235 réponses à ce sujet

[nitefyre410]

The Angry One wrote...

Udina's sudden turn to Stupid Evil was ridiculous and based entirely on the fact that people didn't like him.
How gratuitous. I'll tell you what, I didn't like him. But this didn't make him a bad, expendable character. Sometimes the people you don't like are the ones who are the most effective.

This is the same developer that gave us Bhelen in DA:O after all. Sure, different teams but you think some concepts would rub off and all.

This was Udina's chance to shine. Suddenly promoted to the most powerful human political figure in the galaxy (seeing as everyone else died) and faced with the Reaper war. But no, he's going to stage a coup, join Cerberus and be an idiot for no real reason.

 

Its the same reason TIM was in turned into  another "Saren"   for the sake of having Cerebus act as a canon fodder army  for MP. 

[Shallyah]

Kyuhyun wrote...

Shallyah wrote...

Kyuhyun wrote...

Liara changes her personality every 2 minutes so it would be her for me

That does not make her least lovable, just badly written, as many other things that came from Mac Walters (JamesVega, ME3 ending...).

Lest lovable for me would be Udina. Even when he was on my side of the court I constantly felt like kicking him on the nuts.

Oh no, i wasn't saying i hate her or anything. Just that she's the least -believable- character for me. Not the least lovable

Hehe, I just woke up and totally read "Least lovable character".

Need to wash my eyes before making a fool of myself.

The post is partly saved as Udina is probably also the character I find least believable. 

[Henioo]

I think the idea was great, but executed poorly.

Udina had enough of Council and their anti-human bull. He knew they wouldn't take action unless forced to. So he forced them.

He wanted to help Earth, but the stubborn council was useless. So he contacted Cerberus to help him take control of the council's resources which he'd then use to help Earth.

Too bad it wasn't really shown. He came off as either indocrinated or a Cerberus puppet.

Modifié par Henioo, 12 juillet 2012 - 11:28 .

[Kyuhyun]

Pockydon wrote...

Kai Leng had no place in the ME universe and is a generally dumb and stupid character. I vote Kai Leng!

No.

[MattFini]

jreezy wrote...

Jack.

Whaaaa????  Surely you jest.

I'm going to echo the Udina sentiment in this thread.  I couldn't buy his second act character retcon and while I'll admit that the Citadel coup is exciting from a gameplay standpoint, as soon as you stop to think about it, it's largely incoherent and nonsensical. 

[BiO]

I still don't see why people compare TIM to Saren. The first one wanted to harness the power of the Reapers and dominate them, whereas the second one wanted to find a means for this cycle's species to NOT get turned into reaper goo, and become willing slaves. Am I missing something here?





On topic- I'd say it's Liara for me.

Modifié par BiO_MaN, 12 juillet 2012 - 11:44 .

[The Angry One]

Henioo wrote...

I think the idea was great, but executed poorly.

Udina had enough of Council and their anti-human bull. He knew they wouldn't take action unless forced to. So he forced them.

He wanted to help Earth, but the stubborn council was useless. So he contacted Cerberus to help him take control of the council's resources which he'd then use to help Earth.

Too bad it wasn't really shown. He came off as either indocrinated or a Cerberus puppet.

Even then, that makes little sense. Udina should have the brains to know that the Citadel fleet alone is going to get shredded by the Reapers. The Council isn't doing nothing because they're unconcerned, they're doing nothing because they're not idiots.

And why the hell would the Asari and Turian commanders in the fleet obey a suicidal order from the guy who's just orchestrated a coup against their councilors?

Modifié par The Angry One, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:09 .

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Kai Leng, Udina and Catalyst I guess.

"EDIT"

Also need to add TIM to the list.

Modifié par Lizardviking, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:11 .

[drinkurmilk]

BiO_MaN wrote...

I still don't see why people compare TIM to Saren. The first one wanted to harness the power of the Reapers and dominate them, whereas the second one wanted to find a means for this cycle's species to NOT get turned into reaper goo, and become willing slaves. Am I missing something here?





On topic- I'd say it's Liara for me.

I entirely agree with the TIM/Saren sentiment.  Their photocopy demise has opened up unjust comparison.

Liara, however, is far from being the worst written character.

Modifié par chrisutd, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:16 .

[Xilizhra]

He's regarded as de facto deputy to Shepard due to his leadership qualities, so I'd like to see some more insight into that. If not 'challenge' Shepard, at least question him/her.

He does, in the wake of curing the genophage. That was actually quite a good "second-in-command" moment.

Also, I wish the Udina thing was better explained, but I don't really consider it awful. I might consider Kai Leng the least believable character, but I honestly consider him having a kind of campy charm. I mean, he's a trenchcoat-wearing space ninja; it's stupid, but I consider it an endearing kind of stupid.

[MB957]

shiny boy star baby gets my vote for most useless character.

yeah...I felt they messed up udina. I mean...I saw him as a bit off the bubble, with a strong sense of duty. he was a politician, and played by those rules, but I didnt see him as a weak and desperate traitor.

but then, maybe that was what bioware wanted to show...that sometimes, extreme things change people. and that change...can sometimes be better...and sometimes not.

[The Angry One]

MB957 wrote...

shiny boy star baby gets my vote for most useless character.

yeah...I felt they messed up udina. I mean...I saw him as a bit off the bubble, with a strong sense of duty. he was a politician, and played by those rules, but I didnt see him as a weak and desperate traitor.

but then, maybe that was what bioware wanted to show...that sometimes, extreme things change people. and that change...can sometimes be better...and sometimes not.

To even call spacebaby a character is an insult to all characters everywhere.

[Henioo]

The Angry One wrote...

Even then, that makes little sense. Udina should have the brains to know that the Citadel fleet alone is going to get shredded by the Reapers.

Alone, yes. But to have the citadel fleet is an advantage in comparison to not having it.

The Angry One wrote...

The Council isn't doing nothing because they're unconcerned, they're doing nothing because they're not idiots.

This is arguable. You could say the same for the way they've been responding to Reapers for the past two and a half years, i.e. calling Shepard mentally ill.

The Angry One wrote...

And why the hell would the Asari and Turian commanders in the fleet obey a suicidal order from the guy who's just orchestrated a coup against their councilors?

Of course, they wouldn't know it was a coup. Udina would heroically be the only one to survive.

Modifié par Henioo, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:29 .

[drinkurmilk]

Xilizhra wrote...

He's regarded as de facto deputy to Shepard due to his leadership qualities, so I'd like to see some more insight into that. If not 'challenge' Shepard, at least question him/her.

He does, in the wake of curing the genophage. That was actually quite a good "second-in-command" moment.

Also, I wish the Udina thing was better explained, but I don't really consider it awful. I might consider Kai Leng the least believable character, but I honestly consider him having a kind of campy charm. I mean, he's a trenchcoat-wearing space ninja; it's stupid, but I consider it an endearing kind of stupid.

Is this exclusive to curing the genophage?

The sabotage scene with Garrus -- which is the one I had -- was one of my personal highlights in the game, though I wouldn't consider it challenging Shepard's authority.  Having said that I appreciate that Garrus is by now, three games in, duteous to Shepard.  Any kind of disobedience would have to have been earlier on in the first game.  Perhaps further questioning Shep's allegiance to Cerberus in the second game.

Kai Leng was a disappointment.  ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng. 

Ah well, at least the art team did a fantastic job with him

[Xilizhra]

ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng.

But was still better than the vasepeeing Cereal Killer in Deception.

[drinkurmilk]

Xilizhra wrote...

ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng.

But was still better than the vasepeeing Cereal Killer in Deception.

Deception? What's that?

[Xilizhra]

chrisutd wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng.

But was still better than the vasepeeing Cereal Killer in Deception.

Deception? What's that?

The last ME novel, and it's an experience, to say the least.

[nitefyre410]

Xilizhra wrote...

chrisutd wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng.

But was still better than the vasepeeing Cereal Killer in Deception.

Deception? What's that?

The last ME novel, and it's an experience, to say the least.

 

How people were able to make it through that book I will never know... I read the google doc  and  my head hurt

[MadCat221]

Udina was acting in desperation, which is classically known for causing bad decisions.

My vote goes for Kai Leng. He induces cutscene incompetence in Shepard that Shep should be utterly incapable of, he's a completely flat character, and all his capabilities are based on being superultrakewl instead of fitting in the frame of the MEverse. He should have died when he landed on the CSEC squad car, but instead of inverting the car and making Kai Lame have a long drop... Shep pops the side door and fires at Lame with a freakin' peashooter gun.

But Lame's most egregious offense?  His "Oh!  I win!" moment on Thessia.  It doesn't matter if you were beating him like the little b&#$ he is with charge-nova... he suddenly wins.

Kai Lame infuriates me like no other character.  He's not a villain you love to hate, he is cheap and totally extraneous to the plot.

My second vote goes for Allers. Completely flat character, suffers from Face Scan Uncanny Valley even worse than Miranda did, utterly awful voice acting, completely flat character again, and nepotizing with IGN, making their reviews of the game even more tainted than before.

Modifié par MadCat221, 12 juillet 2012 - 02:59 .

[drinkurmilk]

Xilizhra wrote...

chrisutd wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

ME3 Kai Leng paled in comparison to Retribution Kai Leng.

But was still better than the vasepeeing Cereal Killer in Deception.

Deception? What's that?

The last ME novel, and it's an experience, to say the least.

Sarcasm translates poorly on the internet.

I choose to refute the existence of this thing called 'Deception'.

[JadedLibertine]

Xilizhra wrote...

He's regarded as de facto deputy to Shepard due to his leadership qualities, so I'd like to see some more insight into that. If not 'challenge' Shepard, at least question him/her.

He does, in the wake of curing the genophage. That was actually quite a good "second-in-command" moment.

Also, I wish the Udina thing was better explained, but I don't really consider it awful. I might consider Kai Leng the least believable character, but I honestly consider him having a kind of campy charm. I mean, he's a trenchcoat-wearing space ninja; it's stupid, but I consider it an endearing kind of stupid.

You've managed to very slightly redeem that posturing nincompoop Kai Leng.  Now I can see him as a campy villain facing off against Adam West's Batman.

[Savber100]

Diana Allers.

[Krabman7]

Udina's betrayal is not a sudden thing.
They were already setting this up a long time ago.
www.usatoday.com/life/comics/2010-10-25-masseffect25_ST_N.htm

Modifié par Krabman7, 12 juillet 2012 - 03:15 .

[Kyuhyun]

MadCat221 wrote...

Udina was acting in desperation, which is classically known for causing bad decisions.

My vote goes for Kai Leng. He induces cutscene incompetence in Shepard that Shep should be utterly incapable of, he's a completely flat character, and all his capabilities are based on being superultrakewl instead of fitting in the frame of the MEverse. He should have died when he landed on the CSEC squad car, but instead of inverting the car and making Kai Lame have a long drop... Shep pops the side door and fires at Lame with a freakin' peashooter gun.

But Lame's most egregious offense?  His "Oh!  I win!" moment on Thessia.  It doesn't matter if you were beating him like the little b&#$ he is with charge-nova... he suddenly wins.

Kai Lame infuriates me like no other character.  He's not a villain you love to hate, he is cheap and totally extraneous to the plot.

My second vote goes for Allers. Completely flat character, suffers from Face Scan Uncanny Valley even worse than Miranda did, utterly awful voice acting, completely flat character again, and nepotizing with IGN, making their reviews of the game even more tainted than before.

But... i love Kai Leng. I swear i'm the only one on BSN