

[Iakus]

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

That may have been the intention, but that doesn't mean it was well done.  In fact, it  did a pretty frakking poor job in conveying that to a lot of people

[zigamortis]

nicocap24 wrote...

chuckles471 wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I didn't need anything when I saw the scene myself. I understood it as I chose to.

Others do not. I really wish Bioware would comment on the issue.

I just don't see how anyone wouldn't understand it. It's obvious that it's implying that Shepard lives and gets reunited with his LI. I mean, we first see whoever his LI is hesitating to put his name in the wall of doom, and then we see him alive. You don't need to be a genius to figure it out.

 
They made a plaque for the memorial wall(unless they keep them all in a drawer), I pretty sure you make one of them after a bit of time being MIA(at least a week if you are cold hearted).  I can see the scene after "Eden planet", "Have we found Shep yet" "not yet" "call the engraver, the memorial wall is looking empty" "shouldn't we wait to make sure""No, we have to do it now before he gets alot of work".
The LI intrest can look up all they want , they are not a throian with a psychic connection and they could be in denial for all we knew.
See, this is what happens when we are told to use imagination.

The point here is understanding the meaning of the scenes. If Shepard wasn't meant to be found that scene wouldn't be there at all, period. The LI would put the name and fly off with the Normandy, and there would be no breath scene. Scenes are there for a reason. They mean something.

So all of the evedence for the indoctrination theory are their for a reason. SHEPARD IS INDOCTRINATED!!!

[nicocap24]

iakus wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

That may have been the intention, but that doesn't mean it was well done.  In fact, it  did a pretty frakking poor job in conveying that to a lot of people

That's because a lot of people lack an understanding of the narrative.

[zigamortis]

nicocap24 wrote...

iakus wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

That may have been the intention, but that doesn't mean it was well done.  In fact, it  did a pretty frakking poor job in conveying that to a lot of people

That's because a lot of people lack an understanding of the narrative.

Including bioware.

[Iakus]

nicocap24 wrote...

That's because a lot of people lack an understanding of the narrative.

So in other words "You just don't get it"? 

[nicocap24]

zigamortis wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

chuckles471 wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I didn't need anything when I saw the scene myself. I understood it as I chose to.

Others do not. I really wish Bioware would comment on the issue.

I just don't see how anyone wouldn't understand it. It's obvious that it's implying that Shepard lives and gets reunited with his LI. I mean, we first see whoever his LI is hesitating to put his name in the wall of doom, and then we see him alive. You don't need to be a genius to figure it out.

 
They made a plaque for the memorial wall(unless they keep them all in a drawer), I pretty sure you make one of them after a bit of time being MIA(at least a week if you are cold hearted).  I can see the scene after "Eden planet", "Have we found Shep yet" "not yet" "call the engraver, the memorial wall is looking empty" "shouldn't we wait to make sure""No, we have to do it now before he gets alot of work".
The LI intrest can look up all they want , they are not a throian with a psychic connection and they could be in denial for all we knew.
See, this is what happens when we are told to use imagination.

The point here is understanding the meaning of the scenes. If Shepard wasn't meant to be found that scene wouldn't be there at all, period. The LI would put the name and fly off with the Normandy, and there would be no breath scene. Scenes are there for a reason. They mean something.

So all of the evedence for the indoctrination theory are their for a reason. SHEPARD IS INDOCTRINATED!!!

Indoctrination theorists are an excellent example of people who can't understand the narrative. Even if you could fabricate the theory with elements shown in the game, it's very clear that IT was not the intention. Just like here it's very clear that the intention is to show that Shepard will live and reunite with his LI.

[chuckles471]

Taboo-XX wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

People don't understand this.

It means something if it's shown. It ALWAYS does.

Not if it's easter egg.
That is the reason we got Alien vs. Predator films because people took an easter egg seriously. 

[Dan Dark]

Taboo-XX wrote...

nicocap24 wrote...

When you write a script, you don't add a scene if it's completely pointless. You don't show Shepard breathing if you don't mean that he's gonna live.

People don't understand this.

It means something if it's shown. It ALWAYS does.

Or it's a red herring. Or they just screwed up.

I'd point to all of the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2, but we actually do know why that never came back up - they changed writers and completely forgot about / decided to change/ remove that element of the story. ... Doesn't explain whatever happened with that signal Cerberus developed at their Sanctuary facility, though... you know, the one that could disrupt the Reapers control signals? You'd think something like that would've been a kinda big deal...