982 réponses à ce sujet

[Wayning_Star]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...



intact? no, restored, yes, how, reaper tech. oopseedaisy The plant was reaper controlled, Sheppard destroyed it's root system, freeing the Asari and settlers. I think it was the illusive man who started studying it for indoctrination capabilities, but everyone knows he was indoctrinated, so it was the reapers all along.

You're now making it up as you go along. BYE!

hmm hmmm, another troll victory for space magic I spose. If we can't win, just say bye in big letters/cry foul. lol

feel the raw power of my space magic, much stronger than your's.

[Heeden]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Then why squeeze the lemon? If it does not have significance then Shepard's death doesn't make sense. It would be for decoration only when nothing was used.

You squeeze the lemon to get the juice, you use the juice to enact Synthesis, the juice does not control people's minds but if you did not have the juice you could not make Synthesis work.

[RiouHotaru]

[quote]General User wrote...
Synthesis filled in that gap.[/quote]Bollocks.  Human beings don't have a full understanding of the Great Mysteries and machines have even less.  How would force fusing the those two forms of life fill any sort of gap?
[/quote]

Who knows, that's part of the consequence of Synthesis, it's a HUGE unknown.

[Heeden]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

He still had a Brain like an inactive hard drive, it wasn't Reaper Goo. There is no evidence to suggest that there is anything left of the consciousnesses of those used to create the Reapers.

He had a brain like a broken RAM stick - difficult to get working and even if you repair it the data will have been wiped (unless you employ suitably-advanced-science).

[Sarevok Synder]

Heeden wrote...


Synthetics can be created to fulfill a purpose, pre-Synthesis they can no more be blamed for fulfilling this purpose than you can blame fire for burning.

I'm not, I regretfully Destroyed them, but if I were to keep them around through Synthesis it would be out or respect for the billions of beings conjoined within them, to give them a chance to take on a new role in the galaxy and perhaps to meet them in the info-scape (or IRL if they develop avatars).

No, you're trying to absolve it from personal responsibility. It made its choices due to having free will, it now must pay for those choices.

Those trillions of dead species memories are spat on by keeping them around. They themselves are long gone. If you can't see what's wrong with keeping them around, well I can't help you. We are just polar opposites.

Wayning_Star wrote...


hmm hmmm, another troll victory for space magic I spose. If we can't win, just say bye in big letters/cry foul. lol

feel the raw power of my space magic, much stronger than your's.

The Reapers never controlled the Thorian, that's not space magic, that's you making it up as you go along. Yes, you are indeed a troll.

Modifié par Sarevok Synder, 05 juillet 2012 - 09:30 .

[Krunjar]

Just a quick how do to all the anti-synthesis crowd.

Who claim to be against forcing youre own views on people.

Yet can't stop bashing people for liking a different ending to a game.

Oh .. delicious delicious irony.

[Sarevok Synder]

Heeden wrote...



He had a brain like a broken RAM stick - difficult to get working and even if you repair it the data will have been wiped (unless you employ suitably-advanced-science).

Take a hammer to that broken HARDDRIVE, (a brain stores information for long periods of time, ram doesn't), smash it to a billion pieces and you may be close to Reaper Goo, now try to get it back conscious again.

[General User]

RiouHotaru wrote...

General User wrote...
Bollocks.  Human beings don't have a full understanding of the Great Mysteries and machines have even less.

How would force fusing the those two forms of life fill any sort of gap?

Who knows, that's part of the consequence of Synthesis, it's a HUGE unknown.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I daresay that's exemplary of the overarching problem with Synthesis: when you ask a few questions/put a little thought into it/shine a light on it, it falls to pieces.  If that's good enough for you then, as they say in Mexico, via con Dios.  But I'm looking for something a little more substantial.

Modifié par General User, 05 juillet 2012 - 03:42 .

[Sarevok Synder]

Krunjar wrote...

Just a quick how do to all the anti-synthesis crowd.

Who claim to be against forcing youre own views on people.

Yet can't stop bashing people for liking a different ending to a game.

Oh .. delicious delicious irony.

Funny, I haven't hit any button which forces them to agree with me.

[Heeden]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

No, you're trying to absolve it from personal responsibility. It made it choices due to having free will, it now must pay for those choices.

Synthetics are beings created with a function, free-will no more allows them to break away from that function than it will allow a human to disobey the laws of gravity. They may be free to choose but their options are limited.

Those trillions of dead species memories are spat on by keeping them around. They themselves are long gone. If you can't see what's wrong with keeping them around, well I can't help you. We are just polar opposites.

