16 réponses à ce sujet

[PrincessDarkstar]

Hi All

I am fairly new to the game and have been playing through as a mage (Level 7 so far), I have also read enough posts to know that mages are some of the most useful characters in the game.

I have read a few things about certain spells (Mana Drain and Crushing Field I think) but haven't seen much on character development.

I don't think I have made the best choices spells wise, so my question is:

What spells are the 'best' to take, and in what order should I take them?

Also are there any to avoid?

Please bear in mind that I am starting fresh, so I need to know all the good spells* not just the 3 I might end up using in the late game.

It is probably worth noting that I haven't installed any patches since installing the game (And don't intend to until at least after my first run through) and I was thinking about going Blood Mage/Spirit Healer, if that is a valid combination?

*Spell combinations and tactics would also be apprecaited

Thank you all in advance!

[Rainen89]

Cold 4
Paralysis 4
Mana clash 4
Whatever else you want, I reccomend lightning after cold so you can do some amazing storm of the century 3 goodness.
1-4 depending on preference After that hexes and one point for drain life. Then the rest is up to specs.

Modifié par Rainen89, 15 décembre 2009 - 04:00 .

[andysdead]

max out one school of magic per playthrough for achievements.

[DragoonKain3]

1.02 blizzard seems to not to work as intended (WAI). Right now it seems its only an initial 4 second freeze, when a Bioware developer said its supposed to be an initial 4 second freeze, 2 second unfreeze, another 4 seconds freeze, 2 second unfreeze, and so on until Blizzard's duration expires.

As such, with 1.02 Blizzard not WAI, Storm of the Century seems to be that much more attractive. Or even maybe Inferno, since that's enough to kill people.

Before, I was advocating the use of Death Cloud instead of Tempest/Storm, but that's only because back then Blizzard was great in keeping people within its AoE in conjunction with another CC spell. Now, I find I'm actually trying to burst people down to zero moreso than using it as an AoE CC spell because of its insanely short freeze time.

So, the way I would go is this (all assumes you go Circle tower --> Redcliffe like most people do)..
Stats: Max magic
Origin: Arcane Bolt
1) Winter's Grasp, Frost Weapons
2) Cone of Cold (if you have CE, else switch with 3)
3) Lightning
4) Blizzard
5) Shock
6) Tempest
Ostagar) Chain Lightning
7) Mana drain
8) Mana cleanse
9) Spell Might
10) Mana clash
11) Mind Blast
12) Force Field
13) Telekinetic Weapons
14) Crushing Prison

(save before desire demon in Redcliffe story line, unlock Blood mage, reload save, and get talent tome instead. This can be done as early as lvl 10'ish, but I'm putting it at 14 just in case people do sidequests first. Also buy 3 arcane tomes)

Desire tome) Blood Magic (Take bloodmage/spirithealer specs)
Arcane tome 1) Blood Sacrifice
Arcane tome 2) Blood Wound
Arcane tome 3) Drain Life
Redcliffe Talent) Flame Blast (this and drain life is so you have more nukes)

15) Spell Wisp
16) Blood Control
17) Arcane Shield
18) Staff Focus
19) Arcane Mastery
20) Walking Bomb
21) Death Syphon
22) Virulent Walking Bomb
Landsmeeet talent) Animate Dead

[PrincessDarkstar]

Thanks for the speedy replies



I am slightly sad that Fireball isn't on the list (I haven't got it yet and did want it) but I will test that out in another run through I think, first time round I would rather do it right.

[Rainen89]

Why do people get chain lightning? It does at max 20 damage to the original target and subsequently less afterwards, while also taking 3-4 seconds to cast. Soooo not worth it.

