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[dreman9999]

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

BigBadMammogram wrote...

The emotions have nothing to do with it. Most people were expecting a sad ending, including myself.

But this ending makes no sense, at all. That, in my opinion, is the biggest problem.

The ending makes sense with EC.

Why didn't harbinger shoot the normandy when it was right in front of its 'eye'?

Explain to me what exactly partly synthetic DNA is?

Just saying

1. The same reason Why he said "serve us" to Shepard before blasting him.
2.Synthesis is no longer a combination of organics and synthetics down there dna. If you think that it still is , rewatch the synthesis explination agein and listen carefully.

1. I believe that is an arguemnt for indoctrination? I dont really believe in it.

2. I refuse to pick synthesis morally anyway, but i thought bioware said they weren't changing the endings?

1. It's more of an arguement that the reaper let you go up the citadel.
2.Ok then, why complain about it if you don't have to pick it.

1. Okay. I dont really care about these theories matey, but shep still wasnt on the normandy so destroying it wouldnt have stopped him getting up, rendering that point...well...pointless

2. Thats like saying 'Why complain about Mitt Romney since you dont have to vote for him?' Thats like saying 'why complain about homosexuals if you dont have to have homosexual sex?'

1. If you think that then you don't understand the physics of an explotion. Hech, did you not miss what happen to the ship the was shot down near you on earths fall? 

2.The same concept applies for those points. If your not forced into it, don't compline. Why be upset that it's a choice?

[Malkeor]

3. ???

[dreman9999]

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Flog61 wrote...

Its far less emotionally absorbing than the first 2

I disagree; I could probably count the number of ME1 moments I found emotional on one hand.

Not counting any companion/squaddie deaths, since they are always optional (obviously Virmire doesnt count as someone has to die there)
 ME1:
Gaining Spectre Status
Liara killing mother
Virmire Decisision
Romance scenes throughout game
Trip to and Landing on Ilos
Discussion with Vigil
Seeing Sovereign attacking the citadel
Saren Killing himself
Shep surviving scene

ME3:
Leaving Earth
Liaras visit to 'write name in stars'
Liara, Kaiden, Ash
Curing Genophage
Peace between geth quarians
Leaving thessia
Romance with VS, Liara or Team Dextro, all others are pretty well ignored

ME1 wins in story, mass effect 3 wins on combat, albeit at the expense of the story.

Most would probably agree with me.

ME3 has more story then ME1.

I think im gunna refer to 'quality over quantity' here. I'd rather have an amazing chocholate than a disgusting baguette.

Ok then. The Tunchanka mission and rennock mission story wize is better then ME1. It still lead to ME3 being thbetter story.

well, when you say me3 has the better story, i assumed you meant the whole game. it sounds like you mean 'parts of me3 had a better story' which i would agree with. in the same way parts of mass effect 3 had a worse story.

Rennock and tuncanka is the majority of ME3. So it still stands. There was nothing wrong about sactuary or the cerberus base, thessia need some more work.And the problem with the endin gof ME3 was that it was confusing. Added the ending given still fallows the main theme of ME, the concept of what lengths you would go to stop an unstopable force. In the end we are given choice that are all moraly wrong that can stop the reapers. Is the issues with the ending before was that they did not make sense or that all the choice were all moraly wrong?
If it was based on the fact that it was all morally wrong, then this issues sould of been brought up when you were force to choose to save the council at the cost of alliance navy lives or abandon the council to to save Alliance personal lives. We were always been give choice to pic that force moral delemas, that the back bone of ME, to force the player into moral delemas based on the given choices.

Firstly, look at the timings of the actual missions, they dont make up more than half of the game. Secondly, you thought the cerberus base was good? Dont you think it would have been a good idea to have miranda or jacob come with you if they are alive? Also, they chickened out on the endgame ME2 decision, making it a 10 point difference.

