541 réponses à ce sujet

[movieguyabw]

G1MEE50K wrote...

It's entirely possible, and I wish it was an option. "Artistic vision" Disagrees with us though.

I think that's the point, personally.

It should be an option for those who wish to fight conventionally and have high enough EMS.  I get that a lot of people like the idea that the Reapers are unbeatable - and I got to admit, I did like the idea of facing Cthulhu-esque beings who I had no chance of defeating...  but the cutscenes and the codex have painted the image in my mind that the Reapers can be defeated.  And in my playthrough with my Renegade Vanguard, who charges Banshees and Brutes to death, I've gotten the impression that the Reapers are pushovers.

Would I do playthroughs where there is no hope, and Shepard is doomed to fail, because he/she's overwhelmed?  Hell yeah.  Do I feel that every playthrough of everyone's Shepard should be like that?  No.

[Chaoswind]

Again another person misses a big point.

in all the ME games the codex has been more propaganda than fact.

For all we know all those supposed codex entries could be exaggerated or plain old lies, you must take everything in the codex with a grain of salt, after all sovereign was a Geth flag ship, the ruins of Ios are of a prothean city and the system alliance has one of the strongest fleets in the game.

(all of those are half truths or completely false)

If you don't see anything ingame to support a codex entry, then assume the entry isn't 100% accurate,

[Father_Jerusalem]

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

[Sajuro]

movieguyabw wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reaper+endless husk troop>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>What ever we have now.

TIM proves husks can be released from Reaper control on Sanctuary.

How did that work out for him the moment the Reapers decided to shut it down? Did he release the banshees from Reaper control? what about the brutes and ravagers? What would happen if they did get released? Even if they aren't being controlled, husks are mindless murder machines, and I have no doubt that even if they regained sentience of some kind the other reapers would be in ongodly amounts of pain and the rage would cause them to be even more murderous.
somehow I don't think you thought your ingenious plan all the way through.

[movieguyabw]

Chaoswind wrote...

Again another person misses a big point.

in all the ME games the codex has been more propaganda than fact.

For all we know all those supposed codex entries could be exaggerated or plain old lies, you must take everything in the codex with a grain of salt, after all sovereign was a Geth flag ship, the ruins of Ios are of a prothean city and the system alliance has one of the strongest fleets in the game.

(all of those are half truths or completely false)

If you don't see anything ingame to support a codex entry, then assume the entry isn't 100% accurate,

I think a better way to approach this is saying "the codex has been proven wrong a number of times", and "if it happened in the game, but the codex says it can't... then assume the codex was in error." 

[ashwind]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

ashwind wrote...
*facepalm*
People are still only
comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of
them are generals because I cringe to think of national security if such
people are in charge of defense....

I'd take any one of them over the people who would say "We need to use this doo-dad that no one has ever built to beat an enemy. Oh, and this thing is going to take a ton of resources and is slower than my grandma in comparison to everything else." Yeah...

I am not agreeing with the Crucible. I favor Rejection more than ever at this point

-BUT-

I do that NOT under the illusion and ignorance that we can win conventionally - lining up our ships and shoot it out like how they use to fight back in 1700's

Look at Javik, they got it right. If his stasis pod isnt damaged and he woke up 20,000 years before the Reapers return with his million strong soldier. The Reapers will be destroyed either before they wake up in darkspace or the moment they exit the Citadel Mass Relay.

[ashwind]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

Sure - Vietnam never happen. 

[Ticonderoga117]

ashwind wrote...
I am not agreeing with the Crucible. I favor Rejection more than ever at this point

-BUT-

I do that NOT under the illusion and ignorance that we can win conventionally - lining up our ships and shoot it out like how they use to fight back in 1700's

Look at Javik, they got it right. If his stasis pod isnt damaged and he woke up 20,000 years before the Reapers return with his million strong soldier. The Reapers will be destroyed either before they wake up in darkspace or the moment they exit the Citadel Mass Relay.

Whoa there, lining ships up like that IS suicide, and it no way even "conventional" by ME times. *shudder*
If an admiral used that in ME3, I would have Shepard shoot him faster than I did Udina.

ashwind wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People
are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I
hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if
such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

Sure - Vietnam never happen. 

