165 réponses à ce sujet

[goblinsly1]

Hey everyone,

Since i hope that sometime in future i will find time to play this great game again, i want to be ready when
the time comes. I wanna talk about my party, not really looking for an answer, more like, looking for a nice chat,
hear what others think about it, some ideas maybe...

I will play BG2 + TOB with SCS2 on insanity. Until now i always played with tactics and ascension on insanity,
this time i will make a few changes:

1) i wont abuse potions to sell/steal for infinite money, actualy wont steal anything, not even that efreeti bottle
which is just sick sweet, but, the law is the law

2) i wont abuse that spell learning, erasing, learning again, erasing again, for some extra experience. If i dont
cheat in college where i only learn about computers and information science, i sure as hell dont want to cheat when learning about fireballs and demons....could end up in tears hehe

3) other minor cheats, cant really think of any exept ghost firegiants in TOB where u can get some exp. Never used
that much, but it sure is out of the question. As mentioned, wont pickpocket anyone, soo no ribald touching, no
fancy book a demon has, no efreeti bottle ( kind of miss that one .. ).
The only thing i can think of that can be considered as cheat is having 2 strongholds. Since i was always able to
get both fighter and mage stronghold, it doesnt feel like a cheat and i will miss having both of them.

Until now i usualy just used my main char. I had 5 or 6 ppl in a party but most of them had just 1 purpuse. To stay alive. For instance my kensei/mage took care of everything, hiting things during timestops, lower magic resistance + spells, etc. Part of the reason was that robe of vecna makes a single character soo much better then probably all the rest combined...but luckily i dont get robe of vecna until TOB soo i will have to use everyone.  I want to use every single party member, no matter how useless he is. There will be a job for everyone, even if it means carrying the towels. 

Now for my party. The decision about party members is final, i will give some info bout each one:

- Protagonist - Berserker/mage - i will dual him at 13 or 14, i forgot which is better, will have to check. From my times with Kensei/mage i learned that its worth to get those extra few levels. Why berserker/mage and not some other fun combination i wanted to try, like ranger/cleric ? Well, i need a strong char for SCS2 and fighter/mage combinations provide that. Why Berserker ? First, i never played him before and second, rage is sweet and less item restriction then with kensei is also sweet.

- Minsc - i played bg2 many times and dont think i ever played without him. And sure as hell never will. He will be much trouble though. Its very easy to keep mages alive due to protection spells, it will be hard to keep him alive. I never used him much, this time it will be different. He will have that short sword for mirror images, armor of faith, hardiness and that weapon from copper coronet should give him lots of damage reduction and well, he will be a Ninja of a kind. First line when needed, when necesary he will run away and shoot arrows. I will make him very usefull.

- Imoen - Same as Minsc, she was always in a team and always will be. Not much else to say, she is a Mage, easy to play, easy to keep alive and easy to win battles with.

- Aerie - dont remember ever playing with her. She will be in a team and will get robe of Vecna ( SCS2 only gives me that in TOB ). It should be lots of fun casting cleric spells much faster, puting them into triggers, also unlike normal cleric, she will be easy to keep alive. The only thing is her low stats. There are certain points in game where i can improve stats, like watchers keep. Here i could use some advices as to what is worth upgrading ( considering also that certain items add inteligence, etc. ). In the end i want to have all Cleric spells and be able to cast level 9 mage spells. When i cant add spells i will use potions for inteligence ( i hope thats not cheating ? )...and for scroll learning i hate to decide whether lower difficulty level when learning to get automatic learn, reload when it fails or just use scs2 ( or was it some other mod ? ) option for 100% learning.

- jaheira - i want a druid and fighter/druid will be fine, i will also romance her and shes fun to have around. To be honest i mostly like Druids for elemental princes...not that they are that usefull or necessary but lets face it, once you go Sunnis, you never go back. I also like some other Druid spells ( again, not that they are that usefull compared to mage spells but they are fun and thats what the game is all about ). It will be quite hard to keep her alive due to her low hp and no usefull defensive spells exept those skins. I think Jaheira and Minsc will share some defensive items.

- Haerdalis - this is intended for pure fun. Never used him before and it should be fun. Quite easy to keep alive due to mage spells and if i use my cards right i can even get him to be quite usefull ( read some blade guides... ). But the real reason is, use any item. Not sure how usefull that will be but it will be extremely fun. With that i think i should get him close to 100% magic resistance ( and if u add protection from magical weapons he is practicly invincible ). He will be the partys crossdresser, like, during the battle he will come and say, hey, do you like my new dress ??? And then he will kill some enemies. To keep his manly status, he will date Aerie ( i think ). Out of all characters i am looking forward to him the most. All those paladin and monk items i never could use...

- Yoshimo - here i cant decide whether to keep him around until Imoen or not. I like that extra exp i get for his black heart ( but still that is not even close to what he will cost me due to sharing of exp, even door opening and trap disarming wont compensate for that ). 1 option is to get him just before i travel to the island, but i am thinking if it would be good to have a thief around, for disarming and opening locks. Keep in mind that i usualy do most of the quests before i go to get Imoen. Maybe i should keep him for roleplaying and act surprised when i learn that he is in league with Irenicus. Ideas are welcome.

Ok, this is it. If anyone managed to stay awake and read through this novel...good ! I wont talk about weapons much because there is too much text in here as it is. I have a few ideas in my mind ( like +50% MR for Haerdalis, bastard sword with +MR for minsc....imoen and aerie will have ranged weapons and some nasty small weapon ( like dagger or short sword ) for hiting stunned enemies or hiting enemies during time stop ( something with low damage but nasty effect. For main char i will try to use some things like sword that lowers magic resistance and AC...with minsc it depends, maybe decapitation axe + that damage reduce thingy from Julev could be combo 1, another combo would be 2 handed swords and halberts...Ideas are welcome, i want to make sure my 6 chars cover all good weapons ( meaning they have enough proffs in them ) soo i have a tool for every occasion. Actualy not just all good weaspons, but even bad weapons. Surely that can be possible with 6 characters.

