825 réponses à ce sujet

[Ageless Face]

LaughingDragon wrote...
Do you even know what an opinion is? Kid? You saying blue is the best color is an opinion.

Saying the game has auto dialogue, choices did not matter, no ME2 characters as squadmates...are facts. Put the crack-pipe down and open a dictionary.

"The game is bad" Is an opinion.

[CronoDragoon]

LaughingDragon wrote...
Do you even know what an opinion is? Kid? You saying blue is the best color is an opinion.

Saying the game has auto dialogue, choices did not matter, no ME2 characters as squadmates...are facts. Put the crack-pipe down and open a dictionary.

 Auto-dialogue and no ME2 characters as squadmates are not inherently negative aspects. It is a fact that these exist, however.

"Choices do not matter" is simply untrue. Every choice you make in the game technically "matters" because it affects what comes after it, even the ones that only boost EMS. Since you are being anal about it to another person here I'd just thought I'd lawyer you on this.

"Choices do not matter in a meaningful way" is of course, not a fact but an opinion. The fact that some people have an entire galaxy full of hybrid organic/synthetics at the end of their trilogy whereas mine has no synthetics at all and 100% organics shows you that at least some choices indeed matter in a very noticeable way.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:26 .

[DMWW]

[/quote]
Do you even know what an opinion is? Kid? You saying blue is the best color is an opinion.

Saying the game has auto dialogue, choices did not matter, no ME2 characters as squadmates...are facts.
[/quote]

The first and third are facts (assuming "ME2 characters" means "ME2-only characters"). The second is opinion (not one I share).

Modifié par DMWW, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:26 .

[Dutchess]

Oransel wrote...

Auto-dialogue. Canon Shep.

The holiest of games, ME1, has not as much dialogue as you may think. Upon replaying the game I noticed many times that Shepard would say the exact same line when I picked a different option. ME3 is simply more honest in this and does not bother to let you choose between three options that lead to Shepard saying the same line anyway.

[Taesuun]

corporal doody wrote...

Taesuun wrote...

Alpha Protocol is one of the best games of this decade.. Game where your choices do indeed matter. But it's a stand-alone game, a lot harder to build a trilogy.. BioWare should probably try out a stand-alone as well.

Fallout 3 was not a good game, maybe medicore. Certainly very far from its predecessors greatness.

huh....wow....um....best games? woooo.......   to each his own i guess.

and BW HAS made standalone games......Jade Empire and KOTOR just to name two.


edit: Alpha Protocol had soooo much potential. I couldnt get past level design and wonky gameplay. The weapon customization was nice. I preordered it the day i saw a thing about in a magazine over a year before the ORIGINAL planned release date....and date that got bumped cuz some executive said the game was tooo hard.  I still own it though...i would be willing to give a sequel a try.

Aye, BioWare has indeed made excellend games. Never played Jade Empire, but KOTOR is great. ME1 was great as well, but like I said, it needs a lot more work to continue games with the emphasis on player choice for a whole trilogy. Then again, suppose it's easier to build on succesfull title, marketingwise.

As for Alpha Protocol, I play with PC, and the worst thing about that game was the technical issues from porting it to the PC from console. But I was willing to forgive that for its excellend new ideas (even liked the dialogue system) and interactive story, easily.

[Plasma Prestige]

 Mass Effect 3 is a shining example of a good game in the gaming industry. You want a bad game? Go play the first person shooters that come out these days; you know, the ones with one-dimensional characters, meaningless plots, and laughably short single-player experiences.

Just because ME3 disappointed you in some ways doesn't mean it's a bad game. In reality, Mass Effect 3 is probably one of the best games of the generation when compared to other titles. 

[LaughingDragon]

CronoDragoon wrote...

LaughingDragon wrote...
Do you even know what an opinion is? Kid? You saying blue is the best color is an opinion.

Saying the game has auto dialogue, choices did not matter, no ME2 characters as squadmates...are facts. Put the crack-pipe down and open a dictionary.

 Auto-dialogue and no ME2 characters as squadmates are not inherently negative aspects. It is a fact that these exist, however.

"Choices do not matter" is simply untrue. Every choice you make in the game technically "matters" because it affects what comes after it, even the ones that only boost EMS. Since you are being anal about it to another person here I'd just thought I'd lawyer you on this.

"Choices do not matter in a meaningful way" is of course, not a fact but an opinion. The fact that some people have an entire galaxy full of hybrid organic/synthetics at the end of their trilogy whereas mine has no synthetics at all and 100% organics shows you that at least some choices indeed matter in a very noticeable way.

Choices do not matter is an opinion, not a fact? Let's examine this further.

Evidence 1: ME1, decision to kill the last rachni queen, wiping out their entire race forever. (no more queen, no more eggs, no more racnhi)

Evidence 2: ME3 - Rachni are back in the game, in the exact same way regardless of your choice, except instead of the queen there is a fake queen (which does not constitute a legitimate difference). Either way, the decision to "kill the last queen" and "wipe them out forever" does not matter in ME3.

