202 réponses à ce sujet

[VinWizzy]

I don't see how you can like an organization that's shady with so many secrets. I do agree, I wasn't fond of how they became a common enemy in the game, but still. And yes, it's stupid how the auto dialogue does do well for renegades as Shep is too buddy buddy with some people because of it. This game may have been different if it was still in development but that's just the way things are.

[Ainyan42]

*cough* For all of you saying that without Cerberus, Shepard would have died and the Normandy would have been destroyed and that was it...

You need to remember it was TIM who set the Collectors on Shepard in the first place at the beginning of ME2. (You learn about this towards the end of the game.) Without Cerberus, Shepard would never have died and we would never have lost the Normandy SR-1. So - yeah.

[Quackjack]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Ainyan42 wrote...

*cough* For all of you saying that without Cerberus, Shepard would have died and the Normandy would have been destroyed and that was it...

You need to remember it was TIM who set the Collectors on Shepard in the first place at the beginning of ME2. (You learn about this towards the end of the game.) Without Cerberus, Shepard would never have died and we would never have lost the Normandy SR-1. So - yeah.

When was this mentioned? Because I don't remember this at all.

Yeah, what is this guy going on about?

[robertthebard]

fr33stylez wrote...

Well, TIM at least offers you an explanation for his actions, and at least makes some effort to distance himself form 'rogue factions' in Cerberus. Evidently, this was enough for Shepard to be in Cerberus the entire game. This was enough for several members of the Alliance and Normandy SR1 to defect to Cerberus. So either Cerberus wasn't as clearly evil as people say, or Shepard, Joker, Chakwas etc. are unbeliveably stupid.

And the last scene with TIM in ME3 would suggest that TIM is not completely evil. He honestly think he's helping the goals of humanity. He can even apologize and kills himself as a 'redeeming act'.

And I'd like to see how people view the Reapers if they believe Cerberus was always 100% evil. The Reapers were presented 100X worse than Cerberus throughout the trilogy. They made no attempt to explain their actions and unlike TIM, didn't even bother saying they were trying to 'help us'. The Reapers used evil and diabolic means to indoctrinate, huskify and instigate galatic conflicts throughout the games. Even their 'harvesting' process is depicted as repulsive and an abomination...

...Then suddenly you meet the King of the Reapers in the last 5 minutes of the trilogy and he says he was helping organics all along? Everyone who believes it's so obvious Cereberus was evil all along must've chosen 'Refusal' for their last choice. Because there's no way you should be able to accept ANYTHING the Catalyst says.

Can you point me to any dialog options that enable to me to walk away prior to the SM?  Tali isn't working for Cerberus, she's working for you, as is Chakwas.  Joker went because he wanted to fly, and the Alliance grounded him, of course, he explains this to you right after you re-meet him.  But you have two options, play the game, or quit and uninstall.  There is no point in the game until after you have finished the SM that you can tell TIM to take a long walk on a short pier.  Funny you should mention the redeeming act, since you claim he's got nothing to redeem himself for.  He is, afterall, looking out for humanity, right?  So he feels so bad about doing that, his stated mission, that he has to kill himself?

Why is "huskifying" evil when the Reapers do it, but in the best interest of humanity when TIM does it?  Same result, although at least the Reapers method was more, um, merciful?  Since it used the Dragon's Teeth to do it, while the Cerberus method left the victim fully aware, feeling every bit of the transformation.  Don't take my word for this though, I read it in a codex.  That somebody has to dip to this level of hypocrisy to justify one faction over another kind of points to there being a reason, don't you think?

BTW, I don't have to accept anything SC says to choose Destroy.  I'm not sure where you get the logic of "disregarding Cerberus for what it is means you allow the Reapers to continue".  I would be more inclined to think that anyone that chose to follow TIM in 3 would choose Synthesis, it is, after all, in the best interests of humanity, isn't it?  It's certainly no different than converting living/concious humans into husks.

[robertthebard]

Quackjack wrote...

MassStorm wrote...


Isn't it odd that TIM knows the Collectors are behind the colonies, but didn't send some anonymous messages to the Alliance command structure to try to help them figure out a way to stop them?

