395 réponses à ce sujet

[Khajiit Jzargo]

 @MegaSovereign.
Yeah, but your implying that during my decision making my Shep had already done something similar, when he hadn't. 
My Shep clearly says he never worked for Cerberus, that he used them for their resources to take down the collectors base and that's it. If anything it can be considered an alliance, not that Shep worked for them. Are you saying that you know my intentions and how I see a situation? better yet that my Shep lied?

Of course Shep has had to compromised his integrity before, but it is obtuse to insist that just because Shep has comprimised his intergrity before for very small things, it means that Shep can comprimised his intergrity to do something like genocide.

The ball is on your yard.

[Khajiit Jzargo]

Lord Goose wrote...

You
submitted to the Catalyst's ultimatium, and make a
decision you would have never made out of fear of
extinction just to ensure victory

Actually, Shepard could commit genocide in one way or another, if there is no choice. Geth/quarian conflict, it is not always ends in peace, and he had made decision in one way or another. Sabotaging krogan cure to have them and salarians as war assets.

I know that, how does that change anything know, are you trying to say he commited genocide before, so it justifies it him doing it again?

[MegaSovereign]

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

 @MegaSovereign.
Yeah, but your implying that during my decision making my Shep had already done something similar, when he hadn't. 
My Shep clearly says he never worked for Cerberus, that he used them for their resources to take down the collectors base and that's it. If anything it can be considered an alliance, not that Shep worked for them. Are you saying that you know my intentions and how I see a situation? better yet that my Shep lied?

Of course Shep has had to compromised his integrity before, but it is obtuse to insist that just because Shep has comprimised his intergrity before for very small things, it means that Shep can comprimised his intergrity to do something like genocide.

The ball is on your yard.

So the only way to keep your hands clean is if you don't download the DLC? Are you listening to yourself? 

Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. I'm saying DURING the Arrival DLC, ALL Shepards were railroaded into sacrificing the system in order to delay the Reapers.

[jojon2se]

@Hadea:

I'm afraid you may be speaking to people who just can't let a contrary opinion go unmocked...

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

MegaSovereign wrote...
Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. 

I don't think so. If you don't have Arrival (or any other DLC), game perfectly alters events to match that, so it's still canon.

[Khajiit Jzargo]

MegaSovereign wrote...

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

 @MegaSovereign.
Yeah, but your implying that during my decision making my Shep had already done something similar, when he hadn't. 
My Shep clearly says he never worked for Cerberus, that he used them for their resources to take down the collectors base and that's it. If anything it can be considered an alliance, not that Shep worked for them. Are you saying that you know my intentions and how I see a situation? better yet that my Shep lied?

Of course Shep has had to compromised his integrity before, but it is obtuse to insist that just because Shep has comprimised his intergrity before for very small things, it means that Shep can comprimised his intergrity to do something like genocide.

The ball is on your yard.

So the only way to keep your hands clean is if you don't download the DLC? Are you listening to yourself? 

Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. I'm saying DURING the Arrival DLC, ALL Shepards were railroaded into sacrificing the system in order to delay the Reapers.

I never said that, please don't put words in my mouth.

Again, you even proved my point for me, they were railroaded into sacrificing the system, in the endings you had a choice. Also like I said before, Shep has comprimised his integrity before, but it is obtuse to insist that just because Shep has comprimised his integrity before for way smaller things, it means that Shep can comprimised his integrity to do something like Genocide. 

[Khajiit Jzargo]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...
Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. 

I don't think so. If you don't have Arrival (or any other DLC), game perfectly alters events to match that, so it's still canon.

Actually it does happen, but shepard has nothing to do with it.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...
Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. 

I don't think so. If you don't have Arrival (or any other DLC), game perfectly alters events to match that, so it's still canon.

Actually it does happen, but shepard has nothing to do with it.

Yes. That what I meant by altering events.
Similar with LotSB.
But game confirmed it with Shepard had nothing to do with it - this makes this plot variant canon. It would be different if game said that Shepard did it regardless of you having DLC.

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:17 .

[DocGriffin]

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

Dumping my 2 cents about Refusal.

1. Like it or not, Refusal spells galactic extinction for your cycle, and given the chance you had options to stop that, it IS your fault.

*snip*

1-How is it he's fault? not arguing just asking.
*snip*

It is Shepard's fault because he was presented choices that would prevent the galaxy's destruction. 