Don't forget the Winter War!

Modifié par Ticonderoga117, 30 juin 2012 - 06:45 .

[Father_Jerusalem]

ashwind wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

Sure - Vietnam never happen. 

The Vietnamese had the numbers, and were getting tech from Russia. So... I'm not quite sure what your point is here.

[Bfler]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

You know Napoleon? He achieved most of the victories in his first years through advanced tactics against larger armies.
And french soldiers weren't better equiped than prussian soldiers.
The weather was the factor which stopped him in Russia.

Modifié par Bfler, 30 juin 2012 - 06:50 .

[Father_Jerusalem]

Bfler wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

You know Napoleon? Her achieved most of the victories in his first years through advanced tactics against larger armies.
And french soldiers weren't better equiped than prussian soldiers.
The weather was the factor which stopped him in Russia.

And how did that go for him in the end?

[Bfler]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

Bfler wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

You know Napoleon? Her achieved most of the victories in his first years through advanced tactics against larger armies.
And french soldiers weren't better equiped than prussian soldiers.
The weather was the factor which stopped him in Russia.

And how did that go for him in the end?

As I said, because of the Russian winter, like in case of the Germans in 1941.

[Sajuro]

ArchDuck wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

ArchDuck wrote...

Possibly you mean "virtually unlimited" or "easily replaceable"? Because unlimited is impossible.

And I can understand if you are annoyed by my insistance at clearing up a technicality. But my intention is not to harass or annoy but to show that it is not quite as one sided as it appears.

The Reaper minions are easily replaced, the Reapers themselves are replaced at a horrendously slow rate.

If you can show me a limit to the troops, which clearly is not shown, then you can say that. Reguardless, we on the other hand have clear limits that given time the reapers can over run. We can't win convertionally like that.

Ahhh you must be joking right?
Unlimited = No limit.
So that would mean bypassing the universe's limits of space, matter and energy.

At the very least reaper minion forces are limited to the total current amount of Galactic citizens that they could draw on.

and what are our forces limited to? The total current amount of galactic citizens we can get to fight? What about the weapons they need to fight? The armor they need to get from dropping less like flies than they normally would? Vehicles? Training?Ships?Weapons for the Ships? Element Zero to power the ships and the guns and the kinetic barriers? Oh and fuel, you know the stations that the Reapers blow up throughout the course of the game. The Reapers may not have infinite forces but they have enough that they waste a human to create a the arm cannon for a Cannibal, they may not have infinite supplies but each of their capital ships can outclass our dreadnaughts,they can break our supply lines. Their patience is infinite.

[movieguyabw]

Sajuro wrote...

movieguyabw wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reaper+endless husk troop>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>What ever we have now.

TIM proves husks can be released from Reaper control on Sanctuary.

How did that work out for him the moment the Reapers decided to shut it down? Did he release the banshees from Reaper control? what about the brutes and ravagers? What would happen if they did get released? Even if they aren't being controlled, husks are mindless murder machines, and I have no doubt that even if they regained sentience of some kind the other reapers would be in ongodly amounts of pain and the rage would cause them to be even more murderous.
somehow I don't think you thought your ingenious plan all the way through.

Well, seeing as we're arguing about a fictional science fiction world, in which the laws can be altered at the whim of writers, it's not like anyone can know how any situation will play out unless it's actually written.

My point was that these are possible solutions.  No more farfetched than how Mordin came up with the cure for the Genophage; or how Gavin Archer was able to use his brother to interface with the Geth; or how the Geth used Reaper code to acheive true sentience.  It's no more lore breaking than having the Normandy touch down to pick up your party members, while Harbinger shoots at you; or having an Alliance Dreadnaught in Earth's atmosphere.

What seperates what I proposed and what is deemed "fact" by you, is that what I mentioned wasn't written into the game.  I can't answer your questions adaquately because I'm not one of the writers.  Which frankly, that makes all arguments moot.


I could sit here and say that TIM's research was incomplete, and that with proper study of the Reaper code you attain in numerous missions (Fetch quests, side missions, and on Rannoch), of EDI, and of the Geth after acheiving sentience; that you could perfect the formula he used for breaking the husks from their Reaper control.

