2749 réponses à ce sujet

[ElectronicPostingInterface]

Awesome way of handling this, Jade.

I actually thought this theory was interesting and would have been a cool resolution.

Too bad. Cheers to MEHEM, eh?

[devSin]

AlanC9 wrote...

Someone should drop The Twilight God a line. He's got the only IT version that's still viable.

I saw something the other day by that one guy (Casey or something) who always went on about how the ending was complete and brilliant (or maybe it was *brilliant*) that made me question if he stopped believing in indoctrination (either that or it was a more subtle dig than I'd traditionally give him credit for).

Strange times.

Jadebaby wrote...

You can, visit their new forums and ask them...

I think you have to register to even read them.

At which point, I have no interest in reading their discussions (which all too often turned toward simple derision of those who don't subscribe to their interpretation—it was bad enough here that I don't need to go seeking them out in other places).

Modifié par devSin, 21 février 2013 - 11:16 .

[Obadiah]

What do you guys think of the Refuse option now? Do you think of it as:
- a loss
- an uncompromising ultimate sacrifice win
- some combination of both of the above

Just kinda curious.

[Jadebaby]

Well the stargazer scene would imply it's an uncompromising ultimate sacrifice win..

The only thing I will miss if I download mehem, is Shepard refuse speech. It's just so god damn good! That speech, in and of itself, should have destroyed the Catalyst...

Secondly, there's still the strange problem of the Catalyst's Reaper voice...

[estebanus]

Ah well, looks like this is the absolute end of the line. Shame. It was fun while it lasted though, wasn't it?
The citadel DLC looks very interesting. I think I'll go and buy it, even though it won't give me the ending I wanted. You win some, you lose some, right?

[devSin]

Refuse is a loss. Like the filename reveals, it's an opt-out for the player where BioWare is allowed to take over and advance the game to the ending without you.

You don't have to get involved, and BioWare is free to implement synthesis, which is the only true solution to the dilemma posited by the end.

Modifié par devSin, 21 février 2013 - 11:23 .

[inversevideo]

Jadebaby wrote...

devSin wrote...

I think one of the indoctrination guys said a lot of them were going to walk out if this wasn't Shepard's "wake up" DLC, but I'm honestly pretty skeptical that they won't just keep on believing, finding more ways to try to make the game fit their interpretation.

But with the thread being locked and the discussion of it banned from the forums, there's not really any opportunity to get their opinions on it. I've been curious for nearly a year now what they were going to do when no proof of their belief ever came, and now I may never get to find out.

You can, visit their new forums and ask them...
http://indoctrinatio...orumotion.co.uk

@IsaacShep, thanks.. It doesn't really help anyone to spit the dummy lol but I am pretty hurt inside. I guess I'll start looking into mehem installation soon.

I'm thinking of MEHEM too. There are many good elements, within ME3, but I find that whenever I start, a new playthrough, I can never finish it.  Too painfully soul crushingly depressing.

I've never been affected by a game this way before.  ME will always have a special place in my heart.

I think I will replay ME1 & ME2. And reflect on how good they are and take joy from that.

And Jade,Thanks for the excellent theory, the many intelligent discussions, and the whupping you gave me in MP<3

You are one very classy lady! 

[shepskisaac]

Jadebaby wrote...

Secondly, there's still the strange problem of the Catalyst's Reaper voice...

Hmm, to me it was always natural his real voice would sound like that. I mean, "our" VIs/AIs speak with human/asari voices, so Leviatahns would make their VIs/AIs speak with their voices no?

Modifié par IsaacShep, 21 février 2013 - 11:28 .

[CronoDragoon]

Obadiah wrote...

What do you guys think of the Refuse option now? Do you think of it as:
- a loss
- an uncompromising ultimate sacrifice win
- some combination of both of the above

Just kinda curious.

Well, I think it depends. If the next cycle wins through conventional victory, then I think it has meaning. If the next cycle just uses the Crucible anyway to defeat the Reapers, then I don't see the point.

[inversevideo]

Obadiah wrote...

What do you guys think of the Refuse option now? Do you think of it as:
- a loss
- an uncompromising ultimate sacrifice win
- some combination of both of the above

Just kinda curious.

It's the human race.  Standing up to defy the evil that is the Catalyst. Refusing to go along with the choices made by evil. Humanity. That spark which makes us great.  The best of humanity delivered in a powerful speach by Shepard.