Why does it make the cerberus base bad if Miranda and Jacob did not come. You have yet to tell me why the cerberus base mission is bad.
And they did chicken out on the ME2 ending, that choice desided your saftly net. At low ems, if you pick to destory the base, it means you bdestroying the reapers along with everyone else.
And at low ems, if you picked to save the base, it put you in control of the reapers in ME3 and allows you to rebuild galactic sociaty.

[Raizo]

I think they did try too hard. They were trying to hard to sell the whole entire them of war and trying to hard pull on 'gamer' emotions that they forgot to make a 'fun' game, a game that gamers would wan't to play over and over again and would never want to put down.

I also feel that a lot of Bioware's methods fell way short of there intended goal, that stupid brat that Shepard keeps dreaming of immediately springs to mind, they were trying to hard to drive a simple point home and overdid things to the point where my reaction was probably the opposite of what they were hoping for.

[SpamBot2000]

Eh, if you don't like a political candidate, other people might still force him on your country. As for other people's sexualities, why indeed?

[dreman9999]

Raizo wrote...

I think they did try too hard. They were trying to hard to sell the whole entire them of war and trying to hard pull on 'gamer' emotions that they forgot to make a 'fun' game, a game that gamers would wan't to play over and over again and would never want to put down.

I also feel that a lot of Bioware's methods fell way short of there intended goal, that stupid brat that Shepard keeps dreaming of immediately springs to mind, they were trying to hard to drive a simple point home and overdid things to the point where my reaction was probably the opposite of what they were hoping for.

That is all based on the ending that changed. ME 3 is a game you can play mutiple times, that changes based on your past choices. The tone of event change on what you do in the past.
If you really want to see this, pick to destory the genophage cure in ME2. The tone of the tuncanka mission changes completly.

[EsterCloat]

Hackulator wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

I didn't realize I was required to add qualifiers to my every little comment.

"Very few people seem to think Mass Effect 3 is 'great art'."

"Even people who liked the ending wouldn't go that far from what I can tell."

You seem to have problems with other speaking on your or anyone else's behalf. Odd that.

Regardless of what qualifiers you might add, you are attempting to add weight to your own argument by claiming it is shared by other, ambiguous people, where I simply state my own opinions. Allow me to direct you to a website you should probably read.

http://yourlogicalfa...s.com/bandwagon

You're funny.

[AlexPorto111]

Bioware has done something with ME3 that only happened once with me before with MGS4,i cried.ME3 has a much better story,characters and interaction than ME1 and 2.All the main characters death,Mordin,Thane,Anderson,Legion all were powerful and really got to me.Also,the romances,curing the genophage,the goodbyes on Earth,Shepard finally feeling the pressure of the war,and now with be beautiful High EMS Destroy ending EC.

ME3 is easily the most emotional game i ever played.So yeah,Bioware nailed it with the emotion.

[Ryzaki]

Honestly? Yeah I think so. The "humanization" story of Shepard fell flat on its face with me. Shepard had been so action heroy in ME2 that they pretty much had to break Shepard's character and replace it with their own for their humanization to fit. And sadly for me it utterly took me out of the game and I stopped liking Shepard. It probably worked for others but not for me.

Sad thing is it was completely unnecessary. The other character's were spot on and engaged me far more than Shepard ever could. Being able to respond to them in different ways rather than the lame 2 choices we got would've been very engaging. Alas like alot of other things it's something ME3 dropped the ball on.

[dreman9999]

Ryzaki wrote...

Honestly? Yeah I think so. The "humanization" story of Shepard fell flat on its face with me. Shepard had been so action heroy in ME2 that they pretty much had to break Shepard's character and replace it with their own for their humanization to fit. And sadly for me it utterly took me out of the game and I stopped liking Shepard. It probably worked for others but not for me.

Sad thing is it was completely unnecessary. The other character's were spot on and engaged me far more than Shepard ever could. Being able to respond to them in different ways rather than the lame 2 choices we got would've been very engaging. Alas like alot of other things it's something ME3 dropped the ball on.

The problem here it the fact that you not playing your role as yiour playing this role playing game. Try to be Shepard, which is the consept of a role play gmae is, and you feel the emeotins of the game. None of it is ever forced.

