235 réponses à ce sujet

[Casticus]

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

Modifié par Casticus, 12 juillet 2012 - 01:51 .

[Dusen]

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

[TheShadowWolf911]

Dusen wrote...

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

wait, Didn't Ashley say in the first game you wouldn't be getting her into thigh high boots and miniskirts?

THEY CONTRADICTED HER!

[Mr.House]

TheShadowWolf911 wrote...

Dusen wrote...

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

wait, Didn't Ashley say in the first game you wouldn't be getting her into thigh high boots and miniskirts?

THEY CONTRADICTED HER!

No. She says the only way would be getting her dinner first.

[naes1984]

Casticus wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

If we were to rewrite this to make the coup plot make sense then Udina would be trying to assasinate the dalatrass and primarch and matriarchs secretly with Cerberus help and replace them with more easily manipulated candidates who would then tell the councilors what to do.

[Shaleist]

Vega was believable. And yeah I liked Vega, I understand there is always a need for 'New Blood' in games/TV series etc. So he's an idiot!? So what, idiots exist and he was well presented as a simple grunt on steroids.

[Casticus]

Shaleist wrote...

Vega was believable. And yeah I liked Vega, I understand there is always a need for 'New Blood' in games/TV series etc. So he's an idiot!? So what, idiots exist and he was well presented as a simple grunt on steroids.

I thought Vega was a solid enough character. No complaints really, and much more believable than Udina was.

[Apple Lantern]

Udina is the guy we love to hate. That said, I did not expect the coup attempt. It doesn't make any sense. The guy may be a ******, but he's a smart ******, and he probably realizes that something like that coup would make gaining the cross species alliance impossible.

I still enjoyed putting that bullet in him.

[ADLegend21]

Mr.House wrote...

Allers.

Liara.

[Dusen]

Mr.House wrote...

TheShadowWolf911 wrote...

Dusen wrote...

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

wait, Didn't Ashley say in the first game you wouldn't be getting her into thigh high boots and miniskirts?

THEY CONTRADICTED HER!

No. She says the only way would be getting her dinner first.

Hmm, so she was going on dinner dates and who knows what else with Anderson those two years my Shepard was dead. That explains how she jumped rank so quickly too! That skank!

[Dusen]

Mr.House wrote...

TheShadowWolf911 wrote...

Dusen wrote...

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

wait, Didn't Ashley say in the first game you wouldn't be getting her into thigh high boots and miniskirts?

THEY CONTRADICTED HER!

No. She says the only way would be getting her dinner first.

In all seriousness though, they really did assassinate her character.

Modifié par Dusen, 12 juillet 2012 - 01:59 .

[jijeebo]

That woman with the red hair at the start who says the important people are ready to see us.

Suffice to say I did not believe that those people were in fact ready.

[M2S SOLID JOSH]

udina and kai lang was pretty terrible. jacob was completely laughable XD

[Mr.House]

Dusen wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

TheShadowWolf911 wrote...

Dusen wrote...

Frankly, a lot of characters experienced some form of character assassination. Whether it be Ashley's sudden love for high heels and miniskirts, Udina's backstabbing betrayels, TIM's retardation or Shepard's fixation on a meaningless child's death and his sudden lack of a spine or memory (how does he forget about peace between the geth and quarians at the very moment where it counts?) while confronting the enemy at the end. It's honestly hard to pick one.

wait, Didn't Ashley say in the first game you wouldn't be getting her into thigh high boots and miniskirts?

THEY CONTRADICTED HER!

No. She says the only way would be getting her dinner first.

In all seriousness though, they really did assassinate her character.

She's only in character if you romance her. :innocent:

[Dusen]

naes1984 wrote...

Casticus wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

If we were to rewrite this to make the coup plot make sense then Udina would be trying to assasinate the dalatrass and primarch and matriarchs secretly with Cerberus help and replace them with more easily manipulated candidates who would then tell the councilors what to do.

I would have Cerberus perform the coup on their own and in order to redeem Udina in our eyes he would die saving the other councilors from Kai Leng (of course if I was rewriting it I wouldn't have Kai Leng in the entire game).

[AngryFrozenWater]

Mr.House wrote...

Allers.

Yeah. I think BW crossed the line with that one.

[Mr.House]

Dusen wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Casticus wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

If we were to rewrite this to make the coup plot make sense then Udina would be trying to assasinate the dalatrass and primarch and matriarchs secretly with Cerberus help and replace them with more easily manipulated candidates who would then tell the councilors what to do.

I would have Cerberus perform the coup on their own and in order to redeem Udina in our eyes he would die saving the other councilors from Kai Leng (of course if I was rewriting it I wouldn't have Kai Leng in the entire game).

And Shepard be sad about Udina dieing? HELL no!

[naes1984]

Mr.House wrote...