I could go on to say that once they're free they'd more likely be in excrutiating pain, and in horrible realization of what they've become, they gruesomely claw themselves apart, attempting to rip the tubing that runs through their body out.

But I get the feeling you'll call BS on that, because I'm not one of the ME writers, and this is never explicitly stated in the game, codex, or any of the novels, and you feel the game disproves me.

Then you'll postulate what you think will happen, and I'll call BS on you, because I feel the game disproves you; while admittedly, I've never read any of the novels, and don't make it a habit to read the codex - but I understand that this is a work of fiction, and I understand what I feel would make for an interesting story.


So this argument is moot.

[Sajuro]

Bfler wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

Bfler wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

ashwind wrote...

*facepalm*

People are still only comparing number of ships and size of the guns.... god. I hope none of them are generals because I cringe to think of defense if such people are in charge of defense....

Most numbers generally wins.

Most advanced tech generally wins.

Most numbers + most advanced tech? Yeah. You can "OMG GENERALS!" all you want, it has nothing to do with the facts.

You know Napoleon? Her achieved most of the victories in his first years through advanced tactics against larger armies.
And french soldiers weren't better equiped than prussian soldiers.
The weather was the factor which stopped him in Russia.

And how did that go for him in the end?

As I said, because of the Russian winter, like in case of the Germans in 1941.

Because the troops were equipped for springtime, what about Waterloo? How did he do there?

[Maias227]

saracen16 wrote...

What emotional chest-pounding. The monkey may try to make itself look frightening, but that's not going to stop predators from eating it. I also read these Codex entries:

"The Reapers are technologically superior to the organic species of the galaxy -- but the degree of that superiority is a matter of debate in the intelligence community.
The Reapers' thrusters and FTL drives appear to propel them at more than twice the speed of Citadel ships. Estimates of their location in dark space suggest they can travel nearly 30 light-years in a 24-hour period.

Reaper power sources seem to violate known physical laws. Reapers usually destroy fuel infrastructure rather than attempting to capture it intact, indicating that Reapers do not require organic species' energy supplies. Consequently, the Reapers attack without regard for maintaining supply lines behind them, except to move husks from one planet to another. Unlike Citadel ships, Reapers do not appear to discharge static buildup from their drive cores, although they sometimes appear wreathed in static discharge when they land on planets.

The main gun on a Reaper capital ship dwarfs that of the Alliance's Everest-class dreadnoughts. No dreadnought has yet survived a direct hit from the weapon. Estimates put its destructive power anywhere from 132 to 454 kilotons of TNT. Even if the target is hardened, as in the case of a surface-based missile silo, the gun can instead bury the target beneath molten metal. Precise targeting computers and correctors also give the Reaper weapons a longer effective range than organics' dreadnoughts or cruisers.

The kinetic barriers on a Reaper capital ship can shrug off the firepower of a small fleet. Weapons specifically designed to overcome shields, such as the Javelin, GARDIAN lasers, or the Thanix series, can bypass the barriers to some degree. The difficulty is getting close enough to use them -- the surface-mounted weaponry on Reaper ships, similar in principle to GARDIAN, presents an effective defense against organic species' fighters."

Don't forget the storyline: a single Reaper can wipe out 4 turian companies in less than an hour. The devastation they laid upon Palaven and Menae is unbearable. They've already laid waste to Dekuuna and Irune. They've also controlled MANY sectors irrevocably on the galaxy map, and even some sectors such as Sentry Omega are not even close to accessible (mentioned in the news overheard on the Citadel). Thessia fell as a result of failed guerilla tactics. Which brings me to these:

"The assault on Thessia did not go as smoothly as the Reapers' strikes against other races. While other species met the Reapers head-on, the asari resorted to dangerous hit-and-run tactics to harass their attackers. By engaging in guerilla strategies--blast a Reaper ship, then jumping to FTL where they could not be tracked--the asari forced the Reapers to remain on the defensive.
Unfortunately, the Reapers' greater numbers allowed them to accept certain losses, so they soon ignored the attacks against them and began orbital bombardment of Thessia. This in turn forced the asari to defend their homeworld with a more traditional stance, facing the Reaper forces directly. As soon as the Reapers landed on Thessia, the harvesting began.

