55 réponses à ce sujet

[eroeru]

I saw a thread with this title on the GOG.com forum, and instantly thought about a reply:

I've an idea - why not reverse the idea you're against and implement an
option of assigning a myriad of quests to your henchmen. Most quests
would serve the purpose of giving them more XP and loot/gear, some would
trigger unique dialogue, and maybe more story. And it would be specific
to the character you assigned quests to. The characters would gain
different stuff, and perform differently depending on their abilities.


Also, it's optional to play them through, but most would be rather
simple fetch-quests with some story and post-quest cut-scenes attached
to them.

Just an idea I had when reading the topic title
and instantly thinking about one of my most frequent thoughts - what would have
made DA2 more interesting. :happy:

[Dio Demon]

So something like Assassin's Creed Brotherhood/Revelations? I don't really see it working well, the main character is the main focus point in the specific game, and can't have the story branching off for different companions unless the main character is involved.

Perhaps they could be special missions where your character accompanies your companion/s to do a special quest, and they could have certain restrictions such as a set party for the mission. That's how I see it could work ... for now

[Dio Demon]

As for the errand boy bit, this can easily be fixed if the main character is given personal motivation for something, such as Bandits kidnapped your Mabari that you love ever so much, or someone said something bad about your hair and you go out for revenge.

[David Gaider]

I like the idea of assigning quests to henchmen... in theory.

If you had to play through (either as those henchmen or as the player accompanying those henchmen), then that's really no different than doing the quest yourself. A different context, perhaps, but is the issue simply being the errand boy or doing quests that make you feel like an errand boy?

Meanwhile, if you sent henchmen off to do quests without you, we run into a problem of a different sort-- namely one of quest design. Such side quests exist, after all, to provide content for the player. If the player feels the content isn't worth doing, that's a different problem... but it's not one that you eliminate by letting the player skip, as then what's the point of including the content in the first place? You replace what's essentially cheap content with very expensive content (dialogue, meaning we must now discuss the experience which you didn't think was worth doing yourself).

If there was content that was specifically set up this way, as in the player simply can't go and do these quests-- he has to send a follower/henchmen and they "do" the quest on their own... that might be a little different. You're not telling them to do quests you could otherwise do yourself, but it's instead a mechanic of its own. So that might be something. It certainly wouldn't be cheap (especially if you talked to them about these quests they're doing), but it might have some interesting flavor.

[Cimeas]

Sort of like how SW:TOR did crew skills, are you saying? Like you click a panel and send your companion off do a mission and they come back with exp/gear/etc..

[Master Shiori]

David Gaider wrote...

A different context, perhaps, but is the issue simply being the errand boy or doing quests that make you feel like an errand boy?

The issue, at least for me, is that fetch quests are stand alone and don't tie into anything bigger. In short, it feels like the writers didn't really know what to do, so they added the "pick a random pile of bones in this mine and then bring it to that certain person in Kirkwall who you've never met before" to fill in space and have players do something just for the sake of being busy.

A good example of fetch quests done right would be finding the Urn of Sacred Ashes in DA:O and bringing it back to Redcliffe. There's a good reason why your character is looking for this item and it actually ties into the overall storyline.

Not every fetch quest needs to be on such a scale or have the same importance to overall plot, but there should definitely be a better reason as to why our character is doing it, other than extra gold and experience points.

Modifié par Master Shiori, 10 juillet 2012 - 02:44 .

[TonberryFeye]

I don't mind the odd fetch quest in moderation, especially when it makes sense. "The Chantry requests a donation of 20 health poultices." is a good example. They aren't asking the saviour of the world to do a mundane task... but said saviour can do it if they happen to have the items on hand.

One I spotted in Awakening that I liked was hunting down the mages in Amaranthine. I liked that you could turn around to the Templar and say "why don't you do it yourself?" or words to that effect, and she gives a good answer. She is alone - one templar (and a newly recruited one at that) against half a dozen apostates. In short, she believes she'd die in the attempt, and is looking for mercenaries to get the job done.

However, too many of these 'quests' in DA2 felt pointless. You find a bottle of turpentine on the floor and somehow you magically know that some random idiot will pay you 50 silver for it. That makes no sense, and it's clearly a timewasting exercise. Hell, the entire Act 1 can be said to be a timewasting exercise, since there's no actual plot to it; you just do sidequests and fetchquests until you have enough money to carry on with the game proper.

[hero 2]

While I like the idea of changing main characters for a while, I think the player might lose focus. Who's the protagonist? And why bother creating a hero if he's just going to stand in a pub all day?

On Tonberry's example, it might be nice if you could tell someone "no" and there is a repercussion, perhaps someone doesn't survive to give you a buff for the final boss fight. Or maybe the repercussion is a GOOD outcome... maybe someone settled their differences in a peaceful way and became friends. For once.

Modifié par hero 2, 10 juillet 2012 - 02:44 .

[eroeru]

David Gaider wrote...

If there was content that was specifically set up this way, as in the player simply can't go and do these quests-- he has to send a follower/henchmen and they "do" the quest on their own... that might be a little different. You're not telling them to do quests you could otherwise do yourself, but it's instead a mechanic of its own. So that might be something. It certainly wouldn't be cheap (especially if you talked to them about these quests they're doing), but it might have some interesting flavor.

Thank you for your reply!