If this case is argued before a judge and jury of peers, it comes out as fact the choice did not matter.

Modifié par LaughingDragon, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:36 .

[o Ventus]

CronoDragoon wrote...

 Auto-dialogue and no ME2 characters as squadmates are not inherently negative aspects. It is a fact that these exist, however.

"Choices do not matter" is simply untrue. Every choice you make in the game technically "matters" because it affects what comes after it, even the ones that only boost EMS. Since you are being anal about it to another person here I'd just thought I'd lawyer you on this.

"Choices do not matter in a meaningful way" is of course, not a fact but an opinion. The fact that some people have an entire galaxy full of hybrid organic/synthetics at the end of their trilogy whereas mine has no synthetics at all and 100% organics shows you that at least some choices indeed matter in a very noticeable way.

Autodialogue is inherently bad when it undermines the initial appeal of the trilogy: the dialogue wheel, and when it forces your Shepard to act in an OOC fashion. How is the lack of ME2 characters NOT a bad thing? What was the point of introducing them if they aren't going to get any meaningful screentime in the following game and are largely limited to 1 or 2 recycled conversations throughout the entirety of the game?

The only meaningful choice made in the entire trilogy is the choice amde at the end of ME3. Did you kill or release the rachni? Doesn't matter, they appear regardless. Was Anderson your chosen councilor? It doesn't matter, Udina took his place. Did you destroy the Collector Base in ME2? It doesn't matter, Cerberus finds and takes the proto-Reaper anyway. Did you rewrite or destroy the heretics in ME2? It doesn't matter, the geth are enemies anyway.

[MegaSovereign]

It's not a bad game. Not even close.

[Ageless Face]

LaughingDragon wrote...
Choices do not matter is an opinion, not a fact? Let's examine this further.

Evidence 1: ME1, decision to kill the last rachni queen, wiping out their entire race forever. (no more queen, no more eggs, no more racnhi)

Evidence 2: ME3 - Rachni are back in the game, in the exact same way, except instead of the queen there is a fake queen. Either way, the decision to "kill the last queen" and "wipe them out forever" does not matter in ME3.

If this case is argued before a judge and jury of peers, it comes out as fact the choice did not matter.

You see the queen coming back in either form but only one is the orginal as "my choice doesn't matter". It does matter, otherwise the queen will act as if you saved her even if you didn't. She didn't. And she betrays you afterwards. Maybe the choice didn't matter enough for you, and that is fine, but for other people it did. It's all subjective.

[Pantanplan]

renjility wrote...

Oransel wrote...

Auto-dialogue. Canon Shep.

The holiest of games, ME1, has not as much dialogue as you may think. Upon replaying the game I noticed many times that Shepard would say the exact same line when I picked a different option. ME3 is simply more honest in this and does not bother to let you choose between three options that lead to Shepard saying the same line anyway.

This only happened a few times in ME1. Believe me, I've played ME1 4 times, twice as paragon, one with a renegade Shepard, and one with only neutral responses. Most of the dialogue was completely different. I did the same thing with ME3, and the changes were almost negligible. The majority of the dialogue in ME3 is auto-dialogue, while in ME1 there are only a few instances where the dialogue is the same in disguise.

[AlexPorto111]

No.ME3 its an amazing game.

[o Ventus]

HagarIshay wrote...

You see the queen coming back in either form but only one is the orginal as "my choice doesn't matter". It does matter, otherwise the queen will act as if you saved her even if you didn't. She didn't. And she betrays you afterwards. Maybe the choice didn't matter enough for you, and that is fine, but for other people it did. It's all subjective.

No, it doesn't matter because the Reapers just somehow artificially create a rachni "Breeder" to spawn Ravagers if you killed them off in ME1. The only context of it making sense is if you kept them on Noveria. Did you save them or kill them? It doesn't matter, either way, the Reapers are making Ravagers.

@bold- Lolno.

Modifié par o Ventus, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:45 .

[Pantanplan]

I haven't seen a single user here (except HagarIshay) take every point the OP mentioned, and refute it with actual evidence. All I see is "no, you're wrong", or "yeah, well like that's your opinion man". Come on, debate at least. Show the OP why he's wrong. I personally agree with every single thing he said, but I'm prepared to be proven wrong.

Modifié par Pantanplan, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:47 .

[Grogimus]

"This game is bad."

"No it isn't!"

"Yes it is!"

"Whatever, it's not that bad a game."

"Fanboy!"

"Why do you say that?"

"Because the game sucks."

"So I'm a fanboy because I like the game and you don't?"

"No, you're a fanboy because you're too stupid to realize this game sucks."

"I see, what game do you recommend then?"

"This game, I'll tell you all about it......"

"Hmm, I tried that game, and I didn't like it.  You must be a fanboy."

Modifié par Grogimus, 13 juillet 2012 - 04:46 .

[Jadebaby]

renjility wrote...

Oransel wrote...

Auto-dialogue. Canon Shep.