Allright, soo, what do you think about this party, the ideas, plans, etc.

Modifié par goblinsly1, 03 juillet 2012 - 12:30 .

[The Potty 1]

Dual at 13, there's very little reason to wait till 14, and you only get your levels back at 1500+1875=3375k instead of 1250+1500=2750k. Personally I dualled at 9, then you only need 250+250=500k.

I also installed SCS2 after finding Tactics/Ascension waaay too easy, I was using Def Jam at 50% XP to slow my levelling. I made the mistake of installing Def Jam with SCS2, and got slaughtered. Basically install all of SCS2, but perhaps drop the difficulty to core rules.

[goblinsly1]

Oh yea, its all coming back now, since its levels from 9, some ppl dual at 12 for thaco and at 13 for that extra half atack. Soo its 13 not 14. Personaly i was always sorry when i went for level 9 cause early battles arent that hard and at later ones you sure could use any bonus you get.
I wont use Def Jam but will keep difficulty at insanity soo if i cannot complete the last battle at TOB i can always lower the difficulty - i have to admit, i never completed the last battle with ascension on insanity, had to drop the difficulty a notch. Maybe this time i can do it, who knows.

And yes, Tactics and Ascension added lots of challenge to the plain game, but scs2 is better at this. First, there is less cheese and more tactics. And second, what i really really missed in Tactcs....scs2 does more efford to improve every single enemy. For instance, with Tactics Slavers quest wasnt much harder. With scs2 it was pretty hard - offcourse since i didnt use money and exp cheat, i was weaker but still.....cant wait to play it again. Soooooo, what about my party, proficiencies are a big dilema, cause usualy i want planing anything soo i ended up giving my NPCs prof points into things they never used and therefor was lacking prof points for things i neeed.

[ScotGaymer]

I don't know how people can play SCS2.

I played SCS with BG1 and found it very very difficult, but I managed it "okay". At least when I went back to a play thru of BG1 without it I found it laughably easy. Especially Sarevok - killed him in less than a minute lol.

So naturally when I went on to play BG2 I thought to myself "MODDING!" and put SCS2 onto it - having not played it at all yet.

And as you might expect it was an Epic Disaster.

I got seriously pwned in Irenicus' dungeon. But I struggled through it. Then I hit the Slaver Questline; and just kept dying over and over. It was extremely frustrating.

I must have done something wrong in the install or something lol.

But you folks you can play with it have my utmost respect. Seriously.

@OP.

My personal opinion on your party...

I love Minsc. He is just win of awesome of win. And his interactions with Aerie almost make that character worthwhile.

I couldn't imagine doing a playthru without our Sis, Immy. Just not possible.

Aerie is probably one of the most annoying characters Bioware have ever created. Yes even more annoying than Fenris and Merril. She just whines and moans the whole game and then assumes ur her boyfriend out of nowhere; and then acts all butthurt when you say "Aerie just because I didn't tell you to STFU when you were whining does not make me your boyfriend okay?"
Her interactions with Minsc, and her abilities as a Mage/Cleric and the fact that she can wield the Epic Warhammer of Win ALMOST makes up for her cripplingly annoying character. Almost.

Jaheira is just revolting. Her husband of many many years has just been brutally and needlessly murdered by a mad elven wizard, and within days she is like a **** in heat around CHARNAME. It's appalling. And unlike Aerie she doesn't really have a whole lot of use in a combat sense. As a fighter she isn't great - there are better fighters in the game; and as a healer she is also not great, again there are better healers in the game. There are also other druids in the game, who are vastly less revolting, if you REALLY want one - even Faldorn is a better option and she is an evil monster.

Haer'Dalis I can't say I have ever played with. There is just something about him that has always put me off; maybe it's his class - the Bard class has always seemed a little useless to me. So I can't say either way on him. Lemme know how you get on with him, though - I'd be interested to see what he is like.

Yoshimo is great. It was something of a shock when I got to Spellhold and he was like "sorry was working for Irenicus all along"
I was like "You were? What did you do exactly?"
He didn't do anything to help Irenicus of course; which is why I think Irenicus kills him (though it is never really explained other than Irenicus is EVIL!!!! as if we didn't already guess that).
He is a decent thief, and makes a pretty powerful fighter; and when he dies it leaves a convienient open space for Our Sis to come back - instead of having to ditch and possibly lose another party member.

Personally I'd drop Jaheira and get Anomen. His personality while toxic, is less appalling that Jaheira's, and he vastly outstrips her as both a fighter and a healer. He can work as a decent "slot in companion" until you get to Trademeet and can pick up Cernd - if you REALLY want a Druid.
I'd also get shot of Aerie, and ideally use some mod character that is a mage (or sorc like Kelsey); or if you are against NPC mods then take Nalia instead. She is less annoying, and dies less than Aerie.

Just my opinion though.

[goblinsly1]

FitScotGaymer : Tnx for your reply ! Ok from the beginning:
You are offcourse right about SCS2 ( through since you mentioned Irenicus dungeon, dont forget that Tactics gives you a fight against a quite high level band in this dungeon, and unless you act fast, you fight against fallen deva ( ! ). Even without it, fight is tough as hell ). But most of the people who use SCS2 completed BG2 numerous times. I for instance completed it probably about 10-15 times ( dang, i actualy had some free times back then..sadly not anymore ). I know most of the secrets there is. I completed it many times with Tactics and Ascension which is about as hard as SCS2 but more cheesy and less of a tactical. That is why SCS2 brings something new. What i am looking for is for instance a fight against the dragon that will last more then an hour. He will pwn me and i will keep thinking how to beat him, try different things. That is what BG2 means to me now, since i already know the storyline. But yeah, a line between ultimate challenge and frustrating crap is very thin.

