20 réponses à ce sujet

[Artas1984]

I have read about some of the feats still not working in 1.23. Is there a list i can read about it? Are there any fixes made?

I am most curious about darkvision and all of it's "derivates" - it's a realy important feat, yet i can clearly see that it does not work - i was blinded by sunburst and could not do a thing even though i had the feat.

What other feats do not work?

How about spell resistance? Is it ture that it works only the first time absorbing damage, and the you have to rest for it to recharge? That is not bad really compared to useless darkvision.
Also improved intitiative works only for determining the first round of mele, not the rest rounds, right?

Modifié par Artas1984, 09 juillet 2012 - 02:04 .

[Arkalezth]

Darkvision... what? Darkvision works, but it doesn't make you immune to blindness spells, if that's what you mean. As the name implies, it just lets you see in the dark. That's far from useless, though.

The only issue with it is that you have to reactivate it after transitions, but Skywing's Client Extension fixes that. What doesn't work, though, is darkvision granted by items or spells. Kaedrin's pack fixes the latter (at least some warlock invocations which grant it), but there's no fix for the former AFAIK.

The issue you describe about spell resistance is not a problem if you have it naturally, only if you get it from items, or, according to my testing, from shapeshifting (seems that way with warlock's Word of Change at least). I don't know if Kaedrin fixed it.

Initiative is rolled at the start of combat. It works, but spending a feat for it is rather useless.

There are many little things that work badly or don't work at all. I doubt such a list exists, but you can check the wiki about specific feats, bugs are usually mentioned there.

[Artas1984]

Blind fight feat, sorry for misunderstanding, not darkvision - even if blinded or against invisible creatures - that is what is written about it.

Why is there written "even if blinded" if it does not work?

What about items that give the feat "blind fight" - they work?

Modifié par Artas1984, 09 juillet 2012 - 05:21 .

[Arkalezth]

Blind Fight is far from useless. It's actually a must for any character who's not an offensive caster (and even for those, if using touch attack spells). The part about being blinded is wrong, but Blind Fight makes you a much better fighter against concealed enemies (which includes spellcasters, among others).

It's the typical feat that you see no use for, until you need it, then you'll be regretting not having taken it.

Item-granted Blind Fight works, yes.

[GFallen01]

Darkvision... what? Darkvision works, but it doesn't make you immune to blindness spells, if that's what you mean. As the name implies, it just lets you see in the dark. That's far from useless, though.

However, it has no impact on magical darkness, which offers a form of concealment - from my testing, there are no other effects. Player1's Alternative Darkness changes it to a miss chance, so it can properly be negated by Blindsight, Devil Sight, and Helm of Darkness.

is darkvision granted by items or spells. Kaedrin's pack fixes the latter (at least some warlock invocations which grant it), but there's no fix for the former AFAIK.

I've seen items that succesfully grant darkvision/low-light vision - IIRC it was a helmet in Last of the Danaa'n.

The issue you describe about spell resistance is not a problem if you have it naturally, only if you get it from items, or, according to my testing, from shapeshifting (seems that way with warlock's Word of Change at least). I don't know if Kaedrin fixed it.

Yes, the SR from Word of Changing is an item based effect, so it fails after one use. Kaedrin implements a fix that gives the SR to the player as a spell effect. It doesn't seem to work reliably, though. 

The fix from Reeron (as implemented by kevL in PIA) fixes SR for enemy creatures.

Why is there written "even if blinded" if it does not work?

The description is correct, bugsidian wasn't when they implemented it.

If you want to know about bugs, I don't really know what to suggest, besides the wiki which is an unreliable source of information. I learn a lot from reading Kaedrin's version changes, but it's a quite a lot of material.

Modifié par GFallen01, 10 juillet 2012 - 10:10 .

[I_Raps]

GFallen01 wrote...

is darkvision granted by items or spells. Kaedrin's pack fixes the latter (at least some warlock invocations which grant it), but there's no fix for the former AFAIK.

