Just read this over on the Rainbow moon board.
The thing is though, are we really in a day and age in which video games with extreme lengths of gameplay are actually seen as flawed for that reason? I just find it kind of ridiculous that Colin seemed to point out the 100+ hours of gameplay as a possible negative. Has the speed of life really gotten to the point where people are like, "Man, I really wish this RPG was like 6 hours long
The game scored an 8 which is really good for that type of game I guess. But they marked it down for being too long.
How long should DA3 be ? 100+ or 6 hours+ ? Or somewhere in the middle.
Roleplaying games are too long according to IGN reviewer.
Débuté par
AkiKishi
, juil. 04 2012 10:28
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#2
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 11:08
Wulfram
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I expect 20 hours + from my CRPGs.
Though I wouldn't mind the game being shorter if what was cut was the filler. Dump the "exploration", the meaningless fetch quests and the pointless bandit attacks.
I'm also prepared to accept a shorter game in return for more reactive content and plot freedom.
Though I wouldn't mind the game being shorter if what was cut was the filler. Dump the "exploration", the meaningless fetch quests and the pointless bandit attacks.
I'm also prepared to accept a shorter game in return for more reactive content and plot freedom.
#3
Guest_sjpelkessjpeler_*
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 11:12
Guest_sjpelkessjpeler_*
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I like games with longer length. But that length in time needs to be filled with nice diverse gameplay overall.
Long gameplay that is filled with repetitive fetch quests like were mostly done in DA2 is not the way to expend the duration of the game.
In terms of gaming hours; with dlc it took me about 50 hours to finish DA2. I did all quests available (how tedious some of them even were) and think that that amount is to my liking for a game like DA.
100+ hours like you say Bob work for games like TES, but not for a game like DA imo.
Long gameplay that is filled with repetitive fetch quests like were mostly done in DA2 is not the way to expend the duration of the game.
In terms of gaming hours; with dlc it took me about 50 hours to finish DA2. I did all quests available (how tedious some of them even were) and think that that amount is to my liking for a game like DA.
100+ hours like you say Bob work for games like TES, but not for a game like DA imo.
#4
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 11:15
FieryDove
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I prefer 30+. I love long RPG's. These short things...no time to get to know your companions/other npc's much less flesh out your PC...imho
#5
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 11:19
Jerrybnsn
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It's hard holding up your tablet or iphone and playing an rpg at the same time. I finished DA2 within 20+ hours including all sidequests. To me an well paced out rpg should be no less than 80 hours.
#6
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 12:03
Pzykozis
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I'd say it depends, there's games like Alpha Protocol which are short but do really interesting branching which is more enjoyable than simply more comnat, and then there's Skyrim which I've got nearly 300 hours in and I've not even done everything. At the same time you have DA:O which has a pretty wide variable in game time but is fairly lengthy, but it has far too much padding that doesn't really add anything to the game.
A game is only as long really as it feels, for me TW2 is too short because I just want more, even though its pretty lengthy in and of itself though wanting more is never really a bad thing unless you've been undersold, on the other hand you have the Fade and some sections of the Deep Roads which were far too long.
I know that there are people who do dislike long games though, mostly because they don't really have the time to devote to a single game and if a game is so long it means by the time they've finished it they've already forgotten the beginning and whatever is going on, so yeah I guess we have reached a place where the speed of life kinda necessitates shorter games for certain people
A game is only as long really as it feels, for me TW2 is too short because I just want more, even though its pretty lengthy in and of itself though wanting more is never really a bad thing unless you've been undersold, on the other hand you have the Fade and some sections of the Deep Roads which were far too long.
I know that there are people who do dislike long games though, mostly because they don't really have the time to devote to a single game and if a game is so long it means by the time they've finished it they've already forgotten the beginning and whatever is going on, so yeah I guess we have reached a place where the speed of life kinda necessitates shorter games for certain people
#7
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 12:51
cJohnOne
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100 hours sounds perfect to me. Wasn't DAO over that? I got 82 hours out of DA2.
Modifié par cJohnOne, 04 juillet 2012 - 01:07 .
#8
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 01:07
Arthur Cousland
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I like long rpgs, and I'm a fan of exploration. One of many reasons that I love Skyrim is that I can play adventurer and always have something to see or do. A 20 hour rpg is an expansion, not a full game.
Even after playing a 90+ hour playthrough of Origins, 30 hours of Awakening, Golems of Amgarrak and Witch Hunt, I still wanted my Warden's journey to continue. When I'm playing a good rpg, I never want it to end.
