454 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

BP93 wrote...

ITT: People posting their opinions about the s/s romances in the game or lack thereof and get bashed by others for having that said opinion.

People don't have to like what you like nor do they have to agree with you. Seems like anyone who says something that even comes to a slant against homosexuals nowadays just gets labeled as a homophobe.

Hooray for generalizations!

So anyone slanting/attacking homosexuals is called a homophobe? SHOCK AND HORROR

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain
again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say
it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine
it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about
other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care
what people are.

Actually, I think that might be the definition of biphobia.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 12 juillet 2012 - 05:50 .

[Zjarcal]

BP93 wrote...

People don't have to like what you like nor do they have to agree with you. Seems like anyone who says something that even comes to a slant against homosexuals nowadays just gets labeled as a homophobe.

Yeah, saying "ew, my fave character is bi/gay, ICK, characters is RUINED!" is something people should just randomly lol at and move on.

Actually, I do laugh it... at the stupidity.

[Kyuhyun]

Everyone is straight in the real world

[Mr.House]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care what people are.

Your man can think about whatever he dam well wants to as long as he is not doing a crime. Last time I checked, thinknig of men is not a crime, if it is then I shhould be in jail. I'm thinking about men right now! Oh baby!

[Kyuhyun]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care what people are.

Wait but it's okay if he thinks about women and checks out other women? I.. don't really get the logic here or how this is not homophobic.

[Baronesa]

krukow wrote...

Not if they're established as such.  Kelly Chambers is great, and lots of people like Liara (though not sure if people count her).  It's mush when it's changed for fanservice.  It's also mush when everyone is made bi, because that just isn't how the real world works.

I hope you are aware that sexuality is not a black and white division but a continuum.

So... the problem is for chars that has been stablished... Now here is a little problem.

Let's take Garrus for example... In ME there were no indications ot his sexuality AT ALL so making him gay, straight or bi on ME2 would have not been a retcon, since it was a part of his personality that you DIDN'T knew.

Second point, not everyone is aware or accepts their sexuality freely until late in life by many reasons... so someone who comes out as gay or lesbian that was previously married is retconning their life?

The arguments you give are very weak.

[TheMarshal]

krukow wrote...

And you restrict it because you're trying to create real characters, with things like traits, not mushy sex dolls to be used however the character sees fit.  The majority of people are straight, some people are gay, some are bi.  The characters you interact with should reflect this.  When you just turn everyone bi for the sake of fanservice, the characters cease to be real.

I mean, if you just want "characters" for masturbatory fantasy, that's fine.  I like characters that feel real.  And part of real characters is their own defined sexuality, not whatever sexuality I want them to have in any given playthrough.  Cortez and Traynor would be lesser characters if you could make them straight in your playthrough.

Yeah...  This argument pops up every now and again.  "Real" characters have limitations to what they're attracted to and all that.  And I agree with that.  But why stop with sexuality?  Why not also make it so that they're only attracted to a specific personality type?  There was some semblance of that in Dragon Age, and even more of it in earlier Bioware stories.  But what about a step beyond that?  Physical attraction is a big part of romance.  Should they not be attracted to ugly Shepards?  What if Miranda is only into guys with blonde hair?  Would that make things more real?  Would all of this make everything feel more real?

Yes.

It will also, however, make it far less fun for a lot of people.  The reason that the Bioware romances have become easier over time (anyone remember Jaheira?) is to make them more accessible to more people.  Realistic characters are nice and all, but this is fantasy (as evidenced by the fact that you're role-playing a space marine).  Things need to be a little easier and a little more accessible to the player base in order for it to be fun, and making the romances easier to get into is one way they did that.  Miranda, Tali, and Jack are the only Mass Effect romances where your actions could prevent you from romancing them.  Otherwise, you pick 'em and they're into you.  Easy as that.

And if it's easy as that, why not open it up so that people can romance who they choose for their Shepard?

[alek2702]

krukow wrote...
 It's mush when it's changed for fanservice. 

Nothing was changed, Kaidan was bi from the beginning, he just didn't act on his feelings in ME1.

krukow wrote... 
It's also mush when everyone is made bi, because that just isn't how the real world works.

Half your crew wanting to have a relationship with you regardless of your looks and personality also isn't how the real world works, yet no one seems to be complaining about it. It's a game- sometimes complete realism isn't the ultimate goal.

Modifié par alek2702, 12 juillet 2012 - 05:56 .

[Kyuhyun]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

OneWomanArmy wrote...

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care what people are.

Your man can think about whatever he dam well wants to as long as he is not doing a crime. Last time I checked, thinknig of men is not a crime, if it is then I shhould be in jail. I'm thinking about men right now! Oh baby!

Well thankfully I can testify that he is NOT thinking of any men.

I didn't know you could read the mind of a video game character. Teach me how to be cool like you

[TheMarshal]

Kyuhyun wrote...

I didn't know you could read the mind of a video game character. Teach me how to be cool like you

Pretty sure she meant her boyfriend...

[Lenimph]

Personally I don't think gender should matter when you're in love with a giant talking lizard but of course I'm crazy

[Kyuhyun]

TheMarshal wrote...

Kyuhyun wrote...

I didn't know you could read the mind of a video game character. Teach me how to be cool like you

Pretty sure she meant her boyfriend...

Still ridiculous. How would she even know.

[TheMarshal]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

Oh but after he has gotten me he hasn't had the need to look or check out other women... Although he is straight.

This is wildly off-topic, but here we have an example of something that drives me nuts.  Your boyfriend's entire sexuality is tied up by you?  I assume he was attracted to women before he met you.  Are you saying that now that he has you, his attraction to others has been rendered nil?  And bear in mind there's a big difference between not being attracted to someone and not drooling every time a nice pair of legs or a low-cut blouse passes by.

[Mr.House]

I wish I could read mens minds.

[BP93]

@Kyuhyun - There certainly is no pleasing you, is there?

[Kyuhyun]

BP93 wrote...

@Kyuhyun - There certainly is no pleasing you, is there?

What...

[DevilBeast]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care what people are.

Well, I could basically say the same about seeing Liara with manshep, since I always romance her with my femshep.
But really, it doesn´t bother me, because I know it´s not part of my canon Shepard.

[psrz]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

The reason why it bothers me about Kaidan being bi I will explain again.... Its not because I don't like bi or gay people and when I say it burns in my mind it's because my shep is romancing him so I imagine it like in real life. In real life I don't want my man to think about other men and check other the same men as me. Otherwise I don't care what people are.

But you're doing it wrong. You're failing as a player.

You're saying Kaidan is "bi" from a metagame perspective. He's not. In some games he's straight, in others he's gay. "Your" Kaidan is not checking out someone else's dudeShep's body. He's not going to say to your femShep "hey, did  you see that custom dudeShep over there ? cute,  innit ?"

[The Angry One]

Kyuhyun wrote...

Everyone is straight in the real world

I'm straight as a wheel!

...

Yeah.

[krukow]

The Angry One wrote...

Kyuhyun wrote...

Everyone is straight in the real world

I'm straight as a wheel!

...

Yeah.

No, you should be bi.  Why restrict who can romance you?

[The Uncanny]

psrz wrote...

But you're doing it wrong. You're failing as a player.

You're saying Kaidan is "bi" from a metagame perspective. He's not. In some games he's straight, in others he's gay. "Your" Kaidan is not checking out someone else's dudeShep's body. He's not going to say to your femShep "hey, did  you see that custom dudeShep over there ? cute,  innit ?"

Well said. I don't see why that can't be seen to apply more widely. How does how they react in someone else's game need to impact on your game?