A swift and brutal slaughter of the asari ground forces followed. Resistance from trained biotics barely slowly the attackers down. In the end, Thessia's minimal military forces, combined with unpreparedness in the face of an overwhelming enemy, resulted in the fall of the planet."

"The Reapers' first attack on turian space followed an age-old maxim: hit them where it hurts. A populous colony dating back centuries, Taetrus was already embedded in the turian psyche as the site of the worst terrorist attack in turian history. Wounds were still raw from the Vallum Blast, in which a separatist revolutionary slammed a starship into the colony's capital, killing more than a hundred thousand turians. Hierarchy forces responded with a massive invasion of the planet to stamp out the separatist movement. It was a catharsis for the turians, reassuring them that heroes would always triumph over evil. And so the Reapers struck Taetrus first.
By the time Taetrus went dark, the turians had already learned that the batarians and humans were under attack. The Hierarchy responded with what they believed was overwhelming force, only to walk into a trap. Reaper ships were waiting on the other side of the relay to Taetrus, and they released devastating firepower the moment the fleet emerged. Turian leaders observing the one-sided battle were faced with a choice: reinforce their side of the relay to defend against a Reaper invasion, or throw more resources into an offense. With soldiers and civilians alike clamoring for retribution against the Reapers, the turians continued the assault. The Hierarchy sent warp bombs through the relay to clear a path, fighting tooth and talon to inflict casualties against the Reaper fleet. It was a valiant effort, but doomed. The Reapers emerged victorious from the relay and began broadcasting a signal to turian comm buoys-- images of Vallum, Taetrus's capital, once again a smoking wreck. The fight for turian space had begun."

The organic civilizations are fighting a losing battle by the end of the game before Priority - Earth. Don't forget the codex entry about allied dreadnoughts: all number less than 100. The Reapers vastly exceed this number, having been created for countless cycles before.

So, no, conventional victory is IMPOSSIBLE.

Nobody has really refuted any of this so yeah I can't see how its happening either.

[Alushadow]

Shepard Cmdr wrote...

 So I was just browsing the codex in game and happened across a particular codex entry
masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/The_Reapers#Reaper_Vulnerabilities



So conventional victory is possible with a high enough EMS,  also many ships are now equipped with a Thanix Cannon
masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/Ships_and_Vehicles#Mass_Effect_3_2

It also stands to reason that since the Turians reverse engineered them, they would also have thanix cannons on their ships

Please Bioware, give us a high EMS refuse ending where we take control of the fleets and lead them to victory, WITH LOSSES
this is my Idea on how it would play out

Conventional Victory
Yes it was stressed repeatedly during the game that Conventional Victory was impossible, HOWEVER didn't Shepard build a career on doing the impossible.  Shepard got to illos when is was supposedly impossible, Shepard even returned from the Omega-4 relay, possibly without any losses even ON A SUICIDE MISSION.  Therefore I believe that there should be a DLC that enables Shepard to win conventionally, maybe by giving mid game missions that increase Galaxy at war points to where it is possible to get 8000 EMS, and at 8000 EMS the refuse option can be played like the SM and you direct the forces allied against the Reapers to CONVENTIONAL victory.  The better you play the less losses you take; but unlike the SM it is impossible to keep everyone alive. 
Edit: In this ending each of your squadmates and previous squadmates would be in danger

• Jack would be with ascension kids
• Miranda would be with her strike team
• Grunt would be with the Krogan Horde
• Tali would be on the Migrant fleet (She is an admiral after all)
• Garrus would be with his strike team
• Liara would be commanding the Shadow Broker strike team
• The Virmire survivor would be with the Spectre team
• Zaeed would retake control of the Blue Suns and command them
• Samara would be on a team of Justicars
• Not sure about Jacob
• Wrex might also be part of the Krogan Horde
• Not sure about Kasumi
• Not sure about Javik
• James would be part of an N7 Strike team
• The Normandy is an asset so Edi would be part of that
• Steeeeeeve would be part of the fighter wing that he helped convince to assist in the war effort