The holiest of games, ME1, has not as much dialogue as you may think. Upon replaying the game I noticed many times that Shepard would say the exact same line when I picked a different option. ME3 is simply more honest in this and does not bother to let you choose between three options that lead to Shepard saying the same line anyway.

The thing that bothered me more than the cutting of the 'neutral' option, which as you said is more often than not, the illusion of another choice. No, the thing that bothered me more was how much more infrequent an actual dialogue box would open up. To the point where a character would ask a follow up question and Shepard just automatically answers with morals from a previous question's answer.

[Applepie_Svk]

BiO_MaN wrote...

I would just like to point out auto-dialogue isn't necessarily a bad thing, I know some people who liked the change, saying that it made conversations much more smoother and realistic. I don't agree with them, but just saying, that that one is subjective.

/facepalm...

[CronoDragoon]

o Ventus wrote...

Autodialogue is inherently bad when it undermines the initial appeal of the trilogy: the dialogue wheel, and when it forces your Shepard to act in an OOC fashion. How is the lack of ME2 characters NOT a bad thing? What was the point of introducing them if they aren't going to get any meaningful screentime in the following game and are largely limited to 1 or 2 recycled conversations throughout the entirety of the game?

The only meaningful choice made in the entire trilogy is the choice amde at the end of ME3. Did you kill or release the rachni? Doesn't matter, they appear regardless. Was Anderson your chosen councilor? It doesn't matter, Udina took his place. Did you destroy the Collector Base in ME2? It doesn't matter, Cerberus finds and takes the proto-Reaper anyway. Did you rewrite or destroy the heretics in ME2? It doesn't matter, the geth are enemies anyway.

Whether or not auto-dialogue forces your Shepard to act OOC is subjective. I was fine with all of it. Additionally, the existence of more programmed responses allows for the inclusion of more unique dialogue scenarios that would previously have been taken up by dialogue choices that are ultimately meaningless anyway. So while I understand why people would get upset there are less dialogue wheels, 1. they still exist when it matters 2. in my opinion more auto-dialogue has led to better dialogue exchanges.

The characters arcs of ME2 characters were largely finished in Mass Effect 2. Their inclusion in ME3 at all is more out of fan-service than necessity. Miranda might be the exception to this because TIM is still a big part of the story. I don't think many people would argue that story-wise Miranda as a squadmate would have been better than Vega, but the need for a guaranteed soldier character as a gameplay reason is also important.

I happen to love the ME2 characters, but their non-inclusion as squadmates simply cannot be called "inherently" bad, because it is possible for a player to like all the squadmates in ME3 more than their potential replacements.

ME3's ending choice is not the only meaningful one. What does "meaningful" even mean, here anyway? Meaningful taken as "changes something important" designates many examples: Genophage? Rannoch war? Did you shoot the VS at the Citadel or not? Which VS was it? You can't cherry pick choices in ME1 and ME2 that have no impactful plot difference in ME3 (and these choices certainly exist) and then conclude "choices don't matter." Some choices don't, it's true.

[Jadebaby]

Grogimus wrote...

"This game is bad."

"No it isn't!"

"Yes it is!"

"Whatever, it's not that bad a game."

"Fanboy!"

"Why do you say that?"

"Because the game sucks."

"So I'm a fanboy because I like the game and you don't?"

"No, you're a fanboy because you're too stupid to realize this game sucks."

"I see, what game do you recommend then?"

"This game, I'll tell you all about it......"

"Hmm, I tried that game, and I didn't like it.  You must be a fanboy."

The only time to call people fanboys is if they hold the company in as high as a regard as their games. And defend them, no matter what.

[CaptainZaysh]

The OP has a bad face.

[CronoDragoon]

LaughingDragon wrote...
Choices do not matter is an opinion, not a fact? Let's examine this further.

Evidence 1: ME1, decision to kill the last rachni queen, wiping out their entire race forever. (no more queen, no more eggs, no more racnhi)

Evidence 2: ME3 - Rachni are back in the game, in the exact same way regardless of your choice, except instead of the queen there is a fake queen (which does not constitute a legitimate difference). Either way, the decision to "kill the last queen" and "wipe them out forever" does not matter in ME3.

If this case is argued before a judge and jury of peers, it comes out as fact the choice did not matter.

The correct statement is then "some choices do not matter plot-wise," which is absolutely true but sounds less impressive than a general statement about all choices in the game, so people go with the latter hyperbole.

[stonbw1]

It's wild to see how many people in retrospect love ME2. Don't you all remember that the game was SLAMMED on these boards for being COD-ish, no RPG, boring story... and oh yeah.. a stupid terminator. But now, I suppose, it is amazing... go figure.

[corporal doody]

stonbw1 wrote...

It's wild to see how many people in retrospect love ME2. Don't you all remember that the game was SLAMMED on these boards for being COD-ish, no RPG, boring story... and oh yeah.. a stupid terminator. But now, I suppose, it is amazing... go figure.

YUP YUP!!  i say the exact same thing!!! it is SOOOOOO freakin hilarious!!