Hackulator wrote...
Ok, so this time did you respond to the wrong person or something? Once again, this statement seems to make no sense as a response to what I said. I'm not sure if you're misclicking the posts you want to quote or what, but once again you have managed a response that seems like it was in the wrong conversation.
I didn't think you were trolling before, but I am becoming less sure.
DGMockingJay wrote...
One question though. Even in Synthesis ending, u STILL see Joker limping out of the Normandy on the Jungle planet. Shouldn't his legs and bones be fixed?? Doesn't Synthesis "Fixes" everything?? Or was it just lazy BioWare, using the same cut scene.
Heeden wrote...
Bioluminescence would make more sense than circuitry that would have looked over-sized on anything built after the invention of transistors.
wantedman dan wrote...
Hackulator wrote...
Ok, so this time did you respond to the wrong person or something? Once again, this statement seems to make no sense as a response to what I said. I'm not sure if you're misclicking the posts you want to quote or what, but once again you have managed a response that seems like it was in the wrong conversation.
I didn't think you were trolling before, but I am becoming less sure.
Ah, metatrolling. An ascension of antiargumentation rarely seen.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Not like there are vaccuum tubes in there...
Seriously, look. It looks like circuitry, and it gives off a very "Husk" vibe, which makes sense because somehow we all became Husk 2.0.
Modifié par Heeden, 07 juillet 2012 - 08:18 .
Hackulator wrote...
wantedman dan wrote...
Hackulator wrote...
Ok, so this time did you respond to the wrong person or something? Once again, this statement seems to make no sense as a response to what I said. I'm not sure if you're misclicking the posts you want to quote or what, but once again you have managed a response that seems like it was in the wrong conversation.
I didn't think you were trolling before, but I am becoming less sure.
Ah, metatrolling. An ascension of antiargumentation rarely seen.
Ok you win, I give up. I feel like I'm having a covnersation with Cleverbot or something, moving on now.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Torrible wrote...
And enough of this talk about consent. So Shepard didn't sought everyone's consent before giving them green eyes, immunity from diseases, higher intelligence, ability to interface with machine etc. So perhaps, that's not good. But the consent of the Geth (in Destroy) and billions of sentient beings (in Refusal) were not sought either. Nobody asked them, "do you want to be part synthetic like everyone else or do you want to sacrificed when there are other options that will allow you to live?"
Shepard doesn't know that those things will happen for Synthesis. Hell, he should think we are gonna be screwed big time because of what Harbinger said:
"Your species will be brought into harmony with our own."
"We are your gentic destiny" (Since synthesis is the supposed end of the line for evolution..)
"Your species will be raised into a new existance."
Shepard knows these things.
As for Destroy, the Geth signed up to destroy the Reapers at any cost, if the BS plot device makes me kill them because of a forced moral dilemma, welp, sorry Geth, but the writers hate you.
Modifié par Torrible, 07 juillet 2012 - 08:23 .
eddieoctane wrote...
The
line between magic and technology becomes clearer and clearer as more
research is done into the unified field theory. Eventually, a single set
of mathmatical equations will be able to explain all physical
phenomena. This includes higher dimensional interactions, like
superstrings or M theory. There is a point where tech can only be tech,
even if you never saw it before, based solely on science. When you find a
way to cut a gluon in half, come and talk to me about magic. Till then,
everything is tech, and the ending of the game appeared to violate some
basic principles of quantum mechanics.
eddieoctane wrote...
The
function of the crucible is incredibly difficult to believe. A
homogenous burst of radiation would cause random mutations in DNA. SO
the sythesis pulse would have to actually be a series of directed beams,
each tuned to each atom in the galaxy to re-arrange the physical
structure of the object (DNA molecule, leaves in a tree, Joker's eyes,
etc) being altered. A computer that could do this would 1: violate the
Heisenberg uncertainty principle (requiring to know more about the
particles being influenced than can actually be known) and 2: require a
size greater than at least the colelctive mass of the particles being
altered by the pulse. Laplace's demon deals with this very concept-a
computer should be capable of calculating all possible events ina purely
deterministic universe, but would have to be larger than said universe
to function.
