2749 réponses à ce sujet

[Jadebaby]

What's problematic is the fact that only 1 of the Crucible's choices destroys the Reapers.. And even then, that "solution" basically just resets everything anyway... Meaning eventually down the road Reapers will need to be created again because all the great progress everyone had done to unite Synthetic and organic was simply washed away.

[AlexMBrennan]

What's Shepard going to do? Run around the galaxy trying to save as many people as s/he can? No, s/he wouldn't even be able to save .1% no matter what they did.

Successful refuse means beating the Reapers with existing fleets - by delaying the decisive battle until such a time that the Crucible was finished, Shepard would have caused hundreds of millions of unnecessary deaths since we could have just fought off the Reapers when they first arrived.

[Jadebaby]

AlexMBrennan wrote...

What's Shepard going to do? Run around the galaxy trying to save as many people as s/he can? No, s/he wouldn't even be able to save .1% no matter what they did.

Successful refuse means beating the Reapers with existing fleets - by delaying the decisive battle until such a time that the Crucible was finished, Shepard would have caused hundreds of millions of unnecessary deaths since we could have just fought off the Reapers when they first arrived.

Wrong, Shepard still had to ally everyone. I'm not saying they could just win in a straight up fight, but it *could* be written that they do get the upper hand somehow. Heck, I could write it...

[Jaison1986]

I could see the fleets winning at earth. Seriously, they were obviously at superior number with high EMS, they should win at earth. But that's the problem. Even if they win in there, what about the other systems? There are still hundred of reapers attacking there. My best guess is that Shepard would find a way to destroy the Catalyst and the reapers would stop fighting without his control.

[KyreneZA]

Jaison1986 wrote...

I could see the fleets winning at earth. Seriously, they were obviously at superior number with high EMS, they should win at earth. But that's the problem. Even if they win in there, what about the other systems? There are still hundred of reapers attacking there. My best guess is that Shepard would find a way to destroy the Catalyst and the reapers would stop fighting without his control.

No need. Detroy Harbinger at Earth, you've destroyed the Catalyst/Intelligence. Whether that would make the rest of the Reapers docile is another matter though...

[Jadebaby]

Both great suggestions.

The Leviathans could help out in other systems though...

Modifié par Jadebaby, 06 février 2013 - 03:54 .

[Cyberfrog81]

The Leviathan are about as trustworthy as Lex Luthor, though. But yeah, one problem at a time. I'm all for kicking Harby's ass.

Jadebaby wrote...

What's problematic is the fact that only 1 of the Crucible's choices destroys the Reapers.. And even then, that "solution" basically just resets everything anyway... Meaning eventually down the road Reapers will need to be created again because all the great progress everyone had done to unite Synthetic and organic was simply washed away.

When choosing Destroy, you reject the notion that we (organics and synthetics collectively) need something like the Reapers to keep us in check. I would assume the same to be the case for Refuse, since obviously the idea is not, "Heeey, we still need you guys, so go ahead and harvest us."

I'm open to the idea that the Crucible is a trap though. Thing is, post-EC people don't seem very inclined to listen when you tell them that the ending is still open to interpretation. They also tend to forget, it seems, how little Shepard knows about the Crucible; how little the smartest people in the galaxy knows, even. The enemy is your only real source on what it (supposedly) does! We have to take on faith that the most advanced AI ever has so weak defenses against Cyber Warfare that a known threat (the Crucible) can just dock with the Citadel and force the AI to offer Shepard the option to destroy it.

[Jadebaby]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

The Leviathan are about as trustworthy as Lex Luthor, though. But yeah, one problem at a time. I'm all for kicking Harby's ass.

Jadebaby wrote...

What's problematic is the fact that only 1 of the Crucible's choices destroys the Reapers.. And even then, that "solution" basically just resets everything anyway... Meaning eventually down the road Reapers will need to be created again because all the great progress everyone had done to unite Synthetic and organic was simply washed away.

When choosing Destroy, you reject the notion that we (organics and synthetics collectively) need something like the Reapers to keep us in check. I would assume the same to be the case for Refuse, since obviously the idea is not, "Heeey, we still need you guys, so go ahead and harvest us."

No, only refuse does that, in Destroy you prove to the Catalyst how expendable you believe synthetics are...

Just like Shepard was an anomaly.. An outlier.. A break of the pattern.. So too, was the uniting of organic and synthetic to fight the war together. By destroying these creatures you are resetting it all. Plus, as you said.. The Leviathans are still around. What's to stop them rising to power again after Destroy?

The same cannot be said for refuse because the Geth can help out as they cannot be enthralled.

