119 réponses à ce sujet

[TriggerHappy64]

I've played this game for awhile now and have come to the conclusion that the tactics screen does not work as intended.  I miss the attack planning that was present in games like KOTOR where you could add a sequence of abilities and your party would follow them to a tee.  In this game, even at normal difficulty I find I have to continually pause and micromanage and I can never let the tactics just play out.

An example, I set a character to attack an enemy attacking the main character.  His general behavior is also set to aggressive.  The main character falls unconscious in battle and the character just stops attacking entirely.   He just bloody stands there and watches his party members get butchered one by one unless I order him to attack someone else.

Sometimes the presets don't work properly either.  If you have points invested in dual weapons and you have the "dual weapon sweep" ability it and select the "scrapper" preset, it incorrectly lists its activating conditions as "Enemy: surrounded by at least 3 enemies" which does absolutely nothing.  I had to set this to "self: surrounded by at least 2 enemies" to get this ability to activate at all.

The endless micromanaging is driving me crazy and makes any of the combat sequences boring, tiresome and not very exciting.  That, and the fact that I have to go through so many story options to get to any action is really destroying the fun for me.  I don't really understand all the good reviews this game is getting.  Sure it's immersive and I do like the lore and the story, but the gameplay has been extremely frustrating.

And please, this is not a QQ post or anything of the like, it's just how I feel about the game so far.  If you don't have any constructive comments, please refrain from posting.

Modifié par TriggerHappy64, 17 décembre 2009 - 01:39 .

[Duck and Cover]

anyone else have a problem with Wynn (or any healing mage) not healing? It only happens occasionally. It's like she falls "asleep), once I heal with her once, she seems to wake up and heal on her own. But occasionally at the start of fights, she wont' heal, and my tank falls in like 10 seconds.

[sleepy__head]

I agree with the OP. I think the fact that we need to spend valueable skill points on Tactics to fix what is essentially a design flaw that the devs didn't bother to fix is a little insulting. Programming good AI is the devs' job, not ours.

[Curadorf]

I view tactics as a way to enhance the game and automate the simple stuff that doesn't require you to move characters or pre-empt the enemy. Pause is there for a very good reason - and if it gets very hairy you could always disable the AI for more detailed control.



Dual weapon sweep, the cone effect spells and all of the area effect spells are not something that I ever would leave to the AI to do anyway. Friendly fire and poor aiming/positioning make these spells really not something you would want to put in your tactics at all IMO.



Healers I find very easy to build a solid tactic for. The only macro I miss is one for party wide health to trigger the party heal. Leaving only some of the mitigational spells and the regen spell for me to cast myself - and I like that control.



Adding queues would strengthen the game though, so I agree that not having it impairs your ability to play the game for a longer time without having to pause it.

[kevinwastaken]

sleepy__head wrote...

I agree with the OP. I think the fact that we need to spend valueable skill points on Tactics to fix what is essentially a design flaw that the devs didn't bother to fix is a little insulting. Programming good AI is the devs' job, not ours.

If you waited for BioWare to release games with good AI we would never get a game out of them. I think the tactics system is fine for what it does.

[brelrande]

I agree with Kevin it works just fine, sure there are some flaws but there is no such thing as a perfectly built game.

Comparing this to KOTOR is like comparing "Two Worlds" to "Oblivion" lol. If you wish it was more like KOTOR then go play it and stop your dam complaining.

[Eshme]

I Agree. Since the automatic wasted all Stamina and Mana before i really needed them on critical tasks (like silence an add) , I reduced it to do only essential tasks, that i would repeat anyway. Kind of like emergency. And then it barely works.



And since you cannot give anyone a target they should take after a spell for example, you have to use this crappy system if you dont wanna end up correcting anyone each move.



Any situation in this game is different, and a chain of commands like KOTOR would suffice. This new system is like saying an AI can beat hard difficulty alone, but would it then still be hard? And if it was, will an AI still take it on?



Of course saying this, it is different on easy modes and console versions.