He did, after Horizon

Did he, or did he just say he did?  It's kind of like the facility where Jack was experimented on, after Jack escapes, and kills most of the scientists involved, he's going to shut it down.  However, that doesn't alleviate any guilt for actually approving the facility in the first place.  It's just another example of "Do whatever it takes to advance Cerberus, but if you're caught, you're a 'rogue faction'".

[Blitzhawk65]

Ainyan42 wrote...

*cough* For all of you saying that without Cerberus, Shepard would have died and the Normandy would have been destroyed and that was it...

You need to remember it was TIM who set the Collectors on Shepard in the first place at the beginning of ME2. (You learn about this towards the end of the game.) Without Cerberus, Shepard would never have died and we would never have lost the Normandy SR-1. So - yeah.

I did not find that in my playthrough and I am usually very thorough.  Where did you find that information?  It doesn't matter much anyway since ME3 as a whole poorly mishandles Cerberus. 

For the "he was indoctrinated" group.  When was he indoctrinated?  Evolution?  If that were the case, then why did the reapers invade his Horizon base, they had no reason to if he was already under control.  After Cronos Station?  If that is the case, then it is complete character assassination to make him idiotic enough to indocrinate himself and still leaves a full game of cartoon-like evil.

For the "Cerberus is evil!" group.  The type of pure-evil (i.e. being evil just to be evil) that Cerberus portrays in ME3 rarely exists in the world.  Even the most frequently cited example in human history, the national-socialist party of Adolph Hitler, had reasoning behind its actions and its members thought they were working towards a greater good (everyone else just happened to think otherwise).  Cerberus in ME3 derps around the galaxy for no logical reason other than to be evil.  The suspension of disbelieve that sci-fi generally holds broke there for me because ME3 Cerberus is ridiculous.  It took a complex villain that it was ok to hate, and turned them into a lame cartoon achetype.

For the "Cerberus is a terrorist organization!" group.  What makes a terrorist?  Is it because a government says they are terrorists?  The truth is, that definition is a relative term.  What does everyone think of the Sons of Liberty (the historical American group, not anything to do with Metal Gear Solid)?  Group of red-blooded patriots, or terrorists?  What about John Paul Jones or Francis Marion, both of them commited terrible atrocities against other people, but are they ok because the American Colonial government said so?  What about the group of pirates that helped Andrew Jackson win the battle of New Orleans?  Are they not "terrorists" because they fought for the winning side?  How about those of you who played Final Fantasy 7, how did you like working for a terrorist organization and blowing up a civilian power plant in the opening of that game?

I'm not saying that we should have been able to join Cerberus, but it should have kept its gray morality instead of going into full cartoon-villian mode.  It wasn't even fun to hate them in ME3 because they were so poorly done.

[fr33stylez]

robertthebard wrote...

Can you point me to any dialog options that enable to me to walk away prior to the SM?  Tali isn't working for Cerberus, she's working for you, as is Chakwas.  Joker went because he wanted to fly, and the Alliance grounded him, of course, he explains this to you right after you re-meet him.  But you have two options, play the game, or quit and uninstall.  There is no point in the game until after you have finished the SM that you can tell TIM to take a long walk on a short pier.  Funny you should mention the redeeming act, since you claim he's got nothing to redeem himself for.  He is, afterall, looking out for humanity, right?  So he feels so bad about doing that, his stated mission, that he has to kill himself?

People join terrorist organizations because they want to fly? Or because they 'miss space' as Chakwas says? Seriously?

And that's exactly my point about the game's narrative. Bioware wrote ME2 so that you work with Cerberus. If they were so absoultely evil as you imply, then you must accept that Shepard and the others are either terrorists or incredibly stupid to ever consider to work with them. Bioware obviously didn't make Cerberus clear-cut evil in ME2 for a reason. And this is supported by TIM distancing himself from rogue factions. It doesn't matter if he's ultimately still responsible - the game clearly shows cerberus as not some simple mustache-twirling villain....until ME3.