Dusen wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Casticus wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

If we were to rewrite this to make the coup plot make sense then Udina would be trying to assasinate the dalatrass and primarch and matriarchs secretly with Cerberus help and replace them with more easily manipulated candidates who would then tell the councilors what to do.

I would have Cerberus perform the coup on their own and in order to redeem Udina in our eyes he would die saving the other councilors from Kai Leng (of course if I was rewriting it I wouldn't have Kai Leng in the entire game).

And Shepard be sad about Udina dieing? HELL no!

I think the problem with Cerberus is that if they do anything stupid then the writers can just say well they were indoctrinated from the start and so they don't have to come up with logical reasons for their behavior.

[fr33stylez]

naes1984 wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Dusen wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Casticus wrote...

naes1984 wrote...

Udina's plan makes no sense. Killing the ambassadors of other countries doesn't mean you suddenly get to run their military. There's no reality in which that makes sense. The leaders would just appoint a new ambassador. The Council representatives are not the actual leaders of those species. For example, the turian ambassador is not the primarch and the salarian ambassador is not the dalatrass. Think about it. If the US ambassador to Japan gets killed, the president just appoints a new one. Japan wouldn't get to run things. It's bad writing and they can explain it away with "High level indoctrination or whatever."

Exactly. I've been saying this forever. Even if Udina was the sole Councilor, that would just mean that the other aliens would no longer view the Council as legitimate, and would simply form a new Council with or without humans. The very least damage that could possibly be sustained by this action is either Udina's death or arrest. The very worst would be the ostracization of humanity from the Council races, since humanity has no real government to represent it besides Udina.

If we were to rewrite this to make the coup plot make sense then Udina would be trying to assasinate the dalatrass and primarch and matriarchs secretly with Cerberus help and replace them with more easily manipulated candidates who would then tell the councilors what to do.

I would have Cerberus perform the coup on their own and in order to redeem Udina in our eyes he would die saving the other councilors from Kai Leng (of course if I was rewriting it I wouldn't have Kai Leng in the entire game).

And Shepard be sad about Udina dieing? HELL no!

I think the problem with Cerberus is that if they do anything stupid then the writers can just say well they were indoctrinated from the start and so they don't have to come up with logical reasons for their behavior.

What I found amazing is how Cerberus raised a super army made up of cilivians and refugees and somehow made them into huskified snipers, engineers, and experienced tacticians on the battlefield.

That was amazing.

[someguy1231]

Udina - obvious

Diana Allers -again, obvious

Vega - just some new guy introduced without explanation and with Shepard somehow already knowing him

Kai Leng - He's more like a plot device than a character

Cerberus as a whole - I hated levels where I was fighting Cerberus because I always felt Bioware pigeonholed them to be another enemy in this game, when it would be very much in Cerberus's interests to make a truce to fight the Reapers. This pretty much broke my suspension of disbelief.

Catalyst - VERY obvious...

[naes1984]

"What I found amazing is how Cerberus raised a super army made up of cilivians and refugees and somehow made them into huskified snipers, engineers, and experienced tacticians on the battlefield. That was amazing."



Not only that but they did it in 6 months between ME2 and ME3. Remember that at the end of ME2, EDI tells you exactly how large Cerberus is and it is no more than a half a dozen task oriented cells that the Illusive Man can supervise personally. I think the way they handled Cerberus was pretty botched in ME3 because they lose their ambiguity. In the 1st game they are bad guys. In the 2nd game you find that maybe there's more to them. In the third game you find out Nope they were 100X worse than you thought.

Modifié par naes1984, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:17 .

[Casticus]

someguy1231 wrote...

Udina - obvious

Diana Allers -again, obvious

Vega - just some new guy introduced without explanation and with Shepard somehow already knowing him

Kai Leng - He's more like a plot device than a character

Cerberus as a whole - I hated levels where I was fighting Cerberus because I always felt Bioware pigeonholed them to be another enemy in this game, when it would be very much in Cerberus's interests to make a truce to fight the Reapers. This pretty much broke my suspension of disbelief.

Catalyst - VERY obvious...

there's nothing unbelievable about Allers or Vega. Kai Leng is just a terrible character who has cutscene god status. But nothing he does is actually unbelievable. Cerberus isn't a character. The Catalyst? meh

Modifié par Casticus, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:17 .

[grey_wind]

naes1984 wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Anvos wrote...

James Vega

There was absolutly no reason to randomly throw in an entirely new squad mate this deep into shepard's story. Honestly I might have found as much use out of the secruity chief from the citadel as a squad mate as I did him.

How is he not believable?

It is actually quite believeable that you might have someone new on the Normandy and some of your previous companions are off doing their own things. People just don't tend to like Vega. I thought he was ok.

Just because it was believable doesn't make it good storytelling.