[Eshme]

Oh at one fight i had turned on some random presets for fun, and jumped into a boss fight and just watched out of interest. Guess what, i came out winner. Yep, hard difficulty lol.



But i think the boss was bugged since it didnt do anything but stand in a position ,much like Shale in the Village. Not sure exactly what this was supposed to mean.

[fchopin]

Duck and Cover wrote...

anyone else have a problem with Wynn (or any healing mage) not healing? It only happens occasionally. It's like she falls "asleep), once I heal with her once, she seems to wake up and heal on her own. But occasionally at the start of fights, she wont' heal, and my tank falls in like 10 seconds.

Yes i have a problem with healing, i set Wynn to heal < 50% and i always die, i set it to < 75% now and she still does not heal correctly. I have to do a manual heal myself or i am in trouble.
 
In my opinion the Tactics commands are buggy and not working correctly and not only for healing.

[TheRealIncarnal]

Really? I seem to have my party's tactics, especially Wynne, running smooth as silk.

[Heldelance]

Seriously if you can't learn how to manage your guys either pick a different game or stop whinging. It was stated that this was a spiritual successor to the BG series in which your guys did in fact have to be micro-managed. The one spell that allowed you to have something like "Combat Tactics" in BG was the "Contingency" spell. That one was supposed to save your arse from last minute disasters.



The only beef I have with constant pausing is the fact that the music dims down a bit, it gets rather annoying.



Why should the creators have to make good AI for YOUR characters? YOU'RE supposed to be the one managing them, not the computer. The computer does bloody well with the enemy (and to a much lesser extent, allied) AI.



I've got everyone on Aggressive and the only tactics slots I've used is for the activation of certain abilities pre-battle, Oh, and Wynne's heal set to 75%

[JJM152]

A quick read over a lot of these complaints shows that many of the posters don't understand how to use the tactics system. It's not very intuitive unless you have had some sort of basic programming experience and are familiar with conditionals and a drop through case statement flow structure...



Maybe there needs to be an elaborate tactics tutorial set up someplace? It certainly wasnt in the manual...

[Heldelance]

What's not to understand?
It's pretty straightforward kinda like following a flowchart. I've not done programming before but this was rather easy to figure out.

Modifié par Heldelance, 17 décembre 2009 - 04:42 .

[Dragon Age1103]

sleepy__head wrote...

I agree with the OP. I think the fact that we need to spend valueable skill points on Tactics to fix what is essentially a design flaw that the devs didn't bother to fix is a little insulting. Programming good AI is the devs' job, not ours.

U do not have to use tactics at all they still auto do what ever they please it is your choice but I agree that we shouldn't have to spend vital skill points on tactic slots.

[Lohe]

Hello



Im on the xbox-version of the game. As you know there are several difference between our versions. Its far more important on the consoles to reach a good tactic setup. What to say? Everything works fine. Dont create too much rules. Lesser is more sometimes.

[badtim]

i'm sorry, i really must be from an alient planet, but the blow-by-blow micro is the whole REASON i play these games.



i just wish there were six characters, so there would be more of it.

[TriggerHappy64]

How amusing that those who do not agree with my opinion immediately dismiss it as "whining." You'd think I'd insulted their children or something...



Clearly the tactics system is not working if behaviour is set on aggressive and the character just stands still.. I understand how to use the tactics system, it just doesn't work as well as it should. And some of us prefer a more fluid game play experience and not pausing and micromanaging every second. I guess this game appeals to "control freaks."

[Sidney]

TriggerHappy64 wrote...
Clearly the tactics system is not working if behaviour is set on aggressive and the character just stands still.. I understand how to use the tactics system, it just doesn't work as well as it should. And some of us prefer a more fluid game play experience and not pausing and micromanaging every second. I guess this game appeals to "control freaks."

Hardly, I let the thing run just fine. Shale will sometimes brain lock even in Pulverising Blows mode but other than that everyone does what they should once you get the tactics set right. Setting the proper combo between the tactics and whatever that option is that sets Aggressive, Passive and what not matters is important.