A person who is presented a chance to prevent a mugger from shooting a victim is just as much at fault as the mugger if they actively choose not to save the victim.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

DocGriffin wrote...

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

Dumping my 2 cents about Refusal.

1. Like it or not, Refusal spells galactic extinction for your cycle, and given the chance you had options to stop that, it IS your fault.

*snip*

1-How is it he's fault? not arguing just asking.
*snip*

It is Shepard's fault because he was presented choices that would prevent the galaxy's destruction. 

A person who is presented a chance to prevent a mugger from shooting a victim is just as much at fault as the mugger if they actively choose not to save the victim.

Way to twist things.
More like a person who threatened by criminal that his whole family will be killed if he does not kill his friend by end of the week.

[TheClonesLegacy]

DocGriffin wrote...

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

Dumping my 2 cents about Refusal.

1. Like it or not, Refusal spells galactic extinction for your cycle, and given the chance you had options to stop that, it IS your fault.

*snip*

1-How is it he's fault? not arguing just asking.
*snip*

It is Shepard's fault because he was presented choices that would prevent the galaxy's destruction. 

A person who is presented a chance to prevent a mugger from shooting a victim is just as much at fault as the mugger if they actively choose not to save the victim.

Damn Straight.
To guy above,
At least you can Fake your Friends Death.

Modifié par TheClonesLegacy, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:24 .

[DocGriffin]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...


It is Shepard's fault because he was presented choices that would prevent the galaxy's destruction. 

A person who is presented a chance to prevent a mugger from shooting a victim is just as much at fault as the mugger if they actively choose not to save the victim.

Way to twist things.
More like a person who threatened by criminal that his whole family will be killed if he does not kill his friend by end of the week.

What did I twist? Shepard is presented 3 choices that will save most or all of the galaxy. By not choosing any (And the Catalyst tells him this) he dooms everyone in his cycle.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

DocGriffin wrote...

What did I twist? Shepard is presented 3 choices that will save most or all of the galaxy. By not choosing any (And the Catalyst tells him this) he dooms everyone in his cycle.

Shepard forced to pick one of 3 choices under gun point. I fail to see how failing to comply with criminal's demands is crime by itself.
By the way, whole united Galaxy goes down fighting to the last breath. I see this somewhat different from just "ok, we just die now".

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:29 .

[The Twilight God]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

Khajiit Jzargo wrote...

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...
Ofcourse not having Arrival is not canon. 

I don't think so. If you don't have Arrival (or any other DLC), game perfectly alters events to match that, so it's still canon.

Actually it does happen, but shepard has nothing to do with it.

Yes. That what I meant by altering events.
Similar with LotSB.
But game confirmed it with Shepard had nothing to do with it - this makes this plot variant canon. It would be different if game said that Shepard did it regardless of you having DLC.

Just curious...

So does it say another N7 did Arrival? If not, what happened?

Why is Shepard grounded on Earth if he had nothing to do with Arrival?

How exactly did LotSB even play out without Shepard? Did she assault the Shadow Broker's ship and beat him solo?

[TheClonesLegacy]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

What did I twist? Shepard is presented 3 choices that will save most or all of the galaxy. By not choosing any (And the Catalyst tells him this) he dooms everyone in his cycle.

Shepard forced to pick one of 3 choices under gun point.
I fail to see how failing to comply with criminal's demands is crime by itself.
By the way, whole united Galaxy goes down fighting to the last breath. I see this somewhat different from just "ok, we just die now".

No it's Shepard going
"I don't want to kill anyone, I can't Handle the Blood on my Hands/Controlling a race/Making a New Lifeform. Just continue Killing everyone, That way I can Stay on my Moral High horse while I starve to death on this Platform"

Modifié par TheClonesLegacy, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:32 .

[DocGriffin]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

What did I twist? Shepard is presented 3 choices that will save most or all of the galaxy. By not choosing any (And the Catalyst tells him this) he dooms everyone in his cycle.

Shepard forced to pick one of 3 choices under gun point.
I fail to see how failing to comply with criminal's demands is crime by itself.
By the way, whole united Galaxy goes down fighting to the last breath. I see this somewhat different from just "ok, we just die now".

