361 réponses à ce sujet

[Mathias]

While it's very frustrating to see the devs act like nothings wrong, it's completely understandable why they have this attitude. When you devote time, resources and years of hard work into something, it basically becomes your baby. Therefore when people tell you it's bad, it's very difficult to accept that. I'm sure the devs put a lot of devotion into their work and hate to see a majority of people bash it.

However with that being said, there's also a point that can be reached, where you need to swallow your pride and admit to your mistakes. Now that is a very complicated and hard thing to do, because admitting you screwed up could be bad for the company. But the thing is, when you have an overwhelming amount of people telling you the ending was horrible, going into full detail as to why, you really should acknowledge their disappointment. You can argue that they did, but they did it in a way that was condescending, basically saying

"Alright, because YOU don't understand we'll go ahead and meet you half way by making an extended cut, that should clarify our vision." This is basically saying that there's nothing wrong with the endings, and that it's our fault we hated it. Even when playing through the EC, you can tell at certain points that there was an amount of bitterness in the air, especially when speaking to the Catalyst or initiating the Refusal ending.

But nevermind the fact the majority of fans were disappointed, you also got to consider the amount writers that have stepped forward to call Bioware out. Joss Whedon being one of them, and even some of devs from Dragon Age Origins have come out and said the ending was a problem. So despite the fact that it's difficult to admit your product was deeply flawed, we really have reached that point where Bioware should've admitted their mistake. Not to insult them but the words i would use for their attitude is childish and egotistical.

Going back to my initial question, do you think the devs are just in hardcore denial or they do know deep down the ending was terrible?

[Billyg3453]

I personally think Casey and Mac are in denial, and that %70+ don't like it and can't do anything about it.

It's pretty clear those two are in some serious denial however.

[garrusfan1]

Billyg3453 wrote...

I personally think Casey and Mac are in denial, and that %70+ don't like it and can't do anything about it.

It's pretty clear those two are in some serious denial however.

Was it ever confirmed that only those two wrote the ending if so wow that is sad that they didn't bother to get feedback from their team of amazing writers but those two are in denial or have too much pride to admit they were wrong

[Billyg3453]

garrusfan1 wrote...

Billyg3453 wrote...

I personally think Casey and Mac are in denial, and that %70+ don't like it and can't do anything about it.

It's pretty clear those two are in some serious denial however.

Was it ever confirmed that only those two wrote the ending if so wow that is sad that they didn't bother to get feedback from their team of amazing writers but those two are in denial or have too much pride to admit they were wrong

If you believe the Weekes post, then yes. If you don't, then no.

[savionen]

garrusfan1 wrote...

Billyg3453 wrote...

I personally think Casey and Mac are in denial, and that %70+ don't like it and can't do anything about it.

It's pretty clear those two are in some serious denial however.

Was it ever confirmed that only those two wrote the ending if so wow that is sad that they didn't bother to get feedback from their team of amazing writers but those two are in denial or have too much pride to admit they were wrong

The documentary, I believe, said they ending was written/re-written in Dec of 2011 by one or two people alone.

[Dan Dark]

I'll admit, I only skimmed the OP... you have a point, though. I'm not surprised they didn't apologize and say "Yeah, we screwed up," but what gets me is how they've tried to make it out to be the fans fault. Not once have they ever shown even the slightest hint of sympathy. A simple "We're sorry to hear some fans were not satisfied by the endings" would have at least given the illusion that they care, but instead, all we got was "We understand some fans needed additional clarification."

So... I'm not one to dictate company policy or anything, but... whoever is in charge of the PR department there really needs a refresher course in handling public relations.

Edit: Oh, and more on-topic? Did you listen to the podcast that was released before the EC came out? Hudson and Walters are so full of themselves I'm amazed they aren't suffocated by their own egos.

Modifié par Dan Dark, 05 juillet 2012 - 02:38 .

[Voiceacted a Husk]

It's possible that they know, even knew from a while ago, but didn't/don't see another way to have ended it.

[ld1449]

I believe the team knows.

I don't think there can be any doubt that the team knows just how bad it is.

It quite frankly is the only thing that gives me hope. And its the reason I'm still here posting as much as I can and trying to push a little bit more.

I personally believe Weekes post, he denied it later but it was the weakest denial I'd ever seen. He didn't even claim it to be false, just said "I didn't write it."

I never heard a dirrect "Its not true" Chris and Weekes just posted repeatedly "This was not written by a Bioware employee/I didn't write that."

So yeah, I'm very much convinced that a good chunk of the writing team is well aware of the issues. I'm also convinced that if the pressure can be kept up we'll eventually see more from it, but only if people are willing to push a little more.

Furthermore, Mac is no longer the lead writer for future DLC work, as seen by a tweet (now deleted) and a solicitation for a new lead writer for the ME project that was leaked.

And Casey has gone from Dirrector to Producer as well. So yeah, they know.

I'm hoping they'll fix it. Hoping as much as I can.

Not sure if they will but regardless, I have no doubts that Mac and Casey are basically blacklisted in their own offices atm

[bydoritos]

Well, the EC actually solved my problems with the endings.
And from what I saw on the forum, the response of the fans actually improved with the Extended cut (even if there still people that didn't like it)
So I don't think they are in denial.

It's impossible to please everyone unfortunatly.

[Iakus]

garrusfan1 wrote...

Billyg3453 wrote...

I personally think Casey and Mac are in denial, and that %70+ don't like it and can't do anything about it.

It's pretty clear those two are in some serious denial however.

Was it ever confirmed that only those two wrote the ending if so wow that is sad that they didn't bother to get feedback from their team of amazing writers but those two are in denial or have too much pride to admit they were wrong

Never been confirmed.  But as the lead writer and producer, they definitely would have approved the ending, whether they wrote it or not.

But yeah I'm thinking denial.  We're too stupid to appreciate the Art.

[ld1449]

Dan Dark wrote...

I'll admit, I only skimmed the OP... you have a point, though. I'm not surprised they didn't apologize and say "Yeah, we screwed up," but what gets me is how they've tried to make it out to be the fans fault. Not once have they ever shown even the slightest hint of sympathy. A simple "We're sorry to hear some fans were not satisfied by the endings" would have at least given the illusion that they care, but instead, all we got was "We understand some fans needed additional clarification."

So... I'm not one to dictate company policy or anything, but... whoever is in charge of the PR department there really needs a refresher course in handling public relations.

Edit: Oh, and more on-topic? Did you listen to the podcast that was released before the EC came out? Hudson and Walters are so full of themselves I'm amazed they aren't suffocated by their own egos.

Ohhh yeah. I heard that little piece. Had my blood boiling for a good long while.

I don't think we'll be seeing any more of those people in up front game production roles.

[Blitzhawk65]

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

[ld1449]

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

[savionen]

ld1449 wrote...

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

That usually doesn't go very well for employees in the video game industry.

[garrusfan1]

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

That always makes me rage they didn't just give us those things they called endings they won't admit that only two people wrote it. Which means they not only anger fans but let the other writers that didn't make the ending take the backlash with them so not only do they write the endings behind the other writers backs (that alone is a slap in the face) but they let them take as much flak as they do pretty S***ty 

[mjboldy]

I think they may be fully aware and they are going in a direction with this with the next Mass Effect. Would explain why they didn't really want to change much of the ending.

[Blitzhawk65]

ld1449 wrote...

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

That probably results in all of the good Bioware employees getting fired and replaced with yes-men from EA

[garrusfan1]

ld1449 wrote...

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

Then they get black listed and probably never get another writing job and it wouldn't do any good

[ld1449]

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

That probably results in all of the good Bioware employees getting fired and replaced with yes-men from EA

With this scandal?

Not likely.

Think of this.

They go on strike

they get fired.

They go to the press. (and I do mean mainstream press not gaming press)

The press that already covered the Mass Effect 3 ending controversy before.

How would it look, for EA or Bioware if suddenly 50 plus members of their team are explaining in intricate detail the destruction of their work and the violation of their worker rights?

Every worker has the right to go on strike.

They get bad press from the mainstream, the hatred that their player base feels is quadrupled overnight

and their "biggest" game of the year is now dead in the water because of controversy

REAL controversy not just a crappy ending.

[DGMockingJay]

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...

Blitzhawk65 wrote...

Makes you feel for all of the Bioware staff that put their hearts into the game and have had their work (some of it very good) crapped on because a couple people couldn't get the ending right. They get to feel the heat, and they don't have much of a chance to come out against it without feeling backlash from their employers.

There's always the option for them to go on strike if they're as dissatisfied with the final product/the decisions being made as we are.

That probably results in all of the good Bioware employees getting fired and replaced with yes-men from EA

I guess only EA loyals buying game then. But then again, do EA loyals even exist??

[ld1449]

DGMockingJay wrote...


I guess only EA loyals buying game then. But then again, do EA loyals even exist??

Oh haven't you heard??? According to Ninja Stan its just "edgy" and "cool" to hate on EA. There's no real hate for the company that destroys games by rushing them out the door and makes unique experiences into more gray mush that has a Broader appeal.

[TheJiveDJ]

Well since BioWare is owned by a publicly traded company now, it would be very bad for them to publicly admit they screwed up. Bad for their shareholders anyway....

BW should just stealth edit their ending; this way they don't have to admit any wrong doing.

[savionen]

ld1449 wrote...

DGMockingJay wrote...


I guess only EA loyals buying game then. But then again, do EA loyals even exist??

Oh haven't you heard??? According to Ninja Stan its just "edgy" and "cool" to hate on EA. There's no real hate for the company that destroys games by rushing them out the door and makes unique experiences into more gray mush that has a Broader appeal.

I'm really afraid for Dead Space 3... "Hey let's turn a survival horror game into a co-op shooter"

[ld1449]

TheJiveDJ wrote...

Well since BioWare is owned by a publicly traded company now, it would be very bad for them to publicly admit they screwed up. Bad for their shareholders anyway....

BW should just stealth edit their ending; this way they don't have to admit any wrong doing.

They should have done alot of things they didn't do.

Not the least of which was pull a Valve.

"It will be released in two weeks."

Nine months later

Its coming out tomorrow.

Three weeks 42 hours, 58 minutes 32 seconds, later.

RELEASED!!!!

[TheJiveDJ]

ld1449 wrote...

DGMockingJay wrote...


I guess only EA loyals buying game then. But then again, do EA loyals even exist??

Oh haven't you heard??? According to Ninja Stan its just "edgy" and "cool" to hate on EA. There's no real hate for the company that destroys games by rushing them out the door and makes unique experiences into more gray mush that has a Broader appeal.

How dare you hate on EA sir!  You must be one of them anti-corporate hipsters!  Didn't you know that anyone who doens't like EA's business practises are just mules who hop on a bandwagon?!  People like you couldn't POSSIBLY have any legitimate concerns with a company that is homogenizing an entire industry!!  <_<