[DragoonKain3]

For Wynne's spells, assuming you get her ASAP, she starts with...
Arcane Bolt, Rock Armor, Stone Fist, Heal, Rejuv, Regen, Heroic Offense, Heroic Aura, Group Heal

8) Revival
9) Mass Rejuv
10) Earthquake
11) Petrify
12) Life Ward
13) Heroic Defense
14) Paralysis Glyph
15) Warding Glyph
16) Repulsion Glyph
17) Neutralization Glyph
18) Spell Wisp
19) Grease
20) Spellbloom
21) Arcane Shield
22) Staff Focus
23 if you get it) Arcane Mastery


Reason for spell picks...

Cone of Cold/Blizzard/Petrify + Crushing Prison/Stone fist/autocrit skills from your fighters = instadeath to white mobs. Petrify/CoC can also be used to battle grab attacks

Electricity line - you need another AoE so that the burst is fast enough before they move out of Blizzard's AoE. Later on you can upgrade this to Storm of the Century via Spellmight + Blizzard + Tempest, which kills them even faster.

Earthquake/Glyph of Repulsion - former is useful in keeping people in AoE in wide open spaces, latter is superior if you hold a chokepoint. There's also double Grease if you need more AoE CC.

Mana Clash - kills public enemy #1 with impunity

Neutralization Glyph - a secondary way to take out enemy mages. Also doubles up as your dispel magic.
 
Spellbloom - keep this on Wynne as a tactic 'hero mana <100% --> spellbloom'. Mass rejuv should be 'Hero mana < 50% --> mass rejuv'.

Blood Magic - best AoE CC I find, since unlike mass paralysis, its fast enough to cast to interrupt scattershot (ie. public enemy #2). It doesn't work on everything, but combining Blood Wound + Chain Lightning means that you can kill most trash mobs without worry of friendly fire. Blood Control is just the giggles since you can turn anyone with high enough spellpower, barring those you talk to with conversations prior to battling them.

Lifeward - Cleansing Aura sucks, so stop it here. Heal + regen + lifeward is enough healing for your purposes

Heroic Defense - 'your dodge tank: any --> Heroic Defense'. Note that tanks should be built on DEX rather than CON, as it is superior. Warding Glyph if you really want to to increase defense even further

Virulent Walking Bomb - only use on bosses with high or mid health. It does very high damage, but it can potentially wipe your party if not careful

[Zachriel]

I am slightly sad that Fireball isn't on the list (I haven't got it yet and did want it) but I will test that out in another run through I think, first time round I would rather do it right.

My first play through I was a mage and I took Grease and Fireball for the obvious combo. I found it to be a great first strike combination, especially against spellcasters. They're unlikely to make the physical resist against Grease, so they get knocked down and slowed, then the fireball combined with grease fire would take them down. If there were archers mixed in, I'd toss out an Inferno to finish the lot of them off.



I enjoyed my mage, who had a lot of the same spells listed above, but his build wasn't very focused. The one Dragoon describes would be a very versatile and powerful character.

[DragoonKain3]

Rainen89 wrote...

Why do people get chain lightning? It does at max 20 damage to the original target and subsequently less afterwards, while also taking 3-4 seconds to cast. Soooo not worth it.

Early game I like it, particularly during Redcliffe defense because I don't want anyone to die.

That said, it should be changed to scale with spellpower. Late game, I just modded it to do (100 + spellpower) * 0.2, which while not powerful, still makes it worthwhile. Anyone who wants the mod, just ask.

[Enoch VG]

I like the Horror-Sleep-Walking Nightmare line better than the paralysis line. You get the mass control spell (Sleep) one tier earlier, it doesn't have a casting time like Mass Paralysis does, it attacks mental resistance rather than physical, it has a nice combo with Horror, and although enemies wake up on damage, you should be concentrating fire anyway.



Heal and Group Heal (spirit healer 1) is all the healing I've needed.



All the spells in the Crushing Prison line are useful.



Mana Clash is indeed very nice, but it essentially costs 4 spell slots, as the 3 lower tiers in that line are pretty useless. You can do without it, taking on mages with Crushing Prison, or Paralyze, or Force Field, or a stealthed rogue, etc.