It should be set up such that multiple fleets would each be able to do the job alone, however there are too many jobs for too few fleets capable of performing the tasks and therfore you would only be able to keep some of your squad and fleets alive, not all of them.
This I would be willing to pay for (maybe $5-$10) as I do not consider it a prerequisite for a good ending, and there would be extra mid game playable content.Edit: In this ending which would take some time, Shepard would be commanding the fleets, as he/she is no longer needed to create alliances.
note: I copied this from another thread that I posted previously
here is the link to the whole thread
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/12843296

it is not go to ME1 check the conversation you had with sovereign on vermir
your society develops with "reaper" based tech
there are thousands of thousands of reapers which are worth each half to a full fleet
there is no hope

[Sajuro]

movieguyabw wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

movieguyabw wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Reaper+endless husk troop>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>What ever we have now.

TIM proves husks can be released from Reaper control on Sanctuary.

How did that work out for him the moment the Reapers decided to shut it down? Did he release the banshees from Reaper control? what about the brutes and ravagers? What would happen if they did get released? Even if they aren't being controlled, husks are mindless murder machines, and I have no doubt that even if they regained sentience of some kind the other reapers would be in ongodly amounts of pain and the rage would cause them to be even more murderous.
somehow I don't think you thought your ingenious plan all the way through.

Well, seeing as we're arguing about a fictional science fiction world, in which the laws can be altered at the whim of writers, it's not like anyone can know how any situation will play out unless it's actually written.

My point was that these are possible solutions.  No more farfetched than how Mordin came up with the cure for the Genophage; or how Gavin Archer was able to use his brother to interface with the Geth; or how the Geth used Reaper code to acheive true sentience.  It's no more lore breaking than having the Normandy touch down to pick up your party members, while Harbinger shoots at you; or having an Alliance Dreadnaught in Earth's atmosphere.

What seperates what I proposed and what is deemed "fact" by you, is that what I mentioned wasn't written into the game.  I can't answer your questions adaquately because I'm not one of the writers.  Which frankly, that makes all arguments moot.


I could sit here and say that TIM's research was incomplete, and that with proper study of the Reaper code you attain in numerous missions (Fetch quests, side missions, and on Rannoch), of EDI, and of the Geth after acheiving sentience; that you could perfect the formula he used for breaking the husks from their Reaper control.

I could go on to say that once they're free they'd more likely be in excrutiating pain, and in horrible realization of what they've become, they gruesomely claw themselves apart, attempting to rip the tubing that runs through their body out.

But I get the feeling you'll call BS on that, because I'm not one of the ME writers, and this is never explicitly stated in the game, codex, or any of the novels, and you feel the game disproves me.

Then you'll postulate what you think will happen, and I'll call BS on you, because I feel the game disproves you; while admittedly, I've never read any of the novels, and don't make it a habit to read the codex - but I understand that this is a work of fiction, and I understand what I feel would make for an interesting story.


So this argument is moot.

Do you think that the Reapers couldn't just decide to scrap the harvest this cycle and slaughter us wholesale?  And you call BS on me because the writers could possibly write it into the story if the mood striked them? I call BS since pink ponies crapping rainbows could bypass the virus because it is a work of fiction.

[Bfler]

Sajuro wrote...


Because the troops were equipped for springtime, what about Waterloo? How did he do there?

As I said, in his first years. He lost almost his whole army in Russia.
In Waterloo the other armies had occupied his strategies. And also with that they would have been defeated if the prussian army wouldn't have reached the battlefield in time and if he wouldn't have done horrible tactical decisons.


But if you don't like this, take f.e. the Battle of the Teutoburg Forest. The prime example how you defeat a superior army with guerilla warfare.

Modifié par Bfler, 30 juin 2012 - 07:22 .

[Grogimus]

I think one point that has been ignored is that IF conventional means can destroy the Reapers, it will take decades.....DECADES to achieve a victory. The OPs point is moot in my humble opinion. There isn't a single ending mission that can make the Reapers disappear. There is no extra suicide mission available. In a war of attrition, the Reapers will win 99% of the time.