I've seen items that succesfully grant darkvision/low-light vision - IIRC it was a helmet in Last of the Danaa'n.

That is because there are two ways to give Darkvision with an item.  If you just give it the standalone "Darkvision," it doesn't work;  if you give it "Bonus Feat: Darkvision" it works.  This is because the feat version gives the character the little mode icon to activate it.

.....

Other feats that don't work right include "Song of Freedom" (does nothing) and the "Uncanny Dodge" set (works somewhat, but provides no defense against sneak attackers).  I've written a replacement script for SOF which works for my needs;  I haven't tried the UD feats yet (haven't really decided what I want to do with them;  what they're actually supposed to do is apparently impossible to implement from what I've read here).

Modifié par I_Raps, 10 juillet 2012 - 10:17 .

[GFallen01]

(haven't really decided what I want to do with them; what they're actually supposed to do is apparently impossible to implement from what I've read here).

... unless you use NWNx4. Am I mistaken?

PS: Don't want to sound smart here, I'm just excited about Never Launcher.

Also, the nwn2db forum provides some threads about game bugs. You can find the link in my signature.

Modifié par GFallen01, 11 juillet 2012 - 03:27 .

[Arkalezth]

Pain did some fix to UC, yes. And Improved Uncanny Dodge... works "somewhat"? How so? I've read all kind of comments about it, I was under the impression that it worked, but I can't say I've tested it throughfully.

GFallen01 = Riverside01?

[GFallen01]

GFallen01 = Riverside01?

Yes. There's another GFallen here at bioware social, but it's not me. I also use the name in the vault and nexus.

Modifié par GFallen01, 11 juillet 2012 - 03:29 .

[I_Raps]

Arkalezth wrote...

And Improved Uncanny Dodge... works "somewhat"? How so? I've read all kind of comments about it, I was under the impression that it worked, but I can't say I've tested it throughfully.

When I said it "works somewhat," I may have been giving it too much credit.  The feats do give some sort of bonus to Reflex Saves - but that's Kaedrin's version,  the basic version may not do anything.

As for painofdungeoneternal's fix:

manageri wrote...

Ok, so simply starting the game with the NeverLauncher is enough to enable the fix, and will it work for games already in progress?

painofdungeoneternal wrote...

No its a NWNx thing, so you have to run the game with the server program instead of the regular game. I got one specific feature working, but overall i have quite a bit left to do ( hence the term prototype in the linked thread ), but the nwnx plugins are finished, the remaining steps are related to getting these things usable in SP and not limited just to PWs which generally have much better methods for modding the game.

I am working on making it so you can easily do this setup and play a single player game, and for it to behave as far as you are concerned as a single player game. Right now it's mostly usable by PW's, but as i progress with that never launcher it will get easier and easier to set up a server, which is part of my goals, to make it so it's not any harder than turning on a light switch because my program is doing all the hard work for you besides hitting a button.

I think his launcher is now usable for single-players, but that's a big mod to add.  If I have overlooked a version that doesn't require the launcher, I wish you would point me to it.  Not only did I miss it coming out, I can't find anything like that now.

p.s.  it's painofdungeoneternal that leads me to say that it can't be fixed (conventionally):

painofdungeoneternal wrote...

I have a working fix to uncanny dodge which i am testing.

Note its controllable via variable on the player, so it can be blocked when they are in armor or encumbered.

This requires NWNX, and the xp_fix plugin i am working on. You cannot touch it in scripting really.

Kaedrin said much the same on his site.

Modifié par I_Raps, 11 juillet 2012 - 05:56 .

[Artas1984]

Let's return to BLIND FIGHT please!

Is there a fix that completely fixes blind fight? I mean a fix that allows to fight when blinded?
Because when i am blinded after sunrays, i can not do a thing - just move around like an idiot. Feeling realy pissed of about it, since i DELIBERATELY learn all my companions the blind fight feat, and this is what i get - get blinded by my own spells???..........

