74 réponses à ce sujet

[Cyonan]

When I decided to try out the Shuriken earlier I hadn't used it much before today, and my impressions on it were mostly from what I heard on the BSN. I went into it expecting a steaming pile of crap and what I got was a gun that was actually half decent. I decided to try the other guns that are considered "bad" around here by most people, to answer the question are they really that bad?

For the Avenger the answer is: Pretty much, yeah. 

For my setup:

> I que random/random/gold. If it's FBW/G/G I'll leave, but other than that I'll stay, even if they've set the map/enemy.
> I que solo, so I don't have an overpowered team of killing machines at my back while I'm using these guns.
> I don't kick people unless they're AFK, regardless of class or weapon setup.

My character was a Female Quarian Engineer(6/6/6/5/3) with Avenger X(Piercing Mod, Extended Barrel).

Gear Was:
Assault Rifle Amp V + Assault Rifle Rail Amp III
Armour Piercing or Disruptor Ammo III
Power Amplification Module III

The good points about the Avenger is that it's light, it's accurate, and it reloads very quickly. Ammo capacity is alright and I only really needed to restock in between waves. The damage is poor, even with sustained headshots and I was relying mostly on Incinerate, Tech Bursts, and my Turret to do almost all my damage. It runs into the same armour issues that all rapid fire guns do if you can't sunder or ignore armour.

In short, it's a gun that's only really good at applying ammo powers right now, and even at doing that there are other guns that are just as good at applying them and are capable of doing half way decent damage.

It's servicable if you really like it, but the gun can be replaced by just about anything. I'm tempted to say the Avenger is the worst gun in the game right now.

Next I'm going to try Katana. On a Drell Vanguard.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

It's not the weapon. It's how you use it.

[Tokenusername]

Cyonan wrote...
the gun can be replaced by just about anything.

That's exactly the point. It's a common.

[DatFeel]

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

[Arppis]

And this is what kinda sucks about MP. The Avenger is useless in higher difficulties, well not useless, but really bad.

If it had bit more damage it would be great gun to use. I always use it in SP.

[Cyonan]

Tokenusername wrote...

That's exactly the point. It's a common.

The thing is that I found the Shuriken to be actually half decent, despite popular belief around here. The Mantis is actually a fairly good rifle. Not sure about the Katana or Predator that much.

None of them are going to be compared to the Black Widow any time soon, but they're still half decent weapons. The Avenger on the other hand is only good at applying ammo powers, which a lot of guns can do on top of actually being capable of damage.

[darkpassenger2342]

the avenger is actually one of the better assault rifles.... its better than most of the rare ones. long or burst fire, accurate, good ammo, decent dmg, especially when mixed with power spam, and light.
ive used it on single player my whole insanity playthrough because of my experience with it on MP.
there are like 8 Assault rifles i would agree with the OP on.... but not this one...
especially for a common.
its not like i would use it as my primary weapon on a gold match, but i wouldnt do that with pretty much any AR but the harrier.

Modifié par darkpassenger2342, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:38 .

[Arppis]

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

[RedJohn]

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

[darkpassenger2342]

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

i personally despise the grahl, but that's more of a personal preferance.
all i would add to your list is the arc pistol and the viper.
the arc pistol is awful, and the description lies, it does nothing special to shields.

[Arppis]

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

[RedJohn]

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

Yeah it could be ok, but the problem is me, I don't have that kind of skill to use Katana and Disciple, I can use Avenger, Shuriken, etc, but with those two the story is different.

[Cyonan]

DatFeel wrote...
The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

I don't think it should be UR level, but I still feel that every gun should still be at least half decent.

darkpassenger2342 wrote...
the avenger is actually one of the better assault rifles.... its better than most of the rare ones. long or burst fire, accurate, good ammo, decent dmg, especially when mixed with power spam, and light.
ive used it on single player my whole insanity playthrough because of my experience with it on MP.
there are like 8 Assault rifles i would agree with the OP on.... but not this one...
especially for a common.
its not like i would use it as my primary weapon on a gold match, but i wouldnt do that with pretty much any AR but the harrier.

I find ammo for most of the ARs(Except Harrier, Falcon, and Striker) to be decent. Not as high as some of the SMGs can get, but not incredibly low either.

The main issue I had with it is that it just felt like I wasn't really doing damage, even with the mindset of "I'm using a caster weapon, it's not going to kill things incredibly quickly". It's good to apply ammo powers, but so are a lot of guns.

I also used Vindicator on my Soldier insanity playthrough the whole time =P

Modifié par Cyonan, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:46 .

[DatFeel]

I honestly have no idea whats the difference between a Locust, Tempest or Shurkien

[Zorinho20_CRO]

I used a few times the Avenger with my AA just for fun.But I think I´ll use it only for some kind of a challenge or something.

[Tokenusername]

Cyonan wrote...

Tokenusername wrote...

That's exactly the point. It's a common.

The thing is that I found the Shuriken to be actually half decent, despite popular belief around here. The Mantis is actually a fairly good rifle. Not sure about the Katana or Predator that much.

