74 réponses à ce sujet

[darkpassenger2342]

mrcanada, if you got something worthwhile to add, please do. otherwise, keep wasting space with rhetorical rebuttals.
i never said it was a great gun, i said its one of the better assault rifles, which all pretty much suck for gold. if you dont agree with that, pay attention to the 250 threads begging for AR buffs or complaining they arent good enough.
if you are going to dispute something, at least try to offer a shred of insight.
just because you dont agree doesnt make it fact. Try being less of a cynic.

Modifié par darkpassenger2342, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:58 .

[Cyonan]

zorinho20 wrote...
Maybe I´m wrong,but I think common weapons should be weaker than the uncommons etc.They are meant for beginners in Bronze difficulty and for that purpose they are OK.
In every game I played,you alway get some weak weapons and than as you progress you find(buy) stronger.
Good example is Diablo 2:you start with the weakest weapon possible(short sword,hand axe...).
In comparison to that,the Avenger or the Mantis are uberstrong weapons.

I think the progression should still be there, but I don't think the tiers should be that far apart. An uncommon should be better than a common, but I wouldn't say an uncommon I should be better than a common X in pretty much every way.

Mozts wrote...

Now try the pre-buff eagle.

 

I did that once when I first got it. There were a lot of survivors.

[zeal.assassin]

I hate when I see people using the avenger on silver and gold. I would prefer almost anything but the Avenger

[Arppis]

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.

No, that's an opinion. Not a fact.

But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

[mrcanada]

It isn't one of the better AR's, it's the worst and many of the AR's are gold viable because I use them and top scoreboards with them. The math proves it, period. That is all the information you need to know.

[DatFeel]

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

Arppis wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

for me the only bad weapons of the game are Katana and Disciple.

I quite like Katana to be fair. It's a really good shotgun, atleast for me. Accurate, does ok damage, reloads fast and has 5 shots.

Yeah it could be ok, but the problem is me, I don't have that kind of skill to use Katana and Disciple, I can use Avenger, Shuriken, etc, but with those two the story is different.

Ahhh, ok.

I understand completely. I had trouble getting the shots aligned when I started using the Katana. I didn't have Scimitar unlocked, like I did in the demo of the game. I learned to use it overtime. Surprisngly good gun, atleast imo.

Suprisngly good as opposed to what shotgun? Which shotgun is the Katana better than

edit: or do you mean suprisngly not that bad for a common weapon

Better than Discipline (reloads too slowly and really doesn't shine that much otherwise either) and better than Cerberus shotgun (reloads too slow and damage is almost the same) (forgot it's name... drats). Also Graal isn't something I'd want to use (too long cooldowns and bit inacurate when there is lag), even when it has a lot of potential. So I use it over that one too.

These are just IMO thou. Remember that.

I've never used the Discipline. Graal is awesome IF you're the host. I used to use the Katana on my Vanguards! I don't like it personally. Mantis was, and will always be my favorite starter weapon though! R.I.P Sweet Prince.

This isn't directed at you, however I still just don't understand why can't fathom that starter weapons aren't going to be as good as weapons that are harder to unlock. What would be the incentive of unlocking weapons that are inferior to the ones you get from the beginning.

[mrcanada]

Chriss5688 wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.

That's not Arppis' point, I think. He says the Avenger is more satisfying to use than UR's, not that it's better than they are.

'ed by the man himself. Go figure.

How is a pea shooter satisfying in the slightest?

[Arppis]

Chriss5688 wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.

That's not Arppis' point, I think. He says the Avenger is more satisfying to use than UR's, not that it's better than they are.

'ed by the man himself. Go figure.

Haha, thanks for the clarification anyhows.

[Cyonan]

Arppis wrote...
But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

This is an important thing to note while I'm commenting on how good/bad the guns are. Some people will use the guns that they find the most sastifying to use, regardless of how good it actually is. There's nothing wrong with doing that.

I will always use the Wraith over the Talon, even though I will admit that the Talon is better at being a shotgun.

Modifié par Cyonan, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:03 .

[mrcanada]

Arppis wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.