[ashwind]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

ashwind wrote...
I am not agreeing with the Crucible. I favor Rejection more than ever at this point

-BUT-

I do that NOT under the illusion and ignorance that we can win conventionally - lining up our ships and shoot it out like how they use to fight back in 1700's

Look at Javik, they got it right. If his stasis pod isnt damaged and he woke up 20,000 years before the Reapers return with his million strong soldier. The Reapers will be destroyed either before they wake up in darkspace or the moment they exit the Citadel Mass Relay.

Whoa there, lining ships up like that IS suicide, and it no way even "conventional" by ME times. *shudder*
If an admiral used that in ME3, I would have Shepard shoot him faster than I did Udina.

When using the codex to explain how a Reaper can be defeated by multiple ships with thanix cannon or commiting FTL kamikaze or blowing up Mass Relays. How is it different from lining up ships and shot it out? What makes you think that they will always sit there and let you shoot at them? What makes you think that they wont ambush your forces? 

They will destroy your shipyard and factories - they have been doing that if you havent notice. While your production and supply lines are being destroyed slowly, they are making even more troops. With the Reapers chewing on your arse, how fast can you replace your ships and equipments?

Reapers are harvesting your population against you. They can turn a civilian into husk that can threaten a well trained marine. The "Dragon Tooth" is very effective at that, they can do it on the field itself.

Reapers have indoctrinated agents planted amongst your population. They can send indoctrinated spies to obtain intel about you while you cant return the favor - not even the Geth can comprehend their "speech". 

Even "dead" Reapers can indoctrinate people, civilians are easy target - as the war drags on, their number will grow. Each world and colony they take from you they can make either huge number of husks or smaller destroyers.

How do you win when they have so much advantage and the biggest advantage of all - the element of surprise, catching everyone with their pants down.

Dream on.

[OblivionDawn]

Conventional victory might be possible under different circumstances.

But throwing the bulk of the galaxy's military into the most fortified system is not one of those circumstances.

The strategy of that fleet is to use brute force to punch a hole through the wall of Reapers to deliver the Crucible. Even if, by some BS leap of logic, that fleet managed to defeat the Reapers around Earth, they would still have to liberate EVERY other system. That's assuming that the Reapers from surrounding systems don't converge on the remaining Victory Fleet and tear them apart.

It's not in the cards.

Modifié par OblivionDawn, 30 juin 2012 - 07:39 .

[Applepie_Svk]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

Leviathan of Dis = 1 billion years old.
Reapers make at minimum one capital ship per cycle.
Each cycle is 50,000 years, give or take.
1 billion / 50,000 = 20,000
Adjusting for 10% losses over that time = 18,000
Supposing 5% Soverign class ships/95% Destroyers and other vessels = 900 Soverigns, 17,100 Destroyers.
Number of Dreadnoughts it takes to destroy one Soverign = 4
Number of total Dreadnoughts available in the galactic fleet = 150 (and that's being generous)
Number of Dreadnoughts needed to kill 900 Soverigns = 3600
3600 > 150

All of this can be found in various codices.

Math wins.

There is the problem we don´t know how much they loss per previous cycles - this logic is based on pure maths and guess, and they are using tactic to divide enemy forces to smaller pockets so they are focusing just on the few points at same time and using shadowy tactics instead of fullscale war - which would fit more to their supperior power.
My point is that we don´t know how much ships they have and even if they had these numbers their tactics simply saying otherwise, most of galaxy is in fact still untouched and they succesfuly destroyed only Hegemony which is something like a North Korea, and from homeworlds they are succesful only at Earth and Thesia, Palaven other worlds are niether untouched or strugling to invasive force.

Final battle over Earth is try to connect the Crucible to Citadel, so even if their superior power they must be certain of even slim chance that the fleets will succed in their effort and connect Crucible to Citadel which could means simple defeat of Reapers, so even they are not so foolish to ignore such a fact but again on orbit and surface of Earth is maybe few hundreds of ships or thousands which is discredit their number superiority...

Modifié par Applepie_Svk, 30 juin 2012 - 07:44 .

[Thore2k10]

i wanted a conventional victory simply because they said that "they wont use a giant "reaper-off" switch"... so much for that...

a war with key strategic victorys (traping reapers, luring reapers, killing em with exploding mass portals, hit and run tactics and in the end an all assault on earth) could have made up for a good game! in between the tuchanka, turian homeworld, quarian homeworld and thessia missions...