Maybe that went over some people's heads, but it breaks down to this: SPACE MAGIC IS CRAP!
Heeden wrote...
DGMockingJay wrote...
One question though. Even in Synthesis ending, u STILL see Joker limping out of the Normandy on the Jungle planet. Shouldn't his legs and bones be fixed?? Doesn't Synthesis "Fixes" everything?? Or was it just lazy BioWare, using the same cut scene.
No Synthesis is neither implied nor shown to make physical alterations to people's bodies.
Modifié par DGMockingJay, 07 juillet 2012 - 08:25 .
RiouHotaru wrote...
Grimwick wrote...
Is the point of this thread trying to point out that we call one space magicky thing space magic but others not? That's hilarious.
The point of this thread is point out the blatant hypocrisy. The same hypocrisy that occurs when people claim Synthesis is a violation of the galaxy's free-will but Refusal is morally sound.
Heeden wrote...
Yes it looks like circuitry, but circuitry of a size that even a Spectrum would be embarassed to look at it. It's just part of Bioware's over-the-top art-stryle when it comes to that sort of thing. Ever notice how omni-tools make a big, pointless orange glowing thing? It's to show something is happening.
Edit: Husks are only the carcasses and a few minor systems of an organic life-form, mostly they are replaced by robotic parts. That doesn't happen in Synthesis, all we get is green organic energy altering the matrix of organic life.
Torrible wrote...
Poor Geth. Imagine they were there.
Geth: "Synthesis allows not just peaceful coexistence between organics and synthetics, but one that is based on mutual understanding and respect. It will allow us to ascend to true sentience, fully embracing the full range of emotions and other salient qualities of organics. We highly recommend Synthesis."
Shepard: "Destroy, it is then. You signed up for this, you know."
Geth: "We did, but there are other options that achieve the same goal of ending the Reaper threat.."
Shepard: "YOU. Signed. Up. For. This."
Modifié par Ticonderoga117, 07 juillet 2012 - 08:28 .
RiouHotaru wrote...
Synthesis is techno-babble, yes. But that doesn't make it less an option.
Love Sherri wrote...
RiouHotaru wrote...
Synthesis is techno-babble, yes. But that doesn't make it less an option.
"Add your energy to the Crucible's. Everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all organic and synthetic into a new framework, a new DNA.”
That is not techno-babble. That is bad writting desperately trying match Bill Nye the Science Guy.
This is techno-babble:
" By changing frames with a Lorentz transformation in the x direction with a small value of the velocity v, the energy momentum four-vector becomes approximately (E, Ev/c2, 0, 0). The momentum is equal to the energy multiplied by the velocity divided by c2. As such, the Newtonian mass of an object, which is the ratio of the momentum to the velocity for slow velocities, is equal to E/c2."
DGMockingJay wrote...
What does it mean by PERFECTION then??? The implants should have healed his bones right away. Better yet, he should have metal bones now.
U know what?? Dont answer that, with more speculations. It was a rhetoric question to begin with..
Point is, Nobody, except for BioWare knows what Synthesis is capable of doing. And they are not letting in on the secret.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Love Sherri wrote...
RiouHotaru wrote...
Synthesis is techno-babble, yes. But that doesn't make it less an option.
"Add your energy to the Crucible's. Everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all organic and synthetic into a new framework, a new DNA.”
That is not techno-babble. That is bad writting desperately trying match Bill Nye the Science Guy.
This is techno-babble:
" By changing frames with a Lorentz transformation in the x direction with a small value of the velocity v, the energy momentum four-vector becomes approximately (E, Ev/c2, 0, 0). The momentum is equal to the energy multiplied by the velocity divided by c2. As such, the Newtonian mass of an object, which is the ratio of the momentum to the velocity for slow velocities, is equal to E/c2."
He never watched Star Trek then, I guess.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Love Sherri wrote...
RiouHotaru wrote...
Synthesis is techno-babble, yes. But that doesn't make it less an option.
"Add your energy to the Crucible's. Everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all organic and synthetic into a new framework, a new DNA.”
That is not techno-babble. That is bad writting desperately trying match Bill Nye the Science Guy.