Even after playing a 90+ hour playthrough of Origins, 30 hours of Awakening, Golems of Amgarrak and Witch Hunt, I still wanted my Warden's journey to continue. When I'm playing a good rpg, I never want it to end.
#9
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 01:15
xXxKatxXx
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Arthur Cousland wrote...
I like long rpgs, and I'm a fan of exploration. One of many reasons that I love Skyrim is that I can play adventurer and always have something to see or do. A 20 hour rpg is an expansion, not a full game.
Even after playing a 90+ hour playthrough of Origins, 30 hours of Awakening, Golems of Amgarrak and Witch Hunt, I still wanted my Warden's journey to continue. When I'm playing a good rpg, I never want it to end.
#10
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 01:19
sickpixie
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Long games are only long because of repetition. I don't understand why so many people believe RPGs can sustain 50-100+ hours of interesting content when other genres become tired after about a dozen.
#11
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 01:39
Jerrybnsn
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sickpixie wrote...
Long games are only long because of repetition. I don't understand why so many people believe RPGs can sustain 50-100+ hours of interesting content when other genres become tired after about a dozen.
I never thought of Origins as repetitious. I spent over 80 hours I my first play through with that game. Now I can play it all in about 40 some hours.
#12
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 01:51
wsandista
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Who cares what IGN thinks? They probably rated it as a negative because they weren't paid.
#13
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:04
ItsTheTruth
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Exactly.wsandista wrote...
Who cares what IGN thinks? They probably rated it as a negative because they weren't paid.
As far as RPGs go, if the game is great, the longer the better (unless the story becomes repetitive or stupid because of that length). If the game sucks like DA2, 2 hours running in circles in identical caves is too long.
#14
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:37
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IGN, yeah.
That's from their review of Dragon Age 2.Every modification to the gameplay and structure of Dragon Age II is a clear improvement over the previous game. The combat is more responsive and bloody, you don’t need to fight the inventory system anymore, and conversations are more engaging thanks to the adapted Mass Effect wheel. There are downsides though; the semi-linear story and repetitive environments have a negative effect on what is otherwise a great role-playing game. Despite these complaints, Dragon Age II is a game I’m eager to replay.
#15
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:46
Cyberarmy
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ItsTheTruth wrote...
Exactly.wsandista wrote...
Who cares what IGN thinks? They probably rated it as a negative because they weren't paid.
As far as RPGs go, if the game is great, the longer the better (unless the story becomes repetitive or stupid because of that length). If the game sucks like DA2, 2 hours running in circles in identical caves is too long.
Hear hear.
#16
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:48
ashwind
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For me, it all depends on the story, pacing and most importantly the combat.
As mentioned by others, Games like TES that can easily span for 200+ to 300 hours (I think I spend at least 100+hours decorating my house alone in Oblivion and hey it is fun for me - especially when NPC walked in to mu house when I am in the middle of arranging things and gave me a quest) is not necessarily fun all the way, it is fun when you are building your character and collecting equipment but once that is done, everything is pretty flat.
Games like TW2 on the other hand is short 20-30 hours but it requires at least 2 play-through to experience everything hence real play time is about to 50 hours. I actually suggested before that DAO should have each origin deal with only one factions so that different play-through with different origin would present more diversity.
So for me, 50~60 hours would be enough for a good RPG experience if story, pacing and COMBAT is done well.
p/s: Since I like to stand around admiring the environments and reading books/codex... usually a 30 hours game would take 50 hours for me.
As mentioned by others, Games like TES that can easily span for 200+ to 300 hours (I think I spend at least 100+hours decorating my house alone in Oblivion and hey it is fun for me - especially when NPC walked in to mu house when I am in the middle of arranging things and gave me a quest) is not necessarily fun all the way, it is fun when you are building your character and collecting equipment but once that is done, everything is pretty flat.
Games like TW2 on the other hand is short 20-30 hours but it requires at least 2 play-through to experience everything hence real play time is about to 50 hours. I actually suggested before that DAO should have each origin deal with only one factions so that different play-through with different origin would present more diversity.
So for me, 50~60 hours would be enough for a good RPG experience if story, pacing and COMBAT is done well.
p/s: Since I like to stand around admiring the environments and reading books/codex... usually a 30 hours game would take 50 hours for me.
Modifié par ashwind, 04 juillet 2012 - 02:49 .
#17
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:52
RinpocheSchnozberry
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If an RPG has 100+ hours of dialogue, story, cinematics, and interesting, meaningful fights... that game is not too long.
If, like DAO/NWN/BG/KOTOR/Twitcher, a 60 hour game has 20 hours of dialogue, story, cinematics, 10 hours of interesting, meaningful fights, and 30 hours of useless, pointelss, stupid fights, then that 60 hour game is 30 hours too long. The useless fights need to come out to make it a great game. DAO is the only one that gets a free pass, but that free pass is printed with liquid nostalgia.