[Femlob]

Did Bioware focus TOO much on creating an emotional plot?

I don't think so - every BioWare game's the same in this regard. What they did focus too much upon, however, is trying to steer clear of the series being a space opera. It's one of the many things they f*cked up. The series was a space opera for 2.9 games, so go out strong and save your ambigious bullshit for the next series.

[Athulryes]

Hey guys,

I have to say that I honestly disagree. There has always been emotion in the Mass Effect series and I have loved it. Mass Effect 3 I found really culminated all the emotions I had for the characters and events that have happened and really tied a pretty little bow around it. The conclusion to the genephage with Mordin, the Geth and Quarians ending an age old dispute, Thane kicking ass..

There was a lot of times that I felt BioWare really used our connection to the characters for closure on a lot of the side-stories before actually fighting the reapers. I don't think they'd really be able to do that if you didn't feel that emotion in the first two games when rocking out in the Galaxy with Garrus and Liara.

I didn't like Garrus in the first game but as his character developed and we progressed to the third I fell in love with him! He went from being this simple cop who didn't agree with the system to a leader of his own group of outlaws who fought the scum of the galaxy. Watching these characters grow through the three games and then having closure on their personal lives could have only been good with a chunk of emotion.


...Anyways, that's just my 2 cents! If you don't agree that's okay. I thoroughly enjoyed the vast majority of Mass Effect 3.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Could have worked if it was done right the first time. Too bad the only emotion I felt was rage and then sadness and disappointment following the EC.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:54 .

[Ryzaki]

dreman9999 wrote...
The problem here it the fact that you not playing your role as yiour playing this role playing game. Try to be Shepard, which is the consept of a role play gmae is, and you feel the emeotins of the game. None of it is ever forced.

No that's not my problem I managed to RP Shepard just fine in ME1 and ME2. ME3 took Shepard completely out of my hands. The abundance of autodialogue made it impossible for me to RP Shepard meaningfully and flat out contradicted the Sheps I imported save 1. I feel like I'm playing a set character 90% of the time.

And yes the emotions are forced to me. There's this magical thing called open to interpreation. Doesn't mean I'm doing something "wrong" I just get different impressions of it than you. Shepard as a character did nothing for me. And since I wasn't even able to RP with him meaningfully I found myself bored and leaving to go get drinks and crap during conversations. I never did that during ME2 or Me1 until I played (and beat) the game at least a dozen times.

The focus on "OMG EMOTIONS" to me lead to a backlash. Nothings worse than trying to force your audience. Starbrat made me facepalm in particular. Shep chasing after Tali when she tried to kill herself again felt far too forced (and also contradicted the kind of Shepard I had played for the last two games), Shep's face after killing Mordin contradicted my renedouche (but that I can kind of solve by just having him kill Wrex and destroy the cure so killing Mordin's unnecessary) who had gunned down Wrex without remorse and regret for what he saw as the greater good.

I HAD RP'd Shepard for 2 games already. Not my fault ME3 wanted to railroad Shep.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:58 .

[dreman9999]

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

[quote]dreman9999 wrote...

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

[quote]dreman9999 wrote...

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

[quote]dreman9999 wrote...

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

[quote]dreman9999 wrote...

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

[quote]Cthulhu42 wrote...

[quote]Flog61 wrote...

Its far less emotionally absorbing than the first 2[/quote]
I disagree; I could probably count the number of ME1 moments I found emotional on one hand.

[/quote]

Not counting any companion/squaddie deaths, since they are always optional (obviously Virmire doesnt count as someone has to die there)
 ME1:
Gaining Spectre Status
Liara killing mother
Virmire Decisision
Romance scenes throughout game
Trip to and Landing on Ilos
Discussion with Vigil
Seeing Sovereign attacking the citadel
Saren Killing himself
Shep surviving scene

ME3:
Leaving Earth
Liaras visit to 'write name in stars'
Liara, Kaiden, Ash
Curing Genophage
Peace between geth quarians
Leaving thessia
Romance with VS, Liara or Team Dextro, all others are pretty well ignored

ME1 wins in story, mass effect 3 wins on combat, albeit at the expense of the story.