[DragoonKain3]

No Fireball because Storm of the Century or even normal Blizzard + Tempest is just plain better. The problem with Fireball is that it has no companion spell

That said, if you really want fireball, skip chain lightning at Ostagar and move every spell up a notch. Skip Animate Dead in the end, and move stuff up accordingly. As such....

Stats: Max magic
Origin: Arcane Bolt
1) Winter's Grasp, Frost Weapons
2) Cone of Cold (if you have CE, else switch with 3)
3) Lightning
4) Blizzard
5) Shock
6) Tempest
Ostagar) Mana Drain
7) Mana cleanse
8) Spell Might
9)  Mana clash
10) Flame Blast
11) Flame Weapons
12) Fireball
13) Mind Blast
14) Force Field

(save before desire demon in Redcliffe story line, unlock Blood mage, reload save, and get talent tome instead. This can be done as early as lvl 10'ish, but I'm putting it at 14 just in case people do sidequests first. Also buy 3 arcane tomes)

Desire tome) Blood Magic (Take bloodmage/spirithealer specs)
Arcane tome 1) Blood Sacrifice
Arcane tome 2) Blood Wound
Arcane tome 3) Telekinetic Weapons
Redcliffe Talent) Crushing Prison

15) Drain Life
16) Blood Control
17) Spell wisp
18) Arcane Shield
19) Staff Focus
20) Arcane Mastery
21) Walking Bomb
22) Death Syphon
Landsmeeet talent) Virulent Walking Bomb
23 if you get to it) Animate Dead 


Now that I think about it, since Staff of Magister Lords gives +10% fire, maybe this is the superior build. 

[TastyLaksa]

Rainen89 wrote...

Why do people get chain lightning? It does at max 20 damage to the original target and subsequently less afterwards, while also taking 3-4 seconds to cast. Soooo not worth it.

It's kick ass special effects? Same reason why I watch micheal Bay movies. ACTION!

[Rainen89]

TastyLaksa wrote...

It's kick ass special effects? Same reason why I watch micheal Bay movies. ACTION!

Touche, baysplosions for the win.

[DragoonKain3]

Oh wait, I keep forgetting demons are susceptible to Mana Clash. So if you switch it up with Tempest Line (ie getting Mana Clash at lvl 6-7 and leave Tempest for lvl 9), then that would essentially trivialize the mage tower section since almost everything there can be clashed.

You are weaker during the moments prior to mage tower, but you'd own mage tower with ease.

Modifié par DragoonKain3, 15 décembre 2009 - 05:25 .

[EvilIguana966]

Early on you'll want to get cone of frost for AE crowd control. Next you'll probably want to get force field and eventually crushing prison so you have a good single target CC spell. I'd also recommend flame weapons as it adds a ton of damage to your melee characters' attacks for no mana cost other than the 50 upkeep. The cold version does about 1/3 the damage so it's not as good an option. I happen to find Fireball a perfectly useful spell. It's not quite as good as CoC but it's still good damage that immobilizes the enemies for a few seconds. Having a different shape of spell (sphere rather than cone) is always useful, as is having a different damage type. Bottom line is that it's a perfectly good choice for your mage. The one thing I really disagree with people on here is sleep and waking nightmare. Sleep works all right if you want to go that road but waking nightmare is junk. It has a small effect radius that means it can only catch a few enemies, and most of those it affects end up attacking you anyway. If you're lucky it will hit 4 monsters, only 1 of which will attack your enemy and 3 of which will just wake up and go right back to attacking you.

[themaxzero]

My theory on making the best Mage:

All points in Magic, Blood Mage/Arcane Warrior setup.

1) Get good AoE CC- CC works on everyone (more or less) so it gives you something effective in all situations early on.

2) Get damage spells to deal with the 3 main enemy groups you will face: Living, Demon, Undead.

My first choice for AoE CC is Glyphs up to repulsion. Repulsion will make your AoEs ultra deadly (drop in the doorway out of the room). Add to that cast Paralysis on the Repulsion for a 20 seconds AoE stun. Deadly combo. Finally, they have no cast time, cost little mana and can be cast through walls. Repulstion+Taunt is a ghetto FF+Taunt.