A game like DA2, where all the boring old tropes have been chopped back, is what is best for the future and for modern gamers with their Android market games and their PSPs and their dozen monthly new releases. DA2 had some missteps, yes, but the balance of game to work was better than it's ever been and it's only going to get better. DA2's is the formula that will get me a 30-40 hour RPG packed full of awesome every 2-3 years, rather than a 60 hour game/snoozefest every 5 years.
Bring on the games, baby! WOOOO!
If, like DAO/NWN/BG/KOTOR/Twitcher, a 60 hour game has 20 hours of dialogue, story, cinematics, 10 hours of interesting, meaningful fights, and 30 hours of useless, pointelss, stupid fights, then that 60 hour game is 30 hours too long. The useless fights need to come out to make it a great game. DAO is the only one that gets a free pass, but that free pass is printed with liquid nostalgia.
A game like DA2, where all the boring old tropes have been chopped back, is what is best for the future and for modern gamers with their Android market games and their PSPs and their dozen monthly new releases. DA2 had some missteps, yes, but the balance of game to work was better than it's ever been and it's only going to get better. DA2's is the formula that will get me a 30-40 hour RPG packed full of awesome every 2-3 years, rather than a 60 hour game/snoozefest every 5 years.
Bring on the games, baby! WOOOO!
Modifié par RinpocheSchnozberry, 04 juillet 2012 - 02:52 .
#18
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 02:53
Fast Jimmy
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OP, do you mind linking the original article?
I don't mind a 20-30 hour RPG... provided I can replay it and feel like it is genuinely a new experience.
Of course, what is rated as a 20-30 hour RPG usually takes me around 50 hours to complete, as I am a compulsive completionist. Plus, if there is new content like what we saw in Origins, with different Origin stories that have influence on certain dialogue, multiple choices throughout the game and different endings, then sign me up. Although, I think Origins was touted as a 50-60 hour RPG, so it was pretty much one of the most awesome games created in over a decade, in the opinion of me and many, many others.
I'd take replayabilty (TRUE replayabilty, not the 'I can rivalmance the same person I romanced!' nonsense) over a longer game most days. So if I can get the whole package, like with Origins, then that sounds fantastic. If not, give me replay over more content.
I don't mind a 20-30 hour RPG... provided I can replay it and feel like it is genuinely a new experience.
Of course, what is rated as a 20-30 hour RPG usually takes me around 50 hours to complete, as I am a compulsive completionist. Plus, if there is new content like what we saw in Origins, with different Origin stories that have influence on certain dialogue, multiple choices throughout the game and different endings, then sign me up. Although, I think Origins was touted as a 50-60 hour RPG, so it was pretty much one of the most awesome games created in over a decade, in the opinion of me and many, many others.
I'd take replayabilty (TRUE replayabilty, not the 'I can rivalmance the same person I romanced!' nonsense) over a longer game most days. So if I can get the whole package, like with Origins, then that sounds fantastic. If not, give me replay over more content.
#19
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 03:50
Sir JK
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Long enough. No more, no less. I don't care about exactly how many hours it was as long as I can enjoy every minute of them.
#20
Guest_PurebredCorn_*
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 04:24
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40 hours of good story telling and interesting characters with a decent variety of choices to make that are contained within a particular playthrough suits me just fine. Throw in some decent side quests and fights and I'll be a happy camper. That is the recipe for multiple playthroughs for me. But I like creating different characters with different personalities and preferences instead of just one character that goes through the game one time. So having a really long game that has been padded with random fights and repetitive side quests would most likely get dull for me.
In fact I never really keep track of the number of hours I spend playing a game. It's more about how entertained I was while playing the game that is the most important to me, not whether or not I spent 60+ hours in the game.
In fact I never really keep track of the number of hours I spend playing a game. It's more about how entertained I was while playing the game that is the most important to me, not whether or not I spent 60+ hours in the game.
Modifié par PurebredCorn, 04 juillet 2012 - 04:46 .
#21
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 04:36
Eternal Phoenix
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You can't have ignorant without IGN!
#22
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 04:47
ScotGaymer
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Oh shock horror. Colin MoDouchebag spewing complete bollocks again.
Sorry for being rude but that guy is just a complete pillock. There's no way about it. He heads up the contingent at IGN that thinks Fox News is the best thing since sliced bread since they keep copying Fox News in every concievable way.
You simply can not take a thing this guy takes seriously, ESPECIALLY about RPGs.
He clearly hates RPGs.
Oh SAYS differently, but read back on his reviews regarding RPGs in comparison to his reviews and editorials about FPS games and Action Adventure games. You can see a clear anti-RPG bent to everything he says and does.
So of course given that he doesn't seem to actually like RPGs his opinion is going to be negative about them; but given that I reckon his "opinion" is completely irrelevant much like IGN itself is becoming increasingly irrelevant to the gaming community these days.
After IGN's persistent and continuing hostility towards Gamers in general and the HTL/Retake movement in particular in relation to the Endings bruhaha (and their subsequent hostility to Bioware for agreeing to make the EC) I don't think there is a single person on the BSN that doesn't think that IGN are just IGNorant and should be IGNored.
Don't link to them. Or mention them.
Sorry for being rude but that guy is just a complete pillock. There's no way about it. He heads up the contingent at IGN that thinks Fox News is the best thing since sliced bread since they keep copying Fox News in every concievable way.
You simply can not take a thing this guy takes seriously, ESPECIALLY about RPGs.
He clearly hates RPGs.
Oh SAYS differently, but read back on his reviews regarding RPGs in comparison to his reviews and editorials about FPS games and Action Adventure games. You can see a clear anti-RPG bent to everything he says and does.
So of course given that he doesn't seem to actually like RPGs his opinion is going to be negative about them; but given that I reckon his "opinion" is completely irrelevant much like IGN itself is becoming increasingly irrelevant to the gaming community these days.
After IGN's persistent and continuing hostility towards Gamers in general and the HTL/Retake movement in particular in relation to the Endings bruhaha (and their subsequent hostility to Bioware for agreeing to make the EC) I don't think there is a single person on the BSN that doesn't think that IGN are just IGNorant and should be IGNored.
Don't link to them. Or mention them.
#23
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 05:20
Jerrybnsn
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Cultist wrote...
IGN, yeah.That's from their review of Dragon Age 2.Every modification to the gameplay and structure of Dragon Age II is a clear improvement over the previous game. The combat is more responsive and bloody, you don’t need to fight the inventory system anymore, and conversations are more engaging thanks to the adapted Mass Effect wheel. There are downsides though; the semi-linear story and repetitive environments have a negative effect on what is otherwise a great role-playing game. Despite these complaints, Dragon Age II is a game I’m eager to replay.
Yeah....I don't read game reviews anymore. All the games are great and the best ever per them. I actually use the user metacritic for those that actually playgames. And no, not the ones who post just on one game to flame all over it, but the ones who have been posting for the last five or six years, and have listed which games they prefer so I can compare their taste.
#24
Guest_Nizaris1_*
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 05:23
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I like the game is long because of missions, stories, quests...i will be bored and raged if it is long because of fighting waves of enemies that spawned out of nowhere and everywhere we go got road blocked by bandits or monsters
I play Oblivion, it is annoying i can't travel safely on the road, there i will meet wolves, trolls, bandits, minotaur and whatever else...always means there will always be...it is tiresome
in DA2...the enemies are always the same...spawning -->spiders, bandits with different names, shades, abominations, rage demons, undeads...everywhere i see these...it becomes boring and tiresome
I play Oblivion, it is annoying i can't travel safely on the road, there i will meet wolves, trolls, bandits, minotaur and whatever else...always means there will always be...it is tiresome
in DA2...the enemies are always the same...spawning -->spiders, bandits with different names, shades, abominations, rage demons, undeads...everywhere i see these...it becomes boring and tiresome
#25
Posté 04 juillet 2012 - 05:25
Melca36
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I never read IGN
I will also never take any IGN review serious since one of their lackeys was cast in ME3. Can we save favortism/cronyism?
<_<
As for rpgs.... For $60 I am not interested in a 20 hour game. And the people who seek that sort of game should NOT even be playing these games to begin with
I want at least 50 hours in a game. My first playthrough in Origins was 90 hours....but by the time I knew how to get around, it went down to 52 hours.
I do think some gamers have gotten lazier over the years and want everything handed to them. I think its why we got a dumbed down Deeproads (Legacy's was better) and Fade.
I will also never take any IGN review serious since one of their lackeys was cast in ME3. Can we save favortism/cronyism?
<_<As for rpgs.... For $60 I am not interested in a 20 hour game. And the people who seek that sort of game should NOT even be playing these games to begin with
I want at least 50 hours in a game. My first playthrough in Origins was 90 hours....but by the time I knew how to get around, it went down to 52 hours.
I do think some gamers have gotten lazier over the years and want everything handed to them. I think its why we got a dumbed down Deeproads (Legacy's was better) and Fade.