I'm open to the idea that the Crucible is a trap though. Thing is, post-EC people don't seem very inclined to listen when you tell them that the ending is still open to interpretation. They also tend to forget, it seems, how little Shepard knows about the Crucible; how little the smartest people in the galaxy knows, even. The enemy is your only real source on what it (supposedly) does! We have to take on faith that the most advanced AI ever has so weak defenses against Cyber Warfare that a known threat (the Crucible) can just dock with the Citadel and force the AI to offer Shepard the option to destroy it.

exactly! Furthermore none of the Reapers attack it.. Even on low-EMS...

Modifié par Jadebaby, 06 février 2013 - 09:36 .

[Cyberfrog81]

Jadebaby wrote...

No, only refuse does that, in Destroy you prove to the Catalyst how expendable you believe synthetics are...

Some Shepards are anti-synthetic, but it is hardly fair to accuse every destroyer of that. My perspective (when I feel like suspending my anti-ending sentiments for a moment) is not so much that the geth were sacrificed to appease a 'god' (though you could certainly see it that way), it is that they tragically ended up having to pay the price of securing a future free of the Reapers for synthetics (when they re-emerge) and organics alike.

I wonder if the geth would have preferred to be killed by the "creators" rather than by a stupid red beam of enegy that Shepard needed the boss of the Reapers to help him with.

Just like Shepard was an anomaly.. An outlier.. A break of the pattern.. So too, was the uniting of organic and synthetic to fight the war together. By destroying these creatures you are resetting it all. Plus, as you said.. The Leviathans are still around. What's to stop them rising to power again after Destroy?

The same cannot be said for refuse because the Geth can help out as they cannot be enthralled.

Would be great. Though that argument is pro-Control.

And no, in the perspective that Destroy truly does get rid of the Reapers and the cycles, it is not a reset. The perspective could be wrong, but then it is up to BioWare to actually show that it is. And I even welcome that, especially if Synthesis also has to take a beating.

[Ignis Mors]

Operation: NIGHTFALL (Feb 8th-10th)
Event Description: Our concentration on Reapers and
Cerberus forces has allowed Reaper-controlled geth to flourish in
pockets outside of the Perseus Veil. Our quarian-led and quarian-advised
forces will be the key to terminating a geth offensive before it gains
ground.
Individual Goal: Playing as any quarian kit, earn 50,000 points versus geth troopers.
Reward: Commendation Pack

New operation's up, and it's geth related. Does this mean the MP timeline is nearing the Rannoch part of the SP campaign?

[Loaderini]

The puzzle theory has to be the greatest conspiracy theory ever made for a video game
Nice work! I don't believe in the theory, but it would be superbly cool if you're proven to be right

[Jadebaby]

@Loaderini, better than IT? That's saying a lot....

@Ignir mors, I don't know, if Alamo was meant to be Miracle at Palaven then it seems kind of backwards... Plus we're pretty close to the end of the dlc cycle so I'm not sure...

[Ignis Mors]

Jadebaby wrote...

@Loaderini, better than IT? That's saying a lot....

@Ignir mors, I don't know, if Alamo was meant to be Miracle at Palaven then it seems kind of backwards... Plus we're pretty close to the end of the dlc cycle so I'm not sure...

Oh, I'd forgotten the time of the Miracle at Palaven. I thought it was just after you killed Udina during the Cerberus coup. But, if it were post-Rannoch, wouldn't there not be the whole reaper-controlled geth thing going on? Weren't they all at Rannoch and released from Reaper control?

[Jadebaby]

Yes, well it's assumed that way isn't it?

The thing is, it isn't exactly clear when the Miracle at Palaven happens.. I always assumed it would be soon after Tuchanka...

But you don't get the codex entry until towards the end of the game [post-Rannoch]

[Red Panda]

Ignis Mors wrote...

Operation: NIGHTFALL (Feb 8th-10th)
Event Description: Our concentration on Reapers and
Cerberus forces has allowed Reaper-controlled geth to flourish in
pockets outside of the Perseus Veil. Our quarian-led and quarian-advised
forces will be the key to terminating a geth offensive before it gains
ground.
Individual Goal: Playing as any quarian kit, earn 50,000 points versus geth troopers.
Reward: Commendation Pack

New operation's up, and it's geth related. Does this mean the MP timeline is nearing the Rannoch part of the SP campaign?

I don't think so, I think it's more a reason why we don't see them later in the single player after Rannoch. This op just seems like a clean-up of Reaper-controlled Geth outside the Perseus Veil. It's probably post-Rannoch.

[Red Panda]

Ignis Mors wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

@Loaderini, better than IT? That's saying a lot....

@Ignir mors, I don't know, if Alamo was meant to be Miracle at Palaven then it seems kind of backwards... Plus we're pretty close to the end of the dlc cycle so I'm not sure...