My second choice for AoE CC is Forcefield for the FF+Taunt trick. Now people will cry, screw them. You want the best Mage? Then use this combo. Ogre grabbed your tank? FF. Dragon chomping your tank? FF. Awesome, awesome spell.

At this point your level 5:

1) Heal + Glyph of Paralysis
2) Glyph of Warding
3) Glyph of Repulsion
4) Mind Blast
5) Force Field

You have all the control you will just about ever need, AoE, single target, get out of jail free cards. To be honest you probably use just these 6 spells for the rest of the game and still be a good party contributor.
But we are not going to stop there.

The first area you should go is probably the Mage Tower. As the name suggests its full of Mages so you need some spells that will deal with casters (probably your most dangerous enemy throughout the game).

Ostagar bonus Talent: Drain Mana
6) Mana Cleanse
7) Spell Might
8) Mana Clash

If you want to get Mana Clash early then you want it pretty much for the whole of the Mage Tower, its at its overpowered best in there. Don't worry about elemental damage in Mage tower the Demons have such a wide variety of resistances and immunities that damage spells are of questionable effectiveness. It helps to have a good physical DPS'er in your party for this place.

Now after Mage Tower its off to Redcliffe. Redcliffe is in two parts: The Undead part, the Dragon part.

For the Undead Part:

Bonus talent book 1: Flame Blast
9) Flame Weapons
10) Fireball
11) Inferno
Bonus talent book 2: Vul Hex
Bonus talent book 3: Aff Hex

Undead are highly resistant to Cold but take 50% extra damage from Fire. Good use of your glyphs will keep the Undead in place while your Fire spells clear rooms in seconds. Forcefield, Heal and Repulsion make the town defense cake. I like the Hexes since they stack with each other and can DRAMATICALLY up your elemental damage against enemies.

For the Dragon Part:

12) Blood Magic
13) Blood Tap
14) Blood Wound
15) Blood Control
Redcliffe bonus talent: Arcane Warrior Combat Magic

The Dragon part has a lot of Human cultists so Blood Wound becomes awesome. For the Dragon the easiest way to beat it is to range it down while Forcefielding your tank. Arcane Warrior after to wear the sexy medium Dragonscale armour.

At the end of the Dragon/Urn quest you are about halfway through the game. I won't give you anymore hints on spells simply because you don't need anything else. Pick and test what your like or don't like. With Fireball, Forcefield, Blood Wound and Mana Clash you have the tools to deal with any other combat situation in the game.

EDIT: As you can see me and Dragonkains builds are pretty darn similiar.

Modifié par themaxzero, 15 décembre 2009 - 07:43 .

[Wertilq]

Some nice spells;
Cone of Cold, Whole that Mindblast->Crushing Prison line (telekenetic is a bit meeh, but whatever)

The lower two lines of entropy is fairly good, especially if you get the second from the top one. Well most trees have some good spells, I don't know much about Creation though, I haven't used that tree much...
Sleep + Horror = evil damage
Hex+Death Cloud = NASTY damage.

I just love those spellcombos, I made Morrigan into a Entropy Mage and I loved that.

Must have spell though;
Heal. Costs 1 point to get, and all mages should have it, a life, money and poultice saver!


An awesome trick against many enemies. Run from them till you get to a chokepoint. Freeze them there with cone of cold.
Cast Death Cloud on them all. Any stronger enemy in their midst? Cast Death Hex on it. When they wake up, cast Mind Blast, then the cooldown for Cone of Cold is ready, recast.
Now most lesser enemies should be dead, and you can handle the strong ones alone. Work wonders every time, you can change it depending on what spells you have quite a bit.
Only spell really required is cone of cold(you could use other AoE stuns, but it's the best for it.)

Modifié par Wertilq, 15 décembre 2009 - 07:45 .