244 réponses à ce sujet

[Reorte]

Abraham_uk wrote...

Humanity is a flawed and dangerous race that is at very best a corrupted force that leaches resources and kills animals.

Creating synthetics and giving them the ability to think will ultimatly lead to another competing human race. They will try to destroy humanity because humanity is a major threat to them.

Why, because they are just another species that we will exploit. They will rid the Earth of humanity.

Whether it's a good idea to create AIs or not isn't relevent to whether they're alive or not.

[Awesomeman24]

Ryzaki wrote...

There was so stupid hollywood movie about people being grown to be organ donors. They were killed when their parts were needed for the benefactor. That's all their existence amounted to.

Damn if only I remembered the name..

The Island. With Ewan McGregor and Scarlett Johansson.

[Rockpopple]

The Angry One wrote...

Abraham_uk wrote...

Humanity is a flawed and dangerous race that is at very best a corrupted force that leaches resources and kills animals.

Creating synthetics and giving them the ability to think will ultimatly lead to another competing human race. They will try to destroy humanity because humanity is a major threat to them.

Why, because they are just another species that we will exploit. They will rid the Earth of humanity.

Animals kill animals too.
THOSE POLLUTING MONSTERS.

Neanderthals weren't the stupid cave-men they've been depicted in media over all these years.

Neanderthals were smart people, who had art and used tools, just like we did.

There are no more Neanderthals. You know why?

Because as far as we know, no more than one dominant species can survive on a planet like ours at a time. As far as we know. 

For whatever reason, it was us or them, and we won.

We create AI, and it develops sentience, however it comes about, humanity is done. Over. The machines inherit the earth.

Not something I live in fear of, I admit, but I will tell you that the moment I hear the news of some machine out there becoming self-aware is the moment I go robot-huntin'

Modifié par Rockpopple, 30 juin 2012 - 08:16 .

[Sisterofshane]

Rockpopple wrote...

Neanderthals weren't the stupid cave-men they've been depicted in media over all these years.

Neanderthals were smart people, who had art and used tools, just like we did.

There are no more Neanderthals. You know why?

Because as far as we know, no more than one dominant species can survive on a planet like ours at a time. As far as we know. 

For whatever reason, it was us or them, and we won.

We create AI, and it develops sentience, however it comes about, humanity is done. Over. The machines inherit the earth.

Not something I live in fear of, I admit, but I will tell you that the moment I hear the news of some machine out there becoming self-aware is the moment I go robot-huntin'

Except you can't say that Neanderthals had the same understanding of their world as we do today, nor can you say that we will have the same understanding of the world when true AI technology is actually possible.

[KingNothing125]

Zero132132 wrote...

Doesn't relate to life, but all sentience requires is that something can reflect on its own existence, and take this existence into account with other thoughts. This capability can be programmed.

Your own thoughts and behaviors are the result of the structure of your brain and your past experiences. How difference is this from a program, really?

The structure of the brain might be the key element, though. Computers can't dream, they don't have a subconscious mind. They don't get stressed or tired at work, or relieved when they get time off.

I don't think it's possible to program a computer to get a sense of wonder and awe when it gazes up at the night sky. I don't think it's possible to program a computer to appreciate art or music the way you or I do, let alone paint or compose.

[Ryzaki]

Awesomeman24 wrote...
The Island. With Ewan McGregor and Scarlett Johansson.

There we go!

Thanks!

Cthulhu42 wrote...
I read a book about something like that once. Never Let Me Go, it was called. Probably has nothing to do with whatever you're talking about, though.

Yeah Awesomeman24 was right on it. Sounds like a interesting book. Movie's probably based off it.

[Rockpopple]

@SistersofShane, well true. Right now my understanding is limited. Who knows where we'll be as a species 30 years from now. Ask me the same question again at that time, and maybe I'll have a different answer.

But today, there's nothing more I can say about this topic.

[Sisterofshane]

Rockpopple wrote...