This is techno-babble:
" By changing frames with a Lorentz transformation in the x direction with a small value of the velocity v, the energy momentum four-vector becomes approximately (E, Ev/c2, 0, 0). The momentum is equal to the energy multiplied by the velocity divided by c2. As such, the Newtonian mass of an object, which is the ratio of the momentum to the velocity for slow velocities, is equal to E/c2."
He never watched Star Trek then, I guess.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Which is why I call it Husk 2.0. It's more refined than the regular husk creation and somehow allows us to maintain our minds and forms.
Also, what is "organic energy"? I get "the matrix of organic life", it's DNA. Which then leads to headaches because forcibly changing that would HURT LIKE A BASTARD at least. Death at worse. "Organic energy"... still, where's the science for the fiction?
Modifié par Heeden, 07 juillet 2012 - 08:39 .
Grimwick wrote...
WTF.
Declaring something as space magic but leaving other things which are space magic out is not hypocrisy. You can't be hypocritical through omission...
I, nor nearly everyone else, have never declared any of those examples of yours as not being space magic and you don't really have any grounds to this thread. It's obvious you haven't spent enough time reading people's opinions on the BSN or you'd relaise that everyone has already pointed out these flaws.
Also, the fact that something else is space magic too is NOT a justification for the use of space magic in synthesis. That's absurd.
And refusal is a red herring here... morality has nothing to do with space magic so don't try to bring it into the equation.
[On an unrelated note refusal is morally/logically superior unless you use metaevidence - in which case it becomes debatable and opinionated.]
Heeden wrote...
Pretty much the opposite of being a husk then, which is a conversion of mind and form.
I assume organic energy is part of the magic behind the abilities of the Asari, Protheans and possibly the Thorian. A matrix is generally considered to be "a thing that holds other things together", in other words it's to do with the ways we relate. Not necessarily DNA itself but probably related to it (and tying in with Mass Effect's hints at genetic memory). The EC shows a framework being built around DNA, not actually altering the genetic make-up, and either way there is no reason to think it would be painful, DNA is on a level far lower than can be noticed by our nervous system.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Still a fusion of tech and organic.
For all of them, it's genetics. Asari can do the "mate with anything" because I bet it's based off the Protheans "Can get flashes of memory from DNA" and the Thorian can do it's thing because it evolved to do that.
You mentioned yourself "genetic memory". That's saying DNA is involved right there.
Changing anything about the way your body works in such a rapid and brutal manner WILL make your body react. Why do you think radiation posioning is so painful? It wrecks your genetic structure and your body really doesn't like the change.
Heeden wrote...
As is Shepard, as is a man riding a bike, neither are considered Husk 2.0 (or 0.1 in the case of the bike). And Synthesis isn't said to add tech to the body, it allows perfect integration with it.
That doesn't explain how the genes encode the information, how it is read (does Liara impose a genetic change when she shares memories with you?) or how Javik can look around a room and tell you about living organisms who have lived in it. The Thorian may have evolved to do its thing, but that doesn't explain how people infected with its spores can share information in such a way.
Radiation poisoning doesn't hurt at first, the random mutations cause irregularities in cell growth. These in turn disrupt higher systems which do become something noticable to the nervous system.
Ticonderoga117 wrote...
Shepard is more Cyborg than Husk. Husks are where it is a literal fusion, ie, it's difficult to tell where the machine ends and the man begins. The lines are gone.
So add another point to Space Magic. However, it at least got a very weak explanation with Javik and it was not a major part of the game, unlike the ending!
Yeah, well when your body starts reacting to the changes, it's gonna hurt. The change to "integrate better with tech" is a rather large macrospoci change. It would be akin to me either growing a usb port or a Wi-Fi connection suddenly.
Heeden wrote...
Husks are an almost total replacement with tech, leaving only a superficial resemblance to the original being. Shepard is a refined version of similar technology - indeed Shepard him/herself isn't totally certain if they are themselves or just a VI who thinks it is Shepard.
Although similar Prothean magic powers the beacon which essentially drove the plot of the entire first game.
Only if the changes stimulate the nervous system in a way that resembles damage to the body. I don't see any reason to automatically assume this will be the case and the ending doesn't show anyone having obvious problems with it.
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