Letting evil know that whatever the cost, we will not let fear compromise us, we will not lose our soul.

[Obadiah]

When I look at the story of cycles, to be real impersonnal about it, it almost seems like the organic life was evolving over time to eventually destory the Reapers - similar to the way bacteria (heh, Harby's ME2 troll) evolves or mutates to become resistant to anti-biotics.

Each cycle whether intentionally or not contributed to the "resistance" and the inevitable destruction of the Reapers. Even in death, by the actions of the Salarians uplifting races, or by the Protheans messing with the Keepers, even if this cycle failed, the Reapers were eventually doomed.

Kinda ****ed up that this cycle had to go out like this with Refuse tho.

[AlanC9]

It didn't have to. It chose to.

[Jadebaby]

IsaacShep wrote...

Jadebaby wrote...

Secondly, there's still the strange problem of the Catalyst's Reaper voice...

Hmm, to me it was always natural his real voice would sound like that. I mean, "our" VIs/AIs speak with human/asari voices, so Leviatahns would make their VIs/AIs speak with their voices no?

What I mean is, why reveal that to us in refuse? Why add more questions to the already incoherent narrative?

[Obadiah]

Drama?

[Red Panda]

Obadiah wrote...

Drama?

There is none to be had. It is as it is and there's no changing it.

This thread has been one of the few places of solace on the forums, and despite the fact that this theory is down and out, I do not believe anyone here saw this as an unforseeable possibility, as it became almost assured with details that slowly leaked over the last few weeks.

It is at this moment, that I take the time to say goodbye myself to this thread. It was a good thread, one that comforted and calmed the sorrows of those distraught at the endings, reconciling them with those more moderate in their opinions. It brought various ending groups together, and that is no small task, as simply making a thread could not have done that alone. It took actual dedication. Dedication, charisma, persistence, and general sanity accomplished this.

Thank you to all the people who made this thread, and of course, thank you Jade.

It's been a helluva thread. Good job.

Modifié par OperatingWookie, 22 février 2013 - 12:58 .

[TheConstantOne]

Jadebaby wrote...

@TheConstantOne, wow.. Thank you so much! There's hate and anger in all areas of life, not just the internet. But if you let that get to you it will consume you. Best to just filter it and do what you can to just be yourself. It also helps that I can sympathize with a lot of them, because they are hurt at how ME changed in the 3rd game.
Despite your praise, I do ask a request that you actually read the OP. I know it's long (and needs a better tl;dr lol) but it really is pretty fleshed out and is also quite different from IT. The meat of the theory isn't that large, it just looks big because there's a lot of evidence, speculations and other jargon towards the bottom of the post.

Nevertheless, thank you for your kind words and hopefully BSN will be a bit more positive soon

Don't worry, I wouldn't post on a thread without reading the OP first .  I was just saying that I am familiar with discussions on PT and IT.

And I wouldn't take the new DLC news as a downer.  There will likely be some easter egg comments about IT and PT ending interpretations.  Plus the DLC can be great on its own...ME 3 really took a lot of fire for the ending but the game itself was 98% perfect in my opinion

[Jadebaby]

I highly doubt there'll be any Easter eggs lol. If there is. Well then at least I can take pride in the fact that people at bioware actually read this thread and liked it enough to include some kind of mention about it in game. But I don't think so. Nevertheless. I am looking somewhat forwarded to the next LCD. My favourite moment in leviathan was when the LI expresses concern before going underwater ad I don't get omega because you couldn't take your squad mates so naturally this looks promising fr me. Ill go into detail about this more in the hype Tain this assists kind of off topic here.

Lastly ill say thanks you to operating wookie,  ignis mors, bringbacknihlus, ice cold, inverse video, isaacshep, hyrule gal, shotgun Julia, pascal219, saint jimmy, maf1994, bansheeownage, KENNY, AresKieth, Conniving Eagle, devsin, and anyone else that helped move this theory along to help become what it is today. Despite not being correct. I dont regret making it for a second!

Modifié par Jadebaby, 22 février 2013 - 02:56 .

[Ignis Mors]

Jadebaby wrote...

I highly doubt there'll be any Easter eggs lol. If there is. Well then at least I can take pride in the fact that people at bioware actually read this thread and liked it enough to include some kind of mention about it in game. But I don't think so. Nevertheless. I am looking somewhat forwarded to the next LCD. My favourite moment in leviathan was when the LI expresses concern before going underwater ad I don't get omega because you couldn't take your squad mates so naturally this looks promising fr me. Ill go into detail about this more in the hype Tain this assists kind of off topic here.