Oh, I'd forgotten the time of the Miracle at Palaven. I thought it was just after you killed Udina during the Cerberus coup. But, if it were post-Rannoch, wouldn't there not be the whole reaper-controlled geth thing going on? Weren't they all at Rannoch and released from Reaper control?

They are still pockets of Geth that weren't on Rannoch, and not affected by its events.

Hackett says this in the debriefing after Rannoch.

[Ignis Mors]

OperatingWookie wrote...

Ignis Mors wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

@Loaderini, better than IT? That's saying a lot....

@Ignir mors, I don't know, if Alamo was meant to be Miracle at Palaven then it seems kind of backwards... Plus we're pretty close to the end of the dlc cycle so I'm not sure...

Oh, I'd forgotten the time of the Miracle at Palaven. I thought it was just after you killed Udina during the Cerberus coup. But, if it were post-Rannoch, wouldn't there not be the whole reaper-controlled geth thing going on? Weren't they all at Rannoch and released from Reaper control?

They are still pockets of Geth that weren't on Rannoch, and not affected by its events.

Hackett says this in the debriefing after Rannoch.

Thanks for clearing that up. I haven't played ME3 SP in like five months, and I only got to Rannoch once.

[Red Panda]

Ignis Mors wrote...

OperatingWookie wrote...

Ignis Mors wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

@Loaderini, better than IT? That's saying a lot....

@Ignir mors, I don't know, if Alamo was meant to be Miracle at Palaven then it seems kind of backwards... Plus we're pretty close to the end of the dlc cycle so I'm not sure...

Oh, I'd forgotten the time of the Miracle at Palaven. I thought it was just after you killed Udina during the Cerberus coup. But, if it were post-Rannoch, wouldn't there not be the whole reaper-controlled geth thing going on? Weren't they all at Rannoch and released from Reaper control?

They are still pockets of Geth that weren't on Rannoch, and not affected by its events.

Hackett says this in the debriefing after Rannoch.

Thanks for clearing that up. I haven't played ME3 SP in like five months, and I only got to Rannoch once.

No problem.

[Jadebaby]

Does Hackett really say this? Can you provide a link if possible?

[humes spork]

All I have to say, is there is not enough popcorn in the universe for the category-infinite backlash if BW/EA were to pull something as cynical and asinine as planning an ending that required players shell out $35-50 in DLC, plus associated costs and fees, to access.

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Jadebaby wrote...

Yes, well it's assumed that way isn't it?

The thing is, it isn't exactly clear when the Miracle at Palaven happens.. I always assumed it would be soon after Tuchanka...

But you don't get the codex entry until towards the end of the game [post-Rannoch]

I don't remember when you get the codex entry exactly, but for example: If you get the codex entry after the Rannoch mission, then I always assumed the Miracle of Palaven happened chronologically while Shepard was on Rannoch.  Whenever the codex entry is, the Miracle of Palaven occurs during the mission before that.  At least, that's what I believe.

Modifié par Neverwinter_Knight77, 09 février 2013 - 04:51 .

[KingWrex]

Jadebaby wrote...

Does Hackett really say this? Can you provide a link if possible?

I don't think it was Hackett, it was the Asari Councilor who mentions it, at least as far as I can remember.

[Jadebaby]

Oh okay, well whoever it was a link would be good, or a quote....


@humes spork, what's cynical and asinine is what we already have, I'd rather shell out more for an ending dlc than for something like Omega... And why not? So many other games have done stuff like this, including Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas, in fact. To get your characters whole backstory you have to pay for it, and not just one dlc, but 3...

@Neverwinter_Knight77, yea, I thought something along the same lines...

Modifié par Jadebaby, 09 février 2013 - 06:32 .

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Indeed, I would also pay money for ending DLC.

[KyreneZA]

People always tend to forget that BioWare is primarily in this 'game' to make money. If they wish to sell Day 1 DLC or "Get the Best Ending" DLC they are fully entitled to do so. We as customers of their product can decide not to buy into that. If a large enough portion of their market still buy everything they sell it will encourage them that such a business plan not only works, but is profitable too. And there's nothing wrong with that if their customers are not savvy enough to vote with their wallets. Most companies do NOT produce things that don't sell.

Now there may be some ****ing and backlash, but you know what? Quarterly reports do not reflect that.

Personally, I have bought Leviathan when it came out, but not From Ashes or Omega as I didn't think those two DLCs were worth it. I may not buy this last SP DLC either, depending on what it is all about. Sure I was (and still am, since the EC didn't really change anything) disappointed in the endings, but 99% of the SP and certainly almost 600 hours of MP was worth the $33 I paid for the game. More than worth it!