338 réponses à ce sujet

[-Skorpious-]

If Bioware didn't explain the teleporting squad plothole more people would have been pissed. Yes, the execution was sloppy (why couldn't Cortez pick them up instead?), but it was better than refusing to address the issue.

Oh, and Shepard forcing his squadmates to limp towards the beam wouldn't have helped anyone either.

[ElementL09]

I know right, its ridiculous.

Are the Reapers so cocky that they would allow there greatest enemy of this cycle to say good bye to his squad before making a final dash towards the beam that conveniantly leads to the citadel?

[Versus Omnibus]

Isichar wrote...

The original got it right, everyone should have charged the beam without stopping. But since they screwed up the squadmates continuity with that final scene showing your ground crew in the normandy bioware forced themselves into a corner in which this was the only way out.

And yes you MUST throw everything you have at the plan to get 1 person through the beam, because thats the only way to end the war. You went into this fight knowing there would be heavy losses and if it is not stopped then you just lose period.

Even in the original they stopped. Coats can be heard on the radio telling what little of Hammer to full back into the buildings because Harbinger was killing everyone. The plan was failing and if it had continued there would be nobody left.

By stopping that plan, saving those we could, and falling back we still had a chance the next time around.

[TaradosGon]

Isichar wrote...

You stop in the middle of this charge to let people run away.

You know Shepard will reach the beam regardless so you can say it does not matter. But realistically this would just not happen. Why would Shepard call an evac at all considering the situation? Its a last ditch attempt to save the galaxy under terrible odds.

Because Shepard is as irrationally attached to his LI as fans seem to be?

But really, I agree. The whole evacuation was just Point A showing how the crew ultimately ended up at Point B (the jungle planet).

Rather than having the scenes serve the story, they altered the story to serve the scenes. And created Point A to get to Point B, when they should have just threw away Point B, making Point A unnecessary.

They could have kept the Jungle Planet scene by simply making it so that your two squad mates that go with you to the Conduit will not be shown stepping off the Normandy (but why keep it at all? It's pointless, nothing of significance happens there).

They could have just had the squad pull out with the rest of the retreating troops when they think Shepard is dead. They didn't need Shepard to interrupt the Normandy mid-space battle for an evacuation of two freakin' people that in the grand sceme of things are unimportant. Shepard is jeopardizing the mission with his personal feelings.

Modifié par TaradosGon, 04 juillet 2012 - 07:04 .

[BrookerT]

Hvlukas wrote...

BrookerT wrote...

Why didn't Saren Kill Shepard when he held him by the neck? Cool emotional scenes don't have to be logical to be good

When BrookerT posted this, there really wasn't much reason to continue the thread. 

But yet it continues

[Isichar]

Im sorry but you guys need to look at the facts.

Fact: If 1 person makes it to the beam, the reapers are done. If no one makes it to the beam then we lose. End of story. If that does not matter to you then why bother fighting the war to begin with?

I don't care whether or not Harby would be interested in shooting down Normandy, I care that your 10 seconds away from the end of the war and you stop well everyone is getting slaughtered so you can focus on your crew.

If you want the story to reach so far in order to save the ground crew and have them appear on the final scene with the Normandy then OK. I'm not upset my ground crew made it out alive, in fact I'm not upset at all. Even if it is not very logical to me it still answers the question as to why it happened.

[Fingertrip]

Who cares, there's more obvious flaws all over the map, you're just being nitpicky and being whiny.

[Versus Omnibus]

BrookerT wrote...

Hvlukas wrote...

BrookerT wrote...

Why didn't Saren Kill Shepard when he held him by the neck? Cool emotional scenes don't have to be logical to be good

When BrookerT posted this, there really wasn't much reason to continue the thread. 

But yet it continues

And it will until Bioware somehow messes up Dragon Age 3.

[BrookerT]

Versus Omnibus wrote...

BrookerT wrote...

Hvlukas wrote...

BrookerT wrote...

Why didn't Saren Kill Shepard when he held him by the neck? Cool emotional scenes don't have to be logical to be good

When BrookerT posted this, there really wasn't much reason to continue the thread. 

But yet it continues

And it will until Bioware somehow messes up Dragon Age 3.

At least make it "if" they somehow mess up, try to be sporting

[Sniktchtherat]

Actually, the major problem with the evac is:

THE SR2 IS NOT LANDING-CAPABLE. Per EDI in Mass Effect 2, the SR2 is nearly twice the mass of the SR1, and is no longer capable of atmospheric maneuver. Never retconned, never handwaved, just overriden by the Will Of Casey.

Modifié par Sniktchtherat, 04 juillet 2012 - 07:12 .

[KingJason13]

Sniktchtherat wrote...

Actually, the major problem with the evac is:

THE SR2 IS NOT LANDING-CAPABLE. Per EDI in Mass Effect 2, the SR2 is nearly twice the mass of the SR1, and is no longer capable of atmospheric maneuver. Thus the need for shuttles. Notice that every other time in ME2 or 3 that there's a "Normandy in close support" scene, it's somewhere in space: Collector ship, derelict Reaper, Collector base.

^Truth.

[Versus Omnibus]

Isichar wrote...

Im sorry but you guys need to look at the facts.

Fact: If 1 person makes it to the beam, the reapers are done. If no one makes it to the beam then we lose. End of story. 

And you think telling everyone to keep jumping into the jaws of death, which failed and is still failing, until nobody is left is a good idea? Why not just tell the fleet to stand there and let the Reapers shoot them down?

[Favourite store on the CitadeI]

It's allowed because BioWare allows it

[KingJason13]

Fingertrip wrote...

Who cares, there's more obvious flaws all over the map, you're just being nitpicky and being whiny.

Being nitpicky over the game > being nitpicky over a game forum thread about the game

[XFeroxX]

iAFKinMassEffect3 wrote...

shepdog77 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

This isn't as unrealistic as some make it out to be.

Even during the amphibious assaults on places like Normandy, Tarawa, or Iwo Jima during the Second World War, there were landing craft and amtracs evacuating the more seriously wounded while the beach head was still very much contested and under fire. So the evac itself isn't a problem.

The difference of course is that these landing craft and amtracs were usually under fire as well, unlike the Normandy. But there are circumstances in the game to explain why the Normandy does not come under fire. Harbinger was probably preoccupied with the large numbers of dismounted infantry, gunships, and tanks that were close to the beam. As the Citadel was not garrisoned with Reaper troops, any one of these people could have potentially foiled the Reapers plans. The Normandy on the hand, was simply evacuating wounded and not directly aiding the push for the beam. It was simply not a priority target at that time. As noted by one of the posters above me, Harbinger is still firing during that sequence. You can hear it in the background. He just isn't firing at the Normandy.

Think of it as a gamer: Lets say you are playing as Harbinger during that sequence, and you've got all these troops and tanks and gunships rushing the beam. If even one makes it to the beam you lose the game. They are coming at the beam almost faster than you can fire, and you've almost got too many targets to take care of. You are getting twitchy and have to button mash to just to get them all. In the middle of that are you going to run the risk of shifting your fire from them to the Normandy in the background, which is playing no role in the beam rush?

A voice of reason who doesn't bash the endings?!?! BLASPHEMY!!!!!

That's not a reason, that is lies.

There is 1 run down and 1 path, Harbinger was capable of firing multiple shots at a time with great power killing loads of troops instantly.
The Normandy flies by and lands on the battlefield.


It reminds me of games like Call of duty.
Do you shoot the chopper dropping the troops or do you shoot the troops? I think we all know the answer.

But the Normandy isn't dropping troops. I got into a huge debate with another guy on a thread exactly like this. If I were Harbinger, I'd likely have 3 things going on in my head. 

1) The beam is causing massive interference for everybody

2) Nobody can reach that beam, if something is helping them get away from the beam all the better

3) The Reaper IFF along with any help EDI can give would at least put up a question mark over Normandy if not totally trick the Reaper. 

Also, nearly the entire remainder of Hammer was making that push, thats still a lot of people making that rush. 

So you're in Harbinger's squid boots, who do you shoot? The closest threats to the beam, or a ship that is blocked by interference, with questionable alliegance, taking troops away from that push, that would require shifting resources to that location away from those closer to the beam or do you shoot the nearest threat? Either way this argument as to why it DIDN'T gets when it SHOULD have doesn't matter one bit, because as we can see, the Normandy does not in any way get shot. So leave it at that and accept what a world of fiction has given you.

[Versus Omnibus]

BrookerT wrote...


At least make it "if" they somehow mess up, try to be sporting

Oh, I thought the "if" was amplied, my mistake.

[BrookerT]

Versus Omnibus wrote...

BrookerT wrote...


At least make it "if" they somehow mess up, try to be sporting

Oh, I thought the "if" was amplied, my mistake.

yes . . . mistake:bandit:                            

[Auztin]

Stop ****ing about every detail every GOD DAMN thing.Y'all are worse than emo depressed ****es on thier cycle.

[Isichar]

Versus Omnibus wrote...

Isichar wrote...

The original got it right, everyone should have charged the beam without stopping. But since they screwed up the squadmates continuity with that final scene showing your ground crew in the normandy bioware forced themselves into a corner in which this was the only way out.

And yes you MUST throw everything you have at the plan to get 1 person through the beam, because thats the only way to end the war. You went into this fight knowing there would be heavy losses and if it is not stopped then you just lose period.

Even in the original they stopped. Coats can be heard on the radio telling what little of Hammer to full back into the buildings because Harbinger was killing everyone. The plan was failing and if it had continued there would be nobody left.

By stopping that plan, saving those we could, and falling back we still had a chance the next time around.

The plan had not failed, it had become desperate, and only slightly moreso then it already was. My point stands, regardless of the losses, the ending of this hopeless war was in site and we would most likely never get this chance a 2nd time, Shepard stopping to let the normandy evacuate able bodys was a waste of time and effort that in no way contributed to the beam charge, it only made it so less people was charging and we were taking longer to get there.

And again why? Why would Shepard call an evac now for people who have followed him through hell and back when the ending is right infront of him/her? Why not retreat as well if the situation is so grim?

"Hey you guys head off, im gonna finish this impossible charge to the beam before harby decides to shoot us"

[KingZayd]

arial wrote...

because people complained about how your squadmates got back to the Normandy, so they had to show it

because they made a stupid cutscene, and instead of replacing it with one less stupid, they tried to make it not stupid. They failed, creating another stupid cutscene in the process.

Modifié par KingZayd, 04 juillet 2012 - 07:19 .

[iAFKinMassEffect3]

Isichar wrote...

Im sorry but you guys need to look at the facts.

Fact: If 1 person makes it to the beam, the reapers are done. If no one makes it to the beam then we lose. End of story. If that does not matter to you then why bother fighting the war to begin with?

I don't care whether or not Harby would be interested in shooting down Normandy, I care that your 10 seconds away from the end of the war and you stop well everyone is getting slaughtered so you can focus on your crew.

If you want the story to reach so far in order to save the ground crew and have them appear on the final scene with the Normandy then OK. I'm not upset my ground crew made it out alive, in fact I'm not upset at all. Even if it is not very logical to me it still answers the question as to why it happened.

And if the normandy dropped off a Hammerhead the Reapers are done.
If the normandy dropped off any vechicle the Reapers are done.

If a supercarrier came down and dropped off a squadron then the Reapers are done.
If a supercarrier came down an dropped off 50 shuttles then the Reapers are done.

[BrookerT]

just gonna repeat myself here:
"Why didn't Saren Kill Shepard when he held him by the neck? Cool emotional scenes don't have to be logical to be good"