I swear, if there won't be any fix for this feat, i am going to uninstall the game, all the fun is ruined to me if get blinded by my own spell versus which i should have protection. The absurd of this also is that i get blinded even though my will and fortitude are over 30 (one of them SHOULD negate this - another bug?).

Modifié par Artas1984, 29 juillet 2012 - 05:35 .

[kamal_]

Artas1984 wrote...

Let's return to BLIND FIGHT please!

Is there a fix that completely fixes blind fight? I mean a fix that allows to fight when blinded?
Because when i am blinded after sunrays, i can not do a thing - just move around like an idiot. Feeling realy pissed of about it, since i DELIBERATELY learn all my companions the blind fight feat, and this is what i get - get blinded by my own spells???..........

I swear, if there won't be any fix for this feat, i am going to uninstall the game, all the fun is ruined to me if get blinded by my own spell versus which i should have protection. The absurd of this also is that i get blinded even though my will and fortitude are over 30 (one of them SHOULD negate this - another bug?).

Sounds like you're playing at the "friendly fire on" difficulty level. Also, blind fight doesn't make you not blind, it makes you able to fight more effectively while not able to see your opponent. It's not really bugged, it doesn't do what you think it does. nwn2.wikia.com/wiki/Blind_Fight

[Arkalezth]

If such a fix exists, I don't know about it.

If the issue is friendly fire, maybe you should start being more careful with those spells. Do you also complain about taking damage after fireballing yourself?

You were told by several people that Blind Fight doesn't prevent you from getting blinded. If, after that, you still took it to not get blinded... well, what can I say?

Again, blindness apart, it's a very useful feat and a must for meleers, so it's definitely not a waste regardless of the protection, or lack of, from blindness.

[Artas1984]

Perhaps i should not learn the blindness feat, but instead one of my spellcasters should learn the spell blindsight? Would that compensate the feat?

Also which save prevents from being blinded and how much do you need of it?

Modifié par Artas1984, 29 juillet 2012 - 06:44 .

[Arkalezth]

AFAIK, Blindsight won't protect you either. I actually can't think of any kind of "blindness immunity", if there's any, I don't remember/know.

The description of Sunburst (if that's the spell you mean) mentions reflex. "How much you need" depends on how good the caster is, but saves won't make you immune to it unless you have very high saves and Epic Resilience.

We can rant about feats, spells, saves, or whatever, but really, the best and easiest way to avoid getting affected by your own spells is to not cast them on yourself, or just use non-friendly fire ones. If you still insist on doing it, you'll have to deal with the consequences. Blame Obsidian for the bugs, but not for a silly playstyle.

Modifié par Arkalezth, 29 juillet 2012 - 06:59 .

[I_Raps]

As long as this topic is back up ...

I have pretty much concluded that BLIND FIGHT doesn't actually do anything, not even the re-swing against concealed targets. I have never seen the slightest evidence that it works, and after another hour in M.'s V. I'm convinced that it doesn't. I would never take it again for any character.


[edit]  The above is no longer operative.  I decided that instead of relying on my impressions, I could just run a statistical test.  I used Kaelyn without, then with Ilrah's Rib, since she's basically off-the-rack.  The ratio of 
                                                                              (hits):(concealment misses)
was very substantially higher with the rib (which grants Blind Fight for those who didn't know).  It was a small sample (about 40 swings before and 40 after) so I wouldn't say it's definitive, but enough to toss out my earlier certainty that Blind Fight is useless.

Modifié par I_Raps, 29 juillet 2012 - 09:55 .

[MasterChanger]

Artas1984 wrote...

Let's return to BLIND FIGHT please!