Most would probably agree with me.[/quote]ME3 has more story then ME1.
[/quote]

I think im gunna refer to 'quality over quantity' here. I'd rather have an amazing chocholate than a disgusting baguette.[/quote]Ok then. The Tunchanka mission and rennock mission story wize is better then ME1. It still lead to ME3 being thbetter story.
[/quote]

well, when you say me3 has the better story, i assumed you meant the whole game. it sounds like you mean 'parts of me3 had a better story' which i would agree with. in the same way parts of mass effect 3 had a worse story.
[/quote]Rennock and tuncanka is the majority of ME3. So it still stands. There was nothing wrong about sactuary or the cerberus base, thessia need some more work.And the problem with the endin gof ME3 was that it was confusing. Added the ending given still fallows the main theme of ME, the concept of what lengths you would go to stop an unstopable force. In the end we are given choice that are all moraly wrong that can stop the reapers. Is the issues with the ending before was that they did not make sense or that all the choice were all moraly wrong?
If it was based on the fact that it was all morally wrong, then this issues sould of been brought up when you were force to choose to save the council at the cost of alliance navy lives or abandon the council to to save Alliance personal lives. We were always been give choice to pic that force moral delemas, that the back bone of ME, to force the player into moral delemas based on the given choices.

[/quote]

Firstly, look at the timings of the actual missions, they dont make up more than half of the game. Secondly, you thought the cerberus base was good? Dont you think it would have been a good idea to have miranda or jacob come with you if they are alive? Also, they chickened out on the endgame ME2 decision, making it a 10 point difference.[/quote]Why does it make the cerberus base bad if Miranda and Jacob did not come. You have yet to tell me why the cerberus base mission is bad.
And they did chicken out on the ME2 ending, that choice desided your saftly net. At low ems, if you pick to destory the base, it means you bdestroying the reapers along with everyone else.
And at low ems, if you picked to save the base, it put you in control of the reapers in ME3 and allows you to rebuild galactic sociaty.

[/quote]
 The Majority of people who played ME2 will be unlikely to have a low ems. So, the ending of me2 doesnt matter at all to the vast majority of people. so they chickened out[/quote]
No, the only people who wouldn't heve low ems is the people who did the rescue missions and made choice that allowed for the most ems.
If someone only Played ME2, that means Thane had to live, you hae to sane the genophage cure, keep legion, keep tali alive,get legion and Tali to work together, kill the the rachni queen or buy ME2 genisus,and get the quarians and the geth to work togethero or playing the multipler. Being that this is a game made on choice, not everyone made choices that allowed all this.
This is the concept of having many roads to use to solve a salution.

[Hackulator]

EsterCloat wrote...

Hackulator wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

I didn't realize I was required to add qualifiers to my every little comment.

"Very few people seem to think Mass Effect 3 is 'great art'."

"Even people who liked the ending wouldn't go that far from what I can tell."

You seem to have problems with other speaking on your or anyone else's behalf. Odd that.

Regardless of what qualifiers you might add, you are attempting to add weight to your own argument by claiming it is shared by other, ambiguous people, where I simply state my own opinions. Allow me to direct you to a website you should probably read.

http://yourlogicalfa...s.com/bandwagon

You're funny.

Is that your way of saying you don't actually have any valid arguments?

Modifié par Hackulator, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:58 .

[What a Succulent Ass]

I didn't find it to be particularly sad, just annoyingly weepy and melodramatic--even at the expense of logic.

[dreman9999]

Ryzaki wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
The problem here it the fact that you not playing your role as yiour playing this role playing game. Try to be Shepard, which is the consept of a role play gmae is, and you feel the emeotins of the game. None of it is ever forced.

No that's not my problem I managed to RP Shepard just fine in ME1 and ME2. ME3 took Shepard completely out of my hands. The abundance of autodialogue made it impossible for me to RP Shepard meaningfully and flat out contradicted the Sheps I imported save 1. I feel like I'm playing a set character 90% of the time.