Well, basically, what motivated the thought was the seemingly original aspect of giving followers more involvement to the gameplay, via meaningful

1. character-management (thinking of who to assign to quests, and whom to level-up more than the others - for example, you'll not get to do the main storyline with those you've assigned to other quests, yet they'll all have side-quests more fitting to their talents),

2. side-character development (you'd maybe get more "reputation" or special stats/abilities/skills to companions), and

3. character-and-quest-specific cutscenes (which could mesh with specific "reputation" systems and would give them more personality in an original way).

Maybe I'm not thinking of a underlying mechanic, nor a significant improvement, it's much more of a question of originality to the genre.
Also, whilst 'tis an ok idea, I was not vouching for a system where you play as followers instead of your main. Instead I thought of it as a shematic for giving new dimensions to side-character development and quests in general. Via a thoughtful, logical, yet natural-seeming way to progress henchmen, their stories, and giving some significance to the choices themselves, thus involving the main char (the main story and interactions would be affected by the choices for these so-called sidequests).

If I'm at all making sense here.


an edit: I certainly agree with your view on having these quests unavailable to the main char. Yet they should affect the main storyline, and companion capabilities, maybe even their personalities.

Modifié par eroeru, 10 juillet 2012 - 03:48 .

[EpicBoot2daFace]

I think fetch quests are incredibly boring. I hate having to do them in ME3. I wish they weren't tied to war assets. What was BioWare thinking?

[eroeru]

Cimeas wrote...

Sort of like how SW:TOR did crew skills, are you saying? Like you click a panel and send your companion off do a mission and they come back with exp/gear/etc..

Maybe..

I haven't gotten myself to play that game properly.

Either way, whilst "my" idea sounds a bit detached from the concept of the "real" game or main storyline, I think it's also got some potential.

Modifié par eroeru, 10 juillet 2012 - 03:40 .

[Chipaway111]

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

I think fetch quests are incredibly boring. I hate having to do them in ME3. I wish they weren't tied to war assets. What was BioWare thinking?

Obviously that batarian relic I forgot the name of was incredibly vital to the several refugees crammed into an empty cargo container, so vital that it would help take back a planet that was under siege by giant space bugs. 

On a related note however, fetch quests are alright if they're relevant or valid. I don't know how to put this, as I'm not very good with words but for example: Such-and-such needs this useless piece of crap because if they were to get it maybe down the line they'd be nicer and help with [insert dramatic point here]. 

Like I said, not good with words. Just not anything that makes me think I'm doing, err... p**** tasking quests. 

[mitthrawuodo]

This sounds more like a strategy game with rpg elements than a rpg

[hero 2]

This topic could be so much bigger than the OP intended.

[Turid]

I don't mind being an errand girl here and there. But it's not that entertaining to deliver sth to someone who doesn't turn around and look at me to say thanks. Audible, not swallowed in an accidentally wrong camera angle. In that case I'd rather bring it to Bonny Lem's lost property office.

What if the player could send a henchman by drawing the item on his portrait, short sentence and response, prompt reaction. henchman leaves the team, could turn out as a bad idea to cross the level with a smaller cast.

[LeBurns]

BG2 sort of had this idea when you became head of the Thieves Guild and could collect from your underlings each week a part of their take.

It is an overall problem though. Even in Skyrim you can be the head of a faction and your new extra duties are nothing more than doing fetch quests for your underlings. Why the heck would I want to do that if I'm the faction leader? Once a leader of a faction there ought to be a group of underling NPC's assigned to you and you can tell them what to do. Like "Bring me 300 gold this week or I'll tie you to the wheel of shame!", or something like that.

[ashwind]

Why not simply remove mindless & meaningless fetch quest all together?

I never feel like an errand boy doing those fetch quest, I feel more like a dog...

[Sarcastic Tasha]

I like the idea of playing as main character's companions for some of the side quests. One of my favourite quests in Origins was breaking the warden out of the dungeon.

[Eternal Phoenix]

ashwind wrote...

Why not simply remove mindless & meaningless fetch quest all together?

This is a good idea. I like this.

[eroeru]

Elton John is dead wrote...

ashwind wrote...

Why not simply remove mindless & meaningless fetch quest all together?

This is a good idea. I like this.

I concur.

[Melca36]

I'd rather see more quests like Magistrates Orders or Raiders on the Cliffs than those FedEx quests.

While it may work in ME it was just ridiculous in DA2.

I do think if there are to be Fetch Quests, there should be an NPC in the Black Emporium that requests specific items and you can get XP and some sort of armor or weapon upgrade.

[cdtrk65]

TonberryFeye wrote...


However, too many of these 'quests' in DA2 felt pointless. You find a bottle of turpentine on the floor and somehow you magically know that some random idiot will pay you 50 silver for it. That makes no sense, and it's clearly a timewasting exercise. Hell, the entire Act 1 can be said to be a timewasting exercise, since there's no actual plot to it; you just do sidequests and fetchquests until you have enough money to carry on with the game proper.

I disagee about act 1..Hawke had a decent enough motovation to be running around doing fetch quest, and the openning act introduced us to the main characters of the story.

I can agree the magically knowning someone need a bottle of turpentine was a bit of a stretch though.

[EricHVela]

There is a quest (Act II and III from the same person) where they tell Hawke what they need. To me, that's many times better than finding some random item and giving it to some random person without knowing any reason why they want it, what they'll do with it and how Hawke knew where to find the person.

Only one person comments on how odd it seems that Hawke "just stumbled across" the item (and inexplicably calls someone a bunch of "fools").