@SistersofShane, well true. Right now my understanding is limited. Who knows where we'll be as a species 30 years from now. Ask me the same question again at that time, and maybe I'll have a different answer.

But today, there's nothing more I can say about this topic.

Agreed.

[ediskrad327]

the same i have with organics. they are individuals, some are good, some are d!cks.

[Abraham_uk]

The Angry One wrote...

Abraham_uk wrote...

Humanity is a flawed and dangerous race that is at very best a corrupted force that leaches resources and kills animals.

Creating synthetics and giving them the ability to think will ultimatly lead to another competing human race. They will try to destroy humanity because humanity is a major threat to them.

Why, because they are just another species that we will exploit. They will rid the Earth of humanity.

Animals kill animals too.
THOSE POLLUTING MONSTERS.

But the thing is, because we are more advanced, we should be better than what we are.
We know better than this. But we act like savages just like all the other animals.
When intelligent people with technology act like savages, all hell brakes loose.

Now imagine some highly advanced machines acting like savages.
We just don't stand a chance.

Modifié par Abraham_uk, 30 juin 2012 - 08:26 .

[RogueBot]

nitefyre410 wrote...

 The great and distingust Jean Luc Picard  somes up my thoughts on AI 

better than even I can...

Measure of a Man

One of the best TNG episodes. As badass as Shepard is, he can't touch Picard.

[MrDavid]

It depends. If we're talking about Sentient AI and not just some complex computer, then yes, I consider AIs to be "alive." AIs simply manifest themselves differently than organics, but they are still alive IMO.

[Subject M]

Awesomeman24 wrote...

Do you believe it's life, or just a good imitation?

In my opinion, if you can think and feel emotions then you're alive.


Edit:  Wow, messed up the title.  I meant what ARE your opinions on AI. lol

I know its impossible to exactly know how it is to be something that is different then myself. And it probably becomes harder as the difference becomes greater. I can not know if others can feel emotions the same way as I do.

However it it is better to treat someone or something with respect, even if it is different then you, and give then the benefit of a doubt, then not doing so as being treated as one have value probably is something all beings being able to experience share.  (I am not going to rip you apart piece by piece even though I am not sure you can feel anything or have anything against it - because it would be pretty bad if you did)

I hope that answers the question.

Modifié par Subject M, 30 juin 2012 - 08:31 .

[Abraham_uk]

I hope synthetics never become like us.

I hope synthetics never develop a brain.
Never develop emotions.

AI would be developed for warfare. So all that AI would be programmed to do is think in battlefield situations.

This automatically makes them dangerous should they rebel.
They would have the intelligence and means to destroy us.


I hope it's impossible to create a synthetic brain with the ability to think, have emotions and behave.

Modifié par Abraham_uk, 30 juin 2012 - 09:19 .

[Mirdarion]

If someone was to take all information that is stored within my brain, my very soul and everything that's part of my (sub-)consciousness, and put it into a machine that were able to simulate my brain with all its functions, so that physically I wouldn't know the difference (beside being "trapped" in a machine), would I become an AI?

Is it my body that makes me human, or is it my... well, soul sounds so religious. What exactly separates us from animals? A few weeks ago I even read in the Max-Planck-Research (a journal for scientists released in Germany which is also available in English) that some apes mourn for their dead children, so the argument that we are able to experience feelings won't do it anymore.




P.S.: Interesting. After a lot of reading i landed at the wikipedia articel about atheism. Omen? 

Modifié par Mirdarion, 30 juin 2012 - 09:07 .

[Shepardtheshepard]

youtu.be/wUQMvlH39XA

Of course, I also saw the first movie and know fully well what one of these dudes can do if they don't "feel" like being very friendly.

[Herr Igor]

Clever machinery, nothing far beyond of that.

[The Angry One]

Rockpopple wrote...

Neanderthals weren't the stupid cave-men they've been depicted in media over all these years.

Neanderthals were smart people, who had art and used tools, just like we did.

There are no more Neanderthals. You know why?

Because as far as we know, no more than one dominant species can survive on a planet like ours at a time. As far as we know. 