None of them are going to be compared to the Black Widow any time soon, but they're still half decent weapons. The Avenger on the other hand is only good at applying ammo powers, which a lot of guns can do on top of actually being capable of damage.

No one said they are not useable weapons. The point is they are the commons are starter weapons. Basic in all it's abiltys. The weapons that come after them have specialization. Thus making them much better in the abilty you need it for, but weaker in other places.

I will say however that the Vindictor is better than the Avenger in every single way. They only reason you would ever use Avenger over it is if you're lazy and want the full auto.

[DoubleHell]

The Avenger is a great weapon for bronze, without consumables. And an acceptable weapon on bronze with some extras added to it.

[Arppis]

RedJohn wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

Yeah it could be ok, but the problem is me, I don't have that kind of skill to use Katana and Disciple, I can use Avenger, Shuriken, etc, but with those two the story is different.

Ahhh, ok.

I understand completely. I had trouble getting the shots aligned when I started using the Katana. I didn't have Scimitar unlocked, like I did in the demo of the game. I learned to use it overtime. Surprisngly good gun, atleast imo.

[DatFeel]

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

Yeah it could be ok, but the problem is me, I don't have that kind of skill to use Katana and Disciple, I can use Avenger, Shuriken, etc, but with those two the story is different.

Ahhh, ok.

I understand completely. I had trouble getting the shots aligned when I started using the Katana. I didn't have Scimitar unlocked, like I did in the demo of the game. I learned to use it overtime. Surprisngly good gun, atleast imo.

Suprisngly good as opposed to what shotgun? Which shotgun is the Katana better than

edit: or do you mean suprisngly not that bad for a common weapon

Modifié par DatFeel, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:52 .

[Arppis]

DatFeel wrote...

I honestly have no idea whats the difference between a Locust, Tempest or Shurkien

Locust has no recoil, but really crap damage. Tempest does... bit better damage, has more recoil. Shuriken has burst fire and bit of a same damage as Tempest has.

[mrcanada]

darkpassenger2342 wrote...

the avenger is actually one of the better assault rifles.... its better than most of the rare ones. long or burst fire, accurate, good ammo, decent dmg, especially when mixed with power spam, and light.
ive used it on single player my whole insanity playthrough because of my experience with it on MP.
there are like 8 Assault rifles i would agree with the OP on.... but not this one...
especially for a common.
its not like i would use it as my primary weapon on a gold match, but i wouldnt do that with pretty much any AR but the harrier.

Ya, no it isn't.  Sorry.

[Mozts]

Now try the pre-buff eagle.

[Arppis]

DatFeel wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

Yeah it could be ok, but the problem is me, I don't have that kind of skill to use Katana and Disciple, I can use Avenger, Shuriken, etc, but with those two the story is different.

Ahhh, ok.

I understand completely. I had trouble getting the shots aligned when I started using the Katana. I didn't have Scimitar unlocked, like I did in the demo of the game. I learned to use it overtime. Surprisngly good gun, atleast imo.

Suprisngly good as opposed to what shotgun? Which shotgun is the Katana better than

edit: or do you mean suprisngly not that bad for a common weapon

Better than Discipline (reloads too slowly and really doesn't shine that much otherwise either) and better than Cerberus shotgun (reloads too slow and damage is almost the same) (forgot it's name... drats). Also Graal isn't something I'd want to use (too long cooldowns and bit inacurate when there is lag), even when it has a lot of potential. So I use it over that one too.

These are just IMO thou. Remember that.

[Zorinho20_CRO]

Cyonan wrote...

DatFeel wrote...
The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

I don't think it should be UR level, but I still feel that every gun should still be at least half decent.

darkpassenger2342 wrote...
the avenger is actually one of the better assault rifles.... its better than most of the rare ones. long or burst fire, accurate, good ammo, decent dmg, especially when mixed with power spam, and light.
ive used it on single player my whole insanity playthrough because of my experience with it on MP.
there are like 8 Assault rifles i would agree with the OP on.... but not this one...
especially for a common.
its not like i would use it as my primary weapon on a gold match, but i wouldnt do that with pretty much any AR but the harrier.

I find ammo for most of the ARs(Except Harrier, Falcon, and Striker) to be decent. Not as high as some of the SMGs can get, but not incredibly low either.

The main issue I had with it is that it just felt like I wasn't really doing damage, even with the mindset of "I'm using a caster weapon, it's not going to kill things incredibly quickly". It's good to apply ammo powers, but so are a lot of guns.

I also used Vindicator on my Soldier insanity playthrough the whole time =P

Maybe I´m wrong,but I think common weapons should be weaker than the uncommons etc.They are meant for beginners in Bronze difficulty and for that purpose they are OK.
In every game I played,you alway get some weak weapons and than as you progress you find(buy) stronger.
Good example is Diablo 2:you start with the weakest weapon possible(short sword,hand axe...).
In comparison to that,the Avenger or the Mantis are uberstrong weapons.

[mrcanada]

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.