I let the battle basically flow in most cases only controlling my PC most of the time.

Basically everyone has similar commands:
1. Heal < 50%
2. AoE for clustered foes
3. Special powers/spells on higher value targets
4. Attack whoever I am attacking

Toss in a taunt command for the tanks in between 1 and 2 if your mages are attacked and things can pretty much run fine.

[OneBadAssMother]

Actually I would have appreciated a bit more detail in the manual in regards of the tactics system.

[KariTR]

TriggerHappy64 wrote...
An example, I set a character to attack an enemy attacking the main character.  His general behavior is also set to aggressive.  The main character falls unconscious in battle and the character just stops attacking entirely.   He just bloody stands there and watches his party members get butchered one by one unless I order him to attack someone else.

If you havent noticed, when your character dies, the next companion in party becomes the "leader" and switches from auto-control (tactics ON) to manual control (tactics off). I can't understand why anyone who wants to actually play the game rather than have the game play for them would complain about this.

[TriggerHappy64]

KariTR wrote...
If you havent noticed, when your character dies, the next companion in party becomes the "leader" and switches from auto-control (tactics ON) to manual control (tactics off). I can't understand why anyone who wants to actually play the game rather than have the game play for them would complain about this.

In aggressive mode, the character who I'm not controlling should be doing a default attack routine if none of the tactics apply (according to its description) and not stand still.  If I have to tell characters to attack when they are in aggressive mode, something isn't working properly.

Modifié par TriggerHappy64, 17 décembre 2009 - 10:09 .

[fchopin]

This has nothing to do with how users like to play the game.



If something is included in the game it should work correctly, if it does not then it is a bug.



I played FF 12 and most of the commands worked perfect, I could create my team in any way I liked with out problems and there was at least 3 times as many commands.



If bioware do not think these commands are needed in the game then they should be removed.



And don’t tell us how to play our games, I decide how to play my game.

[DodgeMoreLightning]

The tactics system is broken in some spots. This isn't about failing to understand how to use it (it is pretty much the same as Gambits from Final Fantasy 12 and zero issues with that). Simple fact is that sometimes events that should fire don't. They simply do not.

For example, I automated group heal for Wynne. Sometimes she will begin to cast the spell, with the spell name next to her portrait and everything, and she won't cast it. If I don't select her, then manually push the Group Heal button, she will stand there with her arms in the air until combat ends. In contrast, Morrigan will run three rooms ahead of the party to drop a sleep on someone.

The healing problem seems to be the worst when auto-attacking. If an event occurs during the casting of a spell, or moving, the resultant action typically fires at the character's earliest convenience. If an event occurs during the autoattack sequence, sometimes the result will wait until the character is done autoattacking (usually at the death of the target). Sometimes this means that healing spells end up waiting until after combat is over to cast.

For that matter, tactics are only supposed to occur during combat (Self: Any -> Any Sustained Ability except Spell Wisp shows this cleanly), but sure enough, healing spells like Regenerate will be cast when no combat is occurring, yet damage has been inflicted - such as after a trap is stepped on. Or, as in the case of the Ally:Lowest HP tactic, it will constantly be cast (maybe fixed in 1.02, haven't tried it in a while because constantly regenerating a fully healthy Morrigan is only funny for the first 2 minutes).

Now that I look at the above, something might be wrong with how the game treats creation spells.

Using the Enemy: Mage type is odd. The character will end up using whatever ability assigned to it seemingly at random - such as on skeleton archers and dwarves (and other things that clearly are not mages).

These are merely examples of a larger problem: using tactics outside of the very simple basics can have very unexpected results.

Modifié par DodgeMoreLightning, 17 décembre 2009 - 10:38 .

[castaftw]

http://social.bioware.com/project/861/



install enjoy profit

[Myte]

I've played through 3 times now. Disabling tactics on the characters is the first thing I do,