For whatever reason, it was us or them, and we won.

We create AI, and it develops sentience, however it comes about, humanity is done. Over. The machines inherit the earth.

Not something I live in fear of, I admit, but I will tell you that the moment I hear the news of some machine out there becoming self-aware is the moment I go robot-huntin'

Because cave men overtaking other cave men is directly analagous to today. Oh wait, no.

[Zero132132]

KingNothing125 wrote...

The structure of the brain might be the key element, though. Computers can't dream, they don't have a subconscious mind. They don't get stressed or tired at work, or relieved when they get time off.

I don't think it's possible to program a computer to get a sense of wonder and awe when it gazes up at the night sky. I don't think it's possible to program a computer to appreciate art or music the way you or I do, let alone paint or compose.

It's possible to make computers that, on a hardwire level, function similarly to the human brain. They would actually be more efficient in terms of power. The problem is, like the human brain, the accuracy of any assessment would be very questionable. Computer processors try to act as designed approximately 100% of the time. Any individual neuron fires the way it's supposed to about 30% of the time, so modelling computers off of the human brain would sort of make them worse at anything we ask computers to do.

You're right, though. I actually believe that individuality and creativity arise from the error-prone process. Actually, when trying to solve nonlinear optimization problems (especially ones that aren't convex), heuristics very frequently incorporate randomness into their methods, because purely deterministic algorithms often get stuck in local optima rather than the global optimum solution.

What this really means, though, is that AIs wouldn't function the same way we do. Their consciousness may lack the chaotic undertones, and we'd have no reason to program it to even have a sense of awe (although a set of values to guide thoughts and actions may, in function, be similar to joy), but that doesn't prohibit a sense of self-awareness, the ability to learn, or the ability to have a sense of ethical values. None of those things rely on the chaos involved in how we think, but those are the things I regard as respectable (and generally interesting) in life forms.

[KingNothing125]

Neanderthals bred with whatever the other humans at the time were called. There was no us vs. them.

[Fauxnormal]

Rockpopple wrote...

Let me put it this way: the moment a machine starts to feel, that's the moment you unplug it. That simple.

Basically what Javik feels about machines is how I feel. No matter how cute and cuddly they are, the moment it starts crying, you put it in the ground and start again.

Machines aren't like us. We don't know where we ultimately come from, even if we follow the course of evolution to it's source, there's still an air of mystery as to what it is that makes us sentient. But we know exactly where the Machines come from, and they know where they come from. That's makes them fundamentally different from life as we know it. And that makes us ultimately responsible for where they go and how they evolve.

Kill them with fire if they get out of line. Nuff said.

Honestly I'd take a million machines over one person like you. :/ It's mentalities like this that cause problems in the first place.

[capn233]

"AI...What's the A stand for?"

[Shepardtheshepard]

Mirdarion wrote...

If someone was to take all information that is stored within my brain, my very soul and everything that's part of my (sub-)consciousness, and put it into a machine that were able to simulate my brain with all its functions, so that physically I wouldn't know the difference (beside being "trapped" in a machine), would I become an AI?

Is it my body that makes me human, or is it my... well, soul sounds so religious. What exactly separates us from animals? A few weeks ago I even read in the Max-Planck-Research (a journal for scientists released in Germany which is also available in English) that some apes mourn for their dead children, so the argument that we are able to experience feelings won't do it anymore.

I think it's too hard to apply organic feelings to AI feelings. How would a robot/computer/whatever actually "feel" an emotion? How in synthetics do they receive emtional pain?  In organics, emotional distress actually does damage (whether temporary or permanent) to our bodies. Can AI's suffer from that? and if so, why would anyone be so mean to create them like that?
Legion and I think EDI mention throughout the games that they don't "feel" like organics do. Which while that may not mean they're not alive, it certainly presents some tricky questions. Like if it's not like organics, is it even an emotion at all, or simply "when condition X is met excute programme Y"?

Modifié par Shepardtheshepard, 30 juin 2012 - 09:20 .