The party will stay as it is, let me tell you a few reason. Actualy you pointed a few of them, Minsc is minsc and it would be a crime to leave him, Imoen is a nice person and sis, soo she stays.
Jaheira...i need a druid for my fun spells ( elemental princes ) and for my purpuses she is better then Cernd, pure druid is a waste if u ask me, and i can always use another character with warrior high level abilities. Due to iron skins she will prolly survive longer then Minsc.
Aerie...i never played her before and i really really want to try two things. First, cleric spells being cast much faster due to robe of vecna. And second, all those trigers and contingencies with cleric spells inside. Besides....i wont have to date her, haerdalis will.....which reminds me:
I plan to have lots of fun with his "use any item" ability. Remember, he can wear items otherwise only monks can. And since i read some blade guides carefully, i expect him to be at least midly usefull. He can only cast 6 level spell BUT he can spell higher level scrolls, soo timestop or 2 is not out of the question, i will keep tons of scrolls for hard battles. I will report if he lives to the expectatins. Wont happen till hes high level though.
Yoshimo...still dont know...keep him from the beginnning till his death or just pick him before i leave atlahala....
Also, i need your feedback on weapon specializations.

[ScotGaymer]

It's just my opinion on them though man lol.

As you can tell I don't really like the female romance options in BG2. Viconia is tolerable I suppose, for an Evil Witch that is. I much prefer the Jaheira (and Khalid) we got with the BG1NPC mod. BG2 Jaheira is just awful.

Aerie I really like gameplay wise. she is pretty awesome as a Mage/Cleric. Robe of Vecna and the Warhammer of Awesomeness that you can get Cromwell to make for you, combined with her mage and cleric magic make her able to lay down the smackdown on most things.
She is just a bit weaksauce defensively; you NEED a strong fighter to support her. It's just like I said I find her personality excruciating lol.

On my "first" Sorc playthru I went with the typical "vanilla" party. Minsc, Yoshimo/Imoen, Jaheira, Aerie, and the mod NPC Nathaniel.
Minsc I have specialisations in Sword and Shield simply because you can get awesome heavy armour and shield/sword combination pretty early on in the form of the gear of Balduran; and a bit later you get great dragon slaying gear (halberd, sword, and shield I believe).
Yoshimo I went two handed with because I wanted him to focus on using a longbow first then switching to 2h sword when enemies got close.
Immy I went short sword/dagger dual wielded combo. No idea why. lol. I just did.
Jaheira I switched to sword/shield and scimitar/club because you can find some really nice scimitars and clubs fairly early on.
Aerie as you will have guessed I went full on Warhammer with her just so I could get use out of that Awesome Warhammer.
Nate is a Kensai - so went full on Katana with him.

For your protag I would consider the possibility of specialising in Halberds, there r a few really nice ones in the game; and for myself I didn't get a lot of use out of them.

Do you have the BG2 Tweak mod from Gibberlings 3?

I ask because I am sure you can enable Armoured Arcane and Divine Spellcasting (and Thievery) with it, with appropriate penalities obviously.
So you could have your protag lightly armoured (or heavily if you prefer) and still able to make use of his mage abilities...

[goblinsly1]

When i install bg2 again ( god knows when that will be ), i will prolly use BG2 Tweak mod aswell for some minor things ( like 100% spell learning and i am also thinking about nwn hitpoint system because i dont know, having 100hp when i am level 20 with a warrior seems a bit low for the battles coming. I think nwn system at least gives you about 7 points per level ( thats fine since all my previous plays, i always put difficulty on easy when leveling up for max hp ). Dang, this playthrough will be seriously fair and square from my side ! Wont change armoured spellcasting though.

For weapons this is what i got soo far ( a lot of weapons missing + whats even more importaint, the order - uptil now i always put proficiencies into something i wont get for another few days... ):

Since jaheira is limited she will pick what she can, namely clubs, scimitriars and spears ( beginning with scimitriars offcourse ! )

Minsc will pick 2 handed swords and halberds ( since he seems like that kind of guy anyway ), also he will pick flails and possibly axe. To put all this together, 2 handed swords and halberts will be a tool of a "special occasion", like killing a strong enemy, etc. When there is a bigger battle with more foes that can damage our minsc he will have defender of easthaven ( +20% physical damage resistance ) in offhand and in main hand he will switch between flail of ages and that sweet decapitation axe ( when the time comes ). Axe proficiency comes last ! Flail and 2 handed sword will come first, have to decide which one first, probably flail, even though that talking 2 hander is sweet for the beginning. He will also have proficiency in bastard swords just for the sake of that +20% magic resistance bastard sword.
My main char will have long swords and katanas. Why ? This two types will be best fit for the missions i have prepared for him and also, he looks cool with the swords - might get some bastard sword profs later in the game.
Haerdalis will naturaly pick short swords and probably dagers. Other then that i am not sure. Maybe also bastard sword soo he and minsc can exchange +20% magic resistance bastard sword. Naturaly later in the game he will get also proficiencies in 2 handed sword for carsomyr.
I didnt mention ranged weapons since i will cover all of them ( cause i plan on doing some damage with certain bleeding/poison effect thingys ) with different characters.
Ok soo lets see which weapons i forgot:
- Mace - minsc has 2 points in them and to be honest i am not sure if there is any mace worth using..
- Wakizashis & Ninja-Tos - nothing good exept Scarlet Ninja-To +3 which will be covered by jaheira ( with 2 +1 atack per round weapons it could be fun )
- Staves & Rods: this will mostly be just used for their special abilities ( like spells they allow u to cast or some other effects ) because otherwise i really dont see my front warriors use a wooden stick. Soo my mages/priests will carry this ( mkay, maybe jaheira also.. ) and offcourse, for any i cant use otherwise, we have haerdalis.

[ScotGaymer]

The only thing I can say more about Specialisations is that I try to diversify as much as possible.with my party. If only to not be boring lol.

Are you using BGTutu? Or BGT?

[goblinsly1]

No, never did. I kind of didnt like BG1 very much, completed it 2 times just for the sakes of it ( i completed bg2 like 10 times before i played bg1 for the first time ).