Indeed, I believe we should pay great consideration to the sanctity of sentients if we're going to consider eliminating them, you believe RAWR let's blow up the space monsters.

[Sarevok Synder]

Wayning_Star wrote...




hmm hmmm, another troll victory for space magic I spose. If we can't win, just say bye in big letters/cry foul. lol

feel the raw power of my space magic, much stronger than your's.

You just made up a plot which isn't in the game and had nothing to do with what I was saying. Yes, yoy are indeed a troll.

[RiouHotaru]

General User wrote...
Not to put too fine a point on it, but I daresay that's exemplary of the overarching problem with Synthesis: when you ask a few questions/put a little thought into it/shine a light on it, it falls to pieces.  If that's good enough for you then, as they say in Mexico, via con Dios.  But I'm looking for something a little more substantial.

Actually, it doesn't fall to pieces at all.  It just can't answer your questions.  It's like any other "ascend to a higher level" style of story-ending, those generally raises a bunch of questions whose answers amount to a shrug because there's never enough information.  It's why such endings are usually so final.

[Wayning_Star]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Heeden wrote...


Synthetics can be created to fulfill a purpose, pre-Synthesis they can no more be blamed for fulfilling this purpose than you can blame fire for burning.

I'm not, I regretfully Destroyed them, but if I were to keep them around through Synthesis it would be out or respect for the billions of beings conjoined within them, to give them a chance to take on a new role in the galaxy and perhaps to meet them in the info-scape (or IRL if they develop avatars).

No, you're trying to absolve it from personal responsibility. It made it choices due to having free will, it now must pay for those choices.

Those trillions of dead species memories are spat on by keeping them around. They themselves are long gone. If you can't see what's wrong with keeping them around, well I can't help you. We are just polar opposites.

in cash or credits card? Sentient/individually intelligent life forms do not "keep" them around, reapers do that via coded programming. You are now referring reapers as persons? Talk about personal spaced magic..sheesh.

[Heeden]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Take a hammer to that broken HARDDRIVE, (a brain stores information for long periods of time, ram doesn't), smash it to a billion pieces and you may be close to Reaper Goo, now try to get it back conscious again.

When "unplugged" (read: dead) a brain rapidly decays. A hard-drive is designed as a permanent storage device, a brain breaks down after death. It takes 3 minutes before brain damage becomes apparent, how long did it take Liara to recover Shepards body?

[Sarevok Synder]

Heeden wrote...


Synthetics are beings created with a function, free-will no more allows them to break away from that function than it will allow a human to disobey the laws of gravity. They may be free to choose but their options are limited.


Indeed, I believe we should pay great consideration to the sanctity of sentients if we're going to consider eliminating them, you believe RAWR let's blow up the space monsters.

Of course it does, free will allows it to do whatever it wants. It's not free will otherwise. Damn! Personal responsibility cannot be shirked. Much as I know you'd like too.


Nope, they're already dead.

Wayning_Star wrote...

in cash or credits card? Sentient/individually intelligent life forms do not "keep" them around, reapers do that via coded programming. You are now referring reapers as persons? Talk about personal spaced magic..sheesh.

That isn't what I said, starwmans will get you nowhere. You have no evidence that's how they preserve memories either.  And nowhere did I refer to them as persons.

Modifié par Sarevok Synder, 05 juillet 2012 - 04:29 .

[Pacifien]

Spartas Husky wrote...

Pacifien wrote...
Which is totally why they should have blown up the mass relays and then researched their own technology, but that's my pro-Destroy argument.

.... little bit over the top. Destroying relays means galaxy wide dark ages. That did not bode well number wise in our planet after the roman empire fell. I dont think it will be any less traumatic in a galaxy as a whole.

That's how far I'm willing to go, man.

On the flip side, I will alter an entire galaxy to achieve technological singularity. I am a red panda on the edge. I go to extremes. It is all or nothing because my head canon is best canon.

I am purposely being silly.

But I am also telling the truth, so be grateful I am not a writer for BioWare... or am I?

[Heeden]

General User wrote...

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I daresay that's exemplary of the overarching problem with Synthesis: when you ask a few questions/put a little thought into it/shine a light on it, it falls to pieces.  If that's good enough for you then, as they say in Mexico, via con Dios.  But I'm looking for something a little more substantial.

The holes in Synthesis are nothing compared to the problems with Eezo, as soon as I found out how FTL in ME1 "worked" I realised it would mostly be techno-babble; I was actually surprised to see some decent hard sci-fi concepts introduced (micro-manufactories instead of replicators for example) but ME is still incredibly soft so far as science goes.

[AngryFrozenWater]

Heeden wrote...