And try to refrain from using strawman arguments. I've never stated Cerberus or TIM's actions were noble or good at all. My point is simply that it's revisionist history to claim it was obvious Cerberus was written in the plot as absolutely evil all along, otherwise this completely contradicts the main protagonist in the game.

 Why is "huskifying" evil when the Reapers do it, but in the best interest of humanity when TIM does it?  Same result, although at least the Reapers method was more, um, merciful?  Since it used the Dragon's Teeth to do it, while the Cerberus method left the victim fully aware, feeling every bit of the transformation.  Don't take my word for this though, I read it in a codex.  That somebody has to dip to this level of hypocrisy to justify one faction over another kind of points to there being a reason, don't you think?

BTW, I don't have to accept anything SC says to choose Destroy.  I'm not sure where you get the logic of "disregarding Cerberus for what it is means you allow the Reapers to continue".  I would be more inclined to think that anyone that chose to follow TIM in 3 would choose Synthesis, it is, after all, in the best interests of humanity, isn't it?  It's certainly no different than converting living/concious humans into husks.

Again, strawman. I never said Cerberus' actions were OK and the Reapers are not. I said between the two, Cerberus was written more of a morally grey entity than the Reapers ever were. You keep harping on Cerberus being so clearly evil so answer this....Why did Shepard go along with everything they did in ME2? Do you agree that Shepard is indeed a moron then?

You last point I'm not even sure what you're saying but it's nothing I ever said. The point was, the Reapers were evil throughout the entire trilogy, moreso than Cerberus. When you meet the SC, there's no reason based on your logic you should ever consider using any of the options it presents to you, when given the option to refuse. The Reapers are shown to be evil for 99% of the ME trilogy - why would you trust anything the SC says now that you're given the option to refuse (the option you ironically stated ISN'T avialable for you in ME2 against TIM)?

Modifié par fr33stylez, 15 juillet 2012 - 05:37 .

[robertthebard]

fr33stylez wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Can you point me to any dialog options that enable to me to walk away prior to the SM?  Tali isn't working for Cerberus, she's working for you, as is Chakwas.  Joker went because he wanted to fly, and the Alliance grounded him, of course, he explains this to you right after you re-meet him.  But you have two options, play the game, or quit and uninstall.  There is no point in the game until after you have finished the SM that you can tell TIM to take a long walk on a short pier.  Funny you should mention the redeeming act, since you claim he's got nothing to redeem himself for.  He is, afterall, looking out for humanity, right?  So he feels so bad about doing that, his stated mission, that he has to kill himself?

People join terrorist organizations because they want to fly? Or because they 'miss space' as Chakwas says? Seriously?

And that's exactly my point about the game's narrative. Bioware wrote ME2 so that you work with Cerberus. If they were so absoultely evil as you imply, then you must accept that Shepard and the others are either terrorists or incredibly stupid to ever consider to work with them. Bioware obviously didn't make Cerberus clear-cut evil in ME2 for a reason. And this is supported by TIM distancing himself from rogue factions. It doesn't matter if he's ultimately still responsible - the game clearly shows cerberus as not some simple mustache-twirling villain....until ME3.

And try to refrain from using strawman arguments. I've never stated Cerberus or TIM's actions were noble or good at all. My point is simply that it's revisionist history to claim it was obvious Cerberus was written in the plot as absolutely evil all along, otherwise this completely contradicts the main protagonist in the game.

 Why is "huskifying" evil when the Reapers do it, but in the best interest of humanity when TIM does it?  Same result, although at least the Reapers method was more, um, merciful?  Since it used the Dragon's Teeth to do it, while the Cerberus method left the victim fully aware, feeling every bit of the transformation.  Don't take my word for this though, I read it in a codex.  That somebody has to dip to this level of hypocrisy to justify one faction over another kind of points to there being a reason, don't you think?

BTW, I don't have to accept anything SC says to choose Destroy.  I'm not sure where you get the logic of "disregarding Cerberus for what it is means you allow the Reapers to continue".  I would be more inclined to think that anyone that chose to follow TIM in 3 would choose Synthesis, it is, after all, in the best interests of humanity, isn't it?  It's certainly no different than converting living/concious humans into husks.