Yeah i really hope this party should be fun, 2 new characters, lots of new interactions, new tactics and like i said, for the first time i plan to use all characters, not like usualy, get 5 of them to the safe distance and then massacre everyone with my kensei/mage. Its quite easy and possible in most of the game ( at least tactics and ascension, different in scs2 prolly ) but thats a bad thing because later on come a few battles that cannot be won with 1 character because of too many hard enemies and if u never use other chars during the game, when hard battles come u have no idea how to effectively use them. Not to mention its boring to use just 1 char. Its like soloing but u get less exp and have to keep 5 extra chars alive.

[ScotGaymer]

Right. Lol.

I think both games are awesome myself in different ways.

Both have different "goals" and do what they do very well.

I always play with more than one character. never done a solo run. mostly cos I love the NPCs.

[goblinsly1]

NPCs are part of the reason BG2 is great. Anyway, i am welcome to more prof suggestions and some suggestion about on which char i should use those extra points ( like lum the mad ), maybe extra inteligence for aerie ? Will this give me any bonus since i will use 100% learn spells and i will use flask of genius when i need more spells then my book can handle?
Also about my main char...how would u divide points ? I always like to have at least 15 wisdom, therefor i can cast wish with my main and get best wish ( rememorise ) without any wisdom improving flask. Also i like charisma of main char at least 15, i know i can use ring for 18 char, but i dont want to waste slot for that and i just like him being talkative ( like i am irl and as u noticed, on forums aswell xD )

[Mr Spidey]

I don't really like being Mr Nitpicker, but a few things have to be said.

Her interactions with Minsc, and her abilities as a Mage/Cleric and the fact that she can wield the Epic Warhammer of Win ALMOST makes up for her cripplingly annoying character. Almost.

Throwing Crom Faeyr after Aerie, a cleric, seems utterly ridiculous. She's got crap attacks per round and not a particularly good THAC0 either, and she's ridiculously low on health. Yes, she can use it in principle, just like a warrior can use a rusty dagger in principle, but that doesn't make it a good idea. The hammer requires a belt of 21 strength and a pair of gloves of 18/00 strength. Just give her the darn belt and cast Draw Upon Holy Might. Tadah, 25 strength. Same as what the hammer does and then you can give the gloves to someone who might need them (say, Mazzy, Valy, Vicky, Jan, Anomen, Jaheira...), put a bigass shield on Aerie, and still be loads better off than if you'd made the hammer.

The 25 strength is great on characters that aren't clerics. Unfortunately, just about all non-cleric characters would benefit more from a stronger main hand weapon, Belm or Kundane off hand, and a belt of 21 strength, particularly if there's someone around to cast Improved Haste and make Belm provide +2 attacks per round. The difference between 21 strength and 25 strength is +9 or +14 damage per hit. Two more attacks per round adds +18 damage and two more triggers for "on hit" effects. Then there's the small matter of the base damage done by the main hand weapon, which is also applied two more times per round.

Finally there are the on hit effects of the hammer. It kills trolls, ettins, clay golems, and stone golems. And how often are those creatures even remotely dangerous at the time you're able to actually get Crom Fayer? The ability sounds nice but it's actually almost useless.

All this leads to one single and fairly inescapable conclusion: Crom Faeyr is vastly overrated, especially on clerics that can easily get to 25 strength anyway, though that in itself doesn't help them much, since they don't have the APR to use that strength for anything meaningful.

Jaheira is just revolting. Her husband of many many years has just been brutally and needlessly murdered by a mad elven wizard, and within days she is like a **** in heat around CHARNAME. It's appalling. And unlike Aerie she doesn't really have a whole lot of use in a combat sense. As a fighter she isn't great - there are better fighters in the game; and as a healer she is also not great, again there are better healers in the game.

Jaheira isn't "a fighter" or "a healer". She's a divine spellsword and as such one of the best tanks in the game, despite the vast number of fairly useless druid spells. Ironskins + decent AC makes her as sturdy in a straight up fight as Korgan and enemy mages tend to respond rather badly to insect plagues. She can self-heal. She can use Belm + Blackblood or be refitted to use Impaler.

She's not so awesome if you just put a suit of armor onto her and use her like a grunt and she's not at her best when standing on the backline and hurling stones, waiting for someone to require healing. She's a spellsword. Use her as such and she'll do great. Use her as anything else and she'll be mediocre at best.

Personally I'd drop Jaheira and get Anomen. His personality while toxic, is less appalling that Jaheira's

This is ridiculous. Anomen is chaotic neutral and a self-righteous bastard. Jaheira is true neutral, tending towards neutral good, and while she's annoying as hell at first (while being in distress after her husband got murdered), she will eventually end up more or less reasonable.

Yes, Jaheira is attracted to Charname. He's a sickly powerful being and a long time friend and travel companion, who goes to great lengths to comfort her, despite personal loss and dire circumstances. Why wouldn't she be attracted to him? Remember the setting, please. In medieval times you mourned over having lost a loved one and THEN YOU MOVED ON.

Aerie is probably one of the most annoying characters Bioware have ever created. Yes even more annoying than Fenris and Merril. She just whines and moans the whole game and then assumes ur her boyfriend out of nowhere; and then acts all butthurt when you say "Aerie just because I didn't tell you to STFU when you were whining does not make me your boyfriend okay?"

What else would you expect? She's a wingless winged elf that has been released from a tiny cage and is now wandering the great, big surface world, realizing her own abilities and ends up going through some of the darkest, most nighmarish events that the world has to offer. Of course she whines. Anyone would. The fact that she's not a drooling wreck, that she fights on time and again, is a testament to the strength of her psyche.

