407 réponses à ce sujet

[Thomas Abram]

oXTheReverendXo wrote...

Hyperionyht wrote...

Whaddya know, another thread derailed by the Krysae. I regret ever mentioning it.

To get us back on track, I'll ask a question to which I already know the answer:
4) If a missile glitcher is in my match, am I considered to be cheating as well if I don't quit?

TA has stated before that you can finish the match so you don't waste your consumables, but leave the lobby right after.

[FearTheCompany]

Turbo controllers for mattock?
Holding down the trigger to shoot instead of having to press it over and over?
respond please if you are allowed to use these

[MWaHa]

This isn't an issue for me since I play on the eksbocks, but I'm curious about using macros or turbo controllers to automatically fire weapons like the phalanx or the mattock. I've heard that if you map the trigger to the wheel button of a mouse (I could be wrong about this), you can fire the gun just as fast as you can turn your wheel, which is much faster than clicking. Is this OK?

[OneTrueShot]

Thomas: I've had several players join my games that ATTEMPT to glitch but fail. I'm not talking about mistakeable behaviour, I'm talking behaviour that can only be related to attempting to glitch.

I made a topic regarding such but never had an answer, which is okay. BUT...

Those who ATTEMPT to glitch - Is this reportable?

[.458]

BW is doing right by working against cheaters. The attitude that it doesn't hurt other players since it is cooperative is nonsense. Keep evolving. Just be careful, sometimes bugs may legitimately hit the wrong person...hoping you keep a responsive line open for those who legitimately need someone to talk to.

Modifié par .458, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:00 .

[justinblac]

Thomas Abram wrote...

oXTheReverendXo wrote...

Hyperionyht wrote...

Whaddya know, another thread derailed by the Krysae. I regret ever mentioning it.

To get us back on track, I'll ask a question to which I already know the answer:
4) If a missile glitcher is in my match, am I considered to be cheating as well if I don't quit?

TA has stated before that you can finish the match so you don't waste your consumables, but leave the lobby right after.

What if I happen to run into 3 or 4 missile glitchers in a week (unlikely, I know)?  Wouldn't it seem like I'm cheating too just by the number of cheaters I play with?  Can we have system where if  we quit and report the person, we get a vet pack or something to cover our losses, or would that be too hard to track and/or encourage false reports?

Modifié par justinblac, 04 juillet 2012 - 08:59 .

[MikeyV]

staindgrey wrote...

In my mind, if an exploit is considered unfair, it's up to the Bioware team to "fix the rule" as they would in sports-- as in, change the coding to prevent it from happening. Resorting to banning, instead, brings into question things like a glitch's purpose, a player's intent, another player's response or moral obligation afterward, etc. There are a whole lot of gray areas there, and banning is an extreme step to take with so much gray. Meanwhile, unfair exploits achieved outside of the game's programmed rules, well, that's obviously cheating. Nothing gray about that.

I see two major things wrong with this viewpoint. The first being that the missle (and any other glitch) IS outside of the programmed rules. That's why it's called a glitch or a bug. The missile launcher is supposed to act a certain way, specifically, in this case, with a maximum of 5 (or I think up to 10, if you got a bunch before they lowered the max) per match, per player. That's a rule that Bioware put in place. The glitch causes the game to somehow combine a normal weapon with the missle launcher, which is NOT in the games rules, anywhere, at all.

The second, is that, and this has been said a billion or so times on these boards, it takes time and money to find a cause, code a fix, get it approved, and get it to the players. The missle glitch is a relatively recent find, and while it's probably been moved towards the top of the priority list, Bioware has only had a few weeks to work on it.



Mr. Abram, this is an excellent idea, and I hope you consildate the common questions and answers into a nice FAQ in the first post when the traffic dies down a bit

[Thomas Abram]

OneTrueShot wrote...

Thomas: I've had several players join my games that ATTEMPT to glitch but fail. I'm not talking about mistakeable behaviour, I'm talking behaviour that can only be related to attempting to glitch.

I made a topic regarding such but never had an answer, which is okay. BUT...

Those who ATTEMPT to glitch - Is this reportable?

Definitely although a failed glitch cannot be proven in the same way a glitch can be proven so it would be categorized as griefing. We do look at game logs though so if the player has done it in the past or does it in the future we'll know.

[Thomas Abram]

justinblac wrote...

Thomas Abram wrote...

oXTheReverendXo wrote...

Hyperionyht wrote...

Whaddya know, another thread derailed by the Krysae. I regret ever mentioning it.

To get us back on track, I'll ask a question to which I already know the answer:
4) If a missile glitcher is in my match, am I considered to be cheating as well if I don't quit?

TA has stated before that you can finish the match so you don't waste your consumables, but leave the lobby right after.

What if I happen to run into 3 or 4 missile glitchers in a week (unlikely, I know)?  Wouldn't it seem like I'm cheating too just by the number of cheaters I play with?  Can we have system where if  we quit and report the person, we get a vet pack or something to cover our losses, or would that be too hard to track and/or encourage false reports?

We have our ways of differentiating being unlucky with your lobbies from actually cheating. We may do something in the future but as of right now I agree that it would encourage too many false reports which in turn would decrease the time we spend actually removing the real cheaters.

Modifié par Thomas Abram, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:05 .

[GameKillerFT]

All I will say is if I get reported or banned for NOT glitching or cheating, but for useing my striker x or krysae x on my bartarian and vorcha, BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday. After all just because others cheat doesn't mean I have to stop useing a good weapon.

Simply put. Have your proof or don't report or assume without it, or problems will arrise. I payed just like the rest for this half done game.

[MWaHa]

GameKillerFT wrote...

All I will say is if I get reported or banned for NOT glitching or cheating, but for useing my striker x or krysae x on my bartarian and vorcha, BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday. After all just because others cheat doesn't mean I have to stop useing a good weapon.

Simply put. Have your proof or don't report or assume without it, or problems will arrise. I payed just like the rest for this half done game.

lolwut

EDIT: seriously, I think I've only seen one person on the forums complain about being unfairly banned. The folks at BioWare strike me as competent and data-driven and conscientious enough that you don't have to worry about that.

SECOND EDIT: But it would be nice if BioWare could give us any info about the ban appeal process, and how many bans are overturned upon review (how many mistakes they make when banning someone).

Modifié par MWaHa, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:13 .

[oXTheReverendXo]

MWaHa wrote...

GameKillerFT wrote...

All I will say is if I get reported or banned for NOT glitching or cheating, but for useing my striker x or krysae x on my bartarian and vorcha, BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday. After all just because others cheat doesn't mean I have to stop useing a good weapon.

Simply put. Have your proof or don't report or assume without it, or problems will arrise. I payed just like the rest for this half done game.

lolwut

EDIT: seriously, I think I've only seen one person on the forums complain about being unfairly banned. The folks at BioWare strike me as competent and data-driven and conscientious enough that you don't have to worry about that. 

I think you'd have a hard time getting banned for using one of those weapons. Reported maybe, but banned? I think it's pretty easy for them to tell when a lot of missiles have been fired vs. using the regular projectiles.

[Variasaber]

FearTheCompany wrote...

Turbo controllers for mattock?
Holding down the trigger to shoot instead of having to press it over and over?
respond please if you are allowed to use these

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure you're allowed to use them.

[Atheosis]

MWaHa wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...

DarkerCompanion wrote...

What kind of effort is being made to fix the methods through which the cheating is being accomplished? Banning people works in the short term, but fixing the bugs in the first place is a much better solution. Is there anything you can share with us about whether staff members are trying to fix these bugs?

Atheosis wrote...

You need to start patching more often and more effectively. With the two DLC packs you've added more bugs (and by extension glitches) than you've fixed since the game was released.

I'm afraid I agree with this sentiment. The patches seem to be remarkably limited in scope, but with a very large development time. The last patch seemed to be entirely pre-Resurgence, but was released at the same time as Rebellion. Bugs from Rebellion era must be so far behind on the gameplan . . . that there may be no hope at all.

Please see my signature. Can we get that thread stickied?

Your signature is ridiculous in the extreme.  I have been gaming for many years and I've seen many developers effectively patch their games over and over again.  Stop making excuses for BW.  Patching may be harder than your avergae schmoe realizes, but it's not so hard that four months should go by with almost no meaningful fixes.

It seems to be the burden here is on Atheosis to prove his point. What factors should we consider in how quickly games are patched? It seems like games with more lines of code should be patched slower (since the programming is more complex), and given that ME3 is a very recent game, you would expect patches to take longer than, say, a patch for the original Oregon Trail. What is the average rate of patches for a game that is on multiple platforms? How large is the standard game's patch in terms of number of lines of code edited / added?

You might be right, but you're ultimately going to be unpersuasive (and some might even mistake you for a crank) unless you can answr questions like this in a very boring, quantitative way.

The burden is on me?  Have you just started playing games in the last few months or something?  Four months with virtually no bug fixes is abysmal.  I don't see why I need to prove something that every gamer should already know.

[InfamousResult]

GameKillerFT wrote...

All I will say is if I get reported or banned for NOT glitching or cheating, but for useing my striker x or krysae x on my bartarian and vorcha, BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday. After all just because others cheat doesn't mean I have to stop useing a good weapon.

Simply put. Have your proof or don't report or assume without it, or problems will arrise. I payed just like the rest for this half done game.

Bioware isn't going to ban you just for using your gun. They would only ban you for abusing an obvious bug INVOLVING the gun- but that is in no way the same as just using the gun as it was intended to be used.

Also, you would never be entitled to a "very big payday". Technically speaking, Bioware/EA can ban you for whatever reason they please, and you'd have to accept it because that's part of the ToS you agreed to. The most they would give you is the $10 back that the Online Pass is worth, and that would be out of good faith, not obligation.

[oXTheReverendXo]

Variasaber wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

Turbo controllers for mattock?
Holding down the trigger to shoot instead of having to press it over and over?
respond please if you are allowed to use these

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure you're allowed to use them.

Would they even be able to tell? Assuming you're on a console, doesn't the console just register these as multiple standard trigger presses? I thought all the processing work for this was done on the controller itself.

Modifié par oXTheReverendXo, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:19 .

[King Ptolemy IV]

If the rocket glitch was fixed. This thread wouldn't exist. Maybe instead of wasting their time banning people, they could be fixing the glitches. Glitches are temptations a lot of people can't avoid. I blame the wide spread use of glitches on bioware, not the players.

[Atheosis]

Lambda_00 wrote...

MWaHa wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...

DarkerCompanion wrote...

What kind of effort is being made to fix the methods through which the cheating is being accomplished? Banning people works in the short term, but fixing the bugs in the first place is a much better solution. Is there anything you can share with us about whether staff members are trying to fix these bugs?

Atheosis wrote...

You need to start patching more often and more effectively. With the two DLC packs you've added more bugs (and by extension glitches) than you've fixed since the game was released.

I'm afraid I agree with this sentiment. The patches seem to be remarkably limited in scope, but with a very large development time. The last patch seemed to be entirely pre-Resurgence, but was released at the same time as Rebellion. Bugs from Rebellion era must be so far behind on the gameplan . . . that there may be no hope at all.

Please see my signature. Can we get that thread stickied?

Your signature is ridiculous in the extreme.  I have been gaming for many years and I've seen many developers effectively patch their games over and over again.  Stop making excuses for BW.  Patching may be harder than your avergae schmoe realizes, but it's not so hard that four months should go by with almost no meaningful fixes.

It seems to be the burden here is on Atheosis to prove his point. What factors should we consider in how quickly games are patched? It seems like games with more lines of code should be patched slower (since the programming is more complex), and given that ME3 is a very recent game, you would expect patches to take longer than, say, a patch for the original Oregon Trail. What is the average rate of patches for a game that is on multiple platforms? How large is the standard game's patch in terms of number of lines of code edited / added?

You might be right, but you're ultimately going to be unpersuasive (and some might even mistake you for a crank) unless you can answr questions like this in a very boring, quantitative way.

Also, one needs to take into account the engines themselves that specific developers are using to develop the games, some make it easier to find&fix the issues compared to others.

The Unreal engine is known for being relatively easy to work with.

[Thomas Abram]

oXTheReverendXo wrote...

Variasaber wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

Turbo controllers for mattock?
Holding down the trigger to shoot instead of having to press it over and over?
respond please if you are allowed to use these

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure you're allowed to use them.

Would they even be able to tell? Assuming you're on a console, doesn't the console just register these as multiple standard trigger presses? I thought all the processing work for this was done on the controller itself.

We can definitely tell the difference between a regular round and a rocket-firing weapon.

[Caratinoid]

Thomas Abram wrote...

We do look at game logs though so if the player has done it in the past or does it in the future we'll know.

Just how much data are we talking here? I hope that the decision is not made solely on score and  weapon used.

[Mysterious Stranger 0.0]

GameKillerFT wrote...

 BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday.

lololol


@Threatning to sue on the official forums. Good luck with that. 

[InfamousResult]

King Ptolemy IV wrote...

If the rocket glitch was fixed. This thread wouldn't exist. Maybe instead of wasting their time banning people, they could be fixing the glitches. Glitches are temptations a lot of people can't avoid. I blame the wide spread use of glitches on bioware, not the players.

"Temptations a lot of people can't avoid"?

Most of us are avoiding the temptation just fine. If they can't "avoid the temptation", that's a problem of their own character, not Bioware's. It's one thing to make a mistake- it's another thing entirely to take advantage of somebody's mistake. Of those two people, the person taking advantage of the mistake is the one deserving reprimance and blame.

[Thomas Abram]

Atheosis wrote...

Lambda_00 wrote...

MWaHa wrote...

Atheosis wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...

DarkerCompanion wrote...

What kind of effort is being made to fix the methods through which the cheating is being accomplished? Banning people works in the short term, but fixing the bugs in the first place is a much better solution. Is there anything you can share with us about whether staff members are trying to fix these bugs?

Atheosis wrote...

You need to start patching more often and more effectively. With the two DLC packs you've added more bugs (and by extension glitches) than you've fixed since the game was released.

I'm afraid I agree with this sentiment. The patches seem to be remarkably limited in scope, but with a very large development time. The last patch seemed to be entirely pre-Resurgence, but was released at the same time as Rebellion. Bugs from Rebellion era must be so far behind on the gameplan . . . that there may be no hope at all.

Please see my signature. Can we get that thread stickied?

Your signature is ridiculous in the extreme.  I have been gaming for many years and I've seen many developers effectively patch their games over and over again.  Stop making excuses for BW.  Patching may be harder than your avergae schmoe realizes, but it's not so hard that four months should go by with almost no meaningful fixes.

It seems to be the burden here is on Atheosis to prove his point. What factors should we consider in how quickly games are patched? It seems like games with more lines of code should be patched slower (since the programming is more complex), and given that ME3 is a very recent game, you would expect patches to take longer than, say, a patch for the original Oregon Trail. What is the average rate of patches for a game that is on multiple platforms? How large is the standard game's patch in terms of number of lines of code edited / added?

You might be right, but you're ultimately going to be unpersuasive (and some might even mistake you for a crank) unless you can answr questions like this in a very boring, quantitative way.

Also, one needs to take into account the engines themselves that specific developers are using to develop the games, some make it easier to find&fix the issues compared to others.

The Unreal engine is known for being relatively easy to work with.

Off topic. What you believe takes hours to fix, takes days if not weeks. A lot of members have outlined the patch process and while I wish we were able to dedicate everyone to work on the bugs you think should be fixed, we cannot. It's a balancing act.

Start your own thread on this if you want but keep it out of this one, consider yourself warned.

Modifié par Thomas Abram, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:25 .

[MWaHa]

EDIT: apologies. off topic.

Modifié par MWaHa, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:27 .

[oXTheReverendXo]

Thomas Abram wrote...

oXTheReverendXo wrote...

MWaHa wrote...

GameKillerFT wrote...

All
I will say is if I get reported or banned for NOT glitching or
cheating, but for useing my striker x or krysae x on my bartarian and
vorcha, BioWare and I will be in communication for a very big payday.
After all just because others cheat doesn't mean I have to stop useing a
good weapon.

Simply put. Have your proof or don't report or
assume without it, or problems will arrise. I payed just like the rest
for this half done game.

lolwut

EDIT: seriously, I
think I've only seen one person on the forums complain about being
unfairly banned. The folks at BioWare strike me as competent and
data-driven and conscientious enough that you don't have to worry about
that. 

I think you'd have a hard time getting
banned for using one of those weapons. Reported maybe, but banned? I
think it's pretty easy for them to tell when a lot of missiles have been
fired vs. using the regular projectiles.

We can definitely tell the difference between a regular round and a rocket-firing weapon.

Fixed. 

Had quoted conversation about using a programmable controller to allow one to hold down the trigger when firing semi-auto's.

Modifié par oXTheReverendXo, 04 juillet 2012 - 09:37 .