Is there a fix that completely fixes blind fight? I mean a fix that allows to fight when blinded?
Because when i am blinded after sunrays, i can not do a thing - just move around like an idiot. Feeling realy pissed of about it, since i DELIBERATELY learn all my companions the blind fight feat, and this is what i get - get blinded by my own spells???..........

I swear, if there won't be any fix for this feat, i am going to uninstall the game, all the fun is ruined to me if get blinded by my own spell versus which i should have protection. The absurd of this also is that i get blinded even though my will and fortitude are over 30 (one of them SHOULD negate this - another bug?).

The underlying issue isn't really blindness, it's the invisibility code. A character that is blind has to treat all other characters as invisible. Unfortunately 1.23 introduced an issue where an invisible character often can't be attacked at all, even from close range where the character can be seen as an outline.

Fixing invisibility is something that would be possible if the community can get the source code, or maybe even with NWNX4 (currently mostly used for PWs, may soon be more easily used in single-player).

Barring that, you've got a few options. If you like to use Area of Effect spells, either aim more carefully and conservatively or use Normal rather than Hardcore difficulty (to make AoEs not hit friendlies). Also, Kaedrin's newest pack will/does include a feat that allows casters to not hit friendlies with AoEs.

Alternatively, you can not use the Sunbeam/Sunburst spells. Just like they prevent your characters from attacking in 1.23, they prevent enemies from attacking as well, making the spells more powerful than they should be. Or you could have a cleric memorize a few Remove Blindness/Deafness spells or a druid memorize Restoration and just remove those effects as necessary.

[I_Raps]

Artas1984 wrote...

Perhaps i should not learn the blindness feat, but instead one of my spellcasters should learn the spell blindsight? Would that compensate the feat?

Also which save prevents from being blinded and how much do you need of it?

Three possibilities:

(1)  Better aim
(2)  Remove Blindness
(3)  Easier Difficulty Level

A fourth if you don't mind significant editing:

(4)  Make yourself an item with a unique script that grants immunity to the blindness effect, and use it when appropriate.

Modifié par I_Raps, 29 juillet 2012 - 07:24 .

[GFallen01]

I_Raps wrote...

As long as this topic is back up ...

I have pretty much concluded that BLIND FIGHT doesn't actually do anything, not even the re-swing against concealed targets. I have never seen the slightest evidence that it works, and after another hour in M.'s V. I'm convinced that it doesn't. I would never take it again for any character.

I don't know what you mean by "M.'s V.", but I'm pretty confident Blind Fight does work for ranged and melee weapons, unsure about touch attacks. You just don't see the reroll messages in the combat log.

What I did to check it is use Mith's Hall of Training, and fight the Combat Dummy. Concealment preset to 50%, AC 10, and use the console or an editor to give and remove blind fight to the same character. Then crunch the numbers.

I have also heard Mith mention Blind Fight doesn't work with Knockdown rolls - so if you have Displacement together with Mirror Image (that randomly absorbs them), you should be pretty much immune to it.

Modifié par GFallen01, 29 juillet 2012 - 10:26 .

[I_Raps]

GFallen01 wrote...

I don't know what you mean by "M.'s V.", but I'm pretty confident Blind Fight does work for ranged and melee weapons, unsure about touch attacks. You just don't see the reroll messages in the combat log.

"M.'s V" is a location in MOTB, but this is a no-spoiler forum, so ...

As for the rest, yes, I already reversed course above.

"Post posthaste, repent pensively."

[Dann-J]

I was annoyed when I found out a while back that Blind Fight didn't do what it's description advertises (that is, allow you to fight when actually blinded). I have a blind companion in an upcoming module, and I was hoping that Blind Fight and a high listen skill would compensate for their lack of vision. However initiating attacks was still impossible when blinded even with Blind Fight. Although a blinded character has no trouble running up to a non-hostile and initiating a conversation.

It seems the only thing that can counteract blindness (short of a Remove Blindness/Deafness spell) is True Seeing. Blind Fight only seems to improve the odds against targets with partial concealment.