Again, strawman. I never said Cerberus' actions were OK and the Reapers are not. I said between the two, Cerberus was written more of a morally grey entity than the Reapers ever were. You keep harping on Cerberus being so clearly evil so answer this....Why did Shepard go along with everything they did in ME2? Do you agree that Shepard is indeed a moron then?

You last point I'm not even sure what you're saying but it's nothing I ever said. The point was, the Reapers were evil throughout the entire trilogy, moreso than Cerberus. When you meet the SC, there's no reason based on your logic you should ever consider using any of the options it presents to you, when given the option to refuse. The Reapers are shown to be evil for 99% of the ME trilogy - why would you trust anything the SC says now that you're given the option to refuse (the option you ironically stated ISN'T avialable for you in ME2 against TIM)?

Again, I can answer your whole post with one question:  Where is the option given to just walk away?  It is promised in your very first conversation with TIM, but where is it delivered?  You need only answer this question to determine why anyone playing ME 2 worked with Cerberus.

[Kamfrenchie]

txgoldrush wrote...

No, Cerberus is EVIL.

They are the dark side of humanity.

And the Renegade ME2 nding should CLUE you into their evil.

ugh yah, because  smile is such a proof of beng completely evil...
If i just got my hands on a tool to beat a dagerous ennemy of mine, you bet I'dhave a smile like that, anyone would.


The problem with ceberus, as with the rest of the trilogy i think, is that the writers didnt know where the story was going after each opus. There wasn't a structured plot forthe whole trilogy. Hence why Cerberus goes from messed up to well intentionned extremist to stupid villain.

ME2 cerberus was the most interesting beause it was the most grey-ish


and as far as TIM indoctrination before ME1, screw it. It wasn't in the game, it wasn't even mentionned (hey, check out this comic) and the comic is pretty mediocre. Games should be self suficient in term of story. We shouldd not have to track down thisbook or this comic ffor plot critical information, seriously.



also
http://tvtropes.org/...FreedomFighters

[Kamfrenchie]

robertthebard wrote...

fr33stylez wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Can you point me to any dialog options that enable to me to walk away prior to the SM?  Tali isn't working for Cerberus, she's working for you, as is Chakwas.  Joker went because he wanted to fly, and the Alliance grounded him, of course, he explains this to you right after you re-meet him.  But you have two options, play the game, or quit and uninstall.  There is no point in the game until after you have finished the SM that you can tell TIM to take a long walk on a short pier.  Funny you should mention the redeeming act, since you claim he's got nothing to redeem himself for.  He is, afterall, looking out for humanity, right?  So he feels so bad about doing that, his stated mission, that he has to kill himself?

People join terrorist organizations because they want to fly? Or because they 'miss space' as Chakwas says? Seriously?

And that's exactly my point about the game's narrative. Bioware wrote ME2 so that you work with Cerberus. If they were so absoultely evil as you imply, then you must accept that Shepard and the others are either terrorists or incredibly stupid to ever consider to work with them. Bioware obviously didn't make Cerberus clear-cut evil in ME2 for a reason. And this is supported by TIM distancing himself from rogue factions. It doesn't matter if he's ultimately still responsible - the game clearly shows cerberus as not some simple mustache-twirling villain....until ME3.

And try to refrain from using strawman arguments. I've never stated Cerberus or TIM's actions were noble or good at all. My point is simply that it's revisionist history to claim it was obvious Cerberus was written in the plot as absolutely evil all along, otherwise this completely contradicts the main protagonist in the game.

 Why is "huskifying" evil when the Reapers do it, but in the best interest of humanity when TIM does it?  Same result, although at least the Reapers method was more, um, merciful?  Since it used the Dragon's Teeth to do it, while the Cerberus method left the victim fully aware, feeling every bit of the transformation.  Don't take my word for this though, I read it in a codex.  That somebody has to dip to this level of hypocrisy to justify one faction over another kind of points to there being a reason, don't you think?