She's a fantastic story of a disabled, disfigured, and psychologically abused person finding her own place in the world. To those who have always had everything, such a story may seem trivial or boring, but to those who have seen the darker side of life, those who can fathom what kind of hell she's going through, the story becomes a lot less about the wimpy elf who couldn't shut her damn trap, and a lot more about so many other problems. Post-trauma identity disorders, self-realization, anorexia,

By the way, you'd crap your pants if someone sent you into the Underdark. I probably would too. Intense darkness and hordes of mighty big spiders aren't my cup of tea, honestly. Aerie, a now disabled member of a race whose self-identification is almost entirely in being beautiful elves that fly around way above the surface, tolerates being so far underground that normal dwarves might feel uncomfortable. She tolerates it despite feeling that she's lost all that makes her Avariel. That's like trying to be macho after cutting off one's reproductive organs, which I certainly could see myself struggling with.

Evaluating her story without considering the context is no different from reading only half the text and complaining that there's no meaning left.

He is a decent thief, and makes a pretty powerful fighter

If you think Jaheira is a crap warrior and that Yoshi is pretty powerful, I'm not sure what game you're playing. :-)

[Mr Spidey]

maybe extra inteligence for aerie ? Will this give me any bonus since i will use 100% learn spells and i will use flask of genius when i need more spells then my book can handle?

I don't think that serves any purpose. I don't recall how it was with only SoA installed, though I vaguely recall something about level 9 spells requiring 18 int, but with ToB more int really doesn't do much for spellcasters. It affects lore, the number of spells you can fit into your spellbook, and the chance to write spells into the spellbook, nothing more. Or at least asdasd, the level 22 mage I just created with 11 intelligence, can cast three level 9 spells per day.

[goblinsly1]

Thx for your reply Spidey ! I just hope it wont turn out as a "fight" between you two, but rather a testament to this great game, i mean, think about it, we are actualy debating about personalities of people that dont actualy exist and we argue whether they are good, bad, annoying, etc. What a great game it is, and you two are giving exactly what i wanted to this topic, not answering question but giving your opinions, advices, experiences...

Ok, while still waiting for weapon prof suggestions ( and to be honest i also have to do some study in this particular area...afterall i will be using the chars who will use weapons soo i have to make sure they use weapons i like )...
...atributes of main char. I usualy reroll for a few minutes, not trying to get all 18, but its actualy fun rerolling, its like opening presents. While i still have to think about what to do regarding hit points on level up.....when i start game on insaine with no moding about hp, they are simply to low, when you see a berserker with 18 str have about 50 hp when u start the game...its not good. I will need those hp. On the other side....i tried to fix this by starting game on easiest and also turning down difficulty every time i level up. This gave my char an unrealistic amount of hp. Soo tell me, what do u think about that thingy that makes hp a bit like in nwn....its still random ( i WANT it to be random, i like cubes, thats what its all about, randomness and gamble ! ) but it has a lower limit, for instance instead of 1-10 its something like 5-10. This should feel like cheating since it wont be as high as max hp on levelup or as if u lowered difficulty and got max hp this way....but it will give me a realistic amount of hp and enough to fight tough battles. Btw, human or half elf, for berserker/mage ? Oh, soo, atributes...lets say i will get about 90 points to spend ( i think i can manage that, if i get more, even better ):

Str: 18/xx Even though there is a lot of str pumping items, its good to have that much, lets face it, its a thingy to spend points on. I never noticed there is such a difference between 18 and 18/00. I think i might be rolling a lot to get that....+3 vs +1 to hit, +6 vs +2 damage, 400lbs vs 200lbs carrying, 45 vs 20 for breaking doors ( since irl im good at that, i have to go for that in game aswell ). All this bonuses will be great at the start. Not sure if i can even get 18/00....

Dex: As low as 10. Here i differ a lot from many players. For me, Dex is almost useless. Lets face it, my char will have soo many mage spells that melee will be the least of his problems. Besides ( please correct me here... ), when playing with Tactics, Ascension or SCS2, isnt AC kind of useless, i mean, enemies have such low THACO that they auto hit you even if you have like -5 or -10 AC. I think most enemies have at least -5 THACO, soo if you have -10AC that means every 1/4 of hits miss.....thats good but u miss on lots of good gear trying to get -10AC...and strong enemies have more then -5 THACO ( right ? ). But one thing is....all those AC adjustments...like, you have -10AC but certain armors also give enemy some "adjustment" if he is carrying certain type of weapon, practicly making your AC better ( like -15 ) in effect. Am i right ? Well i need some feedback here. But not for my main char, he doesnt need AC, i will use ranged weapons with him but look: difference between 10 and 18 is 4 AC ( which like i said i dont need on my main ) and only 2 THACO loss when using ranged weapons ( which is nothing basicly ). Since im not theif nothing else is importaint, exept this Reaction Adjustment of +2 vs 0 .... something about who atacks first, is this even included in BG2 ? First time i heard bout it....

Con: 18. No contest. Need that hp....

Wis: 18 - for always getting a good wish - that was i could even cast it during fights which i never did before. I only used wish for those items/adventures/money and to rememorate spells after a battle with more then 1 phase where i cant rest in between.

Int: 17 - i need that for dualing...

Cha: 9 - thats all i have left. I will try to roll more but if not, it will have to be enough. Will it really make a difference, for instance, will i miss on some lines because of low cha ? Prices are not the problem, i have a spell friends or i can click with some other char with higher cha. But i dont want to click on quest ppl with my NPCs. And i dont want to waste ring spot for that 18 cha ring. Or...i could put even less in dex, if my booklet is correct even if i go as low as 6, there are no further penalties compared to 10, and then i could have 13 Cha. I hate having any attribute too low though.....Soo yeah, i need info bout Cha, if i click with main char, will i miss on dialogues or better reward, even if for instance i have other chars with higher Cha ( but my main clicked, not them.. ). Its importaint cause i know that if u have too low wisdom for instance u cant do a certain quest on fish island without killing a certain cuddly round guardian ( ruined my day when i had to kill him -.- ).

Ok, this is it for now.

[Mr Spidey]

No worries, Goblinsky. I'm not trying to start a fight, and I don't really like "nitpicking" either. But occasionaly someone says something that seems just a little too inaccurate to let it stand without a comment.