And yes the emotions are forced to me. There's this magical thing called open to interpreation. Doesn't mean I'm doing something "wrong" I just get different impressions of it than you. Shepard as a character did nothing for me. And since I wasn't even able to RP with him meaningfully I found myself bored and leaving to go get drinks and crap during conversations. I never did that during ME2 or Me1 until I played (and beat) the game at least a dozen times.

I have 6 Shepard. And not one ever been taken out of my hand in ME3. I played everysingle one of them to there character I made for them. If you using the "auto-dialoge "card on me then it's clear that the problem is that you were focusing too much on the auto-dialogue. It doesn't even direct what persona Shepard even has.

[Ownaholic]

There was emotion in the ending plot?

Where?

[EsterCloat]

Hackulator wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Hackulator wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

I didn't realize I was required to add qualifiers to my every little comment.

"Very few people seem to think Mass Effect 3 is 'great art'."

"Even people who liked the ending wouldn't go that far from what I can tell."

You seem to have problems with other speaking on your or anyone else's behalf. Odd that.

Regardless of what qualifiers you might add, you are attempting to add weight to your own argument by claiming it is shared by other, ambiguous people, where I simply state my own opinions. Allow me to direct you to a website you should probably read.

http://yourlogicalfa...s.com/bandwagon

You're funny.

Is that your way of saying you don't actually have any valid arguments?

I didn't realize I was arguing anything. O_o I just thought we were shooting the breeze.

[savionen]

dreman9999 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
The problem here it the fact that you not playing your role as yiour playing this role playing game. Try to be Shepard, which is the consept of a role play gmae is, and you feel the emeotins of the game. None of it is ever forced.

No that's not my problem I managed to RP Shepard just fine in ME1 and ME2. ME3 took Shepard completely out of my hands. The abundance of autodialogue made it impossible for me to RP Shepard meaningfully and flat out contradicted the Sheps I imported save 1. I feel like I'm playing a set character 90% of the time.

And yes the emotions are forced to me. There's this magical thing called open to interpreation. Doesn't mean I'm doing something "wrong" I just get different impressions of it than you. Shepard as a character did nothing for me. And since I wasn't even able to RP with him meaningfully I found myself bored and leaving to go get drinks and crap during conversations. I never did that during ME2 or Me1 until I played (and beat) the game at least a dozen times.

I have 6 Shepard. And not one ever been taken out of my hand in ME3. I played everysingle one of them to there character I made for them. If you using the "auto-dialoge "card on me then it's clear that the problem is that you were focusing too much on the auto-dialogue. It doesn't even direct what persona Shepard even has.

Must be a lot of bland Shepards. Since you can't investigate, insult or be neutral. Can't even have a real dialogue with most NPCs. You're an eavesdropper.

[Ryzaki]

dreman9999 wrote...
I have 6 Shepard. And not one ever been taken out of my hand in ME3. I played everysingle one of them to there character I made for them. If you using the "auto-dialoge "card on me then it's clear that the problem is that you were focusing too much on the auto-dialogue. It doesn't even direct what persona Shepard even has.

Lucky for you (no sarcasm) your experience =/= everyone else's. Don't pretend it does.

And the autodialogue doesn't direct Shepard's personality?!? 

WHAT?

For example: 

If my Shep's persona has him not being particularly friendly to character X and the autodialogue forces him to be friendly and buddy buddy to character X guess what? IT'S DIRECTING HIS PERSONALITY.

You know what...yeah NVM. Let's just leave it at your experience not equalling mine and that doesn't mean either of us are doing it wrong. Because clearly we're not going to agree on anything else.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 01 juillet 2012 - 07:03 .

[dreman9999]

Ownaholic wrote...

There was emotion in the ending plot?

Where?

Let's see...
To kill the reapers I have to kill the geth who I see as alive, and kill EDI who is my friend  who I help find her humanity.....

Oh, right there it is!