Under gun point? What? And yeah, it's such a burden to have to save the galaxy from destruction. If you really have that much of an issue with authority that you can't make a decision that saves people if it's 'forced' upon you, then you deserve to have allowed the deaths of everyone you ever knew.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

The Twilight God wrote...
So does it say another N7 did Arrival? If not, what happened?

Team of Alliance marines does it.

Why is Shepard grounded on Earth if he had nothing to do with Arrival?

For his collaboration with Cerberus.

How exactly did LotSB even play out without Shepard? Did she assault the Shadow Broker's ship and beat him solo?

Liard hires team of mercs to assault it. Feron dies.

[DEATHSCOPE]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...

What did I twist? Shepard is presented 3 choices that will save most or all of the galaxy. By not choosing any (And the Catalyst tells him this) he dooms everyone in his cycle.

Shepard forced to pick one of 3 choices under gun point. I fail to see how failing to comply with criminal's demands is crime by itself.
By the way, whole united Galaxy goes down fighting to the last breath. I see this somewhat different from just "ok, we just die now".

Under gun point? Shepard was bleeding to death. The Catalyst could have easily kicked him while he's down, but didn't. Why? Why give him three choices then?

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

DocGriffin wrote...
Under gun point? What?

Umm, yes? Because Reaper King says, "pick the choice or we will kill everybody"
So how this is not the choice under gun point?

DEATHSCOPE wrote...
Under gun point? Shepard was bleeding to death. The Catalyst could have easily kicked him while he's down, but didn't. Why? Why give him three choices then?

Why didn't starkid stop reaping if he admitted that cycles will not work anymore?
The universal answer is - "he's just programmed this way", you can explain everything with this.

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:34 .

[TheClonesLegacy]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...
Under gun point? What?

Umm, yes? Because Reaper King says, "pick the choice or we will kill everybody"
So how this is not the choice under gun point?

That's not even Close to What the Catalyst says,
He's not a James Bond villain.
He's Like "My Solution Won't Work anymore, change the Equation or Prove me Right"
You Letting the Cycle continue.

Modifié par TheClonesLegacy, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:36 .

[DocGriffin]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...
Under gun point? What?

Umm, yes? Because Reaper King says, "pick the choice or we will kill everybody"
So how this is not the choice under gun point?

He doesnt say that, that's what happens if you choose not to save everyone. And yeah, big surprise, if you choose not to save everyone, everyone dies.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

TheClonesLegacy wrote...
That's not even Close to What the Catalyst says,
He's not a James Bond villain.
He's Like "My Solution Won't Work anymore, change the Equation or Prove me Right"

Where he says "Prove me right?". He presents you with choices, then just threatens you every time you tell him you will refuse to choose.

[TheClonesLegacy]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

TheClonesLegacy wrote...
That's not even Close to What the Catalyst says,
He's not a James Bond villain.
He's Like "My Solution Won't Work anymore, change the Equation or Prove me Right"

Where he says "Prove me right?". He presents you with choices, then just threatens you every time you tell him you will refuse to choose.

no I summed it Up as you did.
Just far more Accurate.
That's what you do,
You let the Cycle Continue, instead of Making a Difference. You Prove the Catalysts Solution Works hence "Prove Me Right"
Just to be on your Moral High Horse.
Face it In Refuse your still an Accomplice to Genocide.

Modifié par TheClonesLegacy, 08 juillet 2012 - 09:41 .

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

DocGriffin wrote...
He doesnt say that, that's what happens if you choose not to save everyone. And yeah, big surprise, if you choose not to save everyone, everyone dies.

Sorry, that happens when you refuse to pick the three choices he wanted you to pick.
His Reapers kill everybody. By his command.

[DEATHSCOPE]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

DocGriffin wrote...
Under gun point? What?

Umm, yes? Because Reaper King says, "pick the choice or we will kill everybody"
So how this is not the choice under gun point?

DEATHSCOPE wrote...
Under gun point? Shepard was bleeding to death. The Catalyst could have easily kicked him while he's down, but didn't. Why? Why give him three choices then?

Why didn't starkid stop reaping if he admitted that cycles will not work anymore?
The universal answer is - "he's just programmed this way", you can explain everything with this.

The Catalyst did explain to you that Shepard is the first to stand there, at that chamber, to converse with it, which caused it to rethink the cycle. So, nice try.