Anyways, I've been holding back on advice with proficiencies since I haven't got a clue how SCS2 affects the weapon availability. I'd rather give no advice than terrible advice, so I'm afraid I can't help much with that.

But regarding your other questions.
1) NWN-style HP
Apparently there's a problem when using that together with barbarians. Personally I'd just go for max HP on level up and enjoy the "lucky" rolls. There's a tweakpack option to give all creatures max health, in case you feel that you've got too much health relative to everything else.

2) Human or half-elf for berserker/mage?
This one is easy, because a half-elf can't legally be a berserker/mage. To get the berserker kit you have to start as a human pure fighter, pick the berserker kit, and then dual at either level 9 or 13. If you go with a half-elf then you can't dual and have to go for a fighter/mage multiclass. As it happens, that multiclass option is my personal favorite but then I do like playing with a frontline grunt.

The berserker-mage dual class option gives you all the benefits of a pure mage while also allowing you the health to survive stray horrid wiltings and the weapon skill to jump into melee and kill stuff. If you're playing with true grandmastery (and thus get +1 attack per round from grandmastery) then the dual class option gets ridiculously strong, though only with that chosen weapon.

The multiclass option is more of an arcane spellsword that is gimped as a backline caster but quite possibly among the finest types of warrior in the game. True grandmastery will bridge many of the advantages a fighter/mage multi has over a berserker-mage dual class.

Anyway, short version, if you want a legal berserker/mage, go human and dual at 9. You'll get your levels back soon enough, you'll be "good enough" in melee, and you'll be an immense mage.

3) Attributes
For strength, go for 18/76 or better. Don't insist on rolling 18/00. If it happens, great. If not, 18/76 will do just fine. Less too, if you're rolling 95 or more.

For dex, I always go for 18. Big difference or not, it's a contribution to a safer character and it helps your ranged attack rolls. Why not take what you can get? I don't know what SCS2 does to enemy THAC0, but neither Tactics nor Ascension make everything able to auto-hit you regardless of AC. Tactics mostly adds some challenging scenarios (stronger trolls at de'Arnise Keep, a spellcasting Maevar, much meaner Kuo-Toas, and so on) and Ascension only changes some of the bosses in ToB.

For con, 18 is obvious when you're going for berserker-mage.

For int, 17 is fine but 18 seems more "appropriate" for a mage.

For wis, I'd go lower and drink a wisdom potion whenever I was planning on getting into challenging fights where the Wish spell might become relevant. Yes, there are probably about a handful of conversations where wisdom is checked. The floater you mention requires 13 wis from whatever character is "party leader", so if your protagonist doesn't have that then rotate Aerie up to the top and let her do the talking.

For cha, it really doesn't do much most of the time. The pirate lord and Phaere the Drow are the only two conversations that spring to mind. And temporarily using the ring will work just fine on both occasions.

18 strength, dex, constitution and 17 int adds up to 71. Realistically, you can probably roll something in the 92-95 region, leaving you with at most 24 points to distribute between charisma and wisdom. I'd probably go for 8 wisdom and 16 charisma, but any combination is fine.

[goblinsly1]

SCS2 does even less then tactics and ascension about enemy statistics ( THACO, AC, etc. ), its mostly about AI ( and it works ).

Ok lets say i roll 95. Str. 18, Dex 10, Con 18, Int 18, wis 18, cha 13

How does that sound ? That 18 wisdom really sounds sweet, but i can lower it to 15 np, this still gives me a chance to get rememorise spells without any bottle and thats the most importaint thing ( even though like i said, out of fun i would love to cast wish in the middle of the battle and get some crazy ass bonus like long lasting whirlwind atack - sounds cheesy though.. ). But if i put it to 15, where do i put the rest of the point. I refuse to put it to AC. For mage AC means nothing since he is always protected and 10 vs 18 DEX is 2 thaco points when using ranged weapons which just isnt worth it. Hmm, tough one...

As far as weapons go in SCS2:

http://www.gibberlin...adme-scsII.html

...not sure if anything is different. I know certain items are moved to TOB, like Robe of Vecna, Vhailors helm, clock of mirroring...and i know shield of balduran is removed from the game. The only thing i can remember, Carsomyr changes soo dispeling effect can be avoided by a save throw ( similar to celestial fury ).

Profs are very importaint but nothing is more importaint then order. Cause by the end of the game i will have profs in everything i need. But it is bad if u put profs into something when u start the game and u wont get that weapon ( or any good weapon of that prof ) until later in the game. I will have to check which weapons i can get soon. Long swords, katanas, scimitriars and flails are the first to get profs in. Also, jaheira might be carrying the gnasher for a while, those sliver damage is sweet with that scimitriar that adds extra attack...

[goblinsly1]

Ok, another long post by me.

Axe:
Early: Azuredge
Late: Axe of the Unyielding +5, K'logarath +4

Bastard sword:
Early: Nothing
Late: Foebane +5, Purifier +5

Dagger:
Early: Neb's Nasty Cutter ( ... ), Pixie ****** +3, Stiletto of Demarchess +2
Late: Dagger of the Star +5 ( ... ), Dagger of Throwing +3: 'Fire Tooth',


Flails:
Early: Morningstar +2: The Sleeper, Defender of Easthhaven +3, Morningstar +2: Wyvern's Tail +2
Late: Flail of ages +5


Halberd:
Early: /
Late: Dragon's Breath +4, Halberd +4 Wave, Ravager +6

Katana:
Early: Celestial Fury
Late: Hindo's Doom +4


Long Sword:
Early: Daystar
Late: Angurvadal +5, The Answerer +4

Mace:
Early: Mace of Disruption +1
Late: Storm Star +5

Scimitriar:
Early: Belm +2
Late: Spectral Brand +5

Short Sword:
Early: /
Late: Short Sword of The Mask +5

Spear:
Early: Spear of Kuldahar +3, Spear of the Unicorn +2
Late: Ixil's Spike +6, Spear +3, Impaler