BTW, I don't have to accept anything SC says to choose Destroy.  I'm not sure where you get the logic of "disregarding Cerberus for what it is means you allow the Reapers to continue".  I would be more inclined to think that anyone that chose to follow TIM in 3 would choose Synthesis, it is, after all, in the best interests of humanity, isn't it?  It's certainly no different than converting living/concious humans into husks.

Again, strawman. I never said Cerberus' actions were OK and the Reapers are not. I said between the two, Cerberus was written more of a morally grey entity than the Reapers ever were. You keep harping on Cerberus being so clearly evil so answer this....Why did Shepard go along with everything they did in ME2? Do you agree that Shepard is indeed a moron then?

You last point I'm not even sure what you're saying but it's nothing I ever said. The point was, the Reapers were evil throughout the entire trilogy, moreso than Cerberus. When you meet the SC, there's no reason based on your logic you should ever consider using any of the options it presents to you, when given the option to refuse. The Reapers are shown to be evil for 99% of the ME trilogy - why would you trust anything the SC says now that you're given the option to refuse (the option you ironically stated ISN'T avialable for you in ME2 against TIM)?

Again, I can answer your whole post with one question:  Where is the option given to just walk away?  It is promised in your very first conversation with TIM, but where is it delivered?  You need only answer this question to determine why anyone playing ME 2 worked with Cerberus.

That  doesn't answer the question. Do you think shepard and cie is dumb for accepting to work with cerberus ?

Just lik how TIM is duumb fo trying t control the reapers and kill everyone ?

[Urdnot Amenark]

Emzamination wrote...

Cerberus was a beautiful human centric group committed to the advancement of humanity by any and all means possible.I came to believe strongly in their Ideals/goals while playing Me2 and went out of my way to let characters know I was working 'for' them everytime the opprotunity presented itself.By me2's conclusion I thought I'd be able to continue my budding career as a valued cerberus operative in me3 but alas to my great disappointment, I was forced to rejoin the 'good' alliance and kowtow to that aging relic hackett.If that wasn't bad enough, you took my boss The illusive man and forced him into being my enemy.I cringed everytime I heard my shepard auto dialogue about taking down cerberus by any means necessary.

I should've been allowed to assist cerberus in killing the council and leaving udina with sole power which would've been a titanic boost to war assets considering the citadel fleet and human superiority.Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't eradicating the council and putting a human in power an alternate point of me1's conclusion? The worst part of it all was the destruction of the cerberus base along with the entire organization.When I destroyed that base I couldn't help but feel it was not only a waste of resources but a waste of story potential.My shepard could've taken over cerberus as the new head, purged the reaper tech and restructured it back into the human centric group I came to love.It's not fair the Asari got to keep their commandos and the salarians got to keep stg but human's had to lose their special forces branch.I shall never forgive you for what you did to Cerberus or TIM, Alien lovers.

Hate to be the pessimist, but I think anyone who let TIM keep the Base should've seen their betrayal and eventual indoctrination coming, especially those who read the books in between the two games. Also, while we're in control of Shepard's story to some extent, we're not in control of Cerberus' or any other peripheral entity's actions or decisions. I would've liked to see Shepard take over Cerberus, but naturally you'd have to oust the current leader of the group, and this event would probably be impossible the way the story is currently written, and this isn't a choose your adventure kind of gig, just one that gives us the illusion of freedom by having unprecedented control over the main character. 

You also shouldn't fret. We still have Terra Firma.

[DeathScepter]

HUMANITY FIRST,
HUMANITY FOREVER!

IN ME3, There was a lot of balls dropped including ones relating to Cerberus. As for T.I.M's eyes, in the older Comics, the glow was a part of the Biotic implants.

As for Project Overlord and Pragia, they didn't tell him much about them until after **** hits the fan.

as for racism and evil people, organizations like Cerberus often attracts people that are racist or morally unethical. Within Cerberus, being effective regardless of morality, is important.

Keep in mind, that the Turians wanted to make us a servant species like the volus.

[robertthebard]

Kamfrenchie wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

fr33stylez wrote...

robertthebard wrote...