Lastly ill say thanks you to operating wookie,  ignis mors, bringbacknihlus, ice cold, inverse video, isaacshep, hyrule gal, shotgun Julia, pascal219, saint jimmy, maf1994, bansheeownage, KENNY, AresKieth, Conniving Eagle, devsin, and anyone else that helped move this theory along to help become what it is today. Despite not being correct. I dont regret making it for a second!

I'd wait until the DLC comes out,and someone's found out if it has any effect on the ending before throwing this theory out  completely. We don't know what will be in this enormous dlc. I seriously doubt that it will just be what they mentioned. It just doesn't feel like it would be enough for a four gig dlc, unless the ME2 peoples and Wrex are permanent squadies. (And if they are, the Normandy's going to get crowded.)

[KENNY4753]

A couple thoughts...

First- In the mp dlc description it says the Lancer Assault Rifle. Wasnt that a ME1 weapon too?

Now about the sp dlc...

1. they could have came up with a more creative name than just 'Citadel'
2. 1200 points again!!!!!! This better be worth it unlike Omega.
3. I remember a thread about a cut mission involving Xen and a conspiracy. Is it possible that that is the conspiracy in this dlc.
4. There better be some quasar
5. 'secrets of the coucil archives' could involve the Keepers and their origins I think

Last, to you Jade. Because of you many of us had hope. I must say that I really admire your positivity and faith through it all

[KENNY4753]

@Ignis- Wrex can stay in the cargo hold again. We all now how much he missed it there The others could all pile into Life Suppor, the Lounge, or in the room that would have been Allers room if that troll was allowed on my ship. The Normandy has plenty of room.

[XXIceColdXX]

Thanks for a cool theory Jade. Your positivity gave me hope when was down and out with the series. ME3 would have been all the better if hey gave us a successful refuse. And to tie in with the multiplayer events would have been very clever. Missed opportunity.

Bioware have dropped the ball a few times now. I thought prior to EC the IT theory fit perfectly and would have really fit. Post EC I was hoping Puzzle theory and felt successful refuse could have been the icing on the cake.

Anyway was a great ride and hopefully the upcoming DLC can still help to redeem the series a bit.

Modifié par XXIceColdXX, 23 février 2013 - 02:49 .

[SpamBot2000]

Jadebaby wrote...

The only thing I will miss if I download mehem, is Shepard refuse speech. It's just so god damn good! That speech, in and of itself, should have destroyed the Catalyst...

Indeed. 

Thanks for all the speculations, Jade & co.

[jojon2se]

I don't see that we have enough information to throw anything out. Let's see where we stand after playing the DLC.

IF this DLC is really only what is apparent_suggested, without any truly whole-picture-relevant-maybe-gamechanging concepts, such as speculated on by e.g. the puzzle- and indoctrination theories, then it sounds like the most superficial piece of empty crowd-pleasing tinsel ever.

I realise that this may well be all that most players were missing from the game, but I'd also wager that the majority of those "magpies" (..who might enjoy life in the Matrix), have long ago moved on to the next new shiny thing and will not be returning either way.
Mostly us obsessive ones strikes me as likely to remain - or not; I have no statistics.

[BD Manchild]

Such a shame that it looks like this theory's been debunked (I really don't think Bioware are smart enough to do anything like IT or PT on-the-sly). I enjoyed it a lot and I find Jade's attitude to the whole debacle actually pretty inspiring; I wish I could remain so positive about the game and the series as a whole.

Ah well, looks like Refuse remains the way it is for me; an immediate loss, but an uncompromising ultimate victory in the long run. That said, it's clear Bioware pretty much rushed it; what I wouldn't give to see it properly expanded, say if we heard the full contents of Liara's time capsule or Shepard giving one last farewell to the Normandy. That would at least make it look less like Bioware's flipping you off.

[Obadiah]

Is that Liara scene in Refuse a video? Can't you just mod replace that with another video?

I always figured a successful Refuse ending would be narrated by some unnamed AI or Geth who survived the long war with the Reapers and discovers that the Crucible is a WMD that wouild have destroyed it.

Modifié par Obadiah, 23 février 2013 - 01:08 .