Quarterstaff:
Early: Rod of Terror, Staff of Arundel
Late: Serpent Shaft

2 Handed sword:
Early: Joril's Dagger +3
Late: /

Club:
Early: Club +2 Gnasher
Late: Club of Detonation +5

Warhammer:
Early: /
Late: Crom Faeyr

Sling:
Early: Sling of Everard, Sling of Seeking +2
Late: Sling of Arvoreen +4

Short bow:
Early: Tansheron's Short Bow +3, Tuigan Short Bow +1
Late: Short Bow of Gesen

Long bow:
Early: /
Late: Mana Bow +4

Crossbow:
Early: Giant Hair Crossbow +3, Light Crossbow of Speed: 'The Army Scythe'
Late: Firetooth +5

Soo here are the items i think are worthwhile.
This helped me to figure certain things out. Profs order:

Main: long sword, 2 weapon fighting, katana
Minsc: Flail, 2 weapon fighting, Axe, Halberd, crossbow
Jaheira: 2 weapon fighting, Scimitriar, club, Spear, quarterstaff, sling
Haerdalis: 2 weapon fighting, short sword, dagger, bastard sword, short bow
Imoen: /
Aerie: /

Ok, this is what i came up with. Nothing with Imoen and Aerie since they have too much points as it is. Certanly they will be given some nasty on hit weapons for timestops or hiting stunned enemies. Otherwise immy will go with short bow, Aerie with Sling, jaheira Sling, Haerdalis short bow, Minsc will switch to crossbow as soon as he gets some spare points. Main char will use whatever he finds, wont be using ranged weapons much. The idea is to spread good weapons around characters. Soo, what do you think ? Oh, btw, early means what i get and use early and late what i get late...obviously if first good item i get late in the game, i wont put prof early in the game into that ...Certain weapons like carsomyr are offcourse missing cause Haerdalis will use it ( minsc obviously cant ). Btw since good long swords arent till late in the game, i could use another weapon for my main char...

Modifié par goblinsly1, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:01 .

[ussnorway]

Animosity thy name is party;

Jaheira &  Aerie will fight about who gets to be your woman.
Imoen will probably go slayer against you.
Haerdalis will want to fight with the protagonist for the right to bed Aerie.
Aerie will leave the protagonist for fighting poor Haerdalis.
Minsc will probably pick Aerie to be his witch then fight everyone & anyone whenever she takes damage.
I’ll just let Yoshimo surprise you but when they all see eye to eye you can attack the enemy.

Lets see:
Haerdalis has the best possible armour class in the game so he’ll probably be your party tank.
Minsc is a ranger so you can have him dps (Mazzy is better) or stealth (Valygar is better).. i'd go with a dual wield dps setup because at least that way he will be more inclined to attack the enemy when he goes nuts.

Weapons;
Aerie has one attack but can’t hit the barn in front of her so CF solves one of her problems.
Anything you give Minsc will probably be used against you at some point.
IMO Off-hand = “+1 buckler” for the early Bard then “Scarlet Ninja-To +3” for the later levels... assumes tanking.

Edit @goblinsly1 ,
Any particular reason why your Haerdalis uses a shortbow instead of a longbow eg. “Elven Court Bow +3”?
Early long-swords = “Blade of Roses +3” with “Ras +2” for the extra summon.
Early Slings = The "Sling of Everard +5" from Joluv is the best in the game.

P.s.  IMO the extra abilities of shortswords and scimitars are often more important than the damage they do eg. “Albruil” (underdark) is only a +1 scimitar but it gives poison immunity... it’s situational of course.

Modifié par ussnorway, 08 juillet 2012 - 03:14 .

[Gate70]

As usual so many options.

Jaheira could use a thowing dagger while Aerie can use strength buffs and the sling of seeking. IMO it is the best sling for a high strength character because it adds a large damage bonus that easily offsets the +4/5 slings. Only beaten by throwing axes or something like the dwarven throwing hammer from Trademeet which seems to do crazy damage (I see 40-50 regular in my multiplayer runs so Haer'dalis with UAI might be an option for that).

Re another weapon for charname, having two bladed weapons means you will be a passenger against enemies requiring blunt damage. For a berserker/mage maybe 1 pip in mace or war hammer would be sensible. Early hammer - +1/4 available in de'Arnise keep hits as +4 so able to be used against most things that lesser weapons can't hit, same for improved mace of disruption.

edit, & firetooth crossbow is available early game too, a good choice for Minsc as it will hit pretty much anything. Odren will wait all game for you to come back to Watchers Keep (so long as you don't lose the wardstone and scroll).

Modifié par Gate70, 08 juillet 2012 - 08:58 .

[ScotGaymer]

Yes my personal opinion about Aerie and Jaeheira's personality is "inaccurate".

I am very sorry that my OPINION offends you Mr Spidey.

I can't even reply to that.

[goblinsly1]

Aerie will probably have sing and shield setup, but during timestops she might switch to 2 nasty effect but low damage weapons...remember, in time stop everything is automatic hit, with 2 weapons and improved haste she gets what, 3, 4 atacks per round ? If that weapon puts the enemy to sleep, it would mean after time stop few enemies sleep and her spells can be used for others. CF will probably be used by different chars when needed.
Haerdalis uses short bow cause there are better short bows then there are long bows and also Minsc will use long bows ( since he begins with 2 points in them ) for a long time until he gets any good crossbow. Haerdalis strikes me more as a shortbow guy, immy aswell.

I wont visit watchers keep until TOB, i am trying to decide whether to visit him before or after i deal with Yagashura. I dont want to go there just for items, i wanna do it in 1 piece.

Ok, 2 tiny questions. First. I start as berserker and dual to mage. When i regain my berserker abilities....lets say i have some spare prof points...can i still put 5 stars into single weapon prof just like warriors can ? For instance if i have 4 points in katanas and i am 13/18 berserker/mage, can i put the 5th star into it ?
And another thing....purifier +4 is awesome, i WANT it. But i read only lawful chars can get it, which is a big problem since i am berserker which cannot be lawfull. But then i read Simpsons guide ( he is a bg2 guide god ) and he mentioned that if your main char isnt lawful, just move someone that is lawful, like Aerie into your "leader" position and she will be able to get it ( or maybe just click on the pillar with her ? ). Will that be ok ? Will i be able to do that ???