No, that's an opinion. Not a fact.

But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

No it's a fact.  Look at the math.  Every UR is much better than the Avenger, it isn't disputable at all.  Satisfying is an opinion and that's cool, but it does little damage and is a pea shooter.  I don't get how it's satisfying.

[Arppis]

DatFeel wrote...

I've never used the Discipline. Graal is awesome IF you're the host. I used to use the Katana on my Vanguards! I don't like it personally. Mantis was, and will always be my favorite starter weapon though! R.I.P Sweet Prince.

This isn't directed at you, however I still just don't understand why can't fathom that starter weapons aren't going to be as good as weapons that are harder to unlock. What would be the incentive of unlocking weapons that are inferior to the ones you get from the beginning.

I agree with you, starter weapons shouldn't be as good as the weapons you unlock. I just wish there was "Avenger Advanced" or something. What has superior damage to the old one. :happy:

[ASmoothCriminalx]

obviously, not all guns are going to be balanced for gold. The best you can do with the lightweight, rapid fire weapons that deal little damage is set up tech bursts with engineer classes, or use them on power heavy classes when you are bored of your usual weapons. I especially like putting on my gear bonus SMG rail amp 4 and using the tempest with disruptor ammo on engineer classes. With heat sync and the extended clip you get 90 rounds.

There are plenty of weapons that can be used in gold and I'm fine with most of the common/uncommon weapons being ineffective on higher difficulties.

The Katana is fun on an inf/ prox mine class so you have a debuff/stagger and or flanking ability.

Modifié par ASmoothCriminalx, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:05 .

[mrcanada]

Cyonan wrote...

Arppis wrote...
But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

This is an important thing to note while I'm commenting on how good/bad the guns are. Some people will use the guns that they find the most sastifying to use, regardless of how good it actually is. There's nothing wrong with doing that.

I will always use the Wraith over the Talon, even though I will admit that the Talon is better at being a shotgun.

Nothing at all, unless they are saying it's better than something it obviously isn't.

[darkpassenger2342]

mrcanada, it seems you think arguing your opinion with 10 others makes it a fact.
no one cares about your score.
the avenger is a better assault rifle than some of the uncommon AR's, and possibly even the rares..
lots of people like it.

Modifié par darkpassenger2342, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:06 .

[Arppis]

Cyonan wrote...

Arppis wrote...
But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

This is an important thing to note while I'm commenting on how good/bad the guns are. Some people will use the guns that they find the most sastifying to use, regardless of how good it actually is. There's nothing wrong with doing that.

I will always use the Wraith over the Talon, even though I will admit that the Talon is better at being a shotgun.

Yeah, I always loved Avenger. How it shoots with precission rapid fire where you ment the bullets to go and how fast your cooldowns are when you use it and generaly how the gun behaves is just really satisfying. Also there is how the gun looks and that it's the Alliance core-weapon! It's pretty great in those terms. I just like a gun that behaves like Avenger does. Harrier gets really close thou, shame that it's bullet-count is so low.

And yeah Avenger damage could be higher and it would be brilliant.

Modifié par Arppis, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:08 .

[mrcanada]

darkpassenger2342 wrote...

mrcanada, it seems you think arguing your opinion with 10 others makes it a fact.
no one cares about your score.
the avenger is a better assault rifle that some of the uncommon AR's, and even 1 or 2 of the rares.
lots of people like it.

Except it isn't.  DPS and number support this.  It isn't fact because I say it, it is because the numbers say it is.  That's it.  The Avenger is statistically the worst AR in the category and that's fine.  You use it cause you like it?  Fine, but it isn't better than any gun in the category at all. 

You think because a bunch of other people say something makes them right?  Look at these boards, people say and ask for some of the most ridiculous things imaginable and have obviously experienced very little in the game.  That doesn't make them correct because 10 other noobs agree with them.

[darkpassenger2342]

mrcanada, it appears that you question the skill of others or praise yourself in every post.... i have seen some comments of yours in other places. just in the last few minutes.. you might not be the best player in the world, you know.
 dps is a stupid subjective number that doesnt factor in finding cover, spamming powers, recharge speed. teammates shooting the mob too, the powers affecting it, getting hit, or helping teammates... im not gonna follow some formula just because you think that its all linear math.

Modifié par darkpassenger2342, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:12 .

[DatFeel]

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

mrcanada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

DatFeel wrote...

The way you'd see some people talk around here, they'd want it, and other common/uncommon weapons to be buffed to make rares and ultra rares obsolete.

If only ultra rares would be as satsifying to use like Avenger is. They mostly aren't. There ain't many good assault rifles in this game and sniper rifles are just pouring out of woodworks.

Every UR is a much better weapon than the Avenger.  Fact.

No, that's an opinion. Not a fact.

But avenger is really bad damagewise. I am just saying: It is really SATISFYING to use. Get it? It feels good to shoot.

No it's a fact.  Look at the math.  Every UR is much better than the Avenger, it isn't disputable at all.  Satisfying is an opinion and that's cool, but it does little damage and is a pea shooter.  I don't get how it's satisfying.

I think it's satisfying to see rag doll animations on Kischock. Should I stop considering it that way, since you're saying something shouldn't be satisfying cause it sucks? Let me know what you think.

[cuzIMgood]

Tokenusername wrote...

Cyonan wrote...
the gun can be replaced by just about anything.

That's exactly the point. It's a common.

So?  Every gun, ultra rare or common, should serve a purpose.

[Cyonan]

Arppis wrote...
Yeah, I always loved Avenger. How it shoots with precission rapid fire where you ment the bullets to go and how fast your cooldowns are when you use it and generaly how the gun behaves is just really satisfying. Also there is how the gun looks and that it's the Alliance core-weapon! It's pretty great in those terms. I just like a gun that behaves like Avenger does. Harrier gets really close thou, shame that it's bullet-count is so low.

And yeah Avenger damage could be higher and it would be brilliant.

The alliance do love that gun, which is probably why Commander Shepard uses that gun in every cutscene =P

I'll be seen pulling out the Avenger going into battle, then when I get control suddenly I'm back to my Vindicator, Raider, or Black Widow.

[Fang92]

darkpassenger2342 wrote...

mrcanada, it appears that you question the skill of others or praise yourself in every post.... i have seen some comments of yours in other places. just in the last few minutes.. you might not be the best player in the world, you know.
 dps is a stupid subjective number that doesnt factor in finding cover, spamming powers, recharge speed. teammates shooting the mob too, the powers affecting it, getting hit, or helping teammates... im not gonna follow some formula just because you think that its all linear math.

Now youre just be condescending. Attack a Pyro on gold. Just a pyro by yourself with an avenger. Tell me how long it takes. I dont care if you backpedal the whole time or fire from cover. Just hit it with every bullet and tell me how many magazines you run through.

[darkpassenger2342]

go back and look at my posts and you will see i said it is not a gun for gold.... i said it is one of the better assault rifles because most of them suck....
dude, if you want to try to make people wrong at least read their prior comments first...
i never said the gun was a good gun for gold, i said it is " ONE OF THE BETTER ASSAULT RIFLES", and based it off of ALOT more reasons than just damage.. i dont need the avenger... but it is a balanced gun. jesus.
the guns in this game have a weight too... guns are about more than just their "DPS".

Modifié par darkpassenger2342, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:20 .

[Arppis]

darkpassenger2342 wrote...

go back and look at my posts and you will see i said it is not a gun for gold.... i said it is one of the better assault rifles because most of them suck....
dude, if you want to try to make people wrong at least read their prior comments first...
i never said the gun was a good gun for gold, i said it is " ONE OF THE BETTER ASSAULT RIFLES", and based it off of ALOT more reasons than just damage.. i dont need the avenger... but it is a balanced gun. jesus.
the guns in this game have a weight too... guns are about more than just their "DPS".

DPS isn't everything for sure. With Avenger, I can spam my powers and keep firing at my target. That makes up a lot for it. Especialy when I am using my soldier, put distruptor ammo on the gun and fire up those concusion shots, I get tech bursts to add up.