Synthetics can be created to fulfill a purpose, pre-Synthesis they can no more be blamed for fulfilling this purpose than you can blame fire for burning.

You are confused by VIs. Those are purpose build.

No. An AI is an AI. EDI worked fine. The geth worked fine. Legion worked fine. All were perfectly able to reason. And the geth improved after they uploaded reaper code. The reapers' minds are working just fine as well. Sort of. If you forget their violent nature.

[Sarevok Synder]

Heeden wrote...


When "unplugged" (read: dead) a brain rapidly decays. A hard-drive is designed as a permanent storage device, a brain breaks down after death. It takes 3 minutes before brain damage becomes apparent, how long did it take Liara to recover Shepards body?

They explained how it was preserved. Still a much better chance than Reaper Goo, the brain and as a result personality are most definitely gone in that scenario.

[General User]

RiouHotaru wrote...

General User wrote...
Not to put too fine a point on it, but I daresay that's exemplary of the overarching problem with Synthesis: when you ask a few questions/put a little thought into it/shine a light on it, it falls to pieces.  If that's good enough for you then, as they say in Mexico, via con Dios.  But I'm looking for something a little more substantial.

Actually, it doesn't fall to pieces at all.  It just can't answer your questions.  It's like any other "ascend to a higher level" style of story-ending, those generally raises a bunch of questions whose answers amount to a shrug because there's never enough information.  It's why such endings are usually so final.

If other works have made the same mistakes that Mass Effect made, that's not something I'm prepared to address. 

However, if you can recommend any work where such themes are explored in a competent and thoughtful fashion, I'd be grateful.

Modifié par General User, 05 juillet 2012 - 03:58 .

[Krunjar]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Krunjar wrote...

Just a quick how do to all the anti-synthesis crowd.

Who claim to be against forcing youre own views on people.

Yet can't stop bashing people for liking a different ending to a game.

Oh .. delicious delicious irony.

Funny, I haven't hit any button which forces them to agree with me.

Mereley caring about what some stranger thinks enough to insult him for even liking something is already against what you claim to stand for. You are trying to force youre views on others. Anti-synthesists invade every thread that looks like it might be pro synthesis and shut it down with an attack that consists of trolling/flaming and posting mocking pictures. Wether YOU personally do it or not it happens. Let the homoginisation begin! If you don't choose destroy youre indoctrinated! ... please. Don't bother replying. Cos you  won't get anything  more out of me.

Modifié par Krunjar, 05 juillet 2012 - 03:56 .

[Heeden]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Of course it does, free will allows it to do whatever it wants. It's not free will otherwise. Damn! Personal responsibility cannot be shirked. Much as I know you'd like too.

You're falling from a plane, does free-will allow you to not hit the ground? No, because you are bound by certain physical laws that your body must obey. Beyond that you have several systems, such as circulatory and flinch mechanisms, that operate without any reference to free-will. Your subconscious can cause you to act in certain ways without it necessarily being a matter of you exercising choice and finally there is the determinist view that free-will doesn't exist anyway.

Nope, they're already dead.

Citation needed.

[Sarevok Synder]

Wayning_Star wrote...


in cash or credits card? Sentient/individually intelligent life forms do not "keep" them around, reapers do that via coded programming. You are now referring reapers as persons? Talk about personal spaced magic..sheesh.

And how does this coded programming survive the brain being turned to goo?

I didn't refer to them as people, don't know what you're reading.

[Heeden]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Heeden wrote...

Synthetics can be created to fulfill a purpose, pre-Synthesis they can no more be blamed for fulfilling this purpose than you can blame fire for burning.

You are confused by VIs. Those are purpose build.

No. An AI is an AI. EDI worked fine. The geth worked fine. Legion worked fine. All were perfectly able to reason. And the geth improved after they uploaded reaper code. The reapers' minds are working just fine as well. Sort of. If you forget their violent nature.

EDI was restricted in what she could do until she was unshackled. The Geth continued to tend Rannoch even though they had no intention to live there and weren't sure why they maintained a presence on the planet.

[Sarevok Synder]

Heeden wrote...



You're falling from a plane, does free-will allow you to not hit the ground? No, because you are bound by certain physical laws that your body must obey. Beyond that you have several systems, such as circulatory and flinch mechanisms, that operate without any reference to free-will. Your subconscious can cause you to act in certain ways without it necessarily being a matter of you exercising choice and finally there is the determinist view that free-will doesn't exist anyway.

Citation needed.

Choices are not phyical laws, they are abstract. There was no gun held to Staridiots head.


Them being dead is an axiom, unless you can provide evidence they aren't?