Btw Gram sword of Grief is good against boss enemies. But i decided for going with short sword of mask instead ( 15% of pinning down the enemy ! ), i always go to sendei first and i will go to watchers keep before sendai. Btw how much is this level draining good ? Lets say enemy boss is level 25 or something. Even if i drain 5 levels from him, will that harm him at all ? He wont loss many hp, spells, attack, etc.. But still, i will go for the short sword of mask, period.

Main char will have problems with blade imune mobs yeah, thats why i was thinking:

http://playithardcor...gression_Charts

On the bottom of the page...this mean if i have 2 points in weapon prof, if i give another i get EXTRA 2 thaco and damage and half atack or does moving from 2 to 3 stars in weapon prof just mean everything is same as with 2 stars just extra 1 thaco ?

Cause if its the later one, i will divide points around and give 2 stars to each weapon. Otherwise i will max 2 weapons ( long sword and katana ) and 2 handed weapon and only then go to other weapons. Btw, if i have 2 points in katanas and i use 2 katanas and i also have 2 points in 2 weapon fighting....if i checked this correctly i gain more by putting 3rd star into katanas instead of puting 3rd star into 2 weapon fighting, right ?

[goblinsly1]

Nuuuuuuuuuuuu guys dont fight we have such a wonderfull topic here, please. Boo is sad. :/

[Mr Spidey]

@ FitScotGaymer
Are you playing that classic "opinions can't be wrong" card? Pfft. No, your opinion isn't wrong per se, but the details your opinion is based on are indeed questionable. And no, your opinion doesn't offend me at all. I was just correcting what seems to be persistent inaccuracies.

@ USS Norway

Weapons;
Aerie has one attack but can’t hit the barn in front of her so CF solves one of her problems.

Yes, CF gives +7 THAC0 from strength and +3 in itself, but any +3 weapon can do that for her, because she does not need the hammer to get 25 strength. And since she's not likely to be in combat all the time with her absolutely fantastic 1 APR and awesome health, casting DUHM does entirely as much good as wasting a belt of 21 strength and a pair of gloves of 18/00 strength to get her to 25 strength.

It's just not a very good deal, unless there's absolutely nobody who could put those items to better use. Even then, I'm not sure I wouldn't rather have a 21 strength belt than needing an off hand weapon to go beyond normal strength levels. There aren't all that many good belts in the game but there are a whole lot of good items to use in the off hand. Using a belt gives you flexibility. Using Crom Faeyr removes flexibility and forces you to choose between strength or whatever good abilities you could've gotten from your off hand weapon. And it's just not good enough to be a main hand weapon.

[Mr Spidey]

@ Goblinsky

Regarding proficiencies

Yes, once your fighter class is reactivated, you can pile on points as you could before. But points before that won't stack. Meaning that your four points in quarterstaffs from fighter levels won't merge with your 1 mage point. Any such points are lost.

As for what the points do, the table shows the total bonus, not each individual bonus. Yes, you relaly only get +1 to hit from the third point invested, -2 speed factor with the fourt point, and a further -2 speed factor and +1 damage with the fifth point. Going beyond two points is a waste unless you've modded that aspect of the game.

As far as two-weapon fighting is concerned, the first two points take away all penalties to your main hand weapon. This is good. The third point reduces your off hand THAC0 penalty from -4 to -2. This is less important due to how the game engine handles multiple attacks. In a normal round, you can have up to 5 attacks and if you're dual wielding then one attack will be with the off hand while the rest are with the main hand. Improved Haste simply plays active rounds at double speed for the hasted character, meaning two off hand attacks and the rest main hand.

What the above means is that under the best of circumstances you'll have 2 off hand attacks per round. For this reason, many tend to use weapons with good "equipped" effects and not worry about off hand weapon damage. It's up to you whether -2 THAC0 with those one or two off hand attacks is worth a third point in two-weapon fighting. Personally, unless we're talking about characters with low APR, I don't spend a third point.

Next, the Purifier.
Unfortunately, the Purifier can only be used by paladins and rogues with UAI. The only one in your party that could possibly use it is Hear'Dalis. But the "change party leader" trick may well work, unless the Fixpack crew managed to "fix" that "problem".

Edit: And regarding blade immune mobs, I don't think you need to worry too much. Beyond a few golems, just about anything is vulnerable to blades. But since you don't have any obvious flail-wielders, I'd invest two points in flails for FoA +3. It's good enough to justify it and once you've seen your Imp Hasted zerker-mage slow down whatever he's hitting, you'll forget that he's not looking all cool with two katanas. 

A level 9 berserker gets 7 points to play with. 2x long swords, 2x flails, 1x in katanas, 2 two-weapon fighting. Once you dual to mage, spend a point in quarterstaffs and one in two-handed weapons. As I recall, mages get a point per 5 levels, so at level 10 you can put a second point into katanas. 

If you decide to go zerker(13)-mage, then you can get 2x katanas at zerker level 12, then cross over at 13 and start putting points into staves and two-handers with your mage levels.

Modifié par Mr Spidey, 08 juillet 2012 - 03:07 .

[ussnorway]

Yes any LG character can grab the sword for your bard to use... so go get Mazzy for that bit.

"Short Sword of Mask" is my fav pc thief or fighter/ thief weapon but imo pointless in the party you will use... give Haerdalis "Defender of Easthhaven +3" if you want to spend or any old sword/ flail that comes along. Late game I like to go with "Foebane +5" for the extra health.

By the time Aerie gets around to casting 'Timestop's it's a safe bet that they will be immune to 'Sleep' but yes someone like Imoen can use 'Timestop' with 'Shapechange' to suck their brains for an easy ToB kill.