Can you point me to any dialog options that enable to me to walk away prior to the SM?  Tali isn't working for Cerberus, she's working for you, as is Chakwas.  Joker went because he wanted to fly, and the Alliance grounded him, of course, he explains this to you right after you re-meet him.  But you have two options, play the game, or quit and uninstall.  There is no point in the game until after you have finished the SM that you can tell TIM to take a long walk on a short pier.  Funny you should mention the redeeming act, since you claim he's got nothing to redeem himself for.  He is, afterall, looking out for humanity, right?  So he feels so bad about doing that, his stated mission, that he has to kill himself?

People join terrorist organizations because they want to fly? Or because they 'miss space' as Chakwas says? Seriously?

And that's exactly my point about the game's narrative. Bioware wrote ME2 so that you work with Cerberus. If they were so absoultely evil as you imply, then you must accept that Shepard and the others are either terrorists or incredibly stupid to ever consider to work with them. Bioware obviously didn't make Cerberus clear-cut evil in ME2 for a reason. And this is supported by TIM distancing himself from rogue factions. It doesn't matter if he's ultimately still responsible - the game clearly shows cerberus as not some simple mustache-twirling villain....until ME3.

And try to refrain from using strawman arguments. I've never stated Cerberus or TIM's actions were noble or good at all. My point is simply that it's revisionist history to claim it was obvious Cerberus was written in the plot as absolutely evil all along, otherwise this completely contradicts the main protagonist in the game.

 Why is "huskifying" evil when the Reapers do it, but in the best interest of humanity when TIM does it?  Same result, although at least the Reapers method was more, um, merciful?  Since it used the Dragon's Teeth to do it, while the Cerberus method left the victim fully aware, feeling every bit of the transformation.  Don't take my word for this though, I read it in a codex.  That somebody has to dip to this level of hypocrisy to justify one faction over another kind of points to there being a reason, don't you think?

BTW, I don't have to accept anything SC says to choose Destroy.  I'm not sure where you get the logic of "disregarding Cerberus for what it is means you allow the Reapers to continue".  I would be more inclined to think that anyone that chose to follow TIM in 3 would choose Synthesis, it is, after all, in the best interests of humanity, isn't it?  It's certainly no different than converting living/concious humans into husks.

Again, strawman. I never said Cerberus' actions were OK and the Reapers are not. I said between the two, Cerberus was written more of a morally grey entity than the Reapers ever were. You keep harping on Cerberus being so clearly evil so answer this....Why did Shepard go along with everything they did in ME2? Do you agree that Shepard is indeed a moron then?

You last point I'm not even sure what you're saying but it's nothing I ever said. The point was, the Reapers were evil throughout the entire trilogy, moreso than Cerberus. When you meet the SC, there's no reason based on your logic you should ever consider using any of the options it presents to you, when given the option to refuse. The Reapers are shown to be evil for 99% of the ME trilogy - why would you trust anything the SC says now that you're given the option to refuse (the option you ironically stated ISN'T avialable for you in ME2 against TIM)?

Again, I can answer your whole post with one question:  Where is the option given to just walk away?  It is promised in your very first conversation with TIM, but where is it delivered?  You need only answer this question to determine why anyone playing ME 2 worked with Cerberus.

That  doesn't answer the question. Do you think shepard and cie is dumb for accepting to work with cerberus ?

Just lik how TIM is duumb fo trying t control the reapers and kill everyone ?

Again, where is the option to do anything but work with Cerberus?  You seem to miss the fact that, if you're going to play ME 2, you have no choice.  There is no option, until after the SM to tell Joker to lose the channel.  The ME 1 cast that works with you works with you.  Most, barring Joker, who is bitter from losing the only thing he loves to the Alliance, will tell you exactly that.  The rest, save Mordin and Thane, do it for the money that Cerberus has laid out, or because they work for Cerberus directly.  But again, when can Shepard tell TIM to ****** off?

[DeathScepter]

bad writing for all and all for bad writing.

[budzai]

Who care? Asaris, Turians, Krogans, Salarians are all racist they deserv...

[DeathScepter]

Racist or not, The others races are not as innocent or pure as we like to believe. Just because we are not aware of their dirty laundry, it doesn't mean it is not there.


Because we are with a Human lead, we learn about our dirty laundry with the comics, games and books.

[The Angry One]

Ainyan42 wrote...

*cough* For all of you saying that without Cerberus, Shepard would have died and the Normandy would have been destroyed and that was it...

You need to remember it was TIM who set the Collectors on Shepard in the first place at the beginning of ME2. (You learn about this towards the end of the game.) Without Cerberus, Shepard would never have died and we would never have lost the Normandy SR-1. So - yeah.

This is never said. Also, why would Cerberus have Shepard killed in order to spend billions of credits in a project to resurrect her with no guarantee that it'd even work?

[Xilizhra]

And that's exactly my point about the game's narrative. Bioware wrote ME2 so that you work with Cerberus. If they were so absoultely evil as you imply, then you must accept that Shepard and the others are either terrorists or incredibly stupid to ever consider to work with them. Bioware obviously didn't make Cerberus clear-cut evil in ME2 for a reason. And this is supported by TIM distancing himself from rogue factions. It doesn't matter if he's ultimately still responsible - the game clearly shows cerberus as not some simple mustache-twirling villain....until ME3.

TIM was always that evil, but Cronus Station shows he pretty much gathered the absolute nicest people in Cerberus he could find and shoved them all onto the Normandy to make Cerberus look good for Shepard.

[suprhomre]

OP you should play witcher 2 1000% better then any bioware game.

[BatmanPWNS]

dreman9999 wrote...

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Having them in a grey morality woud be too "video gamey" or too realistic actually.

Looks like someone drank the "We're a grey organization" koolia TIM was serving in ME2.

No........ I drank it in ME1 and I don't even like Cerberus and I am paragon but it's poor story telling if they're conquest is to "TAKE OVER THE WORLD!" so I preferred their ME2 story than their poor ****** excuse in ME3.

[Asebstos]

Emzamination wrote...It's not fair the Asari got to keep their commandos and the salarians got to keep stg but human's had to lose their special forces branch.

Wait, we lost the N7 program?

[CptBomBom00]

LOL, so much Trolling from OP, anyway Cerberus could've been really useful if it stayed with alliance and TIM wasn't in control, but well you see what happens when a guy with problems from childhood takes over.
Kill that kill this, rape that rape this, stab this with toothbrush, stab that, and let's not forget Cerberus is Humanity!
Really he said that like was speaking for every human in galaxy.

[CSI_Spectre]

I think the player should atleast be given the CHOICE to rejoin Cerberus; depending on their actions in ME2. I think we would have atleast liked the option to do so. You can always reject TIM's offer even if you do meet the criteria to rejoin them.

However, that would have meant that your previous choices mattered. Therefore, that would have made the game more diverse. That was definitely not what Bioware was going for in Mass Effect 3.

[robertthebard]

CSI_Spectre wrote...

I think the player should atleast be given the CHOICE to rejoin Cerberus; depending on their actions in ME2. I think we would have atleast liked the option to do so. You can always reject TIM's offer even if you do meet the criteria to rejoin them.

However, that would have meant that your previous choices mattered. Therefore, that would have made the game more diverse. That was definitely not what Bioware was going for in Mass Effect 3.

Really?  Choices didn't matter?  Wonder how it is that I met Jack at Grissom then.  Maybe it's because I chose to do her loyalty mission?  No, that can't be it, because my choices didn't matter. Hmm, wonder how it worked then.

I wonder why Tali is an admiral, instead of exiled.  Hey, Jacob found out his father was a dbag, and got to survive the SM too.  You know, Nassana(sp?) actually remembered me, from ME 1, I wonder how that happened.  My buddy Wrex is large and in charge on Tuchanka, wonder why?  Because I chose to not kill him on Virmire, but tried to talk him down instead, and it worked.  Funny that none of my choices mattered, but I can see results of all those choices, and more, from ME 1 up, all through the game.

If I had been given the choice to talk to TIM face to face at the beginning of the game, I'd pray for a Renegade shoot him in the face.