276 réponses à ce sujet

[Father Superior]

SinerAthin wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

MrFuddyDuddy wrote...

I wanna see this thing take out an Atlas on Gold, bare with no amps or passives and it would take something like 140 seconds of continuous fire to solo one, let alone like 5 or 6 in the later waves.

Do you have any idea how long it would take to take down a Gold Atlas solo without any other outside help like amps with other guns? Still a long f*cking time. And with the Particle Rifle, you don't need to constantly run to an ammo box while the Atlas slowly regenerates its shields back. Just because something isn't a gun for solo runs doesn't mean it isn't a good gun, it just means it fits into a different niche.

I take an Atlas down just fine with my Reegar, Claymore, Harrier etc.

Unless you can give me a list of how much time it takes every weapon to take down a Gold Atlas solo with solid visual evidence, you really haven't proven anything. Also, did you reload cancel? How many clips were used? Were the weapons equipped with Extended Mags? How often did you need to go refill your ammo supply? The Reegar and Harrier aren't exactly built for sustained combat, a niche that the Particle Rifle fits into nicely, so I imagine that you needed to refill your ammo using either a pack or physically finding the box. These are not problems that the Particle Rifle needs to deal with.

[Ashen One]

Father Superior wrote...

SinerAthin wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

MrFuddyDuddy wrote...

I wanna see this thing take out an Atlas on Gold, bare with no amps or passives and it would take something like 140 seconds of continuous fire to solo one, let alone like 5 or 6 in the later waves.

Do you have any idea how long it would take to take down a Gold Atlas solo without any other outside help like amps with other guns? Still a long f*cking time. And with the Particle Rifle, you don't need to constantly run to an ammo box while the Atlas slowly regenerates its shields back. Just because something isn't a gun for solo runs doesn't mean it isn't a good gun, it just means it fits into a different niche.

I take an Atlas down just fine with my Reegar, Claymore, Harrier etc.

Unless you can give me a list of how much time it takes every weapon to take down a Gold Atlas solo with solid visual evidence, you really haven't proven anything. Also, did you reload cancel? How many clips were used? Were the weapons equipped with Extended Mags? How often did you need to go refill your ammo supply? The Reegar and Harrier aren't exactly built for sustained combat, a niche that the Particle Rifle fits into nicely, so I imagine that you needed to refill your ammo using either a pack or physically finding the box. These are not problems that the Particle Rifle needs to deal with.

This might be true with the Reegar, but using a Claymore to take down an Atlas is easily accomplished without having to run to an ammo crate continously.

At least not when I use it...

[Brenon Holmes]

I believe the "hot" multiplier is currently something like 4x.

Modifié par Brenon Holmes, 12 juillet 2012 - 07:17 .

[Kyerea]

The title of this thread is great. XD

But yeah, SP stats = weak PR in MP.

[Father Superior]

Ashen Earth wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

SinerAthin wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

MrFuddyDuddy wrote...

I wanna see this thing take out an Atlas on Gold, bare with no amps or passives and it would take something like 140 seconds of continuous fire to solo one, let alone like 5 or 6 in the later waves.

Do you have any idea how long it would take to take down a Gold Atlas solo without any other outside help like amps with other guns? Still a long f*cking time. And with the Particle Rifle, you don't need to constantly run to an ammo box while the Atlas slowly regenerates its shields back. Just because something isn't a gun for solo runs doesn't mean it isn't a good gun, it just means it fits into a different niche.

I take an Atlas down just fine with my Reegar, Claymore, Harrier etc.

Unless you can give me a list of how much time it takes every weapon to take down a Gold Atlas solo with solid visual evidence, you really haven't proven anything. Also, did you reload cancel? How many clips were used? Were the weapons equipped with Extended Mags? How often did you need to go refill your ammo supply? The Reegar and Harrier aren't exactly built for sustained combat, a niche that the Particle Rifle fits into nicely, so I imagine that you needed to refill your ammo using either a pack or physically finding the box. These are not problems that the Particle Rifle needs to deal with.

This might be true with the Reegar, but using a Claymore to take down an Atlas is easily accomplished without having to run to an ammo crate continously.

At least not when I use it...

That's why I mentioned reload-cancelling. Without it, the Claymore would be far less popular, even with its immense damage and surprising range (SPAS-12 from MW2 anyone?). The Harrier and Reegar both suffer from comically low ammo reserves and needing to retreat back to an ammo box or waste a pack every time it is needed would be time-consuming, while the Particle Rifle's reserves are endless.

[Pakundo]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

I believe the "hot" multiplier is currently something like 4x.

And there we have it, people.

[dr octagon 3000]

Deucetipher wrote...

I like your title. Made me laugh

Me too! Nice.

[Necrotron]

And yet, somehow, I still want one.

[Broganisity]

1337haxwtg wrote...

The dps at X is 285.33. Even if it DOUBLED in damage after a certain period of time spent firing, it would still suck.

Brenon Holmes wrote...

I believe the "hot" multiplier is currently something like 4x.

I snickered to myself.

[Killmoves37]

You should plead your case to Balance King Fagnan. He may choose to buff your weapon if he pleases.

[zRz Tyr]

Best thread name ever.

[Ashen One]

Father Superior wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

SinerAthin wrote...

Father Superior wrote...

MrFuddyDuddy wrote...

I wanna see this thing take out an Atlas on Gold, bare with no amps or passives and it would take something like 140 seconds of continuous fire to solo one, let alone like 5 or 6 in the later waves.

Do you have any idea how long it would take to take down a Gold Atlas solo without any other outside help like amps with other guns? Still a long f*cking time. And with the Particle Rifle, you don't need to constantly run to an ammo box while the Atlas slowly regenerates its shields back. Just because something isn't a gun for solo runs doesn't mean it isn't a good gun, it just means it fits into a different niche.

I take an Atlas down just fine with my Reegar, Claymore, Harrier etc.

Unless you can give me a list of how much time it takes every weapon to take down a Gold Atlas solo with solid visual evidence, you really haven't proven anything. Also, did you reload cancel? How many clips were used? Were the weapons equipped with Extended Mags? How often did you need to go refill your ammo supply? The Reegar and Harrier aren't exactly built for sustained combat, a niche that the Particle Rifle fits into nicely, so I imagine that you needed to refill your ammo using either a pack or physically finding the box. These are not problems that the Particle Rifle needs to deal with.

This might be true with the Reegar, but using a Claymore to take down an Atlas is easily accomplished without having to run to an ammo crate continously.

At least not when I use it...

That's why I mentioned reload-cancelling. Without it, the Claymore would be far less popular, even with its immense damage and surprising range (SPAS-12 from MW2 anyone?). The Harrier and Reegar both suffer from comically low ammo reserves and needing to retreat back to an ammo box or waste a pack every time it is needed would be time-consuming, while the Particle Rifle's reserves are endless.

Oh trust me, I know how unpopular the Claymore would be simply from all of the "Claymore sucks" posts during the demo days of ME 3.

Truth be told, ammo is never really a problem for me with said weapons because I'm constantly moving around the map on the classes I use them on but like I said in another post, I could see the potential in the PPR on a class like the AJA specced for defense. Defensive AJA can fire the weapon continously while shrugging off enemy damage, (benefitting more from the increased damage mode) gets a passive weight reduction to make the weapon somewhat less ludicrous, and benefits more from the unlimited ammo than a more mobile class because having the full DR from Biotic Sphere/Reave at all times means having severely reduced mobility

[LeonLionHart]

Father Superior wrote...

LeonLionHart wrote...

Father Superior wrote...



You are being really narrow-minded. "Shoot, deal damage, end of story" is the overly simplified equation for guns and it is not clear enough to be any real argument. What about the Scorpion? That doesn't do the damage immediately, does that make it a bad gun? What about the Javelin? It can only fire one shot per reload and that one shot is almost always eaten up by shield-gate. Because the Javelin can do the most damage per shot, does that make it the best gun? No, because you are forgetting that there are more factors than just damage when judging a gun's usefulness. The Particle Rifle has infinite ammo, perfect accuracy and a relatively high rate of fire. That alone would make it fairly useful, but to top it off, it also gets a significant damage increase after the sustained fire of 50 rounds, leaving 50/130 leftover with the supercharged damage. This makes it unique from the other weapons and requires strategy to use to its full potential.

Correction #1: The Javelin cannot do the most damage per shot, that would be the M300 Claymore.
Correction #2: Unless you are referring to Bronze or Silver matches, the Particle Rifle's stats (As presented by OP) just don't stand up to par, and will most likely have you the subject of much reviving in an attempt to reach it's full potential through charge-up.
Correction# 3 And... sorry, but when it comes to Gold matches (and soon to be platinum) a weapons damage is VERY much the most important and defining factor in it's usage. Quite frankily we don't have time for you to stand behind a wall and charge a shot while we hammer away at a Banshee with our Sabers and Widows.

Of course you will most likely be proven wrong in the coming balance adjustments anyway, so why do I even bother? <_<

PS: If your a bronzy/silver kinda guy, then the particle rifle is probably for you. Move up to Gold and your attitude will change really quick. 

Read my sig. Do you think I play Bronze/Silver<_

#1: I'm not going to bother doing the math right now, but I'm fairly sure that the Geth Infiltrator tailored for damage can put out the most damage in a single shot using the Javelin, though most of the time it is negated by shield gate. The sole reason people think the Claymore does more damage per shot is because it is blessed with the power to ignore shield gate. If you were to remove shield gate, Javelin would be the ultimate WMD.

#2: The stats also say that my Arc Pistol does more damage than my Carnifex. I guess that makes the Carnifex useless because the Arc Pistol does more damage per shot and has a higher fire rate, according ot the stats at least. The stats also say that my GPS has a lower accuracy than my Graal. Guess the GPS is obsolete now, considering the two have very similar damage outputs, according to the stats. And would you look at that, the Krysae has a lower damage output than the Widow and the Kishock! Guess that means that using the Krysae means sacrificing some damage, huh? Well, at least that's what the stats say.

#3. Weapon damage is not the sole thing that wins Gold matches, you still need accuracy, capacity and low weight for power usage (often the key component to winning Gold). If you have a Harrier or Widow you'll dish out a lot of damage, but you're gonna be sorry when you run out of ammo, expose yourself to fire and find the area you were trying to keep clear overrun. And check your elitist 'tude, you have no right to be condescending towards someone you don't know. I have a Widox X and Saber IX, I think I know a thing or two about those guns and I can tell you with certainty that power doesn't always mean more damage done, it just mean damage per shot. It may not seem like it without paying close attention, but you can strip down a Atlas/Prime's shields more reliably using a GPSMG than you can with a one-shot gun like the Widow.

It was bad enough that you felt the need to be an condescending, elitist d-bag without any idea who you were talking to in your "corrections", but did you really need to put the cherry on top of the a**hole sundae by saying "You'll probably get proven wrong in the balance changes anyway hurr durr"? Seriously, you need to start saying no to the ice cream and start choking down a nice low-fat piece of humble pie. Maybe two.

Dude... I was laughing so hard at all of your ice cream and pie references, that needless to say I failed to see your point due to you making you making me so hungry. 

And... just for the record bro, Your N7 rank doesn't hold up in the court of skill. And if I ever have the fortune of playing someone such as yourself I will gladly turn your spaghetti pasta tactics against you and stomp the scoreboard until you barf twinkies.  (I can make food references too)

[whateverman7]

this thread is an example of 2 things that are present on the bsn:

1. yall care more about stats on spreadsheets then playing the game
2. yall still think the game revolves around gold

in both cases, yall would be incorrect....anyway, i disagree with the threadstarter, i've seen the gun in action on gold, and it did damn good....but i know, this is the bsn, and all that matters is spreadsheet info

on a side note: i expect when the new plat difficulty level comes out, all the talk about how effective things are on gold being the standard to judge effectiveness is gonna change to how effective things are on plat....which will still be the incorrect way of thinking

Modifié par whateverman7, 12 juillet 2012 - 07:35 .

[UkGouki]

i got it at level 1 and agree its terrible in single player on insantity playthrough i have it maxxed and it melts normal troopers its useless againts banshees and phantoms though...

[CheetahZ1]

whateverman7 wrote...

this thread is an example of 2 things that are present on the bsn:

1. yall care more about stats on spreadsheets then playing the game
2. yall still think the game revolves around gold

in both cases, yall would be incorrect....anyway, i disagree with the threadstarter, i've seen the gun in action on gold, and it did damn good....but i know, this is the bsn, and all that matters is spreadsheet info

on a side note: i expect when the new plat difficulty level comes out, all the talk about how effective things are on gold being the standard to judge effectiveness is gonna change to how effective things are on plat....which will still be the incorrect way of thinking

Its not just BSN. It's with most forums. Most people who check forums are either metagaming to maximize effectiveness or looking for news about the game. The fact is, most people here are going to be worried about effectiveness on the highest difficulty, It's not the wrong way of thinking for weapon balance anyways.

Modifié par CheetahZ1, 12 juillet 2012 - 07:41 .

[rmccowen]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

I believe the "hot" multiplier is currently something like 4x.

That makes it about as official as we're likely to get. That makes the "hot" fire stats:

Damage [68.8 - 85.6]
DPS [917.3 - 1141.3]
(no change to ROF, etc.)

On paper, that compares well to the Harrier's stats, without the Harrier's ammunition limitations. (With an Extended Mag, you can stay in hot-fire mode for 9.75 seconds.)

What that leaves is the tactical problem of the 3.75s charge-up where you're doing sub-Avenger DPS, and the build problem of the unattractive weight stat...

[kr3g]

It should become charged after 10 shots

[Atheosis]

So you have to hold the trigger down for 4 seconds before it starts doing UR-caliber damage? I haven't unlocked it yet so I can't speak from experience, but it sure sounds like garbage to me.

[rmccowen]

Atheosis wrote...

So you have to hold the trigger down for 4 seconds before it starts doing UR-caliber damage? I haven't unlocked it yet so I can't speak from experience, but it sure sounds like garbage to me.

It's definitely 50 rounds, which at a RoF of 800 works out to 3.75s. That seems long, but I also haven't used it (or any weapon, actually) in two days, so I don't know for sure.

I'm going to mess around with it a bit more tonight, I think.

[BoomDynamite]

Double uncharge damage and make it's weight on par with the Harrier perhaps?

EDIT: You would also have to the make charge damage multiplier two instead of four.

Modifié par BoomDynamite, 12 juillet 2012 - 07:53 .

[Variasaber]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

I believe the "hot" multiplier is currently something like 4x.

That would certainly get the job done, now it just depends on how hard it is to get it to the "hot" spot, and whether you can still aim effectively while like that.

[CheetahZ1]

BoomDynamite wrote...

Double uncharge damage and make it's weight on par with the Harrier perhaps?

EDIT: You would also have to the make charge damage multiplier two instead of four.

Going to have to wait for bioware to increase damage by 10% increments.

Modifié par CheetahZ1, 12 juillet 2012 - 07:58 .

[DSxCallOfBooty-]

BoomDynamite wrote...

Double uncharge damage and make it's weight on par with the Harrier perhaps?

EDIT: You would also have to the make charge damage multiplier two instead of four.

This seems reasonable.  Still wouldn't be a GREAT killer, but infinite ammo + accuracy of the weapon should make it useful in this state.

[Foxtrot813]

Has anyone tried this on a DoT-heavy char like the Justicar or the Batarian Soldier? I imagine the sheer melting power of Reave stacked on + Particle Beam or Inferno grenades burning with some Ballistic Blade bleed damage could make this thing at least somewhat worthwhile.