219 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadowvalker]

After synthesis:

ALERT: Pillow fight is now illegal due to the fact you now get nasty cuts from the chips!!

[NyxFTW]

Bone3ater wrote...

Yeah, it's forced upon them. So?  Never ever in the entire epilogue is someone outraged about this or sees it as a bad or "sinister" thing, in fact it is portrayed as the direct opposite, if you have even listened to EDI talking during the epilogue.
But you assume that they're indoctrinated of course and have no free will anymore. Enough with the conspiracy theorys already, you have nothing to back that up.

Well at least someone admits that the galaxy was forced into the rewrite. Just because we see a few slides of people smiling and doing random things does not make up the entire galaxy's consensus over their sudden change in biology. Realistically? Unless they were programmed to simply accept that they are now hybrids, there would be much more confusion and chaos over this situation.

You don't find it strange that aside from a few glances at themselves over their new green LED lights, they just simply shrugged and went, "Eh, whatever."?

[Xilizhra]

In involves contaminating organic DNA with synthetic components. This much we know for sure.

Why would this have to intrinsically feel like a violation? Since your mindset is determined by brain chemistry, much of which is brought about by DNA, why couldn't it feel right?

This is about how EDI FEELS, not about how she functions. Again, you are saying everything she said about her feelings was a lie.

It's absolutely about how she functions. Functioning is what's altered by Synthesis, after all.

Because synthesis flat out says EDI is not alive until she's hit with green space magic.

Since she says she's alive earlier as well, the line in Synthesis seems more like a reaffirmation, a statement of something she already knows but is repeating anyway due to the wonder of it. Rather organic, to be honest.

[SNascimento]

Javik might have already decided to kill himself and was just paying his last homage for Shepard

[Baronesa]

Bone3ater wrote...

Baronesa wrote...
In fact, the synthesis speech completely negates that wonderful and touching conversation when EDI changes her code to incorporate self sacrifice.

It also negates the moment Shepard and Co look at the Geth code and tell Admiral Xen that they are a life form.

How does it negate that in any way? If anything it is an wonderful addition to all of those things, because EDI "herself" said that she was feeling "truly alive now" in the Synthesis ending. It confirmed those two occurrences.

So, explanation please. And not some biased theory without any indications of it being legitimate.

Because it implies that BEFORE synthesis she was not truly alive but just a very good copy. It implies that for a synthetic to be truly alive it MUST understand how organics feel... and that is again a fallacy.

The synthesis speech negates the dialogue between Tali and Shepard on Mass Effect, when they talked about the Geth and Shepard flat out tells Tali that it was not surprising that the geth revolted over being SLAVES. (The Reaper code turned the geth into individuals, but as a consensus they were a life form)

It negates the growing process  of EDI along the whole game too when she ALREADY understood  more and more about organics.

[The Angry One]

Xilizhra wrote...

Why would this have to intrinsically feel like a violation? Since your mindset is determined by brain chemistry, much of which is brought about by DNA, why couldn't it feel right?

.... you realise how wrong this sounds, right?

It's absolutely about how she functions. Functioning is what's altered by Synthesis, after all.

But, again, it's also about how she feels.

Since she says she's alive earlier as well, the line in Synthesis seems more like a reaffirmation, a statement of something she already knows but is repeating anyway due to the wonder of it. Rather organic, to be honest.

Why would she need to say it at all? t would make no sense. EDI is already alive, she doesn't need to reaffirm it.
It very much comes across as "I'm part organic, that makes me alive."

[Izhalezan]

I can't stop wondering what impact Synthesis has on undeveloped worlds and civilizations, they have no idea what robots are and now suddenly they're half robot, that's gotta throw their society completely out of whack and possibly drive them crazy.

[Bone3ater]

ghost9191 wrote...
try harder to prove us wrong maybe, i mean it is funny watching you dig a hole but it gets sad after awhile. I know i am jsut reading the conversation but you do know you too are coming off hostile as well. trying to force your belief that synthesis is the right choice down ppls throats.

That said the only thing that talks in the end is edi, she doesn't say how people react ,  that and if no one reacts negatively to it that is proof there that their minds were affected . which is what reapers do when they turn ppl into husks, control them

The burden of proof is on you people. So technically I don't have to or even can prove you wrong at all, because you didn't give me any evidence to "unprove".

As a side note, it's also funny to see how you started your post with an insult, whereas in my OP I did nothing of that sort. Now I do it of course, an eye for an eye, eh, bite me.

And I'm not trying to force anything down anyones throat. The Angry One, you, and a lot of other people on this forum try to force it down our throat, that there is a big conspiracy, and that everyone is indoctrinated zomfg!11
And as a cherry on top try to make us look stupid by your non-evidence. Your behaving exactly like all the gaming websites during the ME ending controversy, insulting gamers with being entitled and "not getting art".

That no one reacts negatively is proof that their minds were affected? What the hell? You're also affirming the consequent, assuming theres only one explanation for the observation you're making. In this case you're trying to support your claim by a non-reaction, not even specifing in what situation the individuals are. That's also jumping to conclusions.

Burden of proof I say.

[danby]

Eternal peace in evolutionary perfection.

[ghost9191]

Bone3ater wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...
try harder to prove us wrong maybe, i mean it is funny watching you dig a hole but it gets sad after awhile. I know i am jsut reading the conversation but you do know you too are coming off hostile as well. trying to force your belief that synthesis is the right choice down ppls throats.

That said the only thing that talks in the end is edi, she doesn't say how people react ,  that and if no one reacts negatively to it that is proof there that their minds were affected . which is what reapers do when they turn ppl into husks, control them

The burden of proof is on you people. So technically I don't have to or even can prove you wrong at all, because you didn't give me any evidence to "unprove".

As a side note, it's also funny to see how you started your post with an insult, whereas in my OP I did nothing of that sort. Now I do it of course, an eye for an eye, eh, bite me.

And I'm not trying to force anything down anyones throat. The Angry One, you, and a lot of other people on this forum try to force it down our throat, that there is a big conspiracy, and that everyone is indoctrinated zomfg!11
And as a cherry on top try to make us look stupid by your non-evidence. Your behaving exactly like all the gaming websites during the ME ending controversy, insulting gamers with being entitled and "not getting art".

That no one reacts negatively is proof that their minds were affected? What the hell? You're also affirming the consequent, assuming theres only one explanation for the observation you're making. In this case you're trying to support your claim by a non-reaction, not even specifing in what situation the individuals are. That's also jumping to conclusions.

Burden of proof I say.

haven't really voiced my opinion much, and last sarcasm is lost upon you

oh and whereas you try to prove everyone is fine with it cause they don't say otherwise?

Modifié par ghost9191, 01 juillet 2012 - 02:59 .

[ghost9191]

Izhalezan wrote...

I can't stop wondering what impact Synthesis has on undeveloped worlds and civilizations, they have no idea what robots are and now suddenly they're half robot, that's gotta throw their society completely out of whack and possibly drive them crazy.

agree

[Carlthestrange]

The Angry One wrote...

Everlasting peace. And unity. And uniformity.

Metal men on a metal Earth thinking metal thoughts.

[Shadowvalker]

EDI's statements of the top of my head - so be gentle - please..

"I would risk non-function for Joker"

"Are we more than our thoughts"

"TIM order my creation years ago - Joker allowed me to think for my self - but only now do I feel alive - that is your doing"

All this points to the fact that EDI knows that "she" is not alive!

Shephard asked:
"are you afraid"?

EDI:
I don't understand the question! Or the purpuse of it.... I know what we must accomplish.

In my opinion EDI don't feel anything! She does NOT understand the concept - she understands what they muse do but..... It is beyond her comprehension. There for I state EDI is NOT alive.

[The Angry One]

Carlthestrange wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Everlasting peace. And unity. And uniformity.

Metal men on a metal Earth thinking metal thoughts.

YES. <3

[Xilizhra]

But, again, it's also about how she feels.

She seems to feel good about her functionality.

Why would she need to say it at all? t would make no sense. EDI is already alive, she doesn't need to reaffirm it.
It very much comes across as "I'm part organic, that makes me alive."

So you interpret, despite this not actually being said. It's far from guaranteed, and I see no reason to assume it is, because... well, it'd contradict earlier development. Why not assume that she's staying consistent?

I can't stop wondering what impact Synthesis has on undeveloped worlds and civilizations, they have no idea what robots are and now suddenly they're half robot, that's gotta throw their society completely out of whack and possibly drive them crazy.

Such a shame we don't have millennia-old repositories of knowledge we just allied with to go around to said planets and explain things... oh, wait.

[The Angry One]

Xilizhra wrote...

She seems to feel good about her functionality.

She does so before synthesis.

So you interpret, despite this not actually being said. It's far from guaranteed, and I see no reason to assume it is, because... well, it'd contradict earlier development. Why not assume that she's staying consistent?

Because there is no need to say that if demonstrating that she is now alive and wasn't before isn't the intent.

Such a shame we don't have millennia-old repositories of knowledge we just allied with to go around to said planets and explain things... oh, wait.

Right, so let's uplift all bronze age civilisations!
Remember what Mordin said about the dangers of advancement before being ready?

I'm totally sure that Ug, mighty spear warrior of the Northen Tribes is ready to access the knowledge of the Reapers.

[ghost9191]

Xilizhra wrote...

But, again, it's also about how she feels.

She seems to feel good about her functionality.

Why would she need to say it at all? t would make no sense. EDI is already alive, she doesn't need to reaffirm it.
It very much comes across as "I'm part organic, that makes me alive."

So you interpret, despite this not actually being said. It's far from guaranteed, and I see no reason to assume it is, because... well, it'd contradict earlier development. Why not assume that she's staying consistent?

I can't stop wondering what impact Synthesis has on undeveloped worlds and civilizations, they have no idea what robots are and now suddenly they're half robot, that's gotta throw their society completely out of whack and possibly drive them crazy.

Such a shame we don't have millennia-old repositories of knowledge we just allied with to go around to said planets and explain things... oh, wait.

instead of letting them achieve their own future, just force one on them again. nice

i think you neeed to lean back, take a deep breath, clean the cheetos off your chin and rethink somethings

by that i just mean you are raging all over your keyboard, chill . others will  have opinions that are different then yours, doesn't mean you have to force yours on ours, if you wish to do so then go to a synthesis support thread

Modifié par ghost9191, 01 juillet 2012 - 03:08 .

[Carlthestrange]

Synthesis could not possibly be a natural form of evolution. It is not "Inevitable."

It was a forced method, and it ruined the entire cycle of life, in my opinion.

[Izhalezan]

Xilizhra wrote...

Such a shame we don't have millennia-old repositories of knowledge we just allied with to go around to said planets and explain things... oh, wait.

Cuz ya know, we know just what planets these are and they're totally gonna give us a call to say they've gone crazy and are commiting suicide/killing each other in confusion and we should totally stop by and have a chat about what's happening to them.

[ghost9191]

Carlthestrange wrote...

Synthesis could not possibly be a natural form of evolution. It is not "Inevitable."

It was a forced method, and it ruined the entire cycle of life, in my opinion.

which is funny considering the catalyst said it is something that cannot be forces, or is it ironic

[Carlthestrange]

ghost9191 wrote...

Carlthestrange wrote...

Synthesis could not possibly be a natural form of evolution. It is not "Inevitable."

It was a forced method, and it ruined the entire cycle of life, in my opinion.

which is funny considering the catalyst said it is something that cannot be forces, or is it ironic

It is incredibly ironic. How can you not force something, that must effectively be forced?

Synthesis as a natural form of evolution would defy logic.

[The Angry One]

Carlthestrange wrote...

ghost9191 wrote...

Carlthestrange wrote...

Synthesis could not possibly be a natural form of evolution. It is not "Inevitable."

It was a forced method, and it ruined the entire cycle of life, in my opinion.

which is funny considering the catalyst said it is something that cannot be forces, or is it ironic

It is incredibly ironic. How can you not force something, that must effectively be forced?

Synthesis as a natural form of evolution would defy logic.

I imagine they mean that synthesis is inevitable for an advanced society.. which is debatable.
But even if it was inevitable.. it's still forcing it! It contradicts itself in a single sentence.

[Xilizhra]

She does so before synthesis.

So... because you feel good once, you can't feel better later? That's a depressing outlook.

Because there is no need to say that if demonstrating that she is now alive and wasn't before isn't the intent.

I just gave you a possible reason. There may not be a need to do that, but I know people who do things like that anyway.

Right, so let's uplift all bronze age civilisations!
Remember what Mordin said about the dangers of advancement before being ready?

I'm totally sure that Ug, mighty spear warrior of the Northen Tribes is ready to access the knowledge of the Reapers.

Well, it's either that or let them figure out synthesis for themselves. If you're concerned, they could easily get just enough information to learn how to function, but I don't know if environmentally-induced evolution is necessary anymore. We may be moving into an era of wholly deliberate evolution.

by that i just mean you are raging all over your keyboard, chill . others will have opinions that are different then yours, doesn't mean you have to force yours on ours, if you wish to do so then go to a synthesis support thread

Raging? I'm not raging. I rather like these debates. In any case, you people hardly stay out of Synthesis support threads, and this thread isn't even about bashing Synthesis.

[Baronesa]

The Angry One wrote...

I imagine they mean that synthesis is inevitable for an advanced society.. which is debatable.
But even if it was inevitable.. it's still forcing it! It contradicts itself in a single sentence.

Death is inevitable as well... maybe we should all commit suicide or kill everyone...  HEY it is inevitable! lolwut -.-

[Nerevar-as]

I wouldn´t worry about primitive civilizations. If Javik is OK with Synthesis, it probably affected them the same way.