13 réponses à ce sujet

[Abraham_uk]

In Baldur's Gate 1

I am playing this build.


Race: Elf 
Gender: Female (but that makes no difference right?)
Dual class: Fighter/Mage
Chaotic Good
Proficency with Axes.


How do I get the most out of my fighter abilities?
How do I get the most out of my mage abilities?
How do I meditate?
What are the spells that I can use?
Which warriors (fighters, rogues, mages) work best for my party?
Can I import this class and my character decisions to Baldur's Gate 2?
You can bring 6 people in a party? Cool!

[Abraham_uk]

I love magic, but I don't want to be limited to it given the old Vencan magic system (which involves lots of meditation).


Fighter: You're going on a five week retreat? All you did was cast a tiny bolt that did nothing?
Pure mage: Which is why I need more time to meditate?
Fighter: And all you can do is cast that one spell in a day?
Pure mage: Yes.
Fighter: A spell that didn't do anything?
Pure mage: Hey. I'm not a wizard. I'm a level one mage. I only started casting spells two weeks ago.
Figher: You know what. How about a permanent retreat? I don't want you in my party.
Pure mage:

Modifié par Abraham_uk, 05 juillet 2012 - 05:36 .

[The Potty 1]

What level did you dual at? Actually no, if you're elven you must be multiclass, only humans can dual class. I prefer multiclass in general, and in BG1 it's loads better than dualling, but in BG2 a fighter>mage becomes pretty unstoppable. Sorry, rambling.

OK, to refresh your spells you need to sleep. This takes 8 hours of game time, and is safest at an inn. You can sleep anywhere by going to any of the interface screens and clicking the indescribable crater-shaped button on the bottom left. You may get ambushed while sleeping in the wilderness, so this is a gamble, save first. Sleeping at an inn will also heal you a small amount, but If you have a cleric you can make them cast healing spells on rest which heals everyone completely.

A mix of classes is traditional in RPGs, a classic fighter, cleric, thief, mage mix is never bad, but there are lots of combinations, not to mention druids, bards, rangers & paladins. I'd suggest two frontliners in full plate, they can be fighters, paladins, clerics, or druids. Behind them a ranger with a longbow, a thief with another bow, and whoever else grabs your fancy. Your F/M can wear armor to start and wade in with the frontliners, or hold back in robes and cast, but later you can wade in wearing robes with the best of them.

My second BG1 playthrough was soloing with a halfling fighter/thief, and this was a complete eye-opener. I blasted through fights I'd struggled with using a group. I later tried a mage/thief solo too, and saw some of the potential that mages only really fulfil in BG2.

Regarding your second post, by the end of BG2 your fighters have to run pretty fast to engage an enemy before the mages hadoken takes them all out.

[morbidest2]

Usually a F/M concentrates on memorizing those spells which are in essence forms of defensive "armor" - eventually including those that protect against mental attacks. You might have a number which last for hours and a few which last for minutes, one of which you quickly cast before the start of a fight. When deciding which spells to memorize, pay attention to both how long they last and how long they take to cast. A young  F/Ms offensive weapons are his physical weapons, not his spells; otherwise he would just be a half-assed, low power mage, whose slow promotion rate keeps him from developing into either a powerful magic user or a frontline fighter. You can memorize any mage spell you own at the levels you are currently capable of handling, but no clerical/druidic ones. As you get promoted, YOU decide which new, higher level spells you memorize from those stored in your spell book - which you get by buying them or getting them as loot. Hence never buy a high level spell that you are not yet smart enough to memorize.
You can change which spells you have memorized any time you rest. Brutal combat experience will teach you what spells you most need.   
Elves have innate skill abilities with bows and swords, so you might want to concentrate on developing your fighting expertise in them.
It's much simpler to play than it sounds to explain it.
As Potty 1 said, it's wise to have a balanced, six member  party: 2 strong fighters, and thief, mage, druidic and clerical skills.
BG1 is a long game, so don't worry too much about BG2. But yes, you will be able to import your PC into BG2 and will bump into many of your former NPCs there. In particular, Imoen, Minsc and Jaheira are very easy to find, as are Viconia and Edwin for the more evilly inclined players.

Modifié par morbidest2, 06 juillet 2012 - 12:57 .

[BelgarathMTH]

I couldn't help LOL'ing at that "indescribable crater" remark. I do believe that's a closed eyelid symbolizing sleeping, or rest.

That was also a very funny description of level one mages. However, "the tiny bolt that does nothing" is the wrong spell to memorize. What the level one mage needs is a Sleep spell. True, he can't do anything but throw darts and rocks for most combats, but then there's that one combat where suddenly the fighters are outnumbered with archers or whatnot, and the mage gets to be the hero by knocking them all out with that Sleep he's been holding back. Which later becomes Web, Fireball, and then an Abu-Dalzim's Horrid Super-Nuke of Mass Destruction. And that little Bolt That Does Nothing turns into FIVE Bolts That Disrupt Enemy Spellcasters Before They Nuke You. Basically, your wise Mr. All-Powerful Fighter Commander needs to understand that the Mage is an investment in the future. One that pays off very well.

However, the OP was actually about Fighter-Mages, which are a whole different animal. As was said, these characters use magic for defense - starting with Armor, Mirror Image, and progressing to Improved Invisibility, Haste, Stoneskin, and all sorts of goodies. Plus, you can still throw a few Fireballs and Abu-Dalzim's Horrid Super-Nukes of Mass Destruction from time to time to spice things up.

[Abraham_uk]

Thanks guys.

I suppose after all those 5 week retreats, I'd be pretty powerful.

[Abraham_uk]

Uh oh, I put two points into axe as an Elf. Is this a mistake?

[Grond0]

Not necessarily. Using a throwing axe allows characters to benefit from any strength bonuses to their damage, so axe is a good utility choice. One problem in BG1 is that they weigh a lot so you can't carry too many around. I tend to use mainly a bow in this situation, but carry around 20 throwing axes to use on the more difficult enemies. There is a magic throwing axe available, but not until late in the game.

The main drawback compared to the bow is that throwing axes do no elemental damage and thus you can't interrupt spells from a stoneskinned mage. There's also the point you are probably worried about that elves have a racial bonus to bow use. However, that's a relatively small factor so you don't need to worry that your axe proficiency is wasted.

[Abraham_uk]

Grond0 wrote...

Not necessarily. Using a throwing axe allows characters to benefit from any strength bonuses to their damage, so axe is a good utility choice. One problem in BG1 is that they weigh a lot so you can't carry too many around. I tend to use mainly a bow in this situation, but carry around 20 throwing axes to use on the more difficult enemies. There is a magic throwing axe available, but not until late in the game.

The main drawback compared to the bow is that throwing axes do no elemental damage and thus you can't interrupt spells from a stoneskinned mage. There's also the point you are probably worried about that elves have a racial bonus to bow use. However, that's a relatively small factor so you don't need to worry that your axe proficiency is wasted.

My biggest issue at the moment is lack of hit points.

My team mates have at least 16 hit points.
I only have 7. That's it. Seven hit points. One hit will instantly kill my character.
How much constitution points does it take to raise my number of hit points to 20?

[BelgarathMTH]

There are several things going on. As a fighter-mage, 18 constitution would get you an extra four hit points per level. However, you are playing a multi-class, and the hit points will always be averaged between the two classes.

Fighters get up to 10 hit points per level. But mages only get up to 4 hit points per level. A fighter-mage can therefore only get a base 7 hit points per level (14 divided by 2). An 18 Constitution would give you an extra 4, for a total of 11 hit points per level. This is only if you have "max hit points per level" turned on in options, or a mod installed called "Tweaks" that has a "max hit points per level" feature. I believe that in unmodded BG1, you can only get max hit points per level by having the difficulty slider turned to "easy" at level up.

You may also be misunderstanding how to play the fighter-mage class. Remember how in the original Star Wars, Obi-Wan gives Luke a blaster and then basicallly tells him to stay the hell out of trouble and let the men handle it? Only much later does he turn into an a**-kicking lightsaber-wielding Jedi. At first, he has to just stand in the back and try to pop a few stormtroopers with that blaster while Obi-wan, Han, and Chewy do all the butt-kicking. That's kind of what playing a fighter-mage is like on early levels. You really can't do much in direct melee until you get your spell repertoire built up.

You can do a little bit of minor meleeing in a pinch if you have taken Dexterity 18 and are using the Armor spell. But you are really much better off using a bow or any other ranged weapon until you get some spells and hit points built up.

You need Strength 15-18, Dexterity 18 (MUST be 18!), Constitution 18, Wisdom dump it, Int can be surprisingly low (only need it for writing spells, based on a dice roll, can use potions at scribing time), Charisma Irrelevant. So, Strength, Dexterity, and Constituion are important to be maxed, Intelligence is only important to raise probabilities at spell-writing time, and Wisdom and Charisma are basically irrelevant.

Let the NPC's handle stuff for you for the first three levels or so, at least until you are experienced enough with the game to know what's coming.

[Grond0]

The other point you may not have appreciated is that you have 2 classes (fighter & mage), while most NPCs have only 1. Your XP is therefore split between 2 classes, which means it takes twice as long for you to get to your first level in either class. In general terms that means your F/M will tend to be 1 level lower than NPCs throughout the game, but because you have the abilities of both a fighter and a mage yours is likely to be the most powerful character.

I agree with Belgarath about the way you should use your character. Missile attacks are by far the easiest way to play the game - put your NPC with the best AC and HPs at the front and the enemies will focus on them, while you shoot them up from behind. With practice you can make your front character run around while enemies chase them - meaning that they die from your missile attacks without even getting an attack in!

Also remember that your sleep spell is devastating against most of the enemies you face early on.

Modifié par Grond0, 08 juillet 2012 - 05:36 .

[Mr Spidey]

However, you are playing a multi-class, and the hit points will always be averaged between the two classes.

That's a slight simplification, isn't it? Normal rolls are halved and so is the constitution bonus. All fighter levels can thus get up to 10/2 + Con/2 hit points and mage levels can get 4/2 + Con/2 hit points.

With 18 con you'll get (up to) +7 HP per fighter level and +4 HP per mage level, adding up to 11 for each combined level, which is indeed just about the average between the mage's 6 and the warriors 14.

You can do a little bit of minor meleeing in a pinch if you have taken Dexterity 18 and are using the Armor spell. But you are really much better off using a bow or any other ranged weapon until you get some spells and hit points built up.

Or, if you don't have any good spells to cast anyway, simply put on the best plate mail you can find. Disabling spell casting doesn't matter until spell casting is significant. Early on this won't really be the case, so why worry about losing it?

[BelgarathMTH]

I forgot to say about that Intelligence score - it does need to be at least 10 so you can read scrolls. Realistically, to avoid headaches, you probably want it at least 15.

So, I would roll at character creation for a fighter-mage until I had Str 18/**, Dex 18, Con 18, Int 15, Wis and Chr use whatever's left.

If you are a playing full-blooded elf, I think Con may be limited to 17, but you can get a 19 Dex for an extra armor class, which kind of makes up for it. So, Str 18/**, Dex 19, Con 17, Int 15.

[Mr Spidey]

If you are a playing full-blooded elf, I think Con may be limited to 17, but you can get a 19 Dex for an extra armor class, which kind of makes up for it. So, Str 18/**, Dex 19, Con 17, Int 15.

Elves are limited to 17 Con but can get 19 Dex. Unfortunately, the only differene between 18 Dex and 20 Dex is a miserable +1 missile adjustment. To clarify, there's no armor class difference between elves and humans. 19 dex is a ranged bonus that also happens to look cool, even if it doesn't do anything useful.

And since we're speaking of looks, isn't it sort of odd to have a low int mage?

18, 19, 17, 17, 8, 8 adds up to 87. That's definitely not too hard to roll, even when you want a good strength percentage. If we're going to aim for racial max values then let's go all out and make it a real crowd pleaser, no? Obviously